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'In matchups where she struggles, Rose's damage buff won't change anything; she's still the same', EventHubs exclusive interview with Luffy

Posted by Nicholas 'MajinTenshinhan' Taylor • June 18, 2014 at 9:03 p.m. PDT

At the recent DreamHack Summer 2014 event in Jönköping, Sweden, EventHubs' very own MajinTenshinhan was on the scene and grabbed some thoughts from European powerhouse MD|Luffy.

The interview covers a number of different topics, such as Europe's power level in fighting games, what players he absolutely hates fighting against, his opinion to changes in Ultra Street Fighter 4 and more.

Look below for a snippet of the interview.

MajinTenshinhan: Last time we spoke, you were hopeful to increase your placement at this year's EVO from last year's Top 16 placing. With Rose looking like she has gotten a lot better in many aspects, this seems all the more likely. How do you feel about Rose now after the final changes to her in Ultra Street Fighter 4?

MD|Luffy: I think that Rose is actually still the same. She's gotten more damage output, but they didn't change any frame data or something like that, so in the matchups where she struggles, the damage buff won't really change anything. It's not like any move was adjusted to be a better anti-air or anything, so I think that overall the character is the same.

In some matchups, the damage will really help, but in matchups where she has difficulty getting away from her opponent or something like that, it'll still be the same. Maybe Delayed Wakeup will help her, but I think in the future people will have found setups for Delayed Wakeup as well, so in the end, it'll still be the same anyway.

MajinTenshinhan: This year, it's been fairly evident that Europe is a force to be reckoned with. Ryan Hart won two majors in the US, Alioune had a very impressive showing at ESGN Fight Night, and you have hardly been a slouch either. Do you think that Europe has always been at this level, and just had a lack of awareness, or do you feel as if Europe has really started leveling up lately?

MD|Luffy: I actually think that most people just didn't know. In Europe, I feel that there are only three people that are really good at an international level, those three people being me, Ryan Hart and Alioune. It's just that, this year, Ryan Hart has started traveling a lot more, which means that people can see more of how he plays and just how strong of a player he is.

Me, I went to EVO last year, and I did okay, and Alioune played a lot of foreign people at ESGN and he was really good, as well. It's just that European players don't travel a lot. But now, Ryan Hart is traveling a lot, and he's showing the world what Europe can do.

MajinTenshinhan: So you told me a while back that you're working on a website for FGC tournament managing and a ELO-based ranking system. Would you mind telling us a little bit about how that's going and what you're hoping to bring to consumers with the site?

MD|Luffy: Yeah, we are working on a website where the tournament organizer can create their tournament, and where players will get an ELO-based ranking. This ranking won't be based on your placing at a tournament, but instead be based on who you beat in that tournament. It's going very well - we have the website, everything is coded already, we just need to finish up the graphics and I hope that it'll be ready to launch in about 3-4 months.

MajinTenshinhan: We've discussed before that you tend to do really well against MCZ|Mago when you match up against him in tournaments, but is there any player you really, really hate going up against? Is there anyone that you might consider your kryptonite, so to speak?

MD|Luffy: Yeah, I think I'd have to say GamerBee... I've never beat him in any tournament, and he plays Adon who is really hard to fight with Rose. With the new change to her EX Spiral, maybe that'll change things, though. Also, Tokido. GamerBee and Tokido are really very good against me, because their characters are very good against Rose, and they are strong players themselves.

MajinTenshinhan: A while back, Ryan Hart talked to Justin Wong about a potential Europe vs. USA 10v10 or 5v5 and which side would win. What are your thoughts on such a matchup?

MD|Luffy: If there was a Europe vs. USA 10v10... Well, I think that overall, the top 10 USA players are better than the top 10 European players. There are more good players in the USA, but I think that the top 3 or top 5 of Europe are better than the top 3 or top 5 in USA. Maybe one player from the USA can beat like 5 people from Europe, but they won't beat the really high-level ones. I think that overall, Europe would win.

MajinTenshinhan: Judging by our very limited time with the game so far, who would you say, at this early stage, are the top 5 strongest characters in Ultra Street Fighter 4?

MD|Luffy: Yun, of course. I think Yun is good. Decapre is good. Probably Rolento... I'm not sure yet, but I do think he's actually good, when played at a really high level. He's difficult to chase, he has good mixups, he can always run away and he has many tools at his disposal. Evil Ryu is good, as well. I'm not sure about the last one, but those four are really good already.

Many thanks to Luffy for agreeing to do this interview with us. Any thoughts on his opinions? Let us know in the comments.

Comments

logitech2059 said on June 18, 2014 at 9:18 p.m.

