Street Fighter 3 Third Strike Online Edition was originally going to be rebalanced, Seth Killian told SiliconEra. Apparently, the budget for the key features they felt had to be included didn't work in conjunction with rebalancing the game, so it was one of the things they cut.
"We had discussed it, actually, somewhat extensively," Seth Killian, Strategic Marketing Director of Online & Community, answered. "The first time I wrote this document for this game was probably, maybe, two and half years ago. When we put together the basic pitch, we did have as part of the potential budget a rebalance. In order to achieve some of the other things I felt were absolutely necessary for the game to be released – budget was going to be an issue, play testing in terms of time, and balancing was going to be an issue.
"Third Strike had over ten years of a competitive history," Killian added. "For anyone who wants to say the game is ridiculous in terms of balance or anything like that – there are very few games that have that kind of history that are actually as bad as they say they are. But, we do understand where they are coming from and it is something we considered."
Fan reaction seems to have been mixed. While some people love that the game won't be rebalanced, others thought it should have been. What do you think? Leave a comment below with your thoughts.
I think rebalancing would've brought a lot of new players and some older players returning to test it, but I still prefer the untouched arcade version, just because I'm hoping to see some Japanese players enter EVO 2012 and show how amazing 3s is.
I myself suck at that game, and prefer to play AE, but I'd MUCH rather watch high level 3s matches than AE or any other FG.
People like Kuroda and RX have done things with 3s no one could ever do with SF4.
i remember playing the game when i was younger. it was fun. i was blessed find a copy of it for the original xbox. i was never in depth with the game like the community for 3rd strike is today but i would like to play the game without rebalance for the simple fact that this is how the game is remembered. i want to play a that was remember as is. its worth way more than 15 bucks too. i agree #3
i guess its maybe because i wasnt into the third strike scene hardcore or something, but hoenstly im sorry, if the game isnt rebalanced, then i feel like im playing the exact same game, and i want the same game, but with a new feeling, and just playing the same game now that I played back in the day doesnt make scence to me........im sorry.
If they dont balance it then *shrugs* i just cant see myself buying it if its over 15 bucks........honestly........i really wish i could pay 10.....
@geni and Chow
none of this is known for fact. i doubt the ONLY people who want no rebalance are yun chun and ken players and the people who want rebalance are 09ers. unless you did some survey but whats that gonna prove on that internet?
Honestly?
I'd rather have the game rebalanced.
However I believe it should be an option - ala HDRemix.
That said, doing it like that would probably fracture the community...
I think the game should be played as it was, no rebalancing is needed to keep this game a classic. Sure I'd like Hugo's grabs a bit weaker and give Ken a damage boost on that kicking super, but I love that game for what it is: a broken, addictive mess. Kind of like a local neiborhood prostitute.
Keep in mind that:
Ppl are calling certain characters "broken" based on TEN YEARS of watching PRO'S play!
What you've seen on YouTube is NOT what you'll see online lol.
Also, when you open it up to the masses, believe it or not, NEW stuff WILL be discovered!
@Seth Killian
you balance that game characters,you're entering a world of pain.
actually this is not MVC,this is thirds strike,there are pros.
Rebalancing is not necessary. Not to someone like me. I've been playing these games all my life. Before the patch generation.
Back in the day you played the game as is. You either sank or swam. There was no crying until a problem or issue got fixed. You were forced to adapt. New players are too spoiled. Anything that "seems" remotely good has to be nerfed or removed.
Whatever happened to putting in work to get past a certain tactic? I couldn't imagine how terrible games like MvC2 or 3S or XvSF would have turned out if they had been released between '09-'11. Terribly nerfed and would have died about 6 months after.
@21
Idk, I'm not 1.2 million ppl. But believe me. Someone is going to grab a low tier character and beast with them.
When you open a predominantly arcade game to a massive online community, new combos and playstyles are going to emerge!
The community should take this as a challenge! Try to change a tier list that's been in place for a decade!
Can you do it?
Welcome to the World of Street Fighter 3!
Re-balancing only benefits the game in the short term because it is the hardcore and purists that will stick with the original for tournaments and practicing. The casual players, however, will just play with it for a few months and jump on to the next new thing.
Street Fighter III 3rd strike is a game that is still heavy being played in tournaments (world wide) and with the upcoming 3rdstrike online it will just stimulate longevity and new players thanks to the online features, robust training modes, and revamped graphics. Capcom did a smart move and anyone disagrees then ask yourself where is SSFII HD remix now?
Capcom made the right decision. HDR didn't bring any new players in because that scene is dead, however ST still has tournaments though(X-Mania). Titles like MVC3,AE and SFxT will bring new players in to fighting games.
lot of imbeciles in here want a broken game and no balance in a fighting game.. wtf?
ricefarmer <3. Where have you been? I've missed you complaining everywhere.
You can't please everyone period just move on people.
i'm sure it won't take too long for people to call for yun, chun, ken nerfs after release of third strike. re-balance it then
I wish people complaining about unbalancedness would just take a hike. If they nerf Yun and Chun, they'll just complain about Makoto. If they Nerf Makoto, they'll complain about Dudley.
Complainers will always complain, because they cannot beat it. Just get in the training room and learn to beat what's there, seriously.
