Updated tier rankings for Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition were recently published by Arcadia Magazine. These look a lot like the past rankings that were posted, as very few changes were made since these were covered back in May of this year.You can compare these to the tier rankings by Daigo Umehara, Mago and Tokido which were published by Arcadia clear back in January of this year.
At that time, both Daigo and Mago listed Seth as the second worst character in the game. Later, Daigo's Yun was beaten in rather spectacular fashion by Poongko's Seth at EVO 2011.
Updated tier translation and news tip submitted by Lynaken.
Whoa, C. Viper is A tier now?
Then again... she was impressive in the right hands of Wolfkrone and Latif.
@2 @7
As a Cammy player, I will tell you why - She's in the black against BOTH twins, as she outspeeds and outmanoeuvres them in all departments.
As far at the TK nerfs go, she lost one glitch and gained buffed normals for it. She's got a deserved A tier spot there, feel free to youtube me/throw me an endless room request on XBL and see for yourself why
"""Later, Daigo's Yun was beaten in rather spectacular fashion by Poongko's Seth at EVO 2011."""
This just shot into my mind after reading it.
Does anyone else remember J.Wong saying how bad Adon was then @ that years EVO he was beaten by one? And more recently Daigo was one of the people saying how bad Seth was going to be and low n' behold he was beaten by on @ this years EVO.
I'm seeing a trend here LOL, score 1 for Character Loyalty vs Tier Lists. ;)
@9
Yeah, I'm surprised at Viper being so high up. Last I remember she had a lot of bad matchups against high tier characters and goes even vs the mid tier. She really only stomps on the low tier or characters that aren't used a lot. Just 'cause Latif and Wolfkrone are doing really good doesn't mean she's high tier. That would be like saying the reason they win is due to character selection and not their skill. I'd like to see some matchup charts just to see why they think Viper is so high.
@14
I AGREE BIG TIME!!!
Guy is an underrated character. I think he's slowly making his way to the top. I was pretty suprised when I saw him ranked at C. I thought he'd be a B at the lowest!
@17
im pretty sure justin started using adon after gamerbee blew him up. before AE that is. also no need to rage. you couldve just corrected him or something.
every god dam tier list you see cammy on top yet nobody uses her.. i dont believe it.. sako dropped her for a reason you know.. she sucks.. i dont care about ur buffed normals.. she can't do crap with it
an american tier list would be pretty different ;p
Cool. Two of the characters I use are A-tier.
Makes me fell better about myself. :3
@36
I agree completely with you right there. Now I'm not trying to call out all American players as being scrubs; but most American players I converse with have proven themselves to be outright LIARS and manipulative to a degree.
Most Americans are not going to give a well-rounded and honest discussion when it comes to the question about balance.
@ 14
I generally agree.
However, with characters that are used with great frequency in Japan - I strongly believe that they know best with regards to their abilities.
That said, you can't really even gauge that without knowing what every other character is capable of.
They are just plain wrong about some things because they don't even "house" the best practicioners of some characters - i.e. Rose (one of many, many examples)
This is what most Americans would say when it comes to balance:
(Insert character that you like) and then you flat out lie and say things about how that character has a hard time dealing with other characters and why that character needs to be buffed in this area, why that character needs to be buffed in that area. You also lie about how you feel that the character is "low" tier even when you know that the character is not low tier at all.
The point of such lies is to try to trick the producers at Capcom into making your own favorite character super-strong in the next iteration of the game.
^
"House" in an arcade environment I mean, since I presume that's where most of this "data" is compiled.
Something else that most American players would say is this:
(Insert character that you do not like) can then lie and say things about how the character is "too good" and how the character needs to be nerfed in this area, and how it needs to be nerfed in that area. Also lie about how you feel that the character you hate is Over-powered or "broken" even when you know that such characters are not OP or broken by a long shot.
The point of this is to try and trick the producers into making the characters you hate become garbage tier in the next iteration of the game.
