UPDATE: A bunch of notes have been added into the story since it became live.
Vergil
"If you get hit while the swords super is active, the swords will disappear."
That sucks
Yeah, that is stupid. If thats the case the same thing should happen to Strider when he gets hit he should lose his orbs.
http://neoempire.com/forum/showpost.php?
s=dd14127d2faa945a36b96d1560739265&p=413019&postcount=253
"Modok's flight seems shorter but that's about it for me, he's got 1 less action in the air too."
@3 its really not that bad. think about how much dante is hit when he is played well. with vergil having a teleport, the swords disappearing if he is not a huge deal. im guessing he doesnt have a ton of health so it will turn out to be a good balance since it looks like he has some good stuff going for him and the community will find ways to maximize his potential since hes so popular.
great stuff on here can't wait to here some jill and wesker stuff in here. Jill and wesker are great mix up characters. Would like if jill had her wall climb like she had in Resident 5.
@ 1
Seth pretty much said that in the angry joe vid. The Vanilla MvC3 players got screwed. They are basically getting nothing but experience for buying it early and for full price eventhough Capcom knew more was coming.
THEY NEED TO SLOW DOWN WESKERS OTG ASSIST!
It's WAY WAY WAY TOO GOOD!
need...morrigan...trish info and v.joe confirmation. NEED IT!
@14 jill with a wall climb sounds soooo goood.
also is it just me or would sabretooth totally clean up in this game? not petitioning, just thinking about dat engine...
I can't believe they nerfed zero you already have to work hard enough with him he wasn't really to strong and removing the DHC glitch is already a nerf to him they should have left him alone
why is zero being picked on so much? hes getting nerfs left and right.
they don't need to slow down wesker otg they need to dumb down his health. He does way to much damage for med size character and with chris redfield health in vanilla. They can lower the damages on his normals a tad bit but of they take away his mix up game then thats a damn shame. Still going to use him, but still a damn shame.
zero jumping H to me was bullcrap cuz of the range and how it can hit with great priority but other than that he does not need any other nerfs
That's a LOT of information. Hopefully we'll get a complete list covering every character.
i like the locks and allowances they're making. alot of the stuff makes sense. i also like how the fighting game revival is in full swing for the new century. which means the complaints we make in every other genre can now be applied now? i thought we loved america.
you're right. if they aren't gonna make what we want, they might as well not make anything.
Flipping FINALLY. That one Phoenix change was what I wanted. Limiting her air actions was icing. Delicious icing.
Interested in knowing more Tron changes. I'm one of those weird peeps who like her on point, so Gustaff Fire assist nerf isn't that much of a deal breaker for me. I know she's supposedly gotten a recovery buff on Drills and is able to chain Servbot Launchers, as well as a nerf on her j.H because it knocks people farther away.
Im surprised that zero has been nerfed this hard, he wasnt that powerful to begin with (basically a wolverine with higher execution but worse damage). so far theyve taken away two of zeros main tools and have given him nothing back.
with his "anywhere on the screen" BnB removed hopefully zero can still do his [ABCS j.2Cxxj.C] starter. if the j.C pushback isnt so severe.
I mean, its like they are dumbing this game down execution wise (which was never that high specially on some chars like wolverine).
off the top of my head:
Magnetos slowed movement will probably either remove the ROM loop or slow it down (making it easier)
taskmasters assistless arrow lift has also been stripped from the game before people could execute it consistently in a real match
dantes dumbed down rekkas will make his combos baby mode to perform now (the tighter timing probably wont make that much of an impact since you only have to input the motion once)
Zeroes Shipuuga loop now removed so the relatively easy charge switching is probably no longer necessary to learn.
I know they already mentioned that they didnt want the game to be so intensive in terms of execution but pulling off those crazy combos in the heat of a match is one of the factors that makes this game fun.
infinites are one thing but its apparent that capcom doesnt want people doing the long combos in favor of the easy ABCS BBCS combos. If they were looking into nerfing characters effectiveness they could have given a universal damage/meter building reduction so at least people could still work for their damage and keep the risk of dropping combos in the game
Why they don't just remove Phoenix from the game? With so many nerfs no one will prefer using her. She is my favorite character and I have to say she is totally unplayable right now. Next nerf will be the "Sudden Death" hit aka one hit kill. Lol...