Rose is the same really!!!???
Why is it that only the Japanese will admit that their character is still good or better smh.

#1
Cascadian1106 said on June 18, 2014 at 9:31 p.m.

Didn't even mention Valmaster.

#2
Wedge said on June 18, 2014 at 9:36 p.m.

Yeah, Rose is free in that Dan matchup now, eh Luffy? Also it IS like she got a better anti-air, coz' U1 is so gewd for that now.

Seriously though, I do agree with the sentiment of her better matchups getting easier, with her hard ones still being hard. Which makes sense, because unless they made some fundamental change to how she plays, there's no reason that would be different.

#3
RandomSelectMaster said on June 18, 2014 at 9:45 p.m.

I don't mind this actually. In the right hands, she is still deadly.

#4
deus said on June 18, 2014 at 9:45 p.m.

Interesting insight into Europe n the USA at 5v5 / 10v10.

I appreciate Luffy's Rose thoughts n I agree with his thoughts on Rolento being a strong character.

#5
kenshin220 said on June 18, 2014 at 9:47 p.m.

Well its like combofiend said they aren't happy unless their char got an i win button. and the usa top 5 vs euro top 5? i don't know how i feel about that

#6
XStrangeBeautyX said on June 18, 2014 at 10:37 p.m.

She not the same,, because now in Ultra her wake up is Horrible LOL

#7
xxMarshy said on June 18, 2014 at 10:50 p.m.

So? Characters should have bad matchups. She's definitely not the same, both her good and bad matchups are easier.

#8
surrender said on June 18, 2014 at 11:13 p.m.

She didn't get a better anti air because she has one of the best ones in the game with her c.hp.

#9
holybird90 said on June 18, 2014 at 11:22 p.m.

It's solid, but definitely not one of the best

#10
ponyz said on June 19, 2014 at 1:19 a.m.

hes not complaining about it, its just that EH was asked how she was and he gave his opinion, that is that

#11
Nayte said on June 19, 2014 at 2:17 a.m.

It's just a little bit too early to speak about Valmaster in europe's best, He needs to fight more against world best players. But he's definitively on the road to be here

#12
wunsumsauce said on June 19, 2014 at 3:14 a.m.

Yeah that's what I was thinking!
Everyone keeps complaining about their mains

#13
Nybear said on June 19, 2014 at 4:37 a.m.

"Rose's changes don't affect her bad matchups"
"Adon is a bad matchup for her, but maybe the EX Soul Spiral change will help that"

#14
EG2 said on June 19, 2014 at 5:17 a.m.

Her damage increases shouldn't be called buffs, but normalizations. Her damage was always anemic compared to the output of the rest of the cast. It was a needed FIX for parity. Now it's actually comparable with others. EX Spiral changes are a wash. So yeah, not much different than before.

#15
kingofthescrubs said on June 19, 2014 at 5:28 a.m.

(This user was banned.)

#16
TheKillerKiwi said on June 19, 2014 at 5:30 a.m.

Sick and tired of some pro's acting like their mains didn't get much better. This is f****** rose, she made one of the biggest tier list jumps out of the whole cast. She is way better in MU's that she struggled with.

#17
NyQuiiL said on June 19, 2014 at 5:54 a.m.

She still gets bodied by Balrog...

#18
Santaclaus said on June 19, 2014 at 6:07 a.m.

Agreed

#19
gtfopanda said on June 19, 2014 at 6:15 a.m.

I'll be honest, what Luffy's saying doesn't make much sense.

How is less startup on fireballs and U1, more invincibility on EX spiral and a faster forward dash "they didn't change any frame data or something like that"? Uh, what?

The damage buffs are not small stuff either, as they affect *ALL* of the moves in her standard cr.LP, cr.LK, cr.MP xx Spiral b&b. AE 2012 Rose dealt 168 damage with said combo, now she deals 203 damage. That's a +35 boost, pretty good if you ask me.

For comparison, USF4 Yun got +28 damage on his standard cr.MP, cr.MP, far MP xx Upkicks b&b, and people were complaining that he's got way too much damage now! Of course Rose is no Yun, but you just can't downplay the change like it's worthless...

Also, speaking of damage, she's one of the few character where UCW is actually pretty viable, meaning she's more likely to score damage and possibly better cover her tougher matchups.

I know pros and character specialists' opinions bear much more weight but come on now, are we really saying she's unaffected? I didn't even mention all of her buffs...

#20
messias_89 said on June 19, 2014 at 6:16 a.m.

well rose got better,not top tier but definitely better.idk but to me this sounds like an excuse if he fails at tournments,like in DreamHack where luffy was beaten by ixion a dan player,and dan isnt better then rose so...