It's pretty ridiculous how so many Americans are playing the game of:
(Insert character you like) and make excuses of why he/she is "too weak."
(Insert character you hate) and make excuses of why he/she is "too strong."
It's even more pathetic how many of them think that they are so smart and how they truly believe that the producers are naive enough to fall for such crap.
The producers know about these pathetic games people play. They know that some of you guys are purposely trying to manipulate them into buffing your own characters to infinite.
@Fireinthehole
Yeah but the people who are saying, "This char is too strong!" Is usually a high-level biased tourney player who prolly got blown up with their main char or fear they will get blown up eventually when everyone else go over the curve with their mains.
@47
Yea, I agree that there are scrubs amongst all nationalities; but Americans do tend to do that WAY MORE OFTEN than others.
BTW, when people write things to Capcom. Capcom can track by IP address which countries those "suggestions" are coming from.
BTW, is THE_GODDAME_MASTER here??? That guy is always talking about "ask the producers this" and "ask the producers that."
Now if you ask the producers about these kinds of pathetic "Insert" suggestions from people who think that they are smart and the producers are stupid. The producers can tell you that the majority of these pseudo-manipulative comments are coming from people in the US.
#27
I agree with the fact that Cammy is A Tier. But to say she's better in AE than her Super version is just wrong. TKCS was pretty godlike.
@1: I feel the same way because I play with T. Hawk. He's awesome.
I REFUSE TO AGREE WITH DANS POSITION. I REFUSE. Being a person who mains him and a character who has gained so much...I refuse...=[...
@52
TKCS was broken. A lot of the pros have stated that. There's clear character bias amongst a lot of the players here in Cammy's favor when they are calling Capcom to bring them TKCS back even when they've already decided to nerf all three of Yun's Divekicks.
This is all of the wrong for the following reasons:
* There is no way that Zangief is better than anyone in A (except maybe Cammy).
* In what multiverse is Seth bottom B? He's top A, no question.
* Abel, Ryu, and Rufus are not mid's. Bottom B, I would accept, but they are not C-listers.
* Anyone listed as below El Fuerte in C is definitely better than El Fuerte.
* Hakan is not better than T. Hawk or Dan. T. Hawk is a counter to all of S, and Dan is at least bottom C at this point, and Hakan is still an oil addict with no defense.
All of the wrong.
@50
wait please elaborate why tournament wins shouldn't reflect tier lists, isnt that where top players of relatively equal skills physically test out these match ups? or are you implying that makoto players such as combofiend, vryu, shiro etc are not as good as the competition?
I'm quite aware of how tier lists are compiled, and its a total overall opinion of where the character stands after each matchup is scored and calculated (im curious to see what the actual matchup grid looks like). But since it shows "A" tier for her on this list, wouldnt that imply that she has a 5-5 or better matchup for more than half the cast? in fact A tier would mean she has 5-5 or better for MOST of the cast right?
That is why im personally confused and dont necessarily agree. Mak does have explosive offensive potential, but she has huge weaknesses. Though she has strong normals, her footsies is heavily impaired by her butt slow walk speed. Her wakeup options are SEVERELY limited and no real "invincible" wakeup (EX chop sorta counts but its strange how the invincibility frames are spread out and how late in frames the active frames are). I would argue that her strongest attributes in this game are only her anti airs and wakeup game, but without a strong footsie game its hard to get any of that started.
I dont think shes a bad character by any means, but I just think A tier is a highly inflated...
Yeah, because Daigo was totally right about Seth.
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH!
cammy has zero safe moves.. and basically is a one trick pony.. her only gameplan is to frame trap.. how the hell is she so good? she sucks
@57, dr_robutnik
I completely agree that zangeif gets blow up by akuma, sagat, and viper, but I think you are misinformed at what this tier list really means....
