Ono is back to discussing a possible rebalance of Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition, this time going over a time line. The topics also turn to MvC3's spectator mode, Street Fighter X Tekken on the PC and in arcades and the two extra character slots on the AE select screen.You could balance SSF4 AE a little at a time, every month or so. — Agriota
Ono: No, agree your opinion. At the soonest 6 month, better is every 1 year. ;D
If you wait until 2012 to patch this broken game [SSF4 AE] no one will bother to play it. — SirVH
Ono: Yeah, I know. but we have many hurdle. Please cheering. ;D
You wanna troll us about the two empty slots in SSF4 AE? They need to be filled!! :P — HighOnPCP
Ono: Hahaha, I can see it. ;P
Please tell to inside company what to do to give us spectator mode in MvC3. — LinkHeroSSBB
Ono: Our [team] already had passed [the] code to Marvel vs. Capcom 3's team before few years.
When will the PC version of SSF4 AE be released? — BarakasObama
Ono: Maybe first of next month. ;)
I hear from many sources that Street Fighter X Tekken is going to be on PC too, but you never say that it is. — TommoPuppy
Ono: Umm, I want watch SSF4 AE's PC. ;D [Editor's note: Probably means the sales of AE.]
If the PC version of SSF4 AE sells good enough, would you consider making Street Fighter X Tekken for the PC? — BarakasObama
Ono: So in addition, pirated version is few. Hahaha ;P
Will there be an arcade cabinet for SFxT? — LloydToDestroy
Ono: We don't have idea in now.... in now... ;)
Will SFxT be at PAX Prime? — Soundyman
Ono: I'll be ready. Maybe. ;D
Can we get Elena as DLC for AE please? — BestAlgorithm
Ono: Ummm, I don't have it now...
Yun fix:
Ex lunge -1 on block.
Ex shoulder can cross-up, normal can't.
Cr.mp adv on hit +5 (makes it a 1 f link)
Extra recovery on up kicks.
Genei jin palms do 50 damage instead of 100 (makes 600 hp kara palm not posible).
copy and paste this for a reasonable nerf that makes yun more technical and less random.
OK, this message is to all those who are fine with AE the way it is.
Please start twittering Ono and telling him that we are fine with SSF4-AE the way it is.
Something else that must be brought to attention is that these scrubby, half-ass crybabies DO NOT represent the majority of the community. These cry-babies may be the loudest voices of the SF-community, but from my experience, they sure as hell don't represent the overall majority.
This might sound corny, but I kind of feel that it's my duty to twitter back at Ono and tell him myself that SSF4-AE is actually the most balanced game of the whole SF4 series.
Now I've been reading through numerous articles concerning the balance of SSF4-AE the recent past few weeks, and I know for a fact that I'm not the only one who thinks that AE is actually WAYYY more balanced than SSF4 was.
Now if we don't speak up just as loud, or even louder then these half-ass scrubs, then these crybabies will manipulate Ono into making their own favority characters into being the most broken and OP members of the cast.
Remember all the BS changes that happened when transitioning from Vanilla-SF4 --> SSF4? The change from Vanilla-SF4 --> SSF4 was supposed to make things more "balanced" but it ended up making things far worse than it already was.
Sagat got hit by the Nerf stick so badly that he was basically inviable in SSF4. Guile got buffed so much that he was worse than Vanilla-Sagat. Not to mention the fact that Cammy was one broken POS character.
People should be happy that they no longer have to put up with the same kind of Bulls--t from SSF4-Guile and they no longer have to deal with Cammy's TKCS and stuff. It's amazing that some of these crybabies writing to Ono are asking him to bring these characters back, but nerf the twins at the same time.
Calling Ono to nerf Yun's divekick, and asking to give Cammy the TKCS back at the same time is purely ridiculous if one wants a more balanced game. Asking Ono to nerf the twins but make Guile as OP as he was in SSF4 is also silly. These crybabies just want their own characters on top of things.
@7 Ono said it himself that they purposely made AE unbalanced. It doesn't matter what you think of the balance if the community thinks it's unbalanced and the folks at Capcom admitted it is. The game is clearly unbalanced.
I can easily handle with Yuns with Ken, but I don't want to play Ken, I want to play a character, I have fun with and have a fair chance at winning, I don't want to feel like my options are limited to counter-picking.
SSFIV was balanced they know this, we know this.
Yun is a broken character with Mortal Kombat 9 hitboxes.
Ono: So in addition, pirated version is few. Hahaha ;P
Best tweet ever?
FFS!!! I wish the bloody cry babies would stop moaning!!!
Yes Yun is powerfull, but hes not unbeatable. Even my record against them is more that 50%, and im not even that good.. lol
I would rather it be Yun at top tier than a fireball character. Online is soo ruined by the amount of scrubs that are happy to turtle/runaway and hide behind fireballs and shoryukens/flashkicks. That kind of play bores me to death. So at least in general, Yun's have to attack to win.
Correct me if im wrong, but a Yun hasnt even won a big tournement yet, so even on a pro level he doesnt appear to be a big problem.
Im more bothered about Geif n T.Hawks rediculas grab damage and huge hitbox's, IMO they seriously need to nerf em.