#21
NyQuiiL said on June 19, 2014 at 6:22 a.m.

I guess i some what agree. The damage buffs have no doubt helped Rose out even though her bad matchups are still pretty rough. Rose still has problems with strong rush down characters, her wake up is arguably worse since she can be thrown out of her only good reversal and U2 comes out slower now. But shes def a better character than in AE. I've run into more Rose than I ever did before

#22
Omochao said on June 19, 2014 at 6:25 a.m.

That might be because of the way he lost to Justin Wong.

#23
MajinTenshinhan said on June 19, 2014 at 7:06 a.m.

To nip this little theory in the bud, I can tell you that this interview was conducted before the tournament.

#24
deteknician said on June 19, 2014 at 7:18 a.m.

UCW for Rose is huge. Also if dmg buffs don't change matchups then please give Gen double damage on all normals, kthx. Rose is so much better in Ultra. Not top 5 but she's very solid.

Europes strongest players sounds like a bunch of wusses. Alioune with his Bison hate and this dude with his eyes closed.

#25
liamdmc said on June 19, 2014 at 7:44 a.m.

at low and intermediate skill more invincibilty seems better which it is but its where it is used that is important. she had throw invincibility before which she now doesnt. she she can be os all day long on wakeup with grabs.
as for fireballs they are like the slowest in game. they dont change her distance game much.
and her dash was near top tier before so it dont matter. a buff to a strong move is the the same as a nerf to a crap move. it dont change it.
as for damage luffy said more damage but getting more damage doesnt change the issues she has in her bad matcvh ups like wake up for example.
and finally ultra being better changing her game ok. its a once a round scenario that cant be relied on.think practically not what you read.

#26
gtfopanda said on June 19, 2014 at 8:13 a.m.

I actually never said in my post that throw invincibility doesn't affect her, I quoted that part being about frame data, which I still don't get what on earth he was trying to say.

As for the move itself, yes, you can argue it's worse then before (and I'd take the former version), but longer invincibility might still be beneficial in specific matchups against characters with long active/invincibility frames.

Also, why are you telling me to "think practically now what you read", when you're completely neglecting DWU as a system dynamic? That's a major buff to any character with weak defense, and Rose is among those. Ex spiral being throwable is what she had to pay for that, and honestly it's not the end of the world with her great backdash.

And for the love of god stop downplaying the other buffs: one of Rose's main weaknesses was dealing absolutely pathetic damage, and that just got addressed. Better startup on U1 makes it a viable antiair move with her fireball game and UCW makes it so that you can have the best of both worlds (UC2 is almost unaffected as the damage was pitiful to begin with).

The other changes are definitely not massive but it's still something. Considering some characters even got nerfed, it's perplexing to say the least that people feel nothing changes for Rose with Ultra.

#27
keroberus2 said on June 19, 2014 at 8:25 a.m.

She plays exactly the same, with small damage buffs to her BnB. Her EX Spiral has more normal invincibility but has lost all grab invincibility so it's still weak, as you can just OS into grabs as opposed to just jabbing twice now.

Her U1 is a slightly better anti air but it's still iffy, so as a character she has barely changed. The matchups where she can do her thing will be slightly better for her, but matchups that are not good for her [hello Rufus >_<] will be just as bad. She will not have changed her place for her hard matchups.

I completely agree with Luffy.

#28
keroberus2 said on June 19, 2014 at 8:45 a.m.

As a Rose player I completely agree with Luffy. DWU is going to help for now, but without a doubt, people will [and are] working on setups and safe pressure on DWUs, so in a year or so it will be just as hard on wakeup.

Her EX Spiral definitely feels like a nerf as OS into grabs are just brutal- there is no reversal option anymore [though before you could just effectively jab twice and stop it so it's something we're all used to, no scrubby free DPFADCs for us T_T]. The old spiral lost invincibilty so late into the move that it wouldn't get stopped by long active frames generally- it would be more mashed jabs or quick moves that stopped it.

Her damage buff is a lovely buff, and I along with the rest of the Rose players are overjoyed. However, this damage buff applies to her BnB normals, of only which one is generally used for footsies [cr.mp], and the damage buff merely puts her BnB damage on par with the majority of the weaker end of the cast's BnBs [her old cr.lp did 20 damage. lol ok] It's a nice buff, but it only applies to the close game, of which is already a weak close game anyway. No improved frame data means all you have to do is crouch tech still- comebacks with Rose are not free XD.

Her fireball recovery buff hasn't been noticed too much purely because of how slow they still are, but I have been able to block more often from slightly higher jump ins, so that's definitely nice, but it's still a poor fireball.