Tier lists are compiled "matchup numbers" when each character is paired up with another. You cant look at specifics like "no way zangeif is A tier, Dhalsim who is "C" tier BLOWS HIM UP", that is just misconstruing the facts, because by that logic zangeif should be S tier because he BLOWS UP the twins. Looking at it that way makes every character listing relative to each other and haphazard. you have to look at it more broadly, like "how many of the 38 other characters does zangeif have an advantage over"? and i think its safe to say zangeif gives MOST of the cast a hard time aside from the true zoning characters in the game that can easily keep him out, but how many of them are there really? 5-10 zoning characters max? thats less than 1/3 of the entire cast so i thin geif is placed where he should be here
@48
It's the American top players who complain eg Sabin the rapist and Philipino Champ. Mago and Daigo admit they play somewhat overpowered characters and that they are in need of nerfs where as Sabin the pedo and champ just says how sh1t Dhalsim is and how good every other character is.
@58
Tournament wins shouldn't reflect on tier lists because nobodys skill level is the same. Should Cody be ranked A just because Momochi won a tournament? No. Momochi won with Cody 'cause he's skilled a skilled player. In this situation one could say that he won due to playing a character that nobody really sees much, but that falls on the players and not their character choices. Hence, you can't use tournament results to place characters on tier lists. If we did he would have a very different tier list where characters like guy and gen would be F tier due to usage.
What we should use to determine tier lists are the character's tools and how they perform versus the whole cast.
@63
First off, I would like to thank you for approaching me in a polite manner, unlike some people. But, I must inform you that you have been mistaken. You see, I was not basing my reasoning off of who beats who, but who is better in general. If you look at my post again, I never say that V should be higher because V beats W, X, and Y. I stated that they should be higher because they are better than those characters (in general), or that they are good enough to be placed in a higher tier altogether. But, once again, I must thank you for addressing me like a proper gentleman. Good day to you.
@65
okay then, so by that logic, if daigo or tokido were to pick up makoto, cammy, or adon we would see those characters winning more tournaments?
I agree with you that tournament results dont mean everything but it sounds to me that you are not considering them as completely moot evidence, whereas i see it as a piece of the puzzle that does show SOME indication of relative strength in character
SSF4 tier list was the most accurate, most the cast couldn't get anymore balanced than that..
@72
How is rose a bad matchup for viper? It's even at worst. And vs Fei is even and is in vipers favour vsing gief. Without Cammy TKCS it's even and we've seen Viper go evenly with Yun and Yang in nearly every tournament so I don't see the bad matchups. Honda is definitely not a bad matchup and I'm not sure about Bison or Boxer. It seems like you're just reading the SSF4 tier list and don't really know anything for yourself.
Tier list is an opinion not fact. Arcadia is a magazine about arcades games in Japan. So, their tier list is based on the arcade scene in Japan which has a completely different viewpoint of characters compared to the American scene. The characters in S and A rank are most likely to be dominating the arcades there so people see them as top-tier.
I think this is the most accurate tier list for AE so far.
When so many factors come into play about so many different match-ups (not including the different PLAYSTYLES of the player in these match-ups) I think this list does a good job of summarizing where the characters would generally be overall.
I'm a DeeJay player. Sagat gives me hella trouble, but C. Viper doesn't. Because just like Viper, DeeJay lacks any exceedingly good 3-frame normals, but is blessed with some of the best auto-correct in the game, which can negate and burn-kick torture. Many other characters aren't that lucky.
So yeah, like I said before, I think this tier list does in fact stack up the characters rather well.
@73
Are you crazy? The top tier where a lot stronger then the bottom and the bottom had literally no chance. Honda had 6-4+ match ups with over half the cast and Bison only had 4 cases where he was lower then 5-5 same as Chun Li.
Makoto was also 62 points lower then Honda so saying that it couldn't get anymore balanced is just plain stupid.