What worries me about the f*cking 2012 version is that we probably have to pay for it yet again, if it is a simple free downloadable update then I wouldn't have any problem, but since is Capcom...
I'm guessing people would have to pay for the changes again especially if there are new characters.
"Ono: No, agree your opinion. At the soonest 6 month, better is every 1 year. ;D"
This game may as well have a subscription service they're thinking about updating it every 6-12 months. I get the feeling that when Capcom end up with a "balanced" version of this game, they're still going to rebalance it every 6 months just to keep it fresh haha.
@14 Daigo won every tourney he participated in the US in 2011... with Yun, of course.
@17 Daigo pretty much won every tourny for the last 2-3 years with Ryu. He's the best in the world, so he could have probably won those tournys even without Yun
I like it how there's more people bitching now about the game then there was when vanilla was out... Back then we saw only sagat in tourneys and no one complained because he was a broken ass shoto... They just wanna see all there shoto buff as Ken now... Plus I remember super having Rufus, Gulies, and Ryu dominating the scene and no one bitched about them... Also all the new added characters in super sucked. It's a good change that new characters are at least worth your money to be powerful.
"Remember all the BS changes that happened when transitioning from Vanilla-SF4 --> SSF4? The change from Vanilla-SF4 --> SSF4 was supposed to make things more "balanced" but it ended up making things far worse than it already was.
Sagat got hit by the Nerf stick so badly that he was basically inviable in SSF4. Guile got buffed so much that he was worse than Vanilla-Sagat. Not to mention the fact that Cammy was one broken POS character. "
You were doing so well until you said that.
"Ono: So in addition, pirated version is few. Hahaha ;P"
There are plenty of Xbox 360 pirates too (just a quick torrent search turns up NEARLY 50% as many seeded torrents for Street Fighter 4 Xbox as for the PC version.) Yet PC gets the shaft.
Piracy is an issue for all systems, the only dif with PC is that the system you play it on is the same one you use to pirate the game, thus it is an easier process. Combine that with the fact development for PC is more difficult than a console (and thus more expensive) it makes Piracy an easy scapegoat when PC sales aren't quite as good as you might want.
-------
As for the rebalancing. If there is a MAJOR upset in the game balance (something like Vanilla Sagat) then quickly fixing this issue should be a priority. However the game needs to be out at least through EVO before they can truly get the data they need. Every 6months would be perfect for a balance overhaul to the game, with minor tweaks to fix bugs/major balance issues (like Yang's invincibility on wakeup) being done more often.
why do you guys are crying ? nerf the twins nerf the twins ....leran to block b-i-t-c-h-e-s ...yun has some really bad matchups too.. for example zangief he also has a bad time against shotos like ken and sagat etc. you can not dive kick all day than you get a shoryuken ...
why do you guys dont say that feilong need to be nerfed ?
is it because feilong almost nobody pick him online ?
The only thing that the twins need is a nerf of the palm (It shouldn't build that much meter) the rest is fine and you know it. I hate those freaking crybabys. There are plenty of characters that can deal with them, hell, no one complained about Yun in 3s, not even Chun and shes considered S Tier in that game. I hate Cammys changes, but I'm mostly fine with the roster right now, its basically your own fault if you want a huge roster like in AE and then expect that everyone turns out the way they do. Look at Makoto, shes really good now, still no one plays her. I remember hearing those people crying out loud for Guy, Cody, Dudley, Ibuki and Mak. "Omg, I'm so going to main him/her", still they got back to Ryu, Ken and Akuma.
Fighting games are never going to turn out the way the community wants them to be. I didn't even complain ONCE about Vanilla Sagats damage, and he was broken as f*ck, I took it just like it is. I'm betting most of the community right now, didn't even played CvS2, 3rd Strike or the Alpha series. Those games had one of the cheapest and most unbalanced characters in it, yet everyone loved them and conciders them one of the best fighting games ever.
I know a CvS2 and Alpha remake or something of that sort will come in the future, and I know that no one will play those games, because you can't mash like a freaking moron, learn the game and stay solid within weeks like in SF4, then everyones going to cry again. Its like 3rd Strike Online, all the newcomers want a rebalance, yet most of the community who played this game 10 years ago are mostly fine with it.
Oh, and should I tell you why your "favorite" characters got nerfed? Because our community is just plain stupid, back then no one cried out loud for nerfs of certain characters, now everyone even complains about bad ones and yet still they get nerfed, not because Capcom wants to, but because they actually seem to listen to those crybabys.
My opinion on balancing is not to nerf anyone. I rather see buffs and better changes to low tier characters and keep high tiers the same. I would love to see Dan fight on par with Sagat or Yun. But to go as far as to tell them to nerf your most hated character is just because you think he's too powerful is just stupid. It just makes the people who play the game casually try even less to win. I mean I like the character Yun you actually have to attack to get damage in and not stand there and zone all game and shoryu to victory. Besides Yun is cool IMO but that my opinion.
I totally forgot the MvC series, look how MvC3 turned out, its your freaking fault. Every team has some Wolverine, Wesker, Sentinel or other bullsh*t in it, and thats only because the other characters suck in comparison. It was the same in MvC2, there were maybe 5-6 tournement worthy characters from that huge roster, I never heard a thing from the community, I wonder why...
http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2010/no...
