Ready-Up.net has an interview with Capcom Europe's PR guy, Leo Tan. This is a mostly tongue-in-cheek article, although there's a few interesting bits discussed. Here's a clip.
With all the existing fighters getting a new Ultra do you think anyone of them now has a surprisingly different game they can play?
Some of the charge characters have a non-charge Ultra now, which has quite a significant impact on how they play. Some of them are just plain cooler (like Ryu’s), and some are more for fun than tournament play. Usually, though, the new Ultra makes up for something in a poor match up.
Thanks to Dan for the news tip.
Posted by Nyoronoru on March 12, 2010 at 7:48 a.m. #1
"More for fun than tournament play"
If you want people to use your character to their best limits, don't bother making moves that can never be landed... is what I'd like to say.
Posted by duckmouth on March 12, 2010 at 7:49 a.m. #2
"Usually, though, the new Ultra makes up for something in a poor match up".
If the above quote is correct then EventHubs might have misinterpreted it. I think it means that some of the new Ultras give the weaker opponent in a bad match up a fighting chance (at least that's how I understand it).
Posted by Catalyst on March 12, 2010 at 7:52 a.m. #3
@Duckmouth
That's what the article/headline says.
Posted by Psycho on March 12, 2010 at 7:54 a.m. #4
@ 2 yep, that's how I see it
Posted by CharlieNash on March 12, 2010 at 7:54 a.m. #5
I hope to god that Guile's sonic hurricane is QCF 2 times, you a guile can juggle after his guile kick, atleast that gives him a chance to juggle his ultra
Posted by duckmouth on March 12, 2010 at 7:54 a.m. #6
I might have misread the title actually (or it was changed); I initially read it as "Capcom Europe: New Ultras make for bad match ups". My mistake. Apologies EH, you can do no wrong!
Posted by SomeDude on March 12, 2010 at 7:54 a.m. #7
Capcom Europe..does such thing exist?!
I think this is the first time that we've heard anything from Capcom Europe regarding SSF4?
But fun read nonetheless.
Posted by Sakura on March 12, 2010 at 7:56 a.m. #8
I smell BS...
Posted by Psycho on March 12, 2010 at 7:58 a.m. #9
meh it was obvious that it would be like 3s super arts where some supers were just useless, because of existing bad ultras already (Guile, Vega), and new ultras that don't look very useful (Ryu, Rufus).
Posted by juxtapose on March 12, 2010 at 8:07 a.m. #10
I still can't see a whole lot of situations where both ultras will be equally viable but useful for different strategies. It's going to be just like 3S where one ultra is simply better than the other because the risk vs reward is too great.
I think it's completely ironic that Chun's SA2 put her on the top of the tier list in SF3 and her Kikisho wasn't even close to being as useful, and the exact opposite will be true in SSF4. Why can't we find a balance here?
Posted by Zegram on March 12, 2010 at 8:07 a.m. #11
Thanks to Dan
Posted by Kash on March 12, 2010 at 8:08 a.m. #12
Here is hoping the ultra spark for Fuerte will help him in his harder matchups, looks useful from what I have seen but only time will tell.
Posted by Kaiser on March 12, 2010 at 8:09 a.m. #13
Dan the Man!!
Posted by daltronica on March 12, 2010 at 8:09 a.m. #14
@ Charlie Nash
According to SRKs Wakeup podcast,where they played the final build of super at the GDC, Guile's 2nd ultra is a charger.And vega's ultra is also a charger, not QCFx2+KKK. This is disappointing right? Vega could have been a bit more fun. Remy had QCF supers and it worked then?
Posted by Truest_Strike on March 12, 2010 at 8:22 a.m. #15
Makoto love.
Posted by irrenmann on March 12, 2010 at 8:58 a.m. #16
Nice to see him admit Ryu can win without paying attention. Sure, it's partly tongue in cheek. Partly.
Posted by Tango_Sucka on March 12, 2010 at 9:03 a.m. #17
my main cammy has had her DP nerfed and apparently her counter ultra is wank as well. Easy stopped and interrupted by armour breaking moves. Still gonna smash balrogs, hondas and giefs face in with her though
Posted by machineking1313 on March 12, 2010 at 9:10 a.m. #18
I would like to thank Dan, the Saikyo legend for the news tip for this morning.
Posted by Chunstoppable on March 12, 2010 at 9:26 a.m. #19
Hmm, I cant use the second ultra to go through fireballs anymore..but who throws fireballs at me when I have ultra anyways..lets see how kikousho works. So far it sounds pretty darn skippy! Gomen ne!
Posted by L on March 12, 2010 at 9:29 a.m. #20
When does Ultra selection occur? Do you select it when you pick your char (like colors/costumes/taunts)? Or do you pick the ultra after each player has chosen characters? Seems like it might be further fodder for counter picking if it's not the latter.