STOP F*CKIN NERFING ZERO, CRAPCOM. geez, he wasnt even that good. this isnt a rebalance anymore, its a complete tier swap between the characters.Vergil's swords go away if he gets hit? i guess i agree, although i think if a Vergil spends another gauge after activation to use them in a different fashion, they shouldn't. lmao phoenix nerfed again? GOOOOOOD! XD. but yea, all Capcom is doin to Zero is giving him less overall depth than WHAT LITTLE HE HAD ALREADY.theyre just dumbing down characters and making them EVEN LESS CHALLENGING TO MASTER TO THE FULLEST, by lowering their potential! not cool,Capcom. Angry Joe: -_-......*points* "STOP IT!"
Zero also got buffed!
He can now cancel his special moves with his buster. That means that in the middle of his command dash he can throw out a buster for an instant 50/50 mix up
He can still do his 700k combos, plus his priority is still better than anyone else
The pheonix nerf the health was too much but the two special in the air an orbs disappearing is a welcome change since all scrubby Pheonix players use that technique. It will force real pheonix players to play smart and not cheesy.
I never mind playing Pheonix teams but it was really a headache playing againts her in vanilla. The run away tactic was a pain and certain teams could'nt compete even with the snap in set ups, if you mess up you just end up losing meter and they keep gaining.
@ 23 wesker is strong because he's a enhanced biological freak and all his natural abilities are supernaturally augmented beyond human capabilities, it took 2 rocket propelled granades to supposedly “kill” him. so the the devs probably took this into consideration when balancing his health and damage stats.
#35
pretty much got the point
if capcom was worried about a characters damage output/meter gain they should nerf that aspect in the sense that they would reduce his overall output by #% not by removing his combo that dealt damage.
i would personally welcome a stricter hit stun decay system. make the window as small as possible if you want but dont freaking take it away.
at this point it looks like capcom is taking away the "curleh mustache" in the game
I hate nerfs for some characters, I think the only thing that should nerfed is the damage and speed. Taking away characters moves will lead to not making the character viable to who they are. Which defeats their purpose.
Thor sounds good, he does need something extra, plus they need to speed him up a bit because he moves slower than Hulk. Thor is probably the slowest character in the game, but in comics he's actually a bit faster.
Zero is so annoying. One combo eats up like 10 seconds, and you just sit there while you get hit 5 times with every move.
Oh good, a moderate increase in Hsien-Ko's walkspeed really is all she needed to be viable!
But seriously, what does CAPCOM have against Chun-Li these days? We're getting flooded with all this information on Ryu's changes: his new god-mode level one Hyper, his new Shoryuken (like anyone will use it regardless), his invisible fireballs (which are considered a glitch in other games). And no love for the First Lady?
Why they keep nerfing Zero!
He is perfect the way he is in MvC3. He need great excecution to do damage like no one in the game (wolv, phoenix, hulk, sentinel, wesker, etc.).
Come on Capcom he didn't need nerfs nor buffs.
Also great to see info on Dante & Vergil.
Talking about Vergil, the round trip will be easy to pull off because the experience I have with Zero's buster.
I'm super salty they shouldn't nerf anyone just buff weak characters
And all would be good lord zero has to work like a slave to do serious damage and now they nerf him... Phoenix is bout
To be F Tier
@11 I understand what you are saying, I think he will still be a great character maybe = or > Dante, but damn I just thought since its activation time is already short, it would almost seem useless to use it out of no where. but your right.
Um.
GOod, Phoenix should lose her fireballs when she gets hit. I used to use her before everyone decided to "SHOT SHOT SHOT," and I just feel way too cheap using her (in addition to the default cheapness with Dark Phoenix). Maybe this'll lessen my guilt.
And yo, let's get a little more love for Hsien-Ko. Damage IS also a huge issue.
What are the benefits of She-Hulk's new move? I know her slide is shorter... but.