^You wanna troll us about the two empty slots in SSF4 AE? They need to be filled!! Ono, you need to get to the bottom of this and yes there is 2 slots missing
@7
You are so full of sh!t. Or maybe you're just riding the "stop complaining" wave of self-righteous pricks. I'm not blaming you, everybody has to belong.
SSF4 had cheap characters, but those cheap caracters had bad matchups, so the game kinda evend out itself. For example, Honda and Rog were very hard for Cammy, Guile had to work against Akuma and Viper, etc.
In AE you've got almost everybody balanced up, with three characters way ahead of the rest of the cast. Fei's even nastier than he was in Super, and the twins are made of 50-50 offenssiveness.
You're so avid in criticising the crybabies when you're nothing more than one yourself.
God, kill this idiot already.
Some time ago everyone thought Capcom can't get any worse.
ANY WORSE. But then Ono appeared, and no happiness was seen for months. Precisely, never again.
I think the main reason for all this patching and community feedback that wasn't as present before is the rise of the internet, and especially things like twitter, and also the ability to patch games once they're out. Now they look to the fans for what they want and change things accordingly (sometimes). People have always complained about games in the past, but because they couldn't be heard the changes weren't made, and so only the people that liked the game for what it was would play it. Now the game gets changed based on community response, which I also attribute to the rise in popularity. It kinda sucks if you like the game and it keeps getting changed, but it also keeps it fresh.
i can't stand this guy.. and can't stand the way capcom does their business either. please release a complete and balanced game at once, we don't want to be paying every year for a "rebalance" and then you release some other update with broken characters, which of course requires more paying for a rebalance later.. and it goes on and on..
about the 2 empty slots that needs to be filled I wonder when will he get to the bottom of it and fill it in? it's already too late since the disc release is today and as far as DLC goes probably hafta pay another $10-$15 for it and on disc probably hafta DLC as well and this "If you wait until 2012 to patch this broken game [SSF4 AE] no one will bother to play it" true because people will lose interest in it really fast
@#27
That is why you aren't in charge of game balance.
There will ALWAYS be tiers. Period. Now consider this: there is 3 S tier characters, and there are 36 characters NOT in S tier. Which would be easier to change?
Now once it is changed, there will be a new tier list, someone will be on top (maybe not an S tier rank but there WILL be tiers.) and someone will be on the bottom. What is important is how small a gap there is between them.
Lastly, if you keep balancing the game by buffing things instead of ever nerfing things, eventually you reach a point where the game is a-kin to rock paper scissors since characters become so powerful as to decide the match in the first one or two moves.
It's such a strange attitude to see out of capcom, I mean.. Evo is coming up and they are like "hey the game is a bit broken, enjoy your competetive tourny hrhrhr"
I think Evo will be worse off for AE then it would have been if it had been on Super, for a big event that only comes once a year it feels like the whole community is getting trolled all at once
:/
Arrancar> better yet I honestly think Ono needs to be shot in the head with a beag bag at 1800 fps
I assure you - his English is better than your Japanese.
I don't want anyone to complain about the twins until they realize it could be worse. Imagine having trouble defeated the enemy for 15-18 seconds, then getting hit by a SPECIAL that takes off SIXTY PERCENT OF YOUR LIFE. Sure, I'm sure it was by an accident, but Raiden is completely overpowered.
Anyways, I have no input on the matter since I'm poor and can't afford AE.
anyone have it yet on disk i wanna know if its worth it i have them paid off but didnt wait and downloaded it anyways mainly cause the achievements wont be fun to get again plus if no imeidate changes dlc will be an option and wont need the disk anyways but i mean a new shiny disk is always awesome
I wonder if someone will hack the retail disc to see if there's undiscovered data on it.
Anyways, I could live without a rebalance, but then again, a yearly update could keep this game alive for a long, long time.
I think EVO will be alright this year. The army of Yuns is not as big as many were predicting it would be and several players will focus on that matchup with their main to be prepared. Chances are that Daigo will win again this year anyway.
I don't enjoy how safe many of yun's normals and specials are and I also find myself having to play super solidly against even the most brain dead yun player but I'll learn.
So if he is nerfed then I won't complain but if he is not then it's either sink or swim. Just how it always was, when patches were simply fantasy.
right on @ #7
is it just me or have the cry-babies come out in full force with AE as opposed to vanilla or super. I thought they would be gone by now....jeeeez
I hate to agree, Yun loves his free safety.
He also has a crap-tonne of armourbreak attacks (including double-hitting normals/target combos etc).
To be honest, I might aswell just say he has everything - except normal health. lol
VanCityPlayBoy
God damn it man. Do you realize how much of an annoying piece of sh*t you are? EVERY god damn Ono troll topic, you, ONLY F*CKING YOU bring up that retarded Dhalsim screen shot and tell him to get to the bottom of it. You just don't f*cking listen, huh? Tell me, are you one of those kids who thinks Oni is not Gouki/Akuma? Who has your head so far up your obsessive ass that trying to reason with you only makes you become more of a brain dead sh*t head?