Nerfing a character because you can't beat him is not really the best way to get up there in the rankings. He has to work for his wins too.
Seriously, the 'new' community really does pee me off.
It's funny to see you people be against rebalance, and yet, you're the same people who bitched about Sentinel, Storm, and Magneto during the MvC 2 days... Yet, you're the people who bitched about Sentinel in MvC 3.... and Yet you're the people who bitch about Yun in AE...
You guys are hypocrites....
Another vote for rebalancing (i.e. not buying). A better balanced fighter is a better game. People will drop this like a rock once they see the same three characters dominate. Just because "old school" games didn't get a revision does not make that a good thing. The technology just didn't exist. Treasuring a poorly-balanced game because it's "pure" is backwards thinking. If you prefer a poorly balanced mess because that's how it was "back in the day", then bless your heart. So you had it tougher and dealt with issues. Good for you, but we have the ability to fix these things now, and should.
the game does mot need balancing. tho only reason why we have oe is because of the people who love the game to begin with not those who couldn't be bothered to learn how to parry. ssf4ae is for everyone, 3rd strike online is for fans of the original game.
"rebalancing" hmmm lets see....we can...
- FK dmg - LK/MK/HK/EX flash kick damage is 100/120/130/ was 130/140/160
- glancing hit FK dmg - [100] to [80]
- backfist dmg - 120 to 90
- U2 dmg - 420 to 300
- U2 startup - slower by 2 frames.
- UDK damage - 120 to 100
- air throw range - 1.25 to 1.07
- air throw startup - 3 to 4 fr.
- boom stun LP/MP/HP/EX sonic boom blockstun reduced to +4/+2/+0/+1 - WAS +6/+4/+2/+1
- Meter gain - halved on boom
- Booms are CH-able by +20 frames
Pls see above for example on HOW NOT TO "REBALANCE"
@#41 So... You can't like the game but recognize that there were some things wrong with it? I see how this is.
I don't even think the game needs heavy rebalancing. But, it needs a little. But, when there seemed to be a LARGE community consensus that a few characters were overpowered, then I don't see how tweaking them would hurt anyone or their love of the game...
I joined the FG community about 2 years ago and started with 3s after having scrubby experience as a kid on MvC, Soul Calibur, and some Tekken. I immediately fell in love with 3s and experimented with other games as I was getting into it, since I knew I wanted FGs to be my main hobby from then on. Nothing fit me quite as well as Third Strike. I thought SFIV was lame, now I think Marvel is lame.
If I could join the community 9 years late and love the game, why can't people with 3so?
I see no need for a rebalance.
@42
wow, it was really that bad? Im glad im done with sf4 then. Guile wasnt dominateing any where to desire those nerfs. When u think about it MOst of the nerfs in ae are just retarded. but then again ae was made that way on purpose, i cant understand why people would even buy it.
45 - Yes, really. Dont get me wrong, I am still hype for AE on PC, but my goodness. I play Guile on the side, but you have GOT to have some compassion for the dedicated Guile players. I feel sorry for them. That was just a major smackdown for all of them. They re-buffed Sagat in AE, you think they would learn from Vanilla to Super to not OVERNERF like that. Super Guile was NOT Vanilla Sagat. They treated him worse.
Well the way I see it, fighting games will never be balanced despite what anyone believes. If there was such a thing, tier list would not exist and everyone would be almost the same in most ways. It would then come down to who looks like someone you would pick rather than their advantages. I think the game is fine how it is. It is the only way we will truly learn the game. As for people that complain now... What if SFV will take place after 3S? I would imagine the game getting a bit more complex. So I am thinking not only is this game made by fan request but maybe perhaps they are trying to get the next generation as well as the veterns a taste of what is to come. Just remember, if there is a chance the next street fighter will play anything like 3S, you will be thanking yourselves for the hell you will put yourself through to master it, and wont get let behind.
@#43 the reason why the game lasted so long was because how it was. the people who will play it in tournaments and the people who played it consistently up to this point on services such as ggpo(i.e the two groups responsible for online edition), will completely ignore the rebalancing in competitive scenarios just like hdr. and apart from sean i don't know who isn't a viable character in game to begin with.
Haters need to stfu; if you don't like it, don't buy it. Go back to playing your dumbed down version of the BEST SF, the trashy game called SSF4.
I hate when all these supposed "old school" players talk about how an un-balanced game should remain un-balanced and how people should learn to "deal" with it. I'm sure you have all "dealt" with it and picked up chun-li, yun, or ken. Nice dealing. If you are really a person that "deals" with it and picks non-top tier characters in 3S, who do you use?...and what do you know that is so amazing that you consistently deal with great yun,ken, and chun-li's? Because all I see in tournaments (US) are chun, yun, and ken...a few makotos, uriens, and dudleys and 5% the other characters..so either post a video of how you've beaten good kens, yuns, and chun's with your non-top tier character or admit that "dealing" simply means using 6 out of the 20 characters...
@41 nope it's because of the resurgence 4 brought that 3s is being given another shot.
