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Seth and Dee Jay Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition v2012 tutorials from Cross Counter featuring Online Tony and BlaQSkillZ

Posted by SFilp • December 17, 2012 at 8:20 p.m. PST
The guys at CrossCounterTV have uploaded some great tutorials for both Seth and Dee jay in Super Street Fighter Arcade Edition v2012.

These are some great basic tutorials here from both DMG|Online Tony and BlaQSkillZ, followed by some specific matchup guides for Seth against various cast members.

Comments

Brillz said on December 17, 2012 at 8:26 p.m.

(This comment was removed by a moderator.)

#1
RebornOdin said on December 17, 2012 at 10:27 p.m.

Seth basics: Put your opponent into "50-50" mixups which are more "80-20" mixups due to having a disproportionate risk:reward ratio outside of your godly 7 frame invulnerable shoryuken, repeat until you win.

#2
Aluppoj said on December 17, 2012 at 10:33 p.m.

@2

Lol, "80-20", I like it.

#3
DandyCheeks said on December 17, 2012 at 11:35 p.m.

Theyre closer to 50/50s due to his health. If your opponent guesses right you die way faster than they do. But whatever man. People that don't know the matchup always complain. He isn't even top tier.

#4
Eternal said on December 18, 2012 at 12:19 a.m.

@DandyCheeks I guess you didn't notice the damage output Seth was doing on those mixups, Seth gets 250-350dmg BnBs without meter or doing any really difficult links. Most characters BnBs are around 230-260 dependin on the character.

Look at it like this. Character A has 200 life and does 150 damage per hit. Character B has 300 life and does 100 damage per hit. Both characters are now effectively the same potential health, any time character A hits character B he is doing half of the total health of character B, and vice versa. Then you tack on more ways for character A to hit character B, and more ways for character A to avoid being hit by character B under the pretense of "character A has low health"

That is generally why pixie characters with strong combos always end up being top tier in most fighting games while grapplers tend to fall to the bottom. Not a hard set rule of course, but a common occurrence.

#5
JIHADJOE said on December 18, 2012 at 2:37 a.m.

@Dandycheeks
In this case I think 50/50 or 80/20 is referring to the outcome of just one particular mixup, not the match in general. The matter of whether Seth needs 4 mixups to kill you, and you need 2 to kill him can be treated independently of the mixup itself.

#6
Aluppoj said on December 18, 2012 at 4:08 a.m.

Which in most cases is a false statement. Because two full combo mix ups will usually lead to stun. And the 3rd free combo usually nets Seth the "PeRfEcT".

He is a risky character to use because of his health. But when used accurately and aggressively he can dominate EVERY character in this game!

It's not like Cammy vs Akuma or somthing. Seth is more akin to Ibuki, where if he knocks you down, and is permitted to run his guessing game it DOES NOT MATTER what character you've chosen. They'll all get destroyed.

Obviously the one caviot to that statement is that characters with better wake up options stand a better chance.

In the end Seth does what he was designed to do. He either completely dominates, or gets dominated. All depends on how effectivly the player can employ his tactics.

Btw, I'm not angry at Seth. Most Seth's online aren't good enough with the character to exploit the characters inherit cheapness. So he's mostly no problem. But omg if you run into someone like Tony lol. You can put the stick/pad down and go get a snack:) it'll all be over soon.

Cheers.

#7
sdfkuhiuhsdf said on December 18, 2012 at 4:12 a.m.

(This user was banned.)

#8
Jedda678 said on December 18, 2012 at 7:52 a.m.

For characters without a teleport or solid reversal, essentially are FORCED to do his mix-up game on knockdown. Cody, Sakura, Rufus, Hakan, T.Hawk etc. characters who have to spend EX meter to have a solid wake up or even spend 3 bars to make it safe have the worst time against Seth. It isn't that his low-health justifies the crazy options he has (Remember AE Yun?) People complained he wasn't good, and when Capcom buffed him to this point he became godlike. Most players agree, Seth, Fei, Cammy, Akuma and generally in the top 5-6 characters of the game. Although Ibuki has similar mix-ups as well (just minus the dive-kick) with her kunai and ambiguous cross-ups she doesn't do nearly as much damage as Seth can but most match-ups she is 5/5 on or roughly averaging that if I can recall correctly.

I'm not salty about Seth, I've beaten my fair share of them and been bodied by a lot since I use Cody and Gouken most of the time. Guessing correctly is hard when he nearly has 3-4 options on your wake-up. If Capcom does a balance patch again after SFxT or DSR I hope Seth gets tweaked a bit more, although even admittedly this is the best version of SSF4 so far, while some may argue vanilla super was the best.