I will Rise Again..............(wait damn maybe not) So now the one fire ball I had to protect me in a teleport will no longer protect me? Oh hell naw!!!!! Phoenix force leaves Jean and enters Dr. Strange
Keep in mind, some of you, that this is the first time EVER that a "Versus" title has EVER gotten a "special edition", as far as the traditional crossover of Capcom with Marvel is concerned. Most people who have followed this particular series of fighting games know to expect it from Street Fighter games, of course, and a few Capcom versus SNK games, sure, but never when Capcom crosses with Marvel in their respective "Versus" series of games. This is a first for MVC, even though it DOES look and sound familiar from every angle, only because we're used to seeing it with Street Fighter games, in general. So of course, you would not expect "another" MVC3 at all, nor to ever have to speak of MVC3 in terms of being called "Vanilla". as old and familiar as it feels, this is actually new. In THIS particular "what if?" universe of storyline, the Marvel and Capcom "Versus" series consists of XMVSF, MSHVSF, MVC, MVC2, MVC3, and UMVC3, and while each game's storline differs in a lot of ways from the others, they are not the first ones to cross characters between the two franchises. Gouki/Akuma was in XM:COTA as a hidden playable character, but had no storyline for himself in that game. He was even in Cyberbots as "Zero Gouki", a big Gouki/Akuma-shaped mech. Anita, the little girl who follows Donovan around in the Darkstalkers/Vampire game series was a hidden character in MSH, and in my opinion, is one of the cheapest playable characters in any fighting game EVER made, to this day. Do consecutive "doll head" supers, one after the other, after maxing out your super meter, and you'll see what I mean. Thanos, the last boss, as a playable character is SECOND cheapest ever in this category, simply because when you play with him, he plays with his special moves at "boss" levels/strengths and are highly and easily spammable. With specials like his, who needs supers? Devilot, whom most people know from Puzzle Fighter games, was originally from Cyberbots, but was playable in Kikaioh/Tech Romancer. I'm off topic, slightly, but anyway. Someone's gotta school the youngsters. XD
Why oh WHY did they take away Zero's loop and make j.H pushback farther?
That makes NO sense. Zero does alot of hits, but in return, his damage output is low, so WHY would they take tools away from him? Braindead characters like Wolverine and Wesker can have all the damage they want with NO EFFORT, but Zero, who requires GREAT execution to do good damage gets screwed and needs to work harder?
Well im just tired of people who think they can win because they pick te cheap character, then quit becaus their predicable habits don't work. Never fails. My matches usually go like this on a typical day/night.
Me vs. Wolverine, Akuma, Dante.
5 wins later...
Me vs. Wesker, Akuma, Sentinel
10 wins laer...
Me vs. Dormmamu, Doom, Deadpool (Keep away)
15 Wins later...
Me vs Team Whatever + Pheonix
16 Wins...
Rage Quit.
Yeah, i'll miss vanilla MvC3.....not.
Oh Nyoro I wanted to point out this:
• Ryu's new Shoryuken resembles Gene Splice, except that you can mash S for more hits.
Do you mean "you (can't) mash S for more hits?" Because I thought Cyclops could mash the attack button for more hits too.
#9 Well I am glad Modok is nerfed at least! Was really necessary to balance out the cast tbh
xshonuffx I think you lose alot i mean alot alot!
They shouldn't have nerfed anyone they should have just buffed all the weak characters I swear capcom does stupid
Stuff sometimes maybe Phoenix could get needed maybe really I wouldn't even nerf her but capcom starts getting out of control they are nerfing characters that don't even need it how can you nerf zero buff taskmaster who is in alot of tourney teams capcom is trying to make it feel like a whole new game to much when it's really just a character pack with some bells and whistles so they are trying to change all the characters so people feel like it's this new thing and they need to stop
@8
The big difference is that Strider's is a LEVEL 3.
I'm glad Vergil seems to have some weaknesses to offset his strengths. Seems like y'all just want him to be god tier and sh*t. You know that even with all this, he's gonna be very powerful, but I guess you're just too lazy to work to use that power. No autopilot for you. :'(
Oh, I really want to see what Thor's new move is.
@59.. thank you someone does need to school these youngsters, they're born close to an age where patching is normal, so they don't know what it's like to just have to deal with the hand that's been dealt and learn ways around it. with these updates/patches capcom's giving them, it's a freakin' arm and a leg as opposed to hard work and dedication to learn strats around supposed "cheap" tactics. and at times i agree somethings in the "vs." series are cheap but not unbeatable...these patches sometimes just give whiners too much freakin' leeway.
Yes!! Arthur health boost! This is exactly what he needed.. Well, the only thing he needed. Sadly now that Haggar's assist is going to be vincible for those few frames his lariat assist may prove to be a problem, especially with smaller characters and characters with instant ranged specials. If that's the case, sorry Haggar... Make way for Firebrand, Nemesis or ghost rider.
• First 2 frames of Lariat are not invincible.
That was totally not needed, this version of the game, it doesn't even do hard knockdown anymore.
@81 Yeah the Lariat is one of Haggar's VERY FEW saving graces, it looks like now he's a joke when compared to the rest of the line-up.
Ooh, a wall bounce for Joe? And a new move for thor? excellent!