Viper and bad Matchups? The only bad matchup for Viper is Makoto. Other then that, she has no matchups at all. Just like ibuki. Once your in her mixups, it doesnt matter who you are. Only Makotos fukiage can match the randomness of the burn kick because with fukiage, it doesnt matter wich side your on, you are going to eat it.
I dont understand how Seth is considered B thou. So many of his moves have frame advantage, and good priority, and with that messed up DP that beats everything, and good options for everwhere on the screen, i would have thought he would be A. Just because Japanese players dont like him does not mean hes only b.
@80
The problem with Seth is that if you guess right then he is screwed. We've seen that a lot with Poongko but we usually see more correct guesses from him. If you guess correctly that he will spd, tandem or shoryuken and he has no meter to cancel then half his life is gone. We saw that in the first to 10 match vs Daigo where one correct guess basically is game for Yun. The difference with Seth and Akuma is that Akuma's vortex is relatively safe with equal outcomes which is why he is higher on the tier list.
this is the worst list, cammy is not A tier, she has many difficult matchups, and cody is not c tier, we all saw how it played this past weekend, and as a cody mainer, i have to disagree, he handles a lot of characters easily especially with a 3 frame normal, if you know how to block you make his wakeup look godlike
#68 Cody's reversal is the EX Sucker Punch (I hate calling it Zonk Knuckle)
Seems mostly accurate altough a few things are SO wrong!
Seth, Sure in the hands of someone like Poongko he can blow everything up, which means he's rather situational. Sakura, yeah hell naoh. Cody, Rufus, Gouken and Dhalsim should be pushed to B, A, B,B respectively.
@73
ssf4 was easily mroe balanced, there was no defined S tier in that game.
@78
if ur goin by that tier list on EH lol, that thing was weak. If honda/guile/bison/chun where so powerful how come we didnt see tournaments dominated by them like how sf4 sagat/ryu and ae yun/fielong dominate now?
@83 I mean good reversal. Ex Zonk is used on wakeup mostly when Cody has 3 bars or when it's just a hail mary. It's bad enough he has to use 1 bar for it but it can be easily option selected and beat eg Ryu, Akuma option select ex tatsu which can lead to massive damage in the corner and it can't even be fadc'd when done like this which is why you rarely see ex zonk on wakeup.
@82
But some matchups give him hell eg Seth, Akuma, Ibuki and Viper and the twins to an extent. However I enjoy the Fei match up as it just comes down to footsies etc and he can just throw out random rekkas.
#81 Yeah sure, but its like that the other way around too. If he guesses right you are going to eat so much damage. and he always has the advantage in those 50/50 situations he can create, cause for you to get out of it you have to take a risk, while he can actually play it safe and just block or jab/throw option select you, and because his dp wins everytime, with 2 meters dp'ing is such a strong option. And its so easy for him to create those situations, where he has the advantage, so most of the time in a fight, you are going to find yourself at a disadvantage because of his options from everywhere on the screen. I dont think Poongko is any where near the skilllevel of the Japanese gods, but seth allows you to go crazy and its so hard to handle that, and so hard to play safe against that, which is what most players at that level try to do. So they get blown up.
@70
You have to look at a character's options in the matchup. If one character has more/better options then that character most likely wins the match on paper. Now, if a player can't take advantage of the advantages the character provides then that player may still lose. That's why we should be weighing options and not using tournament results. People may realize that a character is good by watching match videos, but the options shown in matches that had people realize how good a character is were always there to begin with.
@71
No, we would see those players placing high with those characters. And that wouldn't change those characters place on the tier list (assuming they didn't find new powerful tech. with them). You're right, tournaments sometimes give us a glimpse of what the tiers might be like, but I still believe we shouldn't be using them to make tiers. Just look at the AE results for seasons beating velocity. Would you guess that fei is S along with Yun and Yang? Probably not. Should we change the tiers just because some skilled players did really good with mid-tier? Not unless they found some revolutionary match changing tech. Basing tiers on usage and placing isn't going to give us accurate charts.