JESUS CHRIST, 2 more fighters could be, key word: COULD BE added sometime in the distant future. For now, Arcade Edition is the most recent, FINISHED product, which of course they COULD update OR NOT when they see fit. I wouldn't be surprised if you were that prick on his twitter wall complaining that the slots need to be filled. I for one would love 2 extra dummies to tear apart with Oni, but I am not going to continuously come into threads and cry to everyone that the roster looks "unfinished" with an almost year old picture that no one could care less about, since they saw right through Ono's trolling. Get a clue, imbecile.
All Capcom have to do with Yun is...
- change his dash punch, make it easier to punish on block/wiff
- Reduce meter gained from his palm
#7 is right ssf4ae is actually more balance!. Every character has more potential is jus that ppl are too lazy and jus wanna win so they pick top tiers and thats pathetic. I play whoever i think is cool no matter wat cause any one can make a character the best! I bet u the best dan player can kick your a$$ in a match. Its called dedication and actually playing the game. Not oh no my character sucks let me hop on a top tier and claim i used them before. Yun and yang and fei long are not overpowered. Thats a word crybabies love to use without meaning overpowered means if u pick this character its a garunteed win. And ive seen pros like daigo lose to numerous other characters like gen,sakura,gouken. And those are characters ppl claim they suck. Fei,yun,and yang are not op u cant hop in a much with a garuntted win i highly doubt your fei long skill would beat kiryu's guy stop b!tchin
@29 why would you post tht old a$$ picture of yang. It been confirmed for a long time. Did u honestly think thats was an new character??
How would an AE rebalance go? Would they just nerf the S class or make the C and D class more viable or both? Making c and D class more viable would take a long time because a lot of the AE cast is C right?
@#23
You forget one thing ... that the 360 and ps3 versions of games , or else let's just focus on sf4 , still sells really well .
SF4 didnt even scratch half their sales on pc , while the pc torrent easily matched half the 360 ones .
Not to mention that capcom has been consistantly burned when bothering to release the best versions of some games on pc .
Not saying it's right , but i can see what they feel toward pc versions being secondary
@54
It was NEVER CONFIRMED ANYWHERE! feel free to post the confirmation link here!
We going to start beating this Dead Horse again? Fine... Still shots have revealed that the Hit-Stun pose for Yun/Yang does NOT match that picture! They kneel on the opposite leg! It is also NOT Chun Li!
Her Leg pose is very similar, but it ends there. Every other aspect of Chun NEVER matches that photo. In fact, the legs never duplicate that animation either!
So was it a new character? Who knows... But for Gods Sake STOP acting like you know who it was when your dumb a$$es have no clue what your talking about.
Also.... AE is fine. Three strong characters right? Big deal.
Sagat, Rufus, Ryu (vanilla) > Twins
Guile, Honda, Bison (Super) > Twins
Buffs for low tier characters in AE = better match ups for most of the cast! You cannot deny that you feel better using Low Tiers in AE more than Super! (Fuerte is the exception)
Enough.
I love skimming through these comments and seeing all the people that have no idea what they're talking about.
Best one so far is from #7 saying Sagat (a top 10 character in SSF4) was no longer viable and that Guile was more broken than Vanilla Sagat (who had zero bad matchups in Vanilla).
Keep the laughs coming, kids!
Sagat was still viable, you just had to be tactful with him. As for Guile.....even anti-fireball ultras were usually against his recovery. While I would not say Super Guile was broken, he was a bitch to fight against. Just like Chun-Li.
They won't patch the game now because they'd have to do it for the arcade cabinets as well. That takes time and money, so we'll likely see it in 6 - 12 months, if it is to happen. I still get the feeling they might want to push a balance update with two last characters for some reason, lol.
its quite obvious capcom wanted yun and yang to be especially good since they want 3S online to do well. if everyone enjoys playing them in AE then they will buy 3S online. its a conspiracy theory but legitimate non the less.
if yun and yang werent in the game it would be a pretty damn well balanced game. all the changes in AE were to cater to yun and yang. so now we have a few garbage characters, a whole bunch of decent characters, and 2 uber god like but boring characters.
i honestly didnt have any problem with any of the characters in the past two installments but yun and yang are just over the top. i guess its making me better though since im learning how to beat them. omgz you have to adapt to a game thats based around adapting to your opponent!
but god damnit i dont get why out of all the characters they could have put in they picked the two brothers from third strike THAT THEYRE RE-RELEASING. oh yeahhhh so youll have fun playing them and buy 3s online. capcom could have given us just yun and mixed it up with urien or hugo would have been bitchin too. or maybe even another alpha character??? but no we get two of practically the same characters along with another shoto. i love oni though...pretty legit character design and move set.
anyway..yeah im complaining. but i still love street fighter however a couple small changes to yun and yang AE would be a sick fighter and i wouldnt care at all about any of the above. simple fact. and my cup of tea is finished..dont worry first time posting here and my last. PEACE!
I play Yun and have a lot of trouble with Gief, Hawk, and Ken. I played Rose in Super, and the changes to her made her terrible in the way that I played her. I don't think she is a bad character or that she was nerfed too much, she is just different from my play style now.
I enjoy AE and The twins are strong, but so is Gief and Ken. The whole game has it's ups and downs, but just play the damn game!
Sagat was still viable in Super. He was just toned down. Which was fine IMHO.