Coming from someone who is not a 3s player I feel like this is the right move. While I don't plan on playing 3s I believe that rebalancing wouldn't attract enough new players to compensate for the old players who would be disenfranchised from their toys being taken away. Also there's too much to compete with SF4:AE, MK9, and SFxT being the hot stuff right now for new blood.
If 3soe does well, and if Capcom would want to revisit the old mechanics, really the only way to do it would be to do "4a" (SF3:4th Assault). Add in some characters like Juri, Seth, and Abel, and m.a.y.b.e HD Remix the graphics. But even with that it's really a tough sell to say all that extra work would attract the extra players (and the extra buyers).
However I also fear that no matter how perfect they make the port, nothing will replace the old versions. Just look at MvC2.
@50 lol your only bitching because Chun would get nerfed and you don't want that.
They couldn't fit rebalancing into the budget so it had to get cut, eh?
Good thing they didn't cut out achievements, trial mode, fan art, numerous graphical filters, youtube replay uploads, and all of those other "essential" features! I'm glad they started with something insignificant that nobody wanted like tweaking the balance in a game with known issues!
Brilliant decision making and damage control as usual, Capcom.
The purpose of a fighting game in my view is for it to be fun first and foremost, but also to make every character in the game tournament competitive ( ie: balanced). These two aspects make a great fighting game. You can have just one to make a "good" fighting game, but for it to be "great" it needs to be balanced and fun. I simply would like to see more characters being played. I suggest to have maybe a balance update to 3S:OE...kind of like SSF4:AE...and let people decide what they want to play. People who want to simply play the original unchanged version can...and those who would like a more balanced rendition can have that too...everyone wins....I know I personally would pay even full price ($60) for a good balanced 3S version.
well if i thought i hated online yun yang ken and chun li, i cant imagine how much fun i will have with this game.i will say the features are way bettterrr than AE and MvC3 put together. Very disappointed in both of those games with the features.
For the people begging for a rebalance why the hell do you think this game is still being played? Because the game is fine as is. Lets see how long MvC3 will last with that unbalanced trash. Hell every fighting game out right now is unbalanced. mvc3 = xfactor/wolverine, AE = Yun/Yang/Fei, Mortal Kombat = Kung Lao/Raiden. So stfu with a balanced game, there will never be one, and once there is, it will be boring as f*ck.
If you think about it 4-5 characters at the top is about what you have with every fighting game, however I would've preferred a little bit of rebalance (but none is fine too).
A little priority here, a little stamina there, and little more damage here and there would've been good to see.
People are just complaining without giving reasons. My reasons for the rebalance is to increase the level of "top tier" characters from 4-5 to 8-10. Is that a bad thing?
The fact that a serious rebalance might have happened if money weren't an issue means that Seth and the producers did realize that the game needed balancing. So qft,I would have hoped the game were balanced so we could see it in upcoming tournies again with some new superstars (maybe moi? lol)
@60 yes there are normally 4 - 5 characters at the top...that isn't the problem..the issue is how much better they are in comparison to the rest. Its alright that they are better..but the fact that they are much much better....8 - 2 matches...that is a big issue....
also at 58....its lasted long because its a streetfighter game and it is fun..not because the balance isn't an issue...
@ CaptainKangaroopimp I think the game gets more boring if broken characters exist as not only will one be playing the same character over and over again either online or offline. A more balanced game means more variety. I myself am planning to join the Yun bandwagon and be one of the millions who will play as him.
@63
Perhaps I wasn't clear, but I was trying to say exactly what you were saying. With a little tweaking here or there (like damage and stamina scaling)you could made 8-10 characters at the top dominating the rest rather than 4 or 5.
Rebalancing old games = flops.
CvS2 EO?
SF2 HDR?
There's a limited amount of players looking for fighting games, and of that there's an even smaller amount of players dedicated, or willing to play an old game like ST or 3S. Messing with an established game will only split that already small scene and will be worse for the game in the long run.
If I were Capcom... I would buff some of the worst characters of the game. We dont know who is the very top tier (there are like 4 of them), so the game as it is I think its perfect. Buffin low tiers, keepin top tiers the same, just that simple. But if not I dont really care, the game its pure gold.
personoly im in favor of no rebalance. i love the game how it is. yun and chun arnt THAT bad. sure they are better then most the cast but have their flaws. like if you parry a yuns dive kick he is ripe for the pickings ( with Q you can end up doing 3/4 yuns health with a combo and super after a parried dive kick). if you are apart of the rebalance croud. i can see where you are coming from but ask your self this. Will you actually play this game for years to come? because using Q as main and makoto as a secondary i played 3s from arcade realease to the death of the original xbox.
I never played 3s before so I cant really say anything about rather it should be re-balanced or not. I do understand about adapting in order to become good or pro to be compete with top tier players but its another thing when a game is broken or unbalance and everyone is using the same character in order to win a tournament or win period, I use should be able to use a character that I enjoy using and still be able to hold my own weight instead of picking a character because he or she has a better advantage over the entire roster.
Seth yo seth
MVC2 is saying hi to that last little comment
But yeah the thing is Sean is a very different kinda character with a Shoto base because he has a command grab and a more Dan kicks like Tatsu as well as an intresting attack with the wheel kick. Having him basically as slow and easily as punished as he is, to me is basically a waste of a good character. Hell I've actually had to learn Gen from scratch and win more with him then I do with Sean
This game is not nearly as broken as some people claim. I doubt you're goigoing to run into anyone like MOV or Kuroda online. To 90% of the community the whole cast is pretty much viable.