@75
The same way you're telling him that he's just reading tier lists I'm gonna tell you that you're just watching videos and don't actually know anything yourself. Yang definitely stomps on Viper and Yang is pretty hard for her too. They have better normals and safer ways to get in. Viper can't seismo safely even at full screen and can't use burn kicks to get in. Her wake-up game is probably worse than theirs too. Those are just some examples of how that match goes on Viper's side.
"At that time, both Daigo and Mago listed Seth as the second worst character in the game. Later, Daigo's Yun was beaten in rather spectacular fashion by Poongko's Seth at EVO 2011."
There needs to be a differentiation between Seth & Poongko's Seth. They're both on different tier level.
Tier list truely mean how easy it is to play with a character. Dan and hakan are not low tier, they are advanced characters for advanced players. Anyone can with with shotos, charge characters, fei long or gief ect. It takes skill to use a "low tier character" I only have a few last words...Seasons Beatings...Momochi
@94
You can seismo safely you just have to sjc it or normal cancel it if yang is gunna do his roll kicks and then he is fcked unless he can fadc. You make it sound like she cant just walk to get in, Yang doesn't have projectiles to make her have to burn kick in and she still can burn kick her way in just not as recklessly. Her ex seismo shuts down burn kicks and cancelling it into hp thunder knuckles will blow right through them. Her wakeup is worse then yangs but not yuns since they can both be safe jumped but she can fadc, ex seismo feint.
I don't just get my information from watching videos, I play viper to an extent. I'm not very good but I still learnt the matchups. I agree that Yang may be a bit difficult for Viper around 4.5/5.5 but yun is 5/5 for sure.
@99
That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.
C.Viper and Akuma are some of the most advanced characters yet they are top tier, care to explain?
Dan is not an advanced character. He is quite basic actually and isn't dan counted as a shoto? He has a hadouken, shoryuken and a wanna be tatsu. Every character is hard to master and by master I mean know when to use every move/combo/ultra etc how to properly zone or play footsies with the character and use the character to the best of their ability.
You see Daigo master Ryu and no one elses Ryu could really compare because they didnt master him yet. If it was as easy as you said it was then why did Daigo's Ryu always surprise everyone with his new technology etc? Every character is hard to master but at low level play mastering a character is something which can never be done so you are limited to the Ryu and Ken are easy to use and for scrubs.
Also Ryu is middle C tier and one of the most basic characters at lower levels so how does that factor into your theory?
LOL @ people telling the Japanese how the tier list should work. They place high with Cody, Seth, Sakura at tournaments while there isn't another player in the entire world who manages to do that in majors. (WNF isn't a major so don't bring up OnlineTony) A Vega placed in the Top 8 at SBO, most Vega players in the rest of the world can't even get top 8 at their locals.
Theory Fighters > Japan in terms of knowledge obviously.
@102 it is extremely hard to use dan try getting it on an a good guile, dee jay, ryu, ken ect. I don't count dan as a shoto. "No full screen hadoken" Do you count sagat as one? Minus him not having a form of tatsu? No. Ryu is easy mode, so is ken and definately akuma. I don't need an ounce of practice to use those characters. Why? Because hasn't sh*t changed since I Was seven years old...just pick up and play. No skill required
@104
You say dan is 'Extremely hard to play' Just because he has trouble getting in on fireball characters? News flash lots of characters have trouble getting in on fireball characters, it doesn't make them hard to use. It makes it a hard matchup and it is not necessarily that hard unless you jump in all day which is what I'm assuming you do from the stupidity of your comments. All in all you do not even defend your theory that "Tier list truely mean how easy it is to play with a character". Ryu is easy to use according to you then why is he low C? Why is Viper A when she is one of the hardest to use?
