Tip from KeFFi.
expected them to rank US higher because of a few big names, maybe the average level in the US is just really low
@6
A big part of that is because the community is alot better today then it was years back. Tournaments are now international events, youtube vids/streams spread match notes/character information like wildfire, and big time analysis guys post there stuff all over the net. Think about it, where could u get information about hitboxs in the 90s or early 2000s? Today anyone can get that info in a few mins. That raises the level of ur average xboxlive psn player higher then its every been. All in all its just a really good time to play fighting games.
Lol, it sounds like they're saying most of American players are scrubs. xD
Most people here just don't have the discipline to do something very rigorous and that extends to the training room. =P
Notice how the Japanese do math and science year round, and basically live in the training mode. I'm seeing a pattern.
Also, I'm surprised they live with their parents...thought they were on their own.
Mago's opinion doesnt matter because at this time he had never been to a US tourny for (SF4). its Tokido that im suprised at. he clearly states Europe as being better than US, and he has been to his fair share of US tourneys. it seemed obvious this is something they've all discussed before as they were all in agreement. cant say i agree, but Tokido (being that he plays against these nations) would know better than anyone here who watches from online
Mago played many US players before. not in US, but in Canada and Japan. We really don't know who is better. Maybe they said that because of Alioune.
I think it's not as much as japan being better I just think American players are more emotional so they don't always think as clear everytime you watch a Japanese player he looks so dang calm I think us Americans just get caught up in the moment slot of times and the Japanese so to always be able to think clearer and focus better but heck I'm probably wrong lol
I'm sorry, but who the frack does Europe have? Ryan Heart and??? Desk?
Even with that what has Ryan Heart done? He beat Daigo once and... that's it. Also while Desk's execution skills are impressive, it's will known that he's even unable to attend many tournaments and get much practical exposure.
I'm sorry, but saying that EU is better than NA at SF is like saying NA is better than EU at Quake. The games just aren't really played much in the respective regions.
@21
umm I am American but are you freakin Serious... they Have Luffy and Allione or whatever c'mon be more educated... desk only makes combo vids you sound like u been in the seen for one week... haha sorry about the trolling haha but yea...C'MON!
You it's so funny that the game America loves so much it's so bad at and the game Japan loves Japan is so bad at.
Let me explain:
Obvioulsy US loves SF and Japan who is the best just ranked them #3.
Well Japan's #1 arcade game is actually Tekken. There are twice as many Tekken players in Japan as SF players they love that game to death however when Korea was asked where they would rank players from USA, Japan and Korea they put 1.) Korea, 2.) USA., 3.) Japan.
The irony is too much.
ok well that's nice USA has not had a chance to catch up because we were busy body building doing drugs and having sex, but rest assured the social media will allow for USA to be number one becasue Japan WILL slack. Look at what happened with Western RPGS....one company, Square soft made great RPGS. they merged to Square-enix and now the USA makes probably the best RPGs in the world right now, even Square-Enix agrees. Why, because we were hungry. Now we are DEF hungry with this Genre, and I think USA will come from Behind and come for blood. There is only one place to go when you are on top.
Oh yea, Did I mention Latiff the online player came number 2 and Last Year RICKY ORTIZ came number 2 to the player that this year didn't get number 3
The 3 jap god's...(false gods I say_) are a little bitter that when they come down here a lot of us are rude to them, and that is completely true. I am new to this scene but I will admit that videos I have seen in the past show's USA being more rude to the likes of Daigo than they are of us, so If I was a top player in Japan I would think low of USA due to some kind of salt or dislike. But in General, we are pretty much breaking the barriers of this Genre with Japan and all I can say is that this is a Salty game but if you want to be respected by the best you have to beat the best, and, Show RESPECT
europe (like us and any other country in the world) have so many great players that are unknown because no one watches non-us/jap streams (BECAUSE they're unknown and not as big) or they don't stream at all. maybe they've encountered various good players in europe. who knows.
I still remember Justin and Marn flying to Europe and taking their SBO spots. Mago, Sako and Tokido were just being nice to their hosts when they said that.
Not even Europe believes that nonsense.
Europe doesn't go to EVO, and the few streamed European tournaments I've seen always have Japan/US players dominate. I'm thinking they only said that because they were in Europe at the time.
the statement "europe doesnt go to evo" is bullsh!t, because it costs a fortune and there is no sponsering in europe. aint has anything to do with being good or not.
and US players going down in europe, only Jap player dominate (fuudo etc) and doesn't that looks familiar? right, that's exactly like in the US... funny eh? so they CAN compare it and it's their opinion, that doesn't mean it's set in stone, think what let you sleep at night.
@10
Japanese culture. It's pretty normal for men and women (especially women) to stay at home until they get married. Men less so than women though but men still do it.