Considering AE and 3rd strike will be the only Capcom fighters until SFxTekken, it may be appropriate to assume good sales of OE could signal a rebalance or update to one or both.
@FDB
Are you me? Because when I read your comments I feel like I'm reading myself.
Absolutely 3S needs balancing. For everyone that didn't want it and got your way I wish you would all be a little more honest with your character choices because I've been playing Oro and Elena and get ready to fight exactly the same five guys forever. And for that reason you should be happy but don't expect the game to make a comeback in the tournament scene whatsoever. Most players consider the game to be dead. So yes, 10 years is a long time but this wasn't the 90's it was the "two games released in a decade" 00's. Remember Mario Kart was at EVO during those years and 3S still wasn't even the main event. Even ST was as, or more, popular to most players then.
A rebalance was a good idea that I hope makes a comeback. And please don't bring up HDR as a negative because that's played out. I played ST for three years before HDR and as a Honda/Fei player I'm thrilled with those buffs. The mass of ST players were older who didn't want to relearn matchups and the new guys think it's cooler to listen to the masses. 3S rebalances should happen if the game sells well.
And @Novacane - a tier list means a character has bad odds not "can't" win. Someone doing well with low-tier doesn't mean they didn't work harder for less the whole round. And finally, Yang isn't low tier, he's mid. Mid is not low tier and if you think he is, you just might be a tier whore. Not to call you out of course, it's just a very transparent thing to say.
@ #72: Exactly. Chances are if you run into somebody using high tier and they beat your ass it won't be because he was using a high tier character. They're just the better player.
You can't just pick up a high tier character and start beasting on people. You're gonna have to do this one thing called "practice". It's a concept some of you may not understand because you're too busy crying on message boards trying to have games changed to meet your needs.
And LOL to the people saying "You must play Chun or Yun to not want a rebalance". So if I said I didn't want vanilla SF4 rebalanced I must be a Sagat user? That kind of logic is stupid. I like games to be as AUTHENTIC as possible. I play Urien and Q in 3S, and I don't want a rebalance. I LIKE the uphill battle. It makes me smile when I red parry into DDC with Q.
thing are this...
I really dont care if the game is balanced or not, but Im pretty sure even if all the characters in this game have potential the 85% or more of battles online will be vs 6 diferent characters only (no need to mention right?), and thats why I hate when there is powerfull characters cuz all people uses them and online get repetitive, thats all.
people always like easy things...
just ask people here what character he uses or will use.
Rebalancing could have given this game a breath of fresh air.
No rebalancing, same old game, and as much as I love it, I'm sick and tired of it. I wish some characters had more options, I wish some supers were better, etc. But no, no balancing, no changes. I have been given no reason whatsoever to buy this.
And its not like they couldn't have both in the game (arcade balance, and new balance).
The only reason why SFIII:3SOE is coming out at all is because of the success of the SFIV series. It doesn't surprise me at all that they didn't rebalance it at all. Everyone who never played it at a high level will now get the chance to get their behinds handed to them by the "three gods" and then be perfectly willing to pay even more money for an update with rebalancing.
Just like I agree that AE was made broken to promote 3S, leave the window open for another SSF4 upgrade and push people towards SF X TK. I just think these are cynical corporate strategies at work. So many people have complained about the DLC alternate costumes model, the big empty suits had to come up with a new way to milk everyone. That's the digital distribution model of the 21st century based on the success of Apple's App Store, inter alia.
That's a real shame. If it sells above expectations (which I doubt), they should take some of those profits and put them into a patch that adds optional balance adjustments. Open the game up to new players in a way it was never so open before. Anyone who really loved SFIII would want to see that happen, and better balance would help it.
@85
And you are underestimating new players ability to do some homework on the internot and know who the top tiered characters are and abuse them. You're also underestimating new players' ability to play at a high level.
You'll see, whether they are good at all or not, thanks to people wanting to play as the best characters, we'll all quickly get bored seeing nothing but Ken, Chunners and Yun on 3SOE.
It's not going to take a decade for these younger players to catch on.
MAJOR IDEA:
Balance this game fairly to see how the reaction is and base future games off it.
Yun - SA3 Meter drains faster, Meter length extended by 25%
Chun - SA3 Meter Stock is 1
Ken - SA3 Stock is 2. Meter length increased %25 Slower Startup by 4 frames. Can no longer shoryuken juggle into itself.
I love it how some people are saying "if you want a rebalance your a scrub, suck it up". I'm perfectly fine with the game not being balanced, seeing it's the best SF game, but if it were rebalanced it would be even better - there is just too much of a difference in effort-reward for characters and with balancing, we would actually see the roster geting used a bit.
Example of decent balancing - blazblue carl - you work your ass off, your opponent gets his ass handed to him.
Example of bad balancing - sf3 12 - you work your ass off, gz, you took down the opponent to 2/3 of his life and you still gonna die to one combo.