Her U1 is slightly quicker and has become slightly more viable for anti airing, though it's never going to be a case of 'throw a fireball, they jump it, I U1'- it's still going to require an FADC and the frames on that scenario, due to her monstrous dashes mean negligible differences there. It has however become a potentially good anti air in general- so Rose players definitely should all be picking up UCW from now on, as her orbs aren't used for damage anyway.

Added juggle properties to her soul spiral aren't even too practical outside of a corner reflect into soul spiral to keep corner positioning. However the old ending with soul throw did leave for a nice safejump mixup that will be lost from doing this- so time will tell whether or not this buff is a buff worth implementing.

Overall I feel Rose will not change on the tiers, because she hasn't had any changes to help her with bad matchups. Bad matchups will still completely steamroll her and her honest poking reversal-less game. Rufus will still have his way with her, and the extra 35ish damage on her BnB will mean nothing. She hasn't got fireballs that recover enough for a full projectile zone so she'll have to keep playing her own unique style the same way she has since AE.

Though personally, my favourite 'buff' this version is her new U2 input. NO MORE EX REFLECT. Honestly. The number of games I've lost due to that bug... Thank god that's gone.

Just my two cents as a Rose mainer since Vanilla, sir.

#29
EG2 said on June 19, 2014 at 8:58 a.m.

Well said. Agree completely.

#30
rosy said on June 19, 2014 at 9:39 a.m.

yea, I totally agree what he said.

#31
Sabin said on June 19, 2014 at 10:17 a.m.

I feel like Rose players are in denial with her buffs, shes soooo much improved its not even funny. I wish Dhalsim had half of her bffs, shes a completely changed character

#32
Wedge said on June 19, 2014 at 11:26 a.m.

"Her U1 is slightly quicker and has become slightly more viable for anti airing, though it's never going to be a case of 'throw a fireball, they jump it, I U1'-."

WROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG. That is EXACTLY what it is like now. I land that alllll day and it's hilarious. And the added juggle property to SS is a big deal, since cr/clHP xx HP reflect > EX SS is now a great go to punish for 1 meter at mid-screen. She still has problems with some of the strong rushdown characters, but against anyone else it is way easier to win now. Overall she's a better character because prior evenish matchups are now much more to her advantage.

#33
WongFactor said on June 19, 2014 at 11:28 a.m.

"she can be os all day long on wakeup with grabs. "

Can someone explain how to do this?

#34
kingmedicine said on June 19, 2014 at 11:50 a.m.

I somewhat agree with Luffy, I think Rose suffers from a lot of the same problems that she had before, though he's focusing on the damage buff the real problem/bonus is the buff/nerf to ex spiral. Characters that rush her down really easily can still pressure her for free as long as they play it safe, and just throw her in anticipation of EX spiral and so she gets knocked down and can continue to be pressured for free. Now where i disagree with Luffy is when he says shes "exactly the same" she's better for sure.

#35
kingmedicine said on June 19, 2014 at 11:52 a.m.

If you anticipate an EX spiral on Rose's wake up you can throw her out of it the same way Balrog can be thrown out of EX dash punch. Spiral got more strike invincibility but lost all throw invincibility.

#36
keroberus2 said on June 19, 2014 at 12:16 p.m.

Pretty specific range for the clr.hp reflect to EX SS for mid screen relative to the character sizes- it doesn't seem to be a 100% consistent punish, at least from my own experience anyway.

I've not experienced situations with my AA U1s that didn't feel like it wouldn't have worked before the U1 buff. If people jump after you throw a F fireball then it would have anti aired pre buff- anti air U1ing only happens when the opponent reads the fireball you throw badly- at least in my experience.

Alas, I hope I, with more time in Ultra [spent more time working on Elena and Hugo as opposed to Rose for now, but going back to sticking with Rose]I see the buffs to be less situational buffs. Regardless of how she turns out though, I'm not dropping her.

#37
keroberus2 said on June 19, 2014 at 12:19 p.m.

I wouldn't say I'm in denial, I'd say some of her buffs are good [U2 fix, damage buff to make her BNB do some form of damage, people die slightly quicker due to these buffs, and a slightly more applicable AA], but of course, I can't say I'm on the same level as someone like Luffy or you, despite my grinding.

Feel pretty bad for Dhalsim players, he's always been shafted in my opinion. Hell, even my beautiful Dan's got a viable new B+HK button that does so much.

#38
MagnetoHalfway said on June 19, 2014 at 1:34 p.m.