It's funny, everytime Rufus, Ryu or Sagat get nerfed I don't see the community go nuts.
But if Guile, Bison, Honda or the Rest of the "Super Top Tiers" get nerfed you guys go Ape $hit!
All of (most of) the "Low Tiers" are vastly better in AE then they were in Super! Big ups for a WAY BETTER Hakan, Guy, Makoto, Dan, Sakura, etc etc etc etc... The list goes on.
So the game has three strong characters. Which game didn't? Anyone here think that the prior two versions didn't have STRONGER characters than the Twins?!?
And don't get me started on Fei Long! The S Tier that no one online even knows how to use! No Hadoken, No Spam SRK, No Messiah Kick = You barely see him... So big deal!
Every forum, every thread, we're all just yelling the same crap over and over again!
Not counting the three strong characters AE is the MOST BALANCED SF4 thus far. And forget the three because every version has had an S Tier! If you want all of your characters to have the same skill, same advantages, go play Fight Night or UFC!
When will this madness stop!
@66
Yeah, what a lot people don't realize (because most are too busy crying) is that Yun and Yang DO have bad match-ups. Even Daigo himself said Zangief gives them a hard time, since things like light SPD's range ruins them. Sagat and Fei Long also give them trouble. Chun-Li isn't a walk in the park for them either.
And before anyone brings up Fei Long, most of his bad match-ups in Super are still present in AE.
All I wish for is at least a game that I can enjoy. In my opinion, I wouldn't care if they added more tweaks... I just want to enjoy a good game.
Damn it! I just got SSFIV AE on disc for PS3 and when I start a match no matter training mode, or arcade mode the game gets stuck at the VS screen with the golden AE logo flashing. I ned help to fix this, I did the 1.5 update y checked every option and they are all as I left them when I had SSFIV the game recognize everything even the costumes but I can get past the VS screen.
@20 You completely missed the point you made yourself... Godlike Yun player is still a Yun player, and the fact is he won two big tournaments in two weeks.
@68 Statement about Gief was made back when AE launched in arcades. I saw him losing more to Guile and Cody players than Gief in arcade tbh.
Mvc2 is so broken and went strong for ten years. capcom doesnt like to answer real important questions. They apparently have been banning some people from the unity boards just asking about dmc. That's ridiculous
I'm sure if the last 2 slots are filled it'll be with Cyber Akuma and ryu using "mimic Ken" from marvel vs Capcom 1; honestly though I hope those slots get filled with popular non shoto variations, rolento, Elena, Karin, eagle, sodom, etc. - if those two slots actually get filled in that is, I'm wondering capcOm will do it, could be cool if Ono gave a non troll answer sometime in the future about it
ae is fine as it is for the most part.all the chars that got nerfed (with the exception of elf and maybe vega.he didn't get nerfed much tho) were nerfed for a reason.most had braindead abusable tactics that made for boring, repetitive play.
guile spamming booms,cr.fp and backfist,cammy with tkcs,ryu with braindead cr.fwd footsies and runaway tatsu,rog with st.jab pressure on crouching opponents...now ppl can't play on autopilot with those tactics and actually have to use their brains for once.
the twins aren't that bad like every1 is saying.if they were top 4 would be nothing but them which I have yet to see.yang for 1 is a pushover compared to his bro and yun has bad matches just like every1 else.if I were to change anything it would be ex lunge,meter on palm and making the height restriction on yuns dive kick the same as yang.that's it.but even if these changes never happens it doesn't matter.this game is fun as hell now.
This is what I'd see as reasonable yun nerfs:
Ex Lunge still safe on block, but at +0 so players are left neutral, rather than ending with Yun at advantage. Normal lunges made significantly more punishable, to encourage use of Ex Lunge (basically to make him spend meter).
The same could be done to upkicks, regular HK upkick seems too good ATM, they should have to spend meter to make it safe. This means either regular upkicks falling slightly closer to the opponent, or make them slightly slower. It's a bit crazy that HK upkick is a LOT more reliable as an anti-air than HP shoryuken.
Slight reductions in meter gain all around. Right now it's a bit crazy that after spending one meter for Ex command grab, you can gain almost all of it bar back doing cr.mp, cr.mp s.mp xx hk upkicks.
...
or, you could keep Yun as-is, but give him Seth's old HP and Stun (trollface)
@ #68 and dont forget Balrog, and Seth, both bad matchups for the twins. I dont see why so many are crying about em. IMO Yang is fine, but Yun just needs 1 lil adjustment or 2.
As for the possibilty of 2 new characters... PLEASE NO FIREBALL CHARACTERS, unless its Sean or Oro!!! No more versions of Ryu or Akuma please!!!
I would rather see characters like Alex, Elena, R.Mika or Poison
can someone tell me what this means?
Ono: Our [team] already had passed [the] code to Marvel vs. Capcom 3's team before few years.
#6 how are they lazy? they working on sfxt. you cant take bodies from that game to work on a game thats on its last hoorah. i would much rather they focus on sfxt as much as possible. if there is some down time, then tweak ae.