Capcom will release the game as it is without the rebalances and see how the market reacts to it. If its a huge success then I can see them rebalancing it due to public demand. If it isnt a big success then it will stay as it is but atleast hardcore sf3 players will be able to play against each other online. This is a nice gesture by Capcom, they could have just concentrated on sf4 and sfxtekken but they decided to bring sf3 to 2011.
this game is fine.. stop with he crying. yea, some characters are better than others, but that doesn't really mean anything if you're skill level is low. I use Ken, Chun, Ryu, & Dudley because I've used them in every SF game I've played.. I ignored the tier list because they are there for reasons I don't know about. Plus this game is SOOOOO much better that AE. they pretty much screwed that game up with the AE release. no re-balance makes it 3S.. & thats what I want. I'm done with that lame AE when this game comes out
All the people asking for a rebalance,
1.YOU ARE NOT THE TARGET AUDIENCE.
3SO was made specifically for the people who play 3S til
this day
2.This game is a re-release NOT A REMAKE.
It's not suppose to bring a breath of fresh air to 3S.
3.You would rather fracture a 10 year community for the sake
of character variety?!
4.There have been bad ports of this game in the past such as
the PS2 version.
IMO, the people who stuck with 3S for 10 years (like the producer of 3S0) and supported the scene by actually showing up to tournaments should have the final say. Anyway Gootecks is a true 3S player and he seemed more than happy with Capcoms decision to keep the game Arcade Perfect.
Thx mrdrofficer...it seems there aren't many people with actual logic here at the comments section...at least I know there is one
@93 ...Gootecks also plays urien.....a very good character...had he been a sean main that fact might have a bit more weight behind it....The way I see it....many people who don't want a rebalance either play a top or high tier character as their main and/or don't want to re-learn match-ups from the now viable rest of the cast...
Also I've noticed that there is a big argument circling the idea of separating a community 10 years in the making...This being one of the reasons not to rebalance. I say thats a good thing...who cares if they are seperated. All you have to do is have a normal arcade perfect version with a rebalanced option in the game. If you want to run through the comp with yun online...swell play the old version. If you want to actually use those other 15 characters everyone seems to forget about try the new version with the changes to make them more competitive...plus this is good for the new comers as well. For example I had a friend a few years back who wanted to pick up the game and was immediately drawn to Q. Now imagine a new comer getting his butt handed to him by Yun's, Ken's and Chun's and the incredibly tall mountain he has to climb to even be able to hang with people that play them...its too much for them....they will eventually break and pick a top tier, not because they like that character the most, but so they have a fighting chance. That is whats truly awful in my opinion.....
It's tiresome the bogus ownership people think they have over something like a game or a band just because they "think" that their level of "participation" in a "community" is superior to that of others. Just like with SF IV online, you'll see an entirely new "community" arise from the ashes of the old. That's life.
The argument that a rebalance OPTION will "split the community" is shallow and not well thought out and only relevant to self-proclaimed SF III elitists.
I think Street Fighter fans are spoilt for choice -- there's SF2HD, SF4 and now SF3, all with great online play.
The Udon artists and David Sirlin did an amazing job on HD Remix. Now that game is a bargain.
I think SF3 should be left alone because that series always had a cult following. It doesn't need to attract new players, because those people are supposed to play the SF4 series, and casuals have MVC3's Easy Mode to mess around with.
Now, I have always been a mediocre player, never learnt to parry, but I had a lot of fun with SF3. I could never be good at Zangief in the old SF2 days (I can use him now) but I could use Alex' Power Bomb all day.
Unfortunately the graphics won't be redrawn in HD, but I just did a screencap of SF3 and tried some graphics filters on it, and it definitely looks better with HQ3X and HQ4X upscaling, it would be nice if Capcom could offer that feature.
It does have that squashed look that Capcom games tended to have in those days, I wonder if it will have black bars on the left and right on re-release.
@95
Think of all those players that put all the time and effort into learning to beat their bad match ups in 3S and a group of people just come along and say, "well screw the 10 years you poured into the game, lets make it different for the sake of new players that will already be playing AE and SFxT"
Trying to balance an old game that already has a strong following is like trying to reinvent the wheel. SF4 recently had a balance patch and their players are complaining more than ever.
@Super Shoto
"Well screw the 10 years they put into this game" - Well if making the other 2/3 of the cast a viable threat is a change that "true" 3S fans can't cope with, then who are they to call out people for being scrubs? People that just want to be able to competitively play their favorite characters?
And ... true. SFIV had a balance recently and people are complaining but that's because of a lack of characters and stages. Not balance. How many people were complaining about Super's balance? Especially compared to AE or the Sentinel patch?
For all the "whining" the "Hardcore" says about the "noobs" the fact is nobody bitches louder than the Hardcore and the fanboys because they are the ones conditioned to play top-tier while new and casual players play the characters they are attracted to. When something like the Sentinel patch (the most similar case here) happens, the hardcore say "learn how to play noobs" and then after the patch it turns into, "noobs just whine and get their way." How about ... "Wow this matchup seems more fair and Sentinel can still kill a character with the same easy combos I'm used to, I just don't have GDLK health as well. Seems fair to me." How damn refreshing.
Players like UltraDavid and Markman said they just wish they could have companies make patches frequently until the roster is considered balanced by the community and then the company can move on. This is the MK approach and I think their is merit in this idea.