Zero got nerfed, but got buffed also guys, being able to charge your buster before the match is REALLY useful
I think I stopped playing "vanilla" online after I noticed I had 99 losses. I'll admit, I'm not great at the game and even less so with my hori, but still... it was othing but dantes and spamming deadpools
seemed like most my matches were "Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot! Have gun, will shoot!"
yeah that totally never gets old
@85 Yea but when the characters are horrible characters and the only saving grace is that they have great assist that dosent seems too fair to me. When you are using Haggar or even Tron to an extent as an assist you pretty much have only 2 playable characters on your team. And these characters got some dumb buffs anyways. Seems like they are not going to be on any teams soon.
Hey, I finished up my notes for characters over at SRK.
The analyses for the old characters are here: http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?...
And the new character analyses are on this page: http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?...
Lots of good stuff in there.
@ 70 I agree with you 110% I miss them days sometimes when you had to learn or just get your A handed to you
The next nerf they are gonna give phoenix is as soon as she comes in she just dies and takes 20% of the remaining characters on her teams life away... Was Phoenix op yes it was exciting too but now she's a useless piece of crap seriously crap
So here's what I got from this.
-Haggar is useless now, because as much as lariat was a great assist, he's a terrible character. So why not just choose a character who has a good assist and ISN'T useless when they come out?
-Flame Carpet went from Dormammu's best move to something we will never ever see. He won't be able to zone now because his incredibly area-specific moves don't take up enough screen space, and flame carpet was the only thing that let him zone unless you choose a VERY specific assist to help him, eg missiles or sentinel force. This also makes him one of about 3 characters in the entire game who can't OTG midscreen with basically any assist (probably less since Cap can do that now).
-Phoenix is utterly pointless, you sacrifice all hypers and a slot on your team for a normal, below average character? I already thought only one action may've pushed her down a liiittle too far. Only one fireball was fine, no fireball and teleport would've hurt her badly. But I guess I don't have to worry now because fireballs outright disappearing on hit, on top of the previous changes... Yeah. Confirmed for bottom tier. Poor Jean.
-Dante can do the same things, for less damage, with more strict timing... The only thing overpowered about Dante in Vanilla was the Acid Rain loop which barely anyone could do. Otherwise people complaining were just netplayers who didn't like seeing combos too long which has nothing to do with balance, since they ended up doing the same damage as everyone else anyway (again except for aforementioned Acid Rain loop). So this just completely unnecessarily pushed him down.
-Wesker can still follow up air throw, it's just stricter... I do not see the point in doing this. He still has the exact same potential, you just need to grind training mode longer to do it. This is just putting more emphasis on execution and less on what should make the difference in a match, ie correct reads and strategy. I can understand making something harder to do so something isn't possible (eg less hitstun so you can only follow up with one move and not another) but to just make it stricter for the exact same thing is absolutely, completely pointless.
Yeah, done bitchin'.
If you are using Wildvine as a source, you should change up She-Hulk's notes to include the buffs to Emerald Cannon. Super Armor and new forward movement. Sure, he reported a change in She-Hulk she already had (she can and has dived right through beam supers aimed down at her and grabbed them with her air grab hyper. I've had that happen once too many times) but I trust the validity of a lot of his reports, and it'd make for a lot of info on here.
95
hmm... i didn't get any of that. alot of extremes you got there too.
j/k seriously though i see your point and i'm hyped to play a more strategic MVC3. everyone in the game is good... but in their own way. swear to god. i've been run roughshod by Haggars just as bad Best Friends. we'll all just have to wait and see...
that iron fist launch range does sting like a b!tch tho
I wonder where are the notes on Super Skrull, can't wait to see if there are any new buffs or nerfs. Honestly i feel the Zero nerfs aren't that bad but it does hurt Zero players (like myself) to some degree, mostly the removal of the shippuga loop but I wonder how far does the J.H push the opponent back? Vergil is also sounding pretty fun as is Hawkeye, I can't wait.
Reading these notes gives me flashbacks of reading the changes list for SSF4 AE. I think I've face palmed myself twice reading through them.
lol couldnt help but notice the majority of players bitching about nerfs are zero players.sorry but aside from the maintaining charge during combos his execution is no harder than say wolverine or wesker.his supers do great damage and his attack priority is insane j.H in particular is retarded.some of u make zero sound like he's low tier.
I'm sorry but nerfs are necessary when balancing any fighting game.buffing low tier doesn't change the fact that the tops are too strong.buffing hsienko but leaving phoenix with infinite air actions and fireballs that don't disappear won't change anything cuz phoenix will still run through her as if she was never buffed at all.nerfs have been a mainstay since the sf2 days.any1 that only wants buffs are salty cuz they can't autopilot anymore.