Dan basically has a fireball, shoryuken same crouching roundhouse and forward, light punch and medium punch as the rest of the shotos so how is he so different? Sagat is different as his uppercut is called tiger uppercut and hadouken is tiger shot where as Dan's are similar being gadouken, koryuken, and ultra 2 haoh gadouken, the similarities are all present making the shotos Ryu, Ken, Sakura, Akuma, Gouken,Dan, Evil Ryu and Oni. Seth however has these skills and names but is an incorporation of all fighting styles and all different skills.
Definately Akuma is easy mode? If he was so easy then why would there only be 1 Akuma in most tournaments (Tokido) since he is top tier as well? There are a lot less vipers and Akumas compared to the other top tiers because they are harder to use.
Your theory is still flawed and saying Dan is extremely hard to play and akuma being especially easy just makes you look like a joke.
Instead of tier lists they should have a win percentage list. It would be great to see which characters usually win or lose and how which are the most used characters. The characters that I enjoy playing are all in the C and D list.
@106
I play a bit of viper and yes Ex headbutt is a problem if youre just trying to spam burn kicks all day. You can safe jump ex headbutts, bait them with neutral jump into burn kick. You do not understand that neutral jump fierce only destroy Viper if she is jumping in. You can just dash forward then catch the recovery frames with an ex seismo and then ultra or dash forward and jap thunderknuckle to duck under in. If he is also throwing it out from a distance you can catch his recovery frames with seismo or if its such a problem for you then you can choose ultra 2. It is clearly not a bad matchup since viper can also super jump over honda to reset the charge in cancel into light burn kick to cross up along with all the other cross up gimmicks to negate charge eg jumping rh into rh burn kick which crosses up.
Cammy players will ALWAYS whine until they get their non EX tiger knee dive kick back. They abused that move so much (in reg SSFIV) that it threw their game off by not able use it constantly.
Tierlists are done by overall points guys, so it's very possible for someone to be high in the tier list because he or she has some very favorable matchups and then average to mediocre ones. The only character I'm having questions about is Rufus.
The top is wrong... Its more like...
SS - Yun
S - Fei Long, Yang
And Seth should be bottom of A not bottom of be. Or at least top of B
@112
Sup dude, lol. Funny 2c you post after I talked 2u about this on XBL hahaha.
Anyways...........
Just take what I wrote originally word for word with no other thought.
Wong said Adon was bad then at that years EVO he lost to a Adon during the tournament.
Before this years EVO Daigo etc said Seth would be the worst then he lost to a Seth in the tournament.
All I'm saying is that it's funny that this happened 2 times to two different people. Can you just take it for what it is and not add other info like "well he beat him l8r that day" etc???
Merry Christmas to All; & to all a good night (morning)
I find it more difficult to beat a good Dan player than a good Yun player so this list is BS.
To all of the people saying guy is underrated, I don't really agree with you. He has some huge game breaking flaws in a lot of matchups. If you didn't know any character with a good low profile crouching attack can slip under most of guys jump ins, bushin elbow and even his reversal hurricane kick sometimes. Guy also has a lot of trouble against a lot of small characters due to his neck breaker (run+punch command overhead) completely whiffs over their head and can be punished if used close to them, which really limits some of your mixups. People also still fall out of both of his target combos a lot depending on their hitbox sizes. He is definitely close to being really good but he needs to get a lot of his stuff fixed (a lot is in 2012) so I personally can't wait. Oh and I know you can do other combos/links besides target combo on guy in those matchups but if you played guy you know how vital the mp/hp tc is to keep pressure and stay safe since it gives much higher blockstun for elbow strings/run stop and bushin chain is your best damage combo, without them working you are severely limited in what you can do.
These comments are all biased. What people are really saying is, "Buff my main". Ono, just put the Gem system in SF4 and call it a day.
I always thought Sakura was higher tier even in vanilla, as Boxer, I used to hate fighting her x100 more than Ryu and that should not be the case.........her weird hitbox and stupidly long linked combo into ultra is rediculous!
