AlexxShadenk777 posted a new tool assisted set of matches for Street Fighter 3 Third Strike. He changed up the way these are put together and had this to say about it.
I kicked away the formula I used for the past four tool assisted fights, and present here something which, I hope, shows more solid sort of playing rather than unrealistic — regarding the usage of parrying, reactions and counters, that is. It's still crazy as ever, and I made it a point to not make long sessions of parrying between the two fighters.
Also this way I can showcase all supers for both characters. This kind of tool assisted video, I think, will be more appreciated!
In before 3S praise/bashing. This is my chance!!!
3S fanboys (I play Oro), how does parry not favor characters that don't have to charge? CH have to choose charge or parry. How is this OK? Not bashing, just trying to get my question through on something no 3S fanboy has been able to give me a straight answer on.
The way I look at 3S is: It wasn't this hard/expert game people (It had OS parrying and no distance game) It was just SF with some pretentious design choices and a system that didn't lend itself to all characters. Not bad but not some pinnacle of the series. IV took EX and a form of the parry and refined them, yet 3S fans still bash IV for being easy despite the mechanics being remarkably similar.
ACTUALLY ...
mhhh isn't that exactly the point of a tool assited match? To show ridiculous showcase of parry abuse, inhuman reflexes and insane combos? What's the point to "pgrogramm" faulty play? Seems odd - in that case I'd rather watch a human vs human match, not some cpu vs cpu ranbat.
Just sayin, liked the old concept way more.
No. Nothing. It's the same game 3S is IV with less pretentious-ness. But IV will never have something 3S does ... Oro and Elena. Sweet, sweet Oro.
Dhalsim alt colors don't count!
@#2, all charge characters can punish after parry also without specials hard enough. In some cases it requires harder inputs than just doing something>SRK.
So yes, if you are a newbe who tries to get the hang of parries, yes, circle-motion characters are most likely the thing you want to start with; this makes them also in pro player better characters, but only within the usual influences of a tier list.
@2
ive done it plenty of times but if you look around you can see many players do (mainly with Urien) parry>chariot tackle. i think Kuroda has done it a lot of times to. hold on i'll link it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmCkS0...
look at what he does. btw not a fanboy but WTH
3rd Strike>>>SF4 (SF4 is still good though).
@7: Judging by some of your previous posts on the subject and this one, you most certainly are a fanboy.
I don't see why he needs to make these videos "more realistic" toward real-life play. They're tool-assisted! I really like these and I don't care how real they are to actual matches, shouldn't the whole point be entertainment? I like to imagine this is how the fighters would fight unrestrained by simple controls, like in CGI cutscenes or something.
@8
hahaha if i was a 3rd Strike fanboy, i wouldnt say SF4 is good. thats the point of being a fanboy, you choose one game (or whatever your fanboying) and call the competitor trash/poop/garbage/etc...
Judging by some of your previous posts on the subject and this one, you most certainly are a troll so...
i like both his vids. this one and the previous ones with all the crazy parrying and stuff. but if i had to choose i would pick his older vids, simply because its entertaining to watch. with this vid i feel its been dumb downed. if i wanted to watch this i would go on the Shends channel (this is similair to how the pros play except a bit faster). anyways this one was good but if your reading this i think you should go back to the crazy stuff lol
#3 & #9: It still is entertainment on the same level of over the top; I used *a lot* of kara-anything and red parries throughout. All I removed were the long sessions of parries as compared to the workings of the previous matches (and the Judgement), and added some safe pokes/corner strategies at smart moments, so that the fights flow more smoothly. I mean, Akuma *only* did combos that few people won't/can't do in actual matches. And Ken red parried KKZ. I think watching only once is not enough if you can't notice just how much was performed.
@n1ght and Bison
Thanks so much for REAL answers guys. This clears up a lot for me. I do remember Uriens doing parry to reversal but I guess I couldn't quite understand how that worked. Sounds like it's possible, but we agree it's not optimal. That sounds about right.
Thanks for the feedback!!!
@#2
Could always just charge partition that way you can still get the move out.
You play Oro anyways... you shouldn't be doing anything after a parry other than the CW loop. Stand Mp Cancel into CW then stand Mp into CW then Stand mp into anything you want.
@8 If you're gonna call someone else on out on their posts you should at least make sure your posts aren't 90% complaints or posts that try to start fights because you complain incessantly.
@16: You're calling me a troll (never seen that before), and I was saying that someone else was a 3S fanboy. I don't see how your post has anything to do with mine.