#9
RebornOdin said on December 18, 2012 at 8:31 a.m.

Just so you know, having low health is not a justification for being really good offensively. That statement doesn't even make sense now considering that Seth had the lowest health in the game and had a decent (But nothing stellar) defensive capabilities. The whole reason why Seth works is he has safe setups that lead into his mix-ups. Hope you like taking guesses on when Seth is going to do his completely safe on block Tandem Engine, because if you guess wrong he's going to shoryuken you. Don't worry, Seth will let himself in with his off-the-wall jump, decent forward dash, and teleport.

Pulling out even further, dive kicks have a low risk for very high reward. They disrupt the flow of the game because they purposely counter both crouch-techs and anti-airs, especially with Rufus and him not having any air restriction on his dive kick. You can argue that dive kicks are fine in Third Strike because of parries. (Though parries are really a bad mechanic in that game anyways due to the character selection and the majority of the characters not being designed with Parries in mind *CoughRemyCough*) Dive kicks don't have a hard counter like the rest of the game's inner workings do. Look at how good Cammy INSTANTLY got once everyone discovered her dive kick, and then look how good she STILL got when they nerfed her and she was still top tier. At absolute best (And even this is a stretch), you could say that grapplers counter dive-kicks, but every dive kick character still has good buttons to keep grapplers out. It's not like Rufus doesn't have a good anti-air, his c.MP takes care of pretty much everything. In my opinion, they should've made Rufus have no anti-air normals, even though his s.HP is a stretch.

I know I'm going off on a tangent here, but the whole point I'm trying to make is that both it doesn't matter how much health your character possesses if they have little to no bad match-ups and that Capcom's answer to defensive play nowadays is to just throw in a really safe, abusable normal just because it was in Third Strike.

#10
100thMonkey said on December 18, 2012 at 8:33 a.m.

lol @ seth not being top tier

#11
DougQuaidHauser said on December 18, 2012 at 9:05 a.m.

@ 100thMonkey

LOL I agree, the same way Cammy users say she isn't top tier.

Something has to be done as these mixup characters are beggining to rule the roost now.........either nerf them or leave them and buff a lot of the rest of the cast.

#12
Donald_K_Bahls said on December 18, 2012 at 9:33 a.m.

Deejay focus is pretty much the only way to defeat a good Akuma. You have to think levels upon levels ahead to be good with Deejay, which is why people don't use him.

#13
JAYstarrah said on December 18, 2012 at 9:53 a.m.

Give Queen-Li a vortex.

#14
SuperStraightFighter said on December 18, 2012 at 3:20 p.m.

The difference between seth and Akuma is that seth's health actually matters and makes a difference, Akuma although having poor health, have extremely good stuff for everything else, which makes the hp trade off neglectible.

#15
MingoDynasty said on December 18, 2012 at 3:25 p.m.

@9: I'd have to disagree with this statement "[Ibuki] doesn't do nearly as much damage as Seth". With proper execution (see Sako, lol), Ibuki's damage/stun output is possibly one of the highest in the game. Seth only does big damage when he burns a lot of meter, meanwhile Ibuki can already match it meterless.

Also don't forget the power of Seth's SPD and Tandem Engine, two very powerful options that Ibuki does not have. If you have superb blocking skills, there's not that much Ibuki can do to open you up and maintain "infinite" pressure, unlike what Seth can do.

#16
Aluppoj said on December 18, 2012 at 3:34 p.m.

Why the fu<k does everyone call it "Tandem engine"? Like his stomach is a bicycle built for two!?!

It's TANDEN folks.

#17
sarif2soon said on December 19, 2012 at 3:31 a.m.

lol, i used the same "trick" that tony uses. i was playing against a Guy that was focusing against my sonic booms. i got fed up and punished him with a full screen ultra 1. still lost (just like every game i played against him), and he was a jerk about it.

#18
dsfwedfher said on December 19, 2012 at 3:53 a.m.

(This user was banned.)

#19
abcllkkf said on December 19, 2012 at 6:47 a.m.

(This user was banned.)

#20
JimmyLoves said on December 19, 2012 at 7:15 p.m.

Out of all the "tutorial" videos i have seen, online tony's is by far the best. I hope he makes more of them for other Seth matchups. He really seems to know the character very well...

It's hard to believe the guy doesn't place better at tournaments considering he has great knowledge of the game. Must be execution or nerves. Either way, hope he makes some more vids soon.

#21


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