What do you think of Ono's ideas on the future of Street Fighter? Leave a comment below with your thoughts.
Someone is inevitably going to jump to the "cash grab" conclusion with Ono talking about two separate Street Fighter games. I think this is a good idea, though. Really, MVC3 and SFxT are heading this direction. They both have easy combos that anyone can do and still be effective, but the good players are going to use good tagging, inventive combos, etc to win instead of just A, B, C, launch.
The English dubover almost threw me for a loop, I pressed play and minimized, waiting for Japanese voice.....suddenly English.
I say they round out this generation of games with Street Fighter Alpha 4. Just throw every Street Fighter character ever made into the game and keep doing balance updated. By the time SF x Tekken is over, most of the character models will be done anyway. Just add the last few and make an awesome game.
If you want to Cater to casuals, how about making actual TUTORIAL modes and stuff to teach people the game? instead of just Challenge mode combos... no one wants to sit there failing at doing the same combo over and over again...
A handicap? Oh thats really fair. I go play online and join someone with lower BP than me, so they do more damage or have more health? lol. as if ultra combos and xfactor isnt already bad enough. Instead of ruining the games with this crap, just make good tutorial modes so that new players can learn.
Splitting up the franchise is a huge mistake....Who wants to play with noobs ALL THE TIME when you know the real competition is on the other version. I suggest simply bring back Championship mode that is sorted by region. I hardly heard any complaints about it.
They should break down into leagues like championship mode but using only PP. Championship points were meaningless as you can't even lose them.
0-500 PP league E
0-1000 PP league D and so forth.
You lose you get demoted, you win you are promoted
You can also play the freeforall league with your own PP to risk your butt getting owned or win big.
I like what number 6 is saying. I remember back in the PS2 days, I thought very highly of Virtua Fighter IV's training mode. I actually felt my skills improving after each grind. I really don't see why the SFIV series didn't have more offline modes in general. A survivor mode in super would of been addicting.
in this interview also has some nice things in it as well, Ono also might have slipped in said Jin is in the game at around the 1:30 mark
http://screwattack.com/videos/EVO-201...
Split up the franchise? Get ready for even more hate in this community.
Card-based Street Fighter game again? I could see people just kind of picking that up while leaving the established game alone.
And +1 for a tutorial system.
@6
100% agree on the tuturial idea. I mean seriously now, would it be to hard to get some of the top players to do some clips and put those in the game? Talking about spacing,etc?
And that casual/hardcore split sounds like a bad idea. Sf4 is already casual ENOUGH. ANd that whole handicap idea is trash. Just do a better job with matching making. Again it goes back to having a better training mode. TEACH people how to play. It easier to take a lose when u know WHY u lost then it is to just get smoked and have no idea what happened.
No splitting up! No Handicap! Bad ideas from a guy usually full of good ideas!
Hopefully he's just brainstorming out loud.
Ono... SF Recipe for succes.
1) Make SFxT awesome.
2) Add more stuff to SF4... Costumes/Characters/Stages.. Charge us, we'll pay.
3) Make SF5, release about two years from now. This will give us a full year and a half with SFxT and not overflow the market.
Follow these three easy steps to remain GDLK. Thanks again for the Rebirth of SF... We owe you.
@20
sf5 should wait. New consoles are right around the corner and im sure they will have better netplay and alot more processing power. They should just continue to support sf4/mvc3 aswell as dlc classics(ie alpha,sf3,etc) and push back tekken maybe 6 months(they can use that time to make sure all the favorites are in). End the ps3/xbox360 generation with sfxtekken and then work a all new graphics engine for sf5.
Handicap is a bad idea. All they really need to do is make the match making system using BP more strict. People within certain BP ranges should only be allowed to play with other people in that range. No more skilled option. Also, the problem with tutorials and training mode combos is that when a game is first released it is VERY hard to know what a characters BnB's are. It would help with things that are important like meatying, plinking, or option selects or something like that, but otherwise it's not easy.