I have mained Rose since Vanilla and I agree with Luffy. The buffs are nice, I agree this is a better version of the character, but she struggles just the same in her bad match ups.

#39
McAl said on June 19, 2014 at 2:01 p.m.

Take back all those buffs except the improved downwards hitbox for close MK in exchange for an improved fireball game. That's all Rose really needs. Crouching HP needs a little tweaking so it can be used on the ground for punishes more often.

#40
cerberusfx said on June 19, 2014 at 2:47 p.m.

Combofiend if you read these comments please don't change Rose back to a defensive/footsie oriented character. I prefer as an offensive/footsie oriented character.

She will have bad matchups no matter what. You can't give her everything and hope to keep eveything she already has the same. People need to realize that she can't be played the same anymore during her wakeup and she also has far more options at midscreen than before.

Being able to bypass fireballs / stop on reaction dive kicks or just totally disrespect your opponent's space with just an EX spiral is something Rose needed. She just was way too honest before and you couldn't much against meaty attacks or w/e. Characters like Ryu could just use cl.HK to blow both your reversal and your backdash, same thing with Dudley's f+HP, etc.

She can win fireball wars with MP Spark + Reflect alone, her new cl.MK allows her for devastating damage if landed on counter hit...I think people haven't grinded enough the new Rose we have. Some might find things that are actually ridiculous with her. I know I have. They are not maybe easy as cr.MP, cr.MP, st.MP xx DP from Yun but they can still shift momentum in a battle.

Now she can blow stuff away and still make them eat 200stun. At footsie range, any OS into EX Spiral is 200dmg+/300stun+. In a game where offensive tools are way more effective than defensive tools, what more do you want ?

Don't get me wrong, I cannot say I would've made Rose exactly this way. But I cannot say she will stay the same or even still at mid tier. She will maybe struggle in other matches but in general I definitely feel she got buffed.

#41
rosy said on June 19, 2014 at 8:02 p.m.

Well, let us hope there are some rose player could make it on tournament spotlight like luffy. Not by show result on online match only.

#42
SpinningPileDriver said on June 21, 2014 at 12:12 a.m.

Good lord, you guys. So much denial.

The new EX spiral is GODLIKE. It is absolutely DOMINANT in the neutral game now. It blows up any fireball or non block string.

If in AE, you did wakeup EX spiral a lot, and it beat throws, good for you. You were a bad Rose player. That junk was booty and lost to EVERY setup.

In ultra, if you get thrown out of EX spiral, you take 130 damage, lose an EX meter, and have to do wakeup or delay wakeup. That's much preferable than EX spiral simply losing, or worse, you eating full combo after its blocked.

At least it's invincible till it hits, so you can FADC back if you need to.

The damage buff on B&B is great, but people fail to realize other things:

1) the dash buff means her FADC to cr.fierce combos are easier. This Jumps her damage into the 300s for two meters.

2)The juggle for spiral is crazy good. She gets a midscreen punish combo boost of 30 damage.

3) She can pick up lots of bonus damage from anti air fireballs, U2, soul piede with EX drill. Extra bonus, in the corner you can do reflect, drill instead of soul throw in order to keep them cornered.

4) the greater emphasis on neutral means Rose has more time where she's at advantage with her pokes, doing damage.

This is the best Rose in SF4. much stronger than in Super.

#43
RosePlayer said on June 21, 2014 at 11:11 a.m.

FINALLY a pro Rose player is speaking out about by her. I totally agree with everything that Luffy is saying. I've been using Rose since Vanilla to Ultra. Her buffs are nice but she plays exactly the same. If you get rushed down, good luck using those buffed moves. Using her ex-soulspiral as a wakeup? Just wait til you get thrown out of it because players are learning that new trick against her like they did with Balrog. Consider the variety of moves and changes that other characters have gotten over the years and then look at Rose not much has changed. So you say Rose got Hp reflect > Ex-soul spiral that's nice but unless your just showboating its not really practical in the heat of a fight. Good luck trying to connect it then. I keep hearing her ground moves are better. True but other characters who had better ground game still do and will generally trump her game. Is she stronger in the game? Yes. But so is everybody else so it all balances out. No one wants a win all move but this is Ultra, the latest incarnation of SF4, give her some thing new. Hell i dont know a wall bounce after an HP soul throw , an armor move something cool. Blah, Blah, Blah.... just my IMO

#44
Izuna_Wolf said on June 22, 2014 at 12:38 a.m.

Dude I use rose and I refuse to believe that she jumped up any tiers like everyone else keeps saying.Luffy said her bad matchups stayed the same or got worse mainly because of her EX spiral being grabable...which means you literally just have to grab her on wakeup and GG

#45


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