And to the people who came out and said they played Urien - kudos for your honestly, but Urien is exactly one of the top five played in the game and thus part of the problem. Q however is hard to play but on the level of other heavy hitters like Hugo - fun losers. You can't say you win much with Q, unless your Kuroda who has just trolled in 3S for the last five years.
@97 If I'm an SF3 elitist you're an idiot.
@96 SF2 got re-balanced (ala HD Remix) and where's that nowadays? The unnecessary changes basically killed the player base.
@100 Apparently you haven't read the millions of posts here or on SRK crying about Yun when he isn't even broken.
For all the crying kids who say: "Only the players with top-tier mains didn't want the rebalance."
You should watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMxL3M...
Chad from ScrewAttack is very good at 3s and he uses Oro as his main. Oro vs Chun is 2-8 according to tier lists. Watch his reaction when he heard 3s will NOT be rebalanced.
Stop crying and bitching. Learn how to adapt instead. This is becoming a pathetic rant.
People just need to calm down, balances or not, we just need to wait and see what happens.
Obviously it is all up to Capcom what they do to the game and to us, the fighting game community.
If you feel so strongly about re-balance issues, then stop whining about "The guys who just can't play the game as is" and let Capcom know you don't want your precious childhood game changed. And everyone that keeps saying "Oh top tiers this and that, they dont want them since they're so good." Stop wasting your time and do the same, let Capcom know you'd like a more balanced game.
Personally, I could care less, I just want the damn game.
Any changes that come or don't come with them, can be easily adapted to.
And for all those "Oh, those damn 09'ers whine and moan, go back to your crap game SSF4" and the "You either sink or swim" nonsense. I just think you're all being a bit of a hypocrite, if you're so against changes and re-balances yet you say things like "Players just learned to adapt, or they just kept at it, you either sank or swam."
Then why'd you all quit SF4 so damn fast?
I'm guessing the 3rd Strike fanboys in the comments would defend SSF2T Akuma or SF4 Sagat with exactly this much zeal...
I'm glad they didn't change it. I'm kind of tired of them balancing everything based on their own opinions and what color the shirt they wore that day is. Ruined SF4, no reason to ruin this.
@106 SF4 Sagat wasn't broken you moron. Then again you're stupid so you wouldn't know that.
It would have been interesting to see what kind of changes they would have made. However, I'm very happy with how things worked out. 3rd Strike is an amazing game and im glad to have an arcade perfect port with awesome online options. No complaints here.
yea cuz its sooo pro to cr.fwd into sa2 with chunli.nah we won't see an army of chuns online naah."we played games as is"? "we either sank or swam"? u sir are a fuking idiot. what do u think each new version of SF was?u think sean magically became ass from SI to 3s?or ryu just happened to misplace his 2nd meter for denjin? no, 2nd impact was REBALANCED when 3s came out.
for the record, the ONLY reason 3s lasted as long as it has is cuz back then THAT'S ALL WE HAD!FOR 10 YEARS! not cuz its some gods gift to fighting games.if fgs hadn't died back then a new iteration of the sf3 series would've been made and guess what?it would have been rebalanced!u know a game is broken when their are 8 - 2 match ups in it.
how u have a super that takes 30%+ dmg AND give u FREE mixup all from a LAZY ass hit confirm?how u have a normal(chun back+fp) that stuffs more than half of the games atks from the ground and the air?or yun with a super with the shortest meter in the game,can cancel all atks into each other in any order, gain massive frame advantage on everything to the point that atks are UNpunishable even w/parry and a "ender" that leaves u 1 atk away from full meter.
but then u have a char like sean with not 1 safe move,a tackle grab that's so ass that ppl that even play sean only use it as a command dash and not as it was originally intended and ass supers.or twelve who can't even chain 1 normal and only has 1 (maybe 2) real normal(s) that can combo into anything (sorry but b.mk would be used as a AA b4 being used for a combo).the mark of a good fighting game is having a cast that is fully equipped with everything they need to be able to beat any1 else in the cast.3s doesn't have this quality and def needs some minor adjustments.
@111 I agree with your post but there must be no good fighting games by that logic. Basically no fighter nowadays is balanced.
@105 - most 3s players quit 4 cuz they realized that they could no longer blindly rush in and/or jump in for free,had to make sure they didn't drop combos or theyd get dp'd,couldn't recklessly pressure their opponents wake up with meatys,had to learn how to zone and space with their specials and couldn't get away with murder cuz they had the option to parry any and everything. they all disguised that as "sf4 is scrub friendly I'll stick with a real game 3s" which translates to "I'm gonna stick with 3s cuz its all I'm good at".ST was a harder game.
@109 - sagat as a char wasn't broken (tho his frame traps were kinda gay) but his dmg output compared to the rest of the cast def was.when TU,fadc,f+rh,ultra leads to automatic comeback or in some cases victory then yes that's broken.
@112 - not necessarily.st,alpha2/3 and cvs2 are all great games.all fgs will have uphill battles.I don't mind that part. but when battles are so uphill that it renders half/more than half the cast obsolete or nearly obsolete then yes that's a bad and poorly designed game.games like mvc2 and 3s are perfect examples of this.I love all things SF but the III series has always been my least fav cuz its never felt like sf.