@7 I agree about the cry babies wanting their characters fixed. however, I don't believe the game is balanced at all. The twins are unbelievably strong. There is some truth to that. At the same time, I say to all the cry babies GET OVER IT. There are ways to beat the twins. I have seen them crushed plenty of times. You have to use your noggin . The focus of the twins attack is their dive kick. That is their entry point for them to do further damage. Find something that will nullify it. Anti-air etc etc.
I also agree with 7 about not manipulating ono. The balance may be bad to some standards. That is true. If he is told that something is bad, tries to fix it, and the re-balance becomes worst then what it is now, who is to blame then?
So stop the complaining. This game is at the end of its rope. As I told 6, SFxT is on its way and I want all the people involved focused on that project and nothing else. Its has the potential to be the greatest fighting game of all time replacing MVC2. I don't want nothing to ruin it.
Mvc3 needs that spectator mode. Watching cards fight are weak. If they couldnt do nothing with the code ono gave them, then they should have asked for more info on how to implement it in. I find that to be lazy altogther. I understand top producers want to create their own legend (ie ono with sf4,ssf4,ssf4ae) with little outside help but spectator mode is a must have for every fighting game.
Game is fine. People that complain about Guile is that they can't turtle that much anymore to gain meter. I play Guile, it only takes 2-3 more Sonic Booms to get a 1 bar. Really no difference.
@72
That's likely because Daigo went and learned how to deal with that match-up. Any smart player will look at their character's worst match-up and see how to deal with it. Losing to Guiles is a little surprising though when you consider that that match-up wouldn't be in Guile's favor. Chalk that up to good Guile play, heh.
@89
Ono didn't "give" them any code. He's a producer, he doesn't do coding for Capcom (or handle any sort of actual developmental work for that matter since that's not what producers do), and on top of that he didn't even work on MvC3.
At least place your anger on the right people, which in this case would be whoever couldn't get spectator mode working without lag on the MT Framework engine.
I think Seth Killian said Daigo plays all the characters so he know what's the match up/weakness of a character better than just playing against that character.
ono is god-like. he's got you guys eating out of the palm of his hand. lets get that update out asap for #94. pig_red. he probably can't beat a yun.
AE has not been out for a month yet...lol
that's it im switching to yun
in the ssf4ae book theres a side not about oni
this is the inhuman form akuma assumed afrer being consumed by the satsui no hado. stripped of nearly all human emoion he lives only to fight book looks cool games the same though haha
ONOOOO ! Y U NO SHOT WEB? AND THEN WHO WAS PHONE?
I love Engrish.
While I agree that the game could use a few tweaks, not every character needs to be changed. People need to learn to adapt and "download" their opponents. I play Guile and the only complaint I really have is how unfair it is that the twins' palm builds meter so fast and sonic booms don't build any now. But other than that AE is rather well balanced.
His english is pretty bad, but i give him credit for trying. It says alot about him as a business man and as a person. On top of that i here super broken english all the time, its almost like a second dialect.
@60
If it were new characters they would be out by now! Its nobody new look at the f#cken picture it looks more like yang!! Obviously its not new characters or we would have had a disc version already considering how old this picture is this was before yun and yang so if they were new chars we would have most likey got them before evil and oni use ur f#cken brain. The disc taking a whole nother month for development indicates that their making new characters and content not this bs old pic think u dumbf#ck
well theres nothing new on disk besides announcer and tittle saying ssf4ae other than that nothing
you guys do know you Capcom needs to pay Microsoft and Sony to patch their games right? They can't just frequently patch it like any PC game.
The only thing I find ridiculous is how safe the lunge punch is, including the amount of meter gained from palm fist. Fixing those will go along way to ensuring the game to be closer to balanced.
Take for example a Yun v Guile match up. A Yun may play a honest game by rushing him down, and once he's in there's little that Guile can do. Fair enough, but against a very well organized defensive Guile, Yun may decided to just sit there and palm all day which is ridiculous. 4-5 palms to build a single meter compared to 20-25 booms. Either way, Guile is fcked! and this is an example of match up that could be altered to a reasonable level just by simple needed tweak.
20 - 25 Sonic Booms to gain 1 Bar is complete exaggerating. These people have no fking clue what they are talking about. This proves you're one of those Guile players that Turtle and shoot Sonic Boom all game. Nothing wrong with that, you just lost your bar, that's why people complain. Honestly Guile is no real different having that meter change. Just need to work a bit more since damage is nerf a bit.
Completely exaggerating? How about trying it yourself? A thrown boom will build 1/25 of the meter bar if it doesn't hit.
I don't mind that the meter build the way it is, I can still live and resource manage my meter to adapt to the changes. Never did I say any of this should be buffed.
Its harder to compete in fireball war, but its fine. Its a battle that can be won. Against Yun who simply turtle and build meter endlessly on the other hand is ridiculous.
OMG I JUST FIGURED IT OUT THEY MADE YUN AND YANG OP SO THE SCRUBS WOULD PLAY THEM AND BE FAMILIAR ENOUGH WITH THEM TO BE INTERESTED IN 3RD STRIKE. This is all an elaborate ploy to get 3S:OE to sell, and then they'll nerf the hell out of the twins once they've served their purpose.