(P.S. If you're gonna call someone out on picking a fight, you should at least make sure you're not doing exactly the same thing you accuse the other person of doing.)
@18 So you're not denying it then?.....When you complain as much as you do and talk down about a certain game to the point where it seems like you're trying to start arguments then you come off as a troll.
Where in my post before did I call you a troll also? Mighty defensive about that lol. I could even repost most of your messages for you if you don't think you're being a pessimistic jerk about the whole situation. Feel free to prove me wrong.
@ mrdrofficer
It's all about input leniency and reversal-like inputs.
When you hold back the whole time, press then nothing, then forward, and if the parry appears now within the next 6 frames, you can then press kick on the next frame to do a tackle as early as the parry-animation ends.
With charge partitioning it's more like, charge>parry>keep charging(>do a buffer-attack)>i.e. tackle.
As I said, it's possible using harder inputs (though i still referred to punishments without specials; Urien has c.hp, Remy has c.hp, Oro has a nice command throw; you can't punish light attacks this way mostly, but those you usually block anyway rather then relying on parry all the time).
@19: You say you didn't call me a troll, right after you call me a troll. You summarily ignore my arguments while repeating your own; I wonder who the real trolls are...
Cool arguments you dudes have, especially when they have absolutely nothing with the thread. Aren't you breaking rules 2 and 3 by doing this?
Great to see all supers in action (in "pro play" it's usually just one super over and over again).
That Akuma combo with 2 supers was so badass... I remember practicing that in training mode haha!
Messatsu Gourasen forever!! It's my favorite super (despite being nerfed so bad after 2nd Impact).
Awesome job Alexx!! I gotta check your other videos...
@22 Saying you come off as a troll and saying you're a troll are not the same even though that may be hard to comprehend for you. I didn't ignore your argument since my argument was about HOW you post and antagonize which you did not deny.
I don't think you're a troll....I just think you're either a typical "hatemail" online player or just trying to get into arguments. Also, I like 3rd Strike better than 4 so does that make me a fanboy just for favoring it?
@#2 Mrdrofficer
I know you posed this question before days ago in another 3s related topic. Im assuming you missed my reply then, i broke down how the 4 main charge characters in 3s are capable of getting punishments off a parry just like anyone else. And also name dropped like 1-2 players names of that for each respected charge characters if you wished to look up names on youtube.
Oro's main charge moves are his fireballs and uppercut which neither one is used as a raw parry punish really, seeing how good his stand MP is for starting combos and give you great positioning for a successful combo.
Also another point 3s did have a range game albeit not as proficient as sf4 series. There are good remys and oros players out there able to to play a good mid to long range game, Q and chun getting away with their mid range turtle like gameplay, necros keeping people out until he gains the positioning he wants, Uriens playing at all ranges, Ken playing a sf4 ryu type footsie game. Its not like everyone is always in each other faces just because people are able to OS parry.
Also look up information about charge partitioning if you dont know about it. Charge characters are capable of holding their charges even after a few forwards and backward dashes, down or back charges doesnt matter.
I've been playing 3rd Strike casually over the years, but I never understood the difference between a parry, and a red parry. I've probably done it what, 3 times in my life?
I'd hypothesized to differences.
1) a red parry is a perfectly timed parry, that just gives you more points.
2) There is a slight advantage in a red parry, as it recovers faster than a normal parry.
Can we just enjoy the damn video?
This is really silly, both games are good respectively. Just stop bashing the other game already, we are under the same series why don't guys guys attack something worth bashing like blazblue or arcana heart, or something?
@Powdered
Ugh. Sorry! I missed the post. I'm glad to finally get this bit out of the way. Your information is great too, and catered to my character.
(IF you remember where you posted the first message, I'll gladly go back.)
I liked 3rd strike for many reasons and I also have my sheer issues with the game. However, the main core mechanic that kills SFIV series for me is the easy input system...I don't think it is needed and it is counter productive as far as "proper" execution goes. Thankfully, however, not all Capcom games copy this system - MVC 3 doesn't have easy inputs - but it is the main issue with tons of players.
Street Fighter III, is a great game, a fantastic game with a lot of depth and I can't wait to see how online version is implemented.
@#31
If you are still around my previous post http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2011/ma...
yea oro players ive seen was dirty music and thanatos tearing it up when i used to watch 3s videos years ago.
Also OS parry/throw isnt always applicable as people can and will eventually space out their pokes to be outta throw range, use a super cancel for invurnability frames to blow up the throw after the parry. Which is when you see people just opt for parry then block after cause the simple OS parry/throw is well known and would usually only work a few times.