@114 I actually meant the more recent fighters that everyone is playing nowadays but I understand what you mean.
It takes a lot for a char to be broken so I just want to be sure ppl in an argument (unlike most ppl now) understand ridiculously high =/= broken (esecially since vanilla Sagat harldy won tourneys IIRC).
ST is a harder game than 3s and 4, so I don't know what your point is. 3s players don't like 4 because the game is not about offense at all. It actually rewards most characters and players for playing defensively and then getting bursts of damage. If you're getting your ass rushed down, then you should have to block properly, not reversal, with a completely safe move to get out of pressure. I'm glad the game isn't rebalanced. The only way balancing that would make me happy is if they gave Dudley the shoto dash and shoto crouch forward.
@117: Reversal with a completely safe move to get out of block pressure? Who the hell are you talking about?
(Also, I'd like to hear your answer to 105's last sentence...)
@101 HD-remix isn't very much on the tournament scene nowadays because of basically all the things I already hinted at. It does not have a perfect super turbo arcade perfect port, which may or may not have attracted the old tournament goers for super turbo (probably not). On top of this they changed the game and basically made it completely different for numerous reasons..but mostly they gave gief and some others a fighting chance who normally didn't have them...unless you were Kuni...but based on the ridiculous comments I really dont think Kuni is commenting on here. This said...old players who come back don't want to get beat by new comers and have to learn the new game...they just want the same old thing they played ages ago....thats fine...but remember HD remix does not have an arcade perfect super turbo port in it....that was its mistake. What I suggest for Third Strike is to have the arcade perfect be the default but have another balanced mode in the game. Not to mention if you play remix (like I do...as gief might I add) you will notice there are still alot of people that play to this day. Tournaments are not indicative of the success of remix...
I just feel that if you have both a completely unchanged version and a re-balanced version of 3rd Strike and held tournaments using both unchanged and re-balanced versions of the game it would be interesting to see how many people would show up to play each...and what new faces we would see playing all types of characters and not just the typical three.
wooo there is alot of complaints here. Funny how people keep bringing up the top 3 or 5. and after reading through all the comment seems like there are about 6-7 people being nominated to be top 5, do people even look at the lists before spouting off? Yun,ken,chun,makoto,urien,dudley all mentioned for being top 5 in this thread.
And someone called yang low tier??? Yang and akuma are usually rated above urien. And that being said someone here tries to invalidate Gootecks stance for no rebalancing cause he deemed urien to be in the top 5. Ryu and Oro almost breaks even with urien on the list too just being slightly under him.
There is plenty room for variety if people were to actually step up to the plate. There is about 19 people in 3s and about half the cast show there faces in the tournaments being played. I would say that 10 is good number given that it isnt a big roster to begin with.
Cant say that about that about sf4 series games especially being valued to be more balanced and a bigger roster yet usually see about the same 9-10 people being played outta what is now 39 people. And if people wanna throw out outliers such as gamerbee's Adon( he also dipped into the fei long and akuma at last tournament) i could throw in Hayao's Hugo. They are still competing with characters people would deem not optimal thus showing it is possible to win.
So what looks better on paper 7-10 outta 19 or 9-10 outta 39. People shouldnt complain about imbalances, no game is perfect. While sad to used something that is overdone, Kuroda is an example of how skill can overcome character flaws and win against all odds. If its possible for him to do it...Why cant others? Possibility is there and its not like he overworks himself to win(As people would say about using a low tier). He seems to be trolling more often than not.
And about the topic at hand rebalance or not doesnt effect me much and i use Alex,sean, hugo,Q and a few others. Ive played it on all platforms and played it the longest on ggpo online with many many other people. And guess what most people arent Pro tournament players so fighting against the top tier characters isnt an issue.
And if i do run into a pro player i can expect to get my ass beat due to them being better than me not cause of them using a top tier(mainly cause they can reset the game and win in a mirror against me outplaying me) Granted i dont go down without a fight which i let them know when they do mess up that i can bring the pain pretty quick so dont sleep on me, lingering stun gauge is my friend =).
At the end of the day the game is known to be unbalanced, yes its still more then playable for most but broken none the less, so if you want to repackage summat and sell it then aleast fix it. What makes me laugh is seth pretty much said they would have rebalanced it if they had the budget which says it all really. And on another note one big problem with the fighting game community and the games community in general is people going on about how hardcore they are and how long they have played games as if it means summat like calling people who started playin SF with SF4 09ers that is just sad, people need to stop trying to prove how hardcore they are eg i bin playin this since the stoneage back when we had no patches. Every in this cpmmunity needs to come together as a whole to make games better.
@ZAbuza
Damn you, Zabuza, for killing this thread with your rational, fair argument, supported by facts listed in the OP. How could you? Let's be friends.
Anyone complaining about the balance in this game needs to get their butt handed to them by a high-level Twelve or Remy player. Those are supposedly 'low-tier' characters but they can be deadly in the right hands - same with Hugo, Q, etc. The only character who might have some trouble is Sean, and even then, I'm sure there are plenty of Sean players out there who can kick my tail and then some.