Just watching Uryo V PoongKO sums it up.
Lol at Akuma bring advanced I laugh at how some mindsets here act like Japan doesn't have scrubs and they are worse than the complainers in the US.
Anyways I would like to ask them which Cammy players they see tearing it up that places her in A.
#103
Its not about who places where and with whom. Its about options, priority, frames, damage, vitality and whatnot, and about matchups. You only need one good player to show how good a character is. Once someone plays the characters to their full potential you can see their strength, weaknesses and how they compare to other characters.
This list looks pretty accurate to me.
Cammy is A-Tier. She fights twins well, and has great tools for all situations. Japan has a few Cammy players doing really well. Odin SIN (who has close to a 90% win rate in arcades... which is insane), Naruo is playing Cammy now... a few players have a pocket Cammy (Kindevu, -6)... She's good, if you ask me.
Viper is also CLEARLY A-Tier. Has very little to do with Latiff or Krone. She's just really good. Japan has a BUNCH of Grandmaster Viper's running around.
She loses HARD to Yang, but she goes even or beats most of the cast. She doesn't lose to Honda either... anyone who says that just needs to put more time in.
Seth might be misplaced here, but he's a special case. It's hard to accurately tier Seth. I played Poongko last weekend for a few matches, and he's out of this world. He IS Seth. If you're not playing Poongko, you don't know what Seth is, really. That being said, Poongko is VERY overwhelming at first, and he does really well in tournaments, because he gets a quick 2/3 setting, against players that for the most part, haven't played a Seth like his. He wins in those. He beat Daigo in that setting... but when they ran it back in long sets, Umehara dominates. That says something. It may just say that Seth isn't THAT good, when it's all said and done. There are definitely characters that excel in 1-game format, or 2/3 format. Tournaments will favor those characters, but that doesn't mean the characters are actually better. Unfortunately, Capcom keeps changing the games before the player base can really lock down character placings, because long-term... I don't know where Seth would be, honestly.
Cool but when are we going to see some legit matchup numbers?
Viper isnt S tier because she can get owned up pretty hard with some good reads but she is A tier and really high up there.
Characters that do good against the twins will be higher up then characters that are solid but get owned by the twins. That being said I dont know why T. Hawk isnt further up, KOG has showed how scary the character can be. I would think he would be low C tier at least.
lol this list is ridiculous on its face. cammy and zangief are with viper, akuma, and sagat? cody, honda, rufus, ibuki, and abel are with fuerte, rose, claw, blanka, and oni? seth is not A tier? yeah ok lol, 100% of all major seth players (yes, only 2 people) just happen to win majors and dominate locals with this character teetering between B and C tier, riiiiiiiight.
You guys are reading this wrong. It's from Japan so you're supposed to read it upside down.
@126
SuperShotoFighter4, you got that right.
Please read through comments: 38, 41, 43, 45, and 51.
Those stupid games people are playing, trying to manipulate the producers into buffing their mains, is just plainly laughable.
@133
Hav, I think that Seth deserves to be in the A- or a B+ category. Seth does seem better than the other B-Tiers, but he doesn't seem to be as great as the A-Tiers.
Let me get one thing straight. Seth is one of the harder match ups for Yun, but just because he's a hard match for Yun doesn't mean he's A-Tier. Seth also has match ups where he's not so good. For example, just watch Poongko vs Uryo at SBV and the commentators explain why Seth has a hard time against Sakura.
Also, I would like to add that Yang and Viper should be in the A+ category.
I can understand why people say that Yun and Fei are better than Viper, but I really do not understand why they said that Viper is lower than Yang on the tiers list.
If anything, Viper should be at the same level or even higher than Yang is.
I don't understand the separation between Zangief and T-Hawk. They should both be in the B- level. Without their command grabs (which are nearly a wash between them), they are effectively useless.
Damnit! My main (Dan) and my secondary (T. Hawk), are both bottom tier. YES!