It's a very bad time to patch AE. EVO is around the corner and they are still waiting to see if Oni and E Ryu is broken or needs major patching as well. I think everyone is overdoing it with the complaints about Yang and Yun. They are good but they are not broken. They are similar to Sentinel day 1; give it some time to settle and I'm sure everything will be ok. Also, if you've been keep track of the tournaments, it's not Yun that takes the win but the specific players. Tokido has been winning a lot of tournaments with Akuma. Mike Ross has been doing very well with E Honda. Poongko still plays Seth and won Shadowloo showdown. Alex plays Ryu and does well in almost every tournament he joins. So for the last time, give Capcom and AE some time.
Yun nerfs:
- EX lunge punch must be punishable at least by SPD.
- palm meter gain must be halved, less active frames and less damage
- his EX command grab must be nerfed, it can't have 5 frames startup AND throw invincibility. In 3rd Strike EX command throws don't exist, and the startup is 7 frames.
- he can't have all those 110 damage normals, that's ridiculous, his damage output must be reduced
- some other things
@NvhA
Well sorry cause I have no clue in how you playing Guile. He's still pretty much the same to me.
In a fireball war, I think Guile probably needs maybe 2 more Sonic Booms to make a full meter.
I agree with people who say that this game SHOULD NOT be patched. Only people whining about this is the scrubs. LOOK AT WHAT POONGKO DID IN THE LAST TOURNAMENT YUN CAN BE BEATEN YOU SCRUBS. JUST LEARN THE MATCH UP AND STOP WHINING! You are pitiful.
@61
Hey SnakeX, if you're going to call out people for "have no idea what they're talking about," then you should perhaps take a look at yourself first.
Firstly, you clearly demonstrated you're lack of reading comprehension skills when you accused me of saying that SSF4-Guile was more "broken" than Vanilla-Sagat. I was careful not to use the word "broken" when I made post #7.
Matter of fact I clearly said that "Guile got buffed so much that he was worse than Vanilla-Sagat. Not to mention the fact that Cammy was one broken POS character."
And yes I still stand by my words that SSF4-Guile was worse than Vanilla-Sagat. Let's revisit Vanilla-Sagat in SF4. The worst character to use against Vanilla-Sagat was probably Vanilla-Zangief. Zangief had an extremely hard time getting around Sagat's projectile game.
But guess what? SSF4-Guile could play the same cheap-ass projectile zoning game as Sagat could against Zangief, but the difference was that SSF4-Guile could do the same thing against a much more characters than Vanilla-Sagat could. Guile's charge time on the Sonic-boom was shortened in SSF4 which gave him the ability to shoot fireballs as the same rate as Vanilla Sagat, but Sagat's tigershots took time to recover while Guile recovers instantly on his SonicBooms. Guile also builds meter quite fast in SSF4 as well.
One more thing to add is that Vanilla-Zangief's jump speed is slow, but Vanilla-Sagat was never able to do something so bold as to release a tiger-shot while Zangief was halfway through his jump-arch and still get off a block in time. SSF4-Guile could release a sonicboom while the other person's half-way through the jump arch aand still pull off a block when playing against quite a few characters.
BTW, who are you to say that Vanilla Sagat had zero bad match-ups? There have been many Japanese pros, including Mago and Tokido who have said that Akuma is in fact a bad matchup for Vanilla Sagat. Some Japanese players say that the Akuma Vs Sagat in Vanilla was 6-4 in favor of Akuma, while others went as far as saying that the Akuma vs Sagat matchup in vanilla was 7-3 in favor of Akuma.
Sagat's largehit box gave Akuma the advantage to pull-off insanely large damage, and huge hitstun combos on Sagat, such as using the standing-roundhouse loop multiple times. Also, Sagat had a real hard time esacaping Akuma's demon-flip vortex game once he got knocked down due to the large hitbox.
@62
I never said that Guile was broken. Matter of fact, I was cautious not to use the term "broken" when I wrote post #7.
SnakeX was putting words into my mouths when he claimed that I said that SSF4-Guile was broken.
But at the same time, I stand by my words that SSF4-Guile was definiately OP and unbalanced though. Just take a look at this footage here and see for yourself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xYLVD...
One thing that should be striking is that even the commentators themselves realized that Guile had an unbalanced advantage in terms of his meterbuilding abilities with his Sonic-Boom. Not only that, but this footage showed that Guile also had pretty good footsies as well.
Daigo was around 70% across the screen when he ate the ~420 damage even anti-fireball U2 from Guile. Now if Guile can use his U2 as an anti-projectile against other characters. Then wouldn't it be fair that Guile should be vulnerable to the same thing himself? I think so, but in SSF4, he was immune to anti-fire ultras and supers. Daigo tried to use his super as an anti-fireball when Guile was only around 40% across the screen and Guile was still able to pull off a block in him.
Not only did Guile's U2 come out faster than Ryu's U1 and Sagat's U2, but Guile was immune to anti-fireball Ultras and Supers himself. Matter of fact, SSF4-Guile's U2 comes out almost instantly and it instantly travels ~70% across the screen.
I really can't understand how people are saying the SSF4-Guile was an example of what "good balanced" should be.
^^ Minor correction.
I was cautious not to use the word "broken" in post #7 when I was talking about Guile, but SSF4-Cammy's TKCS was in fact broken.