In all honesty if they could balance they game and do it right then i'd be up for it.... but it's capcom here... they will nerf the low tiers, and buff the high tiers.... and they admit to it and say it will be uninteresting if the game is balanced
Because we all want to see everyone pick the same 1-3 characters? Ugh Seth Killian has no sense, that guy just spits out crap and says it's a prime steak.
@121 - Tougeki 3rd Strike first place teams:
2003 – Ken, Yun, Makoto
2004- Ken, Chun-Li, Yun
2005 – Chun-Li, Ken
2006 – Chun-Li, Ken, Yun
2007 – Chun-Li, Yun, Makoto
2008 – Akuma, Makoto, Chun-Li
2009 – Chun-Li, Yun, Makoto
2010 – Ken, Yun, Chun-Li
Evo 3s first/second places.
2003 – Yun/Ken
2004 – Yun/Ken
2005 – Chun/Chun
2006 – Yun/Yun
2007 – Ken(Yun)/Chun
2008 – Chun/Chun
2009 – (Chun,Yun),(Yang,Urien)
(teams)
u were saying? what was that about there being "plenty of variety"? 9 - 10 out of 19? ur oh deeing more like 5 - 7 out of 19 when looking at the ratio of attendies and averaging their char choices.where in this LEGIT list of winners do u see a hugo, a Q, or even a dudley? yea such variety in the span of only 7 years.lastly for the love of god HOP OFF KURODAS NUTS!!!Spitting kurodas name proves NOTHING! does he use sean,Q or any of those other low tiers at SBO??? NO! he uses Akuma.AKUMA!! him trolling on ppl nowhere near his skill level only proves that he has fun trolling scrubs with crap chars,no diff than what happens here in the states when good players play scrubs.this game obviously needs some minor tweaking.
i do find it funny when people use other pros that body people with lower tiers as evidence they are viable yet they never get top 3 with those low tiers in any major tournament.
The same people who say dan(or any other low tier for that matter) is viable because justin wong used him in the finals and won a few...
but guess what? He (nor anyone else who uses low tier) they never stick with those crappy low tiers all the way through the tourney. And most just use them once or twice on those not so bad matchups... or maybe once or twice to switch things up...but they never seem to be able to go to the end using those low tiers only
@#127
Sigh way to go reading it wrong and nitpicking words out and take them outta context. I said there is plenty of room for variety "IF" people were to step up. I didnt say there WAS variety. Read much? From what you listed Ken,yun,chun,makoto,yang,urien,akuma... i said 7-10 for 3s(7 different names listed, close enough estimation) the 9-10 was for ssf4 comparison. Was pointing out ratio wise you see more variety in 3s than ssf4 due to roster size but no complaining as much, which was the point i was going for.
I understand the game could use some tweaking or whatever, my stance on it is that it "doesn't" bother me given the example i gave after....I DONT GO TO TOURNAMENTS CLEARLY so running into "godlike" kens,chuns, yuns isnt likely as it hasnt happen much in my time playing the game all these years. only noticables on ggpo was nicaKO, renic, acslayer,rakurai that i can recall was actually very good online. But i never made it a focus to challenge them.
Sheesh i would love for alex sa2 to have a vacuum effect like kens sa3 so people wont get pushed outta range, the grab portion whiffs and i get punished instead. Or hyperbomb isnt jumpable on reaction. Or sean being disadvantaged alot for even landing a hit with some of his special moves lol.
Hopefully you read this reply properly before responding.
Oh and to add about the whole kuroda thing, i said he was trolling more often than not after talking about him, never said he was winning big tournaments or whatever nor implying it. We cant edit posts so not like im switching up my story. Most people here dont even attend tournaments so it should be a moot point when playing online or whatever. People make it seem like you cant win with ANYONE else in general without using the top 3. But of course most of this viability mess is directed at tournament results even though most dont even go so it doesnt apply to them yet they complain.
Just cause something is possible doesnt mean it will or did happen.
i have a great idea for a balanced fighting game, only have one character! Oh, but then some of you guys will cry that one color or costume is "better" than the other and demand re-balancing.
no I read ur post perfectly powdered toast, its u who didnt catch the point I was trying to make so I'll explain.yes those chars do show up in tourney but how many of them do u see on the list I provided?not many.u may not play at tourneys but that doesn't mean others don't.I used to play in tourneys until I got tired of putting in all that work just to fight chars that can essentially guess right twice and win.then watching grand finals was equally as dreadful. not to mention boring and monotonous.ppl have been even if I mixed the numbers up u still caught my meaning. oh and just cuz u don't play in tourneys doesn't mean u won't be running into an army of chuns,yuns, and kens online. also if u know kurodas a troll why mention him? what purpose did mentioning his name serve? as u get higher in lvl ur chances of winning get lower and lower if u don't use the god 3.the brokeness of the game applies to all ppl that take the game even remotely serious enough to know things like option selects,charge partitions etc.
@#133 what you are asking for is a 4th iteration of the game. once you change the balance of the game it ceases to be third strike. the last time i checked this was a PORT of third strike not 4th blow or whatever it would be called.
It could only be re-balanced if they called it something else. 4th whatever. Because if it was 3s remix fans and tournaments would have ignored it.