Yeah handicap system feels like its penalising good players rather than praising them. Plus splitting it into two types would be bad, as someone stated, why play against noobs and scrubs when you can be challenged by better players.
The tutorial, information of how games functions etc ideas are much better. Plus i think there should be a boot camp/unranked online matches. This way people could practice without needing to lose points over it
@6: Agreed.
But let's take it a step further. Tutorials should be taught by professional players. With step by step walkthroughs and tips/tricks from the players. Voice overs coupled with video interviews that discuss strategies when you move from beginner all the way up to advanced.
Sure, the game will evolve over time but at least brand new players will build a solid foundation granting them the ability to evolve in the first place.
A brief rundown of how to play each character would be a nice addition to the tutorial series as well.
Theres should be like a Black Ops Elite version'esque type site for Fighting Games
I feel the same, for SSF4AE: Costumes, Characters, Balance/Glitch/Bug fixes, New stages, and FFS they could've added new trials :|
@28
Are games that complicated that we need a professional tutor to play them?
You must be effin joking right?
Some things have got to get back to the Old Ways. No splitting Good players from Bad, no one holding your hand so you can play.
If "Bad Players" are segregated how the Fu<k will they ever become "Good Players"?!
This is all Bull $hit.
The thing is we live in the age of the interwebz. Tutorials, tutorials everywhere. Look at VesperArcade. He made like 11 video chapters for people breaking the game down.
I would like more characters, and more new stages to be in the update of Super Street Fighter IV Arcade Edition Version 2012. I also would like Street Fighter Alpha 4 to be released on PS3, Street Fighter 5, 6, etc to be released on PS3 and next generation consoles.
"Yoshinori talked about splitting up the franchise, with one series more dedicated to the hardcore players and another that would cater more to the casual crowd."
Don't we already have Versus titles for the casuals? Please don't infest the main series with that mentality (yeah, too late).
you guys dont seem to understand what casual means. i dont want them to split the fanbase, but a casual player is not going to have time or the dedication to sit through SF tutorials and teach himself the game. that is what a dedicated player would do newbie or not, hence the word "casual". a casual player is not the same thing as a beginner
Handicap idea is not the right way to go. Just because someone's doing well doesn't mean they should intentionally limit themselves. No handicap, please. I already have to pretend to lose against my friends. I don't want to have to do it online, too.
The tutorial idea is a sound one. Trial mode is a decent way of going about it, but it doesn't really teach you the fundamentals, it just throws you in the deep end and expects you to sink or swim.
I really think they should just take a page out of BlazBlue's book and have a complete walkthrough of game features. Hell, they even have input displays for trials and a video example of what it's supposed to look like. I don't understand why they haven't adopted those ideas.
Now don't take my post as me trying to start a flame war, because I love SF and MvC over anything else, but I would really love to see the games I love flourish with better ideas.
@36 SF is a competitive game by nature. It can't be just casual like Super Mario or something. Sooner or later the will want to win and therefore need to put in the time to learn. Either that or they will give up.
If a casual player had one consolidated source (ie, my tutorial suggestion) of information he/she at least has the option to take the game to the next level.
Scouring the interwebs for information (some of it is just bad too) is a horrible suggestion for teaching someone how to play. Sure there are good tutorials out there and that's why I said to integrate them right into the games platform.
(I haven't watched the video yet, BUTTTT I'm going to comment anyway*Puts up flame shield*.
The "two series" thing could work - look at 3DS' SSFIV and Iphone's SFIV Volt vs SSFIV(Console) and MVC3.
The former is very casual accessible and has plenty of shortcuts(one to the point that Charge characters are overpowered!). The latter is Still casual accessible, but they're going to have to put in time.
Again, the "two series" thing can work - put "casual" versions on Iphone, Ipad, etc. and put the "normal" version on the consoles(PS3, PSVita, except not Xbox - they don't have exclusive characters :P))
@31
Is Basketball that complicated that we need player camps taught by professionals just to play the sport?