And about your opinion about the system not lending itself to all characters is debatable. As for a good while Hugo was regarded as being low tier and over the years found to be a pretty solid character due to the system in place and moved up.
IIRC ex moves started with the darkstalkers series so it wasnt something new the sfIII brought to the table really. And saying focus attacks and parry being similar, i cant personally see the resemblance outside of some way of attack avoidance.
I find sf4 backdashing more in line with 3s parrying being more reactionary while focusing can be more of a preemptive thing giving the large window it allows and of course the inclusion of focus breaking attacks which can outright deny the use, where as backdashing(like parrying) at higher levels of play have folks trying to bait them out because of there abusable nature and only needing directional inputs.
As people will say all you have to do is hit forwards at the right time so easy! And the other side would be all you have to do is mash backdash so easy! Where there is no mashing of focus attacks to get outta things directly and requiring additional inputs to cancel the focus. Thats my viewpoint on that comparison which i honestly think people overlooked too much when mentioning of the sf4 and 3s system.
#28
A red parry is also called a guard parry, meaning it is a parry done immediately after blocking something else; note that both attacks/hits must be tightly followed, such as the two hits of an EX hadouken for example. You can red parry the second hit by blocking the first one.
It otherwise has exactly the same properties as a regular parry (score, meter, etc).
@27 - I'm sorry but there was no REAL range game in 3s.most turtling chun (or any char really) does is for building meter,she's still primarily short/mid range just like every1 else.even her sa2 is only just outside of sweep range.Urien's fireball is complete ass for range fighting and no1s gonna use a tackle from deep like the cpu unless they're a scrub.then there's necro who even tho he can stretch is still most effective at close/mid range.no1 will (or can realistically) stay back and play a dhalsim-esque style long range game with necro.closest thing to a long range capable char is remy but because of parry it makes his ranged game (and every1 elses) all but pointless.even in ur descriptions all chars gameplan eventually lead back to close/mid range. parry destroys anything that even resembles long range play.
@powdered
Awesome! Thanks for taking the time. Dirty Music was the guy who made me keep playing 3S. I thought all my Oro training was for nothing, so I started learning Elena and felt the same "odds against me" feeling when playing most of the cast (this was 2007 mind you). Dirty made me realize I should switch ultras. I knew it was more effective but I DM made me switch.
Gotta practice command grab though. Ironically, I play Oro because Honda's been my main for years and I don't use his command grab very well either. I mean, I'm good, but not GDLK.
@#36
as i said about the range game, cant compare it to sf4 styled range game. Whether by your definition of it being real or not, people get ranged out alot during matches. Just because you can parry doesnt mean you are gonna get in as you would like and brawl it out in short range all day. There is alot of mid range footsies going on during a match along with the meter building.
And about urien it is more or less than just about range fighting its more about controlling space to create a better offense when close or force the opponent to close in. 3s isnt sf4 where you can be content trying to wither down someone from long range all match and label that as the REAL range game.
And i compare necro more in the lines of sf2 dhalsim styled play not what everyone is used to seeing in sf4 sim with trying to pure zone all day. Sim had a crazy short/mid game in sf2 with his drills/slide/throw nonsense which was powerful and also had access to his slow long range game, but he was pretty damn effective once he got his upclose game going as would necro in 3s.
There are still remy players out there capable of playing and good mid/long range game at high levels, but when the opportunity to get in good damage upclose...why not take advantage of it? Everyone cannot parry everything all the times, so saying just because of parry everyone range options are useless isnt valid.
And yeah most people it boils down to short/mid range it is a more offensive oriented game but doesnt invalidate all the zoning that comes beforehand, ive seen alot of the same happening in sf2 days with sagat usually primarily staying mid/long range whenever possible. Seen sims brawling in close, Guiles locking down people upclose with booms and backfists, shotos with C. mk fireball pressure. People find it more effective that way in both 3s and sf2 series.
Might as well say ssf4AE range game is invalid too because of all the anti fireball option people have now like how parry negates 3s ranged game. Its still there just isnt the dominate playstyle anymore.
@#38
Anytime, but be mindful oro command throw is blockable so you wouldnt be able to utilize it fully as you would with honda. Although it isnt parryable from what ive seen, so might be able to abuse the OS parry/throw folks with a meaty command throw? i dont play oro but that may be an idea. And another trick with oro that if you hold his taunt it quickly drains out his stun meter if you never knew and meaty C. mk XX command throw on someone wake up seem to work pretty well every once in a while.
Why am I first, or (second) XD