Well evo is the best of the best and its not a single elimation tournament so I think it holds a bit of truth in it and the results were such:
1. Fuudo (Fei Long)
2. BrokenTier|Latif (C. Viper)
3. Poongko (Seth)
4. MCZ|Daigo Umehara (Yun)
5. eLive|Kindevu (Yun)
5. MCZ|Tokido (Akuma)
7. WolfKrone (C. Viper)
7. Flash Metroid (Zangief, C. Viper)
9. BLG|Juicebox (Abel, Juri)
9. 801Strider (Makoto, Abel)
9. MCZ|Mago (Fei Long, Sagat)
9. DR Ray (Fei Long)
13. EG|Justin Wong (Rufus)
13. Shiro (Makoto)
13. eLive|RF (Sagat)
13. Evans (Fei Long)
17. TTC|GamerBee (Adon)
17. Hsien Chang (Yun)
17. Xian (Yun)
17. CJ Truth (Fei Long)
17. Alex Valle (Ryu)
17. EG|Momochi (Yun)
17. cc.coL|Filipino Champ (Dhalsim, Seth)
17. cc.coL|Combofiend (Guy)
25. EMP|Sanford Kelly (Unknown)
25. Banana Ken (Ken)
25. Shady K. (Ryu)
25. John Choi (Ryu)
25. BLG|Vangief (Zangief)
25. Snafoo (Unknown)
25. Infiltration (Akuma)
25. Leslie Cheong (Sagat)
So although I think Japan is better I dont think they are as far ahead as was stated. To me a far gap is domination and that kind of skill gap was what the Dream Team 1,2, and 3 did LOL now if
What canadian players came to evo this year and how did they fair other than ryan?
Europe has Dieminion and Ryan Hart two guys who beat the crap outta Daigo.
This is just a hunch, but I think Tokido was translating for Mago, not actually stating his opinion during the last qestion.
Japan = a country
United States = a country
Europe = a Continent!!!!! Jesus!!!!! How many countries does it take to churn up a few Top Players?
I can think of like four great (notable) players from all of Europe. I'm pretty sure the US has Europe beat.
I'm from Europe and I think like one of the earlier comments that they were just being nice to their hosts when they said Europe is better than USA.
I believe that if USA wanna succeed over JPN they need to ditch the rivalry, being less salty about losses and cooperate more. This worked better at MVC3 but when it comes to SF4 Japan is way ahead.
Meanwhile when Dieminion was in Europe he had great showings, being the sole known U.S. competitor in many various sized tournaments (featuring Alioune, Evans, Ryan Hart, Louffy, Starnab etc.) Would be interesting to see more American players travel to Japan and Europe and vice versa. Not just the random 1 or 2 Americans that occasionally make the trip and Ryan Hart being the usual European at EVO.
EVO is no way to judge player ranking. because the US audience is hugh and the home support plays a massive and unfair role. even daigo said the heckling was so much he couldnt raise his game. so no way is EVO a good way to judge, its like sports and the advantage is with US. neutral territory or a smaller scale major is a better way to gauge things.
with that said Japan > USA > Europe. mago and Tokido must have been drunk lol
EUROPE >>>> US.
You heard it from the best folks. Now if only we had the sponsors to go to all the US tournaments we'd body.
lol @ people not being able to accept them saying EU is higher and just saying US is without any proof :P not that ive played in US, but every big streamed tourny is in US.
But nah I don't think EU or US are really that dominant over one another though. Although pretty much every pro gamer that has went to both has said that the EU AVERAGE is way higher than US, but thats cause there are more US players.
But people do think EU is free so it is at least nice to see that.
**Sigh** where do I begin...
#21 - What has Ryan Hart done? He's placed top at Evo multiple times, and placed first at Evo too. With regards to SSFIV, I've watched him play some insane sets with the best players, you just need to look for the matches that were recorded to know what I'm talking about.
#27 - Very true, US is blind to the best players in EU unfortunately.
#29 - They took our SBO spots because we got the game insanely late over here (vanilla). That argument holds zero weight I'm afraid.
#30 What streams were you watching exactly? SVB2010 PR Rog and Daigo got sent home by Europe. Certainly not dominating.
#31 Thank you, the EU doesn't go to EVO argument is BS because it does cost a bloody fortune! We're talking $1500-2000 for the entire trip guys. Hardly pocket money.
#39 - Well done, you know the difference between a country and a continent. What relevance does that have? You do realise that England is like the same size of New York (state) right?
The US population is approximately 301 million, the population of the main contenders in EU (England, France, Belgium, etc) doesn't equate to more than about 100 million.
-----
My personal take on it, someone who has played in all three areas.
The US has more Top level players than EU, but not by a huge amount. It is a much bigger place after all.
Overall, the level in EU of the average player, is better than the average player in the US.
The best players from the US, and EU can and HAVE beaten the best Japanese players, so we're not far off of these guys.
I think you'd all be surprised to see the level between EU, US and JP is actually not as big as you might believe.
The truth is, the comments I've responded to above highlight the ignorance the US has towards the level of players in the EU.
Always using out of date tournament references, using rumours not facts to back up these statements, relying on one or two major players in the US to win all your tournaments to give you gloating rights.
whats funny is, over here in EU, we celebrate US wins over Japan, we actually root for you guys. In return, you just try and shut us down... guess that makes you feel better.