Tutorials/Training is there for people who want to step their game up to the next level. Use your head before you post, thanks.
@ ElectricBlanka
you said "Either that or they will give up."
thats just my point. ono states clearly, he doesnt want anyone giving up, he wants all those players. yes some casual players will take the plunge to become dedicated players but a lot will remain casual simply because real life commitments cant allow them to allocate all that time into learning SF. some gamers have jobs, families etc.. competitive or not, this is still a video game, some people do not want to spend hours on tutorials, they just want to play the game and thats it. there will always be these type of casual gamers, who play all genres of games (not just fighters) for fun, and this is who ono is refering too, not the casuals that want to become competitive. im all for the idea, its a great one, but it doesnt solve or answer ono's concept as you will still have those casual players feeling dejected after losing constantly
I like the idea of 2 different SF games.
Hardcore would get a SF3 3RD Strike type game without ultras or other comeback crap & the return of parrying & other new systems.
Casuals would get a SF4 type game have ultras, mega's, superde-dopers, mega fantastical's, ultra mega super awesome push a button & win plus shortcuts out the wahzoo.
@42
Read the instruction manual provided with the game dude. Then go on YouTube and watch all of the combo vids and tutorial videos you want.
Better yet, PLAY THE GAME YOURSELF! PLAY WITH FRIENDS! PLAY ONLINE! these are your BEST resources to get better. It's called PRACTICE son. It's the only thing that's going to make you better. And that my friend is the Most Truthful statement you will EVER read on this site!
You see, I am "Thinking"! If 20% of the games resources are spent on teaching you how to play we all LOSE! these games have a little thing called a BUDGET! and another thing called DEVELOPMENT TIME!
Personally I'd rather let them work on Characters/BG/Music/Balance rather than have a Professional Tutor tell me how to play!
SSF4 has OVER 800 combo trials! I've completed 100% of them 3X now! Once in Vanilla, once in Super, and in AE because my PS broke and I lost everything except the trophy:(
Try using the resources that have been provided already before begging for more. Maybe you've already completed the Trials? Idk.
But clearly, I am thinking.
@47
You clearly missed the point of how beneficial tutorials/training for new players can be -- especially taught by professionals.
Who wouldn't want Basketball lessons from Kobe Bryant as a kid?
Please just shut up while you're ahead. Thanks.
@44 Dude130
I never understood the Ultra = noob game argument
I admit it detracts from the meter managment aspect of the game but at the end of the day in 3s you can build meter (by whifing normals ffs)for 2 geni jins (or whateva) in a single round. How is this any better or worse than having Ultras?!?
@47 part 2:
I'm done arguing with an idiot who can't see the benefit of sitting down with someone like Justin Wong or [insert any top player name here] to learn something versus reading the game manual.
No wonder why this community is so half-baked. Jesus...
Handicap is horrible. My seth / Akuma already have low HP thank you.
But damn this sounds very interesting. Hm a split up, i'd prefer it if they just make it into one thats a great mix. SSF4 was a pretty good mix of beginner friendly bs/mashing/shoryukens but also skill/footsies coming to play.
And nah, they ARE cash cop still to me,. Forever will be. Getting money.
@49
I'm always ahead buddy. And somehow... Some way... I got good at SF and Daigo didn't come to my house and teach me anything.
I'm pretty sure people get good at BasketBall without Kobe as well.
Sadly, you are what's wrong with this generation of gamer. No Mind... No Creativity... That's what makes these Pros the best.
In a single post I have given you the tools to up your game by a solid 25%. That's Fact. Then you tell me to "Shut up?", wtf is wrong with you?
You have a thick skull. That's why you are a Total Fail.
Handicap for Super Slow Fighter Iv:AE?? No need.
Crapcom make a good game, no bullxhits like SFIV or SF3 (the bosta game ever).