The thing about YY is that SCRUB players can play them bc so many of their moves are safe and the PRO players can play them dt so many options and setups. Each thing by itself isn't that bad but when you have TONS of options and MANY of them are SAFE then said characters just become too powerful from the range of scrub to pros. Basically it interferes with the risk-reward balance that should be the hallmark of what constitutes BALANCE.
people who complain that yun is broken etc. probably suck anyways, like they would lose to a good gen or whatever
the 1 exeption i think is daigo...ofcourse a top tier characters in his hands, and i'm not dick riding or anything, will crush you, i mean you saw poongko take shadowloo showdown with SETH
anyways i just hope they add some more characters, stages and maybe even an U3 for everyone, shiet will be baller
@99 - the S tiers in super did have the same advantages that the S tiers in ae have now.most were in reverse tho.guile and honda could turtle EXACTLY as hard as yun can rushdown now.Any1 who hasn't figured out the fei long matchup by now is most likely a lazy scrub and yang has done NOTHING noteworthy in any of the ae tournies that have past as of late.U thinking cammy with tkcs,guile with play lame meter building booms or bison with braindead lk.scissor pressure wasn't as bad as yun is now is equivalent to a years worth of Onos trolling and the "community's" bitching combined!
Yun only needs to be altered. Playing a good yun is really friggin hard for many reasons. Ex Lunge is +1, palm builds alot of meter, and has ALOT of active frames, its like a forcefield. Finally, the shoulder is TOO SAFE, to the point where yun can hagve the first attack again, and hit ppl that are either trying to backdash or jump away, leaving you blocking unless you mash out or wait for yun to stop doing it.
Fei Long really doesn't need many nerfs besides damage maybe, he has 2 useless ultras, and now that he cant spam chicken wing like a retard he really isn't too ridiculously hard to beat. And frankly, Yang isn't nearly as good as Yun, he has a lot of options, but his perssure strings arent nearly as good as yuns seeing as how his rekka pushes ppl back pretty far, while yun stays in close. To keep[ that distance yang needs to use 2 meters to fadc out of rekkas, and that makes it alot easier for ppl to recognize a command grab is coming rather than blocking a cr.mp from yun then gettin command grabbed. I really like the game, but Yun really does make about half the cast obsolete with his really safe pressure.
When playing against yun* Everyone can win in this game, which makes it fun, but for the love of god I do not see why capcom made evil ryu's health and stun so low. To get his high damage you need 2 meters or a lucky break, and frankly it isnt worth it when most ppl know your game plan is cr.mk fireball or axe kick to stay in close. 950 health 950 stun, THX!
"{Please tell to inside company what to do to give us spectator mode in MvC3. — LinkHeroSSBB
Ono: Our [team] already had passed [the] code to Marvel vs. Capcom 3's team before few years.}"
Ok this bothers me, he is basically saying that they passed the code to program spectator mode to the MvC3 team years ago, this means they "could" have put in Spectator mode in years ago. So what gives.
And guys could you please stop writijng bookes on these post? I can be guilty of this too but if every 100 post is like an essay I don't see a point in reading, I get enough of this in college. Just saying.
The_True_Gouki> no you're the one that needs to get a life, and Aluppoj is right is hasn't been confirmed yet and it's been 8 months now still unconfirmed and I think you need to be shot in the head with a bean bag at 1800 fps as well
back on topic but I totally agree with Aluppoj I want more stages and more characters especially Alex, I care less about a 3rd Ultra
yes if they do add Alex this game will have new life Guranteed!!! We need more stages is right. Aluppoj, Thank you for sticking up for me against idiots like The_True_Gouki and holmes15688 but I like what you posted in #60
It's pretty funny to see people in here calling everyone who has complaints about Yun and Yang crybabies when the pro community publicly seems to agree and THE PEOPLE WHO MADE THE GAME SAID THEY DID IT INTENTIONALLY. I don't see how people can try to argue otherwise and not even acknowledge it.
Now people have brought up good points that there have been characters like this in most fighting games prior without people complaining but the big difference is how would anyone have done it then? CVS2 came out a decade ago and Third Strike came out in 1999 (which in case people forgot was THE THIRD iteration of Street Fighter III). What websites would people have gone to then? People didn't publicly complain because they couldn't, the scene was much smaller and people didn't even have voice heard directly by Capcom.
ok here's a thought, just cuz ono and comp. said that they intentionally made the twins op doesn't necessarily mean that's how things ended up turning out.things don't always pan out as intended. IIRC the dev crew never intentionally make sagat and seth op back in vanilla yet that's what ended up happening.yet sagat/seth still didn't win many majors during vanillas tourney life.fast foward to now supposedly the twins are op yet the only to win a major with til this day is daigo and the top 8's of all the past tournies have been filled with variety hell el fuerte made top 8 which I can't remember that happening ever.point is we determine the op status of a char and so far yun is just very strong that's it.
one thing, everyone calling people crybabies need to shut up cause obviously there were people complaining about bison, guile and honda for them to catch the nerf as bad as they did. so there will always be complaints and though you might not agree with them you need to see where those people are coming from.
"If you wait until 2012 to patch this broken game [SSF4 AE] no one will bother to play it."
Sometimes I really hate the community.