@ Dawgtanian if i remember marn and justin in 2010 went over to europe at ESWC and cleaned house with the best of europe. its on youtube if you're unaware of it. regardless of that, im going to take Tokido's word for it.
also you should speak for yourself when you say US does'nt root for EU against japan. everyone is different and not everyone is a fanboy, some do root for the underdog. i also know for sure some EU root for japan against anyone, especially the US.
I'm so enjoying the tears of the American D-Riders. The Gods have spoken, and they have spoken well, so it's time to STFU!
At after hours in EVO the European team wanted to 5 on 5 vs the US but the US was too scared to play them. They would of gotten bodied, and they knew it, so they turned them down. They only wanted to play the Japanese because it's a win-win situation.
Fact of the matter is,
Fact of the matter is that the only way to truly get exposure and recognition in Street fighter is by beating the Japanese. It's hard for Europeans to do that since they only play them maybe once or twice a year, at best.
US players on the other hand get that exposure on a consistent basis, with home court advantage. That's why you have so many hyped up US players. They beat or won a tourney with the top Japanese in it.
As for Justin and Marn taking Europe's SBO spots. LOL! That was for Vanilla, when Justin was a beast and EU wasn't as good. I'd like to see any US player try that now.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-PqIZHTNz2TQ...
lol^^
btw, I'd rather think of us as ONE community then US, Europe, Jap etc I like Poongko as I like Daigo as I like Mike Ross.
Good for Justin & Marn (who was begging for donations) that they did so good in Vanilla when they were in Europe. Let them try that now.
Europe got the best Rose player in the world. Luffy beat Mago 5-0 in a money match, I don't see any US player do that to Mago.
And there is not one Makoto player in the USA who is on VRyu's level.
And Alioune > than any US player.
What I really would like to see is the 5 best players from Europe vs the 5 best from USA.
@#35
don't use one tournament as a player ranking. lol.
EU doesn't sent that many to Evo. Evo is an American tournament. 95% of players in that tournament are Americans. if you send 10 US players to Japan where 95% players are jp players. the result will be different.
and yeah, Alioune > all US players
If they are talking overall as a whole I believe Europe has a average higher level of play than US but on Pro level US has a higher quantity of pro players....
I spent a year in Asia and can defo say the average level of play there is higher compared to EU and USA.
In their opinions I have to Agree JPN> Europe > States
USA and my country Dominican Republic is over Europa DR Ray TOP 9 in the EVO 2011 showing what is our level....
He is TOP 4 in our league we have player with a hight level in the Street Fighter 4 like
Jochy Focus TOP 1
Sanguienario TOP 2
Braulio Evil TOP 3
DR Ray TOP 4
Coco Cross Over TOP 5
PR Rog came to our country and he know what is our level..
@53 We are ranking countries not players, regardless thats not what I am doing. Im not using one tournament for the most part lately US hasnt been getting dominated and in my opinion the skill gap at the top is decreasing. I chose EVO because its the place where the most variety occured. What other tourney this year had more variety and more top players? So if I rank something and use results from something it has to be the place where the most variety will occur. I know home field plays a role but I have seen US dominate in europe and I have seen japan dominate in US quite a few times so its not an impossible feat.
@43 (see above) everyone in US was under the same conditions I went to evo so its a moot point and if he felt that way he should have used the headphones he uses occasionally that doesnt negate the results and diago didnt get heckled badly IMO philipino champ now he got heckled LOL
I love how Japan has the US and EU arguing over who's better I say they're both good and pretty equal I'd love to see them run a set. I'm American and I think the USA and EU should try to take out Japan first b/c they think they are the s**t when its possible beat them. I say we all hit the lab and level up these 3 are not Gods if they have been beaten before. no matter what they say each side will have their excuses thus nothing can be proven. I'm all for competition but this argument is beyond pointless.
@ rogueish1 im sorry but the home field advantage at EVO is on a different scale, please do not compare other tourneys. EVO is like a true sporting event, where the crowd hype is 100x that of any tourny in Europe. and in Japan the crowd cheer for foriegn players so its easy to feel comfortable there. its no way as daunting as EVO. EVO is not a good measure of what's what. too much advantage for the US players there
@52 So you honestly believe in a 5 v 5 Europe's best players will beat these 5 players whom I feel are the best. PR Balrog, Latiff, Alex valle Ricky Ortiz, and Filipino champ? Don't get me wrong, EU has some pretty decent players and very good character specialist. But I just can't picture them winning a 5v5 vs America in any game except maybe Soul caliber. I want Europe to come down more often, they rarely ever do aside from Ryan of course and everyonce in a while dawgtanian and starnab come to the east coast. I'm here there will be a few more EU players at seasons beating this year and I hope they set up an eu vs America exhibition :)
@61 Latiff pretty much learned how to play in America and he LIVES in America, so if you honestly believe he doesn't belong on the American team then idk what's wrong with you. PR Rog is from puertorico, which if you know anything is an American terriroty which is very much a part of America. Also PR rog practically lives in new York and he said it himself in an interview when he tried AE at china town, of he's not there he's in Ohio with his girl friend which is where he has been for like 2 months and will be until seasons beatings.
@62 I highly doubt that it would be that free. Its not like Japan comes over here and cleans house anymore.
in b4 rage storm over EU vs JAP vs USA