Make a new real SF game (the last SF game is ST).
Ono´s mind: "SF 5 with 4 buttons...Yeah real imbecile SF game for fans...
I don't say this allot, but I agree with Aluppoj.
Only practice will make you better. You have to put in the time and the work. A casual player who doesn't want to spend much time to learn the game won't become a great player if Justin Wong or anyone else makes tutorials.
You know what you need Capcom so you dont have to make two seperate games for each audiance ?..A tutorial mode. Yes, again like Blazblue does perfectly.
How are beginners suppose to learn about Frametraps, FADCing, safe, unsafe moves, combos, true blockstrings, frame data in general, etc?? Nothing is explained and the learning curve can be quite slow at the beginning (Ive obviously gone though this I have no problem now, but for beginners)
Learn something that other fighters do right. @BB Has a perfect explanation of everything, its not hard.
But srsly they need a better training mode. Most of these scrubs, myself included for the longest time, don't know how to THINK in the right direction and even worse don't know they're thinking in the wrong direction. That's where a training mode can guide them so they won't be lost.
Personally, I'm not a fan of the split direction. The reason the game is so great and popular now is bc of how its able to cater to both with the motto being-easy to learn, difficult to master.
Anyone else agree that total matches played is the biggest indicator of player skill??
Obviously you can't use a number to determin skill&people have alt accounts/etc; but imo if you're gunna use numbers it goes:
Total games played > PP > BP
Does Capcom even use total games played in matchmaking??
Am I alone in thinking that SF4 was the perfect balance of "Casual meets Hardcore". The game is beginner/casual friendly, but also has amazing depth for hardcore players.
Why the need for a "split" all of a sudden.
And why do we need every player to be so Great at the game? I love getting a few easy ones between fighting Semi Pro online players!
The Skill gap is created by how much ppl play and practice. I think Casual players have other options already. If Capcom wants to make a low level fighting game for new players that's fine... Just don't name it Street Fighter!!!!
@48 Last time I checked,SF X Tekken will be more "Hardcore oriented" rather than "Casual oriented".
Handicaps and splitting the series is pretty lame. Instead
1) Tutorial mode would be great.
2) GGPO online as the standard
3) Things like easy mode in MVC3 is a good idea if you want to cater to casual players
4) Let the game balance itself out. Tech and balancing comes from time with the game (Ex: MVC2)
question from a noob: are ultras considered a handicap? i mean, if you're playing someone at a lower skill level, it shouldn't matter if they have a move that does 500 damage, you should know how to avoid it if you know what you're doing, really..
if i get hit by an ultra, i blame myself for letting myself get set up like that. plus they look awesome, so there's that.
BlazBlue is the ultimate blend of casual meets hardcore. SF4 has too many frustrating systems that encourage bad play from new players and are very abusable by skilled players.
@62, agreed
when i first played (new to fg's), for 3-4 months i was in training mode practicing things that really were not going to help me be a better player
after realizing what i was doing wrong i started to learn what to train and i got better from there
tutorials to point people in the right direction can save A LOT of headache
@69
YES
2 player training mode would be great. I have a friend that is just starting to learn the game and its a pain in the ass to try to show him something and kill him in the process.
2 player training mode/well done tutorials=casuals can make an easier transition into solid player.
SF4 already has 2 player training mode. You need to read that manual. Ultras are not a handicap, but comeback mechanics in general are really stupid to me. They punish the aggressor for playing well by giving the losing player a way to get back in the game for playing poorly. I make 3 right guesses/combos to give you full ultra meter and then I have to make sure I don't make a single mistake to give up the lead I worked hard to make. That doesn't make any sense to me. Comebacks should be hard. You were losing by playing badly, so it shouldn't be easy to get back in a game.
I think that Capcom should invest in a VF like tutorial as well. I can only imagine how difficult SF can appear to someone who has never played a fighting game in their life. By giving a detailed tutorial mode, they can really open up the game for a lot of people.