There is definitely no auto pilot for zero but honestly zero never was a low tier character Phoenix I hate nerfs but she was like a real last boss x5 you almost had to if anyone because she can kill 2 characters in seconds but that is what makes it marvel vs capcom it's utterly ridiculous combos insane it isn't SF it's supposed to be insane I think alot of people just want to nerf anyone who causes them a problem and buff anyone who they can't seem to get good with I use most of the cast I love arther he is low tier did I think he needed to be buffed no I do like recording tools to fight new moves ect. But when you start tKing away that is when it gets kinda crappy because all the wildness dumb damage murderous characters is what makes this game so fun to me and all the people I know who play it I think if anything just ban Phoenix from tourneys and bam problem fixed they do it to Oni
They finally gave Thor a buff. I know reports are its a different version of mighty spark that circles around and hits an opponent in the back but that just sounds ...... silly. If it is a spark it had better just be a placeholder for a hammer toss animation that they are still working on. Zero nerf is really not all that bad he is still going to be a monster. Everyone complaining about Haggar and Tron assist nerfs needs to let that go. There is no reason for you to have access to an unlimited combo breaker that comes out even if your point character gets hit. That crap was overly exploited at every tourney including EVO. Lastly ...... Poor ,poor wasted slot jean.
ummm, can anyone explain why im being forced to use rekka with iron fist. i mean why give someone such a terrible launcher that they can't do "my first combo" lol. its watev doe. And to all the "grandpas" talkin bout back in my day needs to realize that when someone gives a product that cost money and its very understandable that a fighter should be very balanced that when its not u fix it however not say "figure a way around that". This game still takes tactics and such but my opponet shouldn't be harder than any fighitng game arcade boss. its like fighting kazuya(tekken2) mvc2 boss,and dictator(sfa3). those are my final boss horros.
#104 Haggar's invincibility on the first 2 frames was NOT needed. I will complain about it because it was Haggars's only saving grace. The invincibility was a trade off for the fact that it DAMAGED HAGGAR EVERY TIME HE USED IT. It's not like you can spam it, because then you'll have a dead Haggar before you know it! I say the invincibility was much needed, unlike Tron, who didn't earn that invincibility at all, so I'm glad it got taken away. But for Haggar, there was no excuse.
Oops I meant vulnerability on the first 2 frames.
@104 It needed to be nerfed. It was an easily abuseable combo breaker that came out even if your point character got hit. It was very derp and needed to go.
@110 It's as bad as you're making it out to be. If they're gonna nerf it anyway, then why make it take away Haggar's life? Besides the fact that it did that in Final Fight?
@73 Yeah, because it's more efficient to spend 3 meters to have the car come and OTG instead of just OTGing with Torpedo into Emerald Cannon. >.>
@ninjanity watch Evo and tell me its not that bad.
In EVO, players take whatever it takes to win. Even glitches. Don't worry, no more Haggar BS for you. :P
@102 yea no, i use all 3 of them, on the same team actually, (i started with Zero and Wesker since the game dropped, & added Wolvy becaue i was tired of the dive kick spammers), Zero's execution is more challenging than either Wesker or Wolvy, so idk wat you're smoking, sir. I have a combo with cheapass Wolvy that gives me a TWO FULL gauges, AND i can end it with a level three doing 985,000 as soon as the match starts. EASY. idc what u say, aside from the Twin dream corner loop/infinite, which no 1 bothers with online, Zero will never see that much damage or meter gaining in ONE combo without EXTREME execution and @ least 4 meters or X-factor. im not sayin Zero is low tier, but when compared to other high tiers like Magneto, Wolvy,Wesker,and She-hulk? Zero's way harder too bitch & nerf over. he didnt need nerfs or buffs imo.
@102 lol "his supers do great damage"? u mean his rekkoha that u HAVE to do an air combo to hit with, and a wat, 320k lv3? thats not very strong. Wesker & Wolvy's lv3s do more damage.
@108 that assist was broken af & definetly needed attention.haggar getting invincibility in Final Fight was the only reason he retained it in the 1st place. be thankful he has any invincibility @ all anymore. ive played too many ppl who get knockdown and then wake up" DERP! HAGGAR ASSIST TIME", that sh*t was weak & im glad its gone now. now its more crucial 4 ppl to know wen to use it instead of blindly throwing it out. & so wat it it takes away life, its an assist, he'll heal, & hes got the 2nd highest amount of health in the game. wat is it, like 1/20th of life hes losing? big deal. most ppl save him 4 last anyway.
Haha @1
and spider-man might have an OTG :O