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Ryu Apprentice expresses theory of why fake cross ups and corner unblockables exist in SSF4 AE v2012

Posted by Catalyst
December 10, 2013 at 7:40 p.m. PST

Ryu Apprentice has posted a new video offering up a theory of why fake cross ups and corner unblockables may exist in Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition v2012.

He proposes that it has something to do with the game reversing how your inputs are read, therefore when you hold back, you're actually holding forward, instead of blocking.

It's important to note that Ryu Apprentice says this isn't the case with all unblockables, just some of them.

Hit the jump to see the video and full rundown of the theory.

Submitted by Vandylizer.

Comments

Darc_Requiem said on December 10, 2013 at 7:45 p.m.

Could it be that the system that causes attacks to auto correct contributes to unblockables?

#1
DannyBoyPERU said on December 10, 2013 at 7:47 p.m.

Perhaps !

#2
BlackOnyxThunder said on December 10, 2013 at 8:01 p.m.

I like that thumbnail Eventhubs...

#3
elecshield said on December 10, 2013 at 8:07 p.m.

Fascinating

#4
SeaJay said on December 10, 2013 at 8:42 p.m.

Ryu Apprentice puts in so much work in the lab and provides us with some awesome tech...
this theory is a very interesting one

#5
draw2 said on December 10, 2013 at 9:10 p.m.

I thought the Gen unblockables were because...

...you cannot dodge, what you cannot see!!!

:P

#6
Stickyresin said on December 10, 2013 at 9:29 p.m.

Doubtful. Auto-corrects are caused by the large special move input buffer, and I don't see how that affects blocking. Unless blocking is also somehow buffered on wakeup, but that makes zero sense...

The hitbox shift theory made perfect sense because it's not that they are actually unblockable, it's just that it physically hits you from the opposite side you are blocking no matter how you hold block. However, after seeing the first Gen unblockable example in this video I don't know what to think anymore.

#7
neopyro said on December 10, 2013 at 10:36 p.m.

@draw2 #6

+1, good one :D

#8
IMainDanHibiki said on December 10, 2013 at 11:33 p.m.

I hate you for this. I have no choice but to +1.

#9
xianmsg said on December 11, 2013 at 12:15 a.m.

Good stuff

#10
Black1chaos said on December 11, 2013 at 12:21 a.m.

Very interesting Theory, Players like Ryu Apprentice show how much these game can grow

#11
sarif2soon said on December 11, 2013 at 12:33 a.m.

Do you know now how the tech you use works?
:P

#12
Q80Warlock said on December 11, 2013 at 12:34 a.m.

Unless Capcom shows us ublockables done with hitboxes/hurtboxes view-able. There is no accurate way to find out what's happening but current it seems that hurtbox shift around. Capcom also didn't explain how did they patch them out in SFxT making them always blockable.

#13
Ryu_Apprentice said on December 11, 2013 at 12:49 a.m.

I was advocating for a fix similar to SFxT but after extensive testing I would rather have the unblockables in than the SFxT fix to be applied.

If you attempt anything remotely close to an unblockable your attack will wiff totaly its so freaking wierd. the SFxT fix created alot of inconsistencies in jump in attacks that it is not funny

#14
Sasuga said on December 11, 2013 at 1:14 a.m.

At Capcom they should know this. Make a build where autocorrect is removed and see if unblockables still exist.

Then remove autocorrect regardless. ^_^

It doesn't make sense, tho. The game only reverses inputs when the opp switches to the other side, right?

#15
HADdaHUSTLA said on December 11, 2013 at 1:17 a.m.

I don't think it's fixable.

#16
Eye_of_Orochi said on December 11, 2013 at 1:22 a.m.

I would love if auto correct was gone. Not like I've never been auto corrected but I dislike relying on it...

#17
Remondo02 said on December 11, 2013 at 1:28 a.m.

Interesting theory, the mechanic of the game is really weird in many ways...

#18
Jevali said on December 11, 2013 at 1:49 a.m.

well the centre body shifting glitch is (seemingly) a pretty straight forward glitch to fix. Even if this issue is different, I'd be interested to know how fixing the other glitch would affect this setup.

#19
caruga said on December 11, 2013 at 3:17 a.m.

I've always assumed it was the 'auto-correct' mechanic applying to blocking and/or walking. Which it really shouldn't.

#20
Bossman said on December 11, 2013 at 4:51 a.m.

What he said is practical when the character react to a cross up it basically depends on direction, the system will auto correct, so the question is how fast the system reacts, this is something capcom need to look into because I’ve seen allot of times characters get up from a knock down and not know if to go south or north.

#21
chubbyfingerz said on December 11, 2013 at 6:11 a.m.

Ryu Apprentice you are the bee's knees, the cat's pajamas, you rule

#22
Jason said on December 11, 2013 at 6:57 a.m.

Combofiend said that there were two different mechanics that cause unblockables. One that they've already figured out and fixed and one that still exists in the current build of USF4.

#23
Kijui said on December 11, 2013 at 7:49 a.m.

This affects characters at certain distances, too. When I practicing Koryu FADC combos with Dan, if I DC foward from a raw Koryu at gunpoint, he'll briefly pass by the opponent, forcing me reverse my inputs, which is hard to do when you aren't expecting it/I can't delay the follow-up otherwise it will miss anyway.

When that happens, H Danku becomes cl.HK (which DOESN'T juggle), neutral jump MP hits AWAY from the opponent, but double dashing may or may not stay the same. Missing the follow-up because of system BS has cost me and my Siblings of Saikyo dearly. Its a momentum killer.

I've had times where I've backdashed only to have it autocorrect me to my doom. There are times where I get stuffed for doing a late jump when the goal was to bait a move...

I think the same principles apply with neutral responses, as well. I think that whole center focus thing is necessary (the bonus stages are tribute to free movement in SF, its terrible), but the forcing of reversing or seemingly reversing inputs should be addressed. I hate the fact that when I expect a cross-up it isn't, and when I don't it is. I know how to block and adapting isn't a problem, but when it becomes less of know-how and more of a system flaw, it becomes hard to deal with.

Next thing you know, the basics become difficult to deal with, and the unexplained conditions us for that. SF games have a history of "That shouldn't work" mechanics, but this whole back and forth thing has been a huge problem for me for a while. I really hate getting knocked down because I know BS is going to pursue, and playing an "honest" character like Dan who requires time and distance to set-up is too straight-foward to benefit from this. No foward moving normals, and a cross-up that MUST hit late crushes any broken versatility he may have.

#24
Q80Warlock said on December 11, 2013 at 11:45 a.m.

Worst inconsistency is having fake crossups mid-screen always blockable but very hard to block the followups.

One thing interesting thou about SFxT is crossups no longer push away the attacker which was a universal behavior with previous SF's with the exception of SF4 where crossups push you away. Maybe that was part of the unblockable fix ?

#25


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