I think if you want a more casual game, mobile is the way to go now-a-days. I haven't played the SFIV mobile offerings (because they aren't available on android >_<), but that's where the casual audience is now if you want to tap into them.
Hmmmm, maybe a cross between Uno Rush and Yomi which is graphically played out on screen could be cool and casual friendly... Capcom, you listening?
So there is one thing I found to be somewhat interesting. I am with the majority of you, where I do not feel there should be separate games for casual players and hardcore players. Then again, if you are someone who posts on Eventhubs, chances are you are not a casual SF player. Simply by being people who come to this site and looking for DAILY content on the community, we are all likely much more aligned as hardcore players. We know the combos, we know the matchups, we know who the pros are, etc. The casuals by large probably do not know these.
That said, I go to Screwattack every now and then for some of my broader video game news, and I happened to check out the thread for this very video on their site. It was quite the opposite reaction - the idea of a casual SF game seemed to really appeal to a lot of people. There were a lot of posts from people saying things along the lines of "I love SF, but I go online and might land a punch, but I'm horrible at landing combos. I go for a combo, screw it up, then eat a 10-hit combo and an ultra. I would love to feel like I have a chance."
So I guess I can see where Ono is coming from with this idea and I can see where the casuals would want something like this. I have been playing SF since World Warrior and would say I have a pretty high IQ on these games (I won't say I'm someone who can do 1-frame links with regularity or anything...). The game comes naturally to me. And it shocked me when I tried teaching a few friends how to play SFIV. Landing some of the basic combos in Challenge Mode was a big deal to them. Even performing a fireball sometime took a few tries for them, and doing an Ultra was tough. And true, they could get better with hours of training in Training Mode, but that is a pretty boring way to get acquainted with a game.
Is a casual mode game the way to go? Who knows. But I understand the rational. I think Championship Mode did a decent job of allowing the better players to quickly move up the ranks while the less experienced players would stay back in the lower ranks and get to play people more on their level. Perhaps instead of mostly taking in suggestions for rebalancing the game from players, Ono could ask for creative suggestions on how to more appropriately separate the extreme beginners from everyone else and give them a chance to learn the game amongst themselves online.
And yes to #6, a Tutorial would be a great start at the very least. (And my apologies for the wall of text - didn't mean for it to go quite that long!)
the handicap sounds like x-factor? or something of this nature
I think a better tutorial mode would be a good add. A thing to do would be to add more practical things to use in a real match, and also the demo system from BlazBlue where it would show you what the combo would look like if done correctly.
One more thing to help beginning players I feel, would be to include things like the David Sirlin tutorial videos for SSF2T they included in Capcom Classics Collection Vol.2.
(Just for reference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0cFs5... ) I felt this was a really good way of teaching basic strategies to new players.
While I do see that splitting up the series between casual and competitive players would be a pretty good way of making money, IMHO it would just encourage casuals to keep playing casuals. So from a business stand-point; Sounds good. I just feel that making a "Casual" series would be bad for the community.
Here Ono is talking about keeping street fighter alive and relevant for as many people as possible and all you children can do is cry. Pathetic. Its called options people this is a good thing. Give me as many different fighting games as possible these few years are the best the genre has ever seen never forget that.
More tutorials, no handicaps. Like ghettoperu says in his comments above his balrog avatar. Quote this! "PlaytowinLosetoLearn". If you cant understand this then you shouldn't even be playing fighting games. Fine, people play to have fun, but for f#(k$ sake you cant forget about the people who take there time learning the game and trying to perfect there skills. Now we gotta worry about shortcuts and easy mode. I remember it took me six months to learn blankas hop step ultra and his ex rainbow ball aswell as fuertes RSF and sakuras advance combos and balrogs ultra and trying to keep my opponent juggled. Man was that satisfying and CHALLENGING (capcom) aswell. And i have a job and a girl. Whatever happened to taking your time learning a game, and being stoked because you knew a certain trick or advance move that nobody knew about yet????? Capcom be reasonable. You cant give noobs and scrubs that much praise. I am a scrub, but scrub that cant be taken to likely.
mrsbonbon, u look and sound like an a$$. sf and fighting games will be fun and complex forever. Just play the game and learn the f#(K!NG mechanics..... $H!+......
@6
it's a tricky subject. when there's to much information in a game it scares a lot of people. overload people w/ information and they'll get scared or don't want to play. most people don't want to learn how to play the game, they just want to get on, do a few moves and fight people. if a person really want to improve they'll look for things online. it's not that hard.
I wanna see some old school street fighter characters, maybe some from street fighter 1! Maybe after we see street fighter cross over to a 3d engine in tekken x street fighter we will see a new street fighter ex! Personally I think many of the characters in ex were pretty awesome creative, nd I wud love to see some of these characters put into the traditional 2d fighting style. Man I can't wait to see! Hope its soon!
P.s. my favorite characters from ex were allen, garada, skellomania, doctrine dark, blair, hokuto, kairi and cracker jack. I just wrote this incase capcom sees =)
Handicap idea is stupid. If you want to be decent or good for that matter, PRACTICE just like any other sport or game out there. Don't give those crybaby scurbs a tool to use when they refuse to practice or play the game.
I'd have to agree with 37, BlazBlue, which is a pretty complicated game, does have a VERY GOOD tutorial mode. Someone like me who is pretty proficient in fighting games but wanted to learn to play BlazBlue felt the tutorial helped me out a lot. But the BlazBlue series of games have always had a lot of content, and they keep adding more and more stuff to their games. It would appear this time around for SF4 and MVC3 Capcom was hell bent on online content. Can't really be mad at them for that cause nowadays those features move units and keeps people interested in the game (poor SSBB hardly anyone plays that game online anymore ;_;)
Aluppoj,
Looks like more people agree with my tutorial suggestions, kiddy. Stop living in a vacuum thinking that only by practicing and discovering things on your own will make you magically better.
You're what's wrong with this community period. I grew up during the heyday of arcades and have been playing Street Fighter since 1991. Even I see the benefit of insider information delivered to me by professionals that can get me up to speed and practicing RIGHT instead of WRONG. It's no different than someone like Valle or Watson sharing tips with me back in the day while at the local arcade. Dumbass. Use your head.
Another EventScrub bites the dust. NEXT!
Any addition of a tutorial mode seems completely pointless to me. Why would you want to spend hours in tutorial mode, where is the enjoyment in that. Since I stuck my first 20p in an arcade fighting game I've always learnt through trial and error.
If you want to get better at fighting games; particularly in the internet age with it's dominant standardised character combo templates. Something that a tutorial mode/hold your hand while I teach you combos, mode can only reinforce.
The best way to learn and get better is just to jump in and get involved. Play online, play VS mode even Arcade mode; but just play it is a game after all.
"Update current games"? Does that mean we're getting SSFIV AE updates 2013 and 2014?
Unless SF5 comes out before the World Cup, which I honestly doubt.
@36
I agree completely. People don't understand what "casual" means and think it is synonymous with "beginner."
I am one of those people who are all grown up, have a family, and tons of other things in my life, that prevent me from spending 3 hours a day practicing or playing the game. I love Street Fighter, and have since playing SF1 in the arcade in the 80's, but there is no way I can compete against kids who have too much time on their hands. I would welcome a more "pick-up-and-play" alternative that I can play and be competitive in and have fun with, without the time commitment.
That all said, however, nothing will ever replace the feel of playing traditional Street Fighter.
Lighten up everybody! All his comments mean is either NintendoVs.Capcom or Cap's making their own Smash-style S.F.
The series is in good hands with Mr.Ono whose given us the best fighter of the last decade (SFIV) and SFxT looks to be the best fighter of all time.
Handicap idea is very interesting.