Posted by n00b_saib0t on March 12, 2010 at 9:44 a.m. #21
I'm not at home so I can't check, can guile FADC a flash kick? If so, dash to charge ultra is beyond easy, so all you dip s--t scrubs need to quit complaining because flash kick FADC sonic hurricane will work. We already know from balrog's shenanigans that using a down charge doesn't disipate a back charge, so charge down/back, up/back+kick, mp+mk, f f b f+ppp will work since we already have rumors saying ultra 2 juggles after super.
And since ultra 1 can juggle after an anti-air flash kick (guile mainers like to ignore this while complaining about ryu doing it) it will work with sonic hurricane too.
Again, that all depends on flash kick FADC working. Congrats guile players, you might just have reliable combos to ultra now.
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 9:47 a.m. #22
"And Guile can put his shades on in the middle of a fight now. That’s probably the biggest change actually. Putting on shades in the middle of a fight adds a whole new dimension to the game. You could almost say that for Guile players, Super Street Fighter IV is actually in 4D and not 3D."
Thats like a kick in the balls to Guile mainers. I dont main him but hes fun to use aggressivly.
To #22, I was hoping this but they said in the recent Podcast that it only hits a few times and doesnt do much dmg at all. Maybe they didnt do it correctly but I dunno.
Posted by jaysenedwinward on March 12, 2010 at 9:53 a.m. #23
Sorry 22 but you are wrong. They said specifically in the Podcast it may as well whiff since it hit so few times. In fact, it doesn't stay out long enough they said. Very possible that doing it on time makes them land in it as it is ending and doing it a tad delayed makes them no longer juggle-able.
If you don't get what I mean, try to FADC cammy's cannon spike, dash forward and do another cannon spike right away. You do it too soon, she goes right though them. You wait .5 seconds and they are now juggable-able.
Posted by Pusha_T on March 12, 2010 at 9:54 a.m. #24
I hope ryu's metsu srk isnt overpowered
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJC0CG...
Towards the end of the video check out how much damage the first hit of ryu's metsu srk does......Murderous.
Posted by PhinnyCupcakes on March 12, 2010 at 9:56 a.m. #25
WELLLLLlll... SHOULD we take europe's word for it?
Posted by Stingah on March 12, 2010 at 9:59 a.m. #26
I am most interested to see Gief and Power Ranger Bison's U2s. If Gief's U2 has some priority over say uppercuts and Bison's U2 has range on that aborption throw... thinks could get sick nasty!
Posted by THawk on March 12, 2010 at 10 a.m. #27
"When I win with her (Makoto) (which is not very often) I really win. When I win with Ryu, sometimes I’m not even paying attention." -Capcom PR
Posted by n00b_saib0t on March 12, 2010 at 10:09 a.m. #28
@ #23 and #24 - I must have missed the podcast, I just saw the ssf4 changes post that said sonic hurricane juggles after his super. Its a shame it hits so few times, looks like guile really did get shafted. It should have juggled like ryu's ultra 1.
Posted by YoungCharly on March 12, 2010 at 10:22 a.m. #29
Which charge characters, beside Bison and Balrog, have an 'not-charge' 2nd Ultra anyways?
@#27 I'm looking forward to Bison's new ultra aswell >=D
Posted by z3poxx on March 12, 2010 at 10:24 a.m. #30
"Let’s not forget this is going to be cheaper than the original. I can remember paying £85 for Super Turbo when it came out on the SNES."
Impressive i would have paid more for Super Turbo on the snes since it would be quite rare.
ST never came out on SNES.
Posted by z3poxx on March 12, 2010 at 10:25 a.m. #31
@30
Chun's ultra 2 is a command.
Posted by Psycho on March 12, 2010 at 10:26 a.m. #32
@ 25 pfft overpowered? because of the damage? ha! metsu hadoken looks 10 times better than that Ultra.
Posted by Smorgasboard on March 12, 2010 at 10:31 a.m. #33
A flash kick -> FADC -> ultra combo won't be very useful even if it did full damage anyway. A flash kick is nowhere near as good as a dragon punch.
I heard focus attacks are faster now though. If they make Guile's focus attack better then you can ultra combo of that for maximum damage. That strategy is more suitable for Guile.
Also, I would have given Guile a charge sonic hurricane too. Sonic hurricane is basically a big sonic boom and Guile always had nothing but charge specials. It's the way he is meant to be played.
Posted by TheOneandOnlyone on March 12, 2010 at 10:44 a.m. #34
^^ agree with you man with focus sped up guile will land his ultra that way.
Posted by Lechooga on March 12, 2010 at 10:47 a.m. #35
@25
He has a full ultra with no damage scaling. Nearly every character would do that much in that situation.
Posted by Blanks on March 12, 2010 at 10:49 a.m. #36
"When I win with her (Makoto) (which is not very often) I really win. When I win with Ryu, sometimes I’m not even paying attention."
After reading interviews with Seth, Ono and now this PR guy,it seems like they not only admit designed inequalities of the characters but somehow think it makes for a better game. I think that total BS.
True, giving characters certain strengths, weaknesses and unique abilities is great for a fighting game, but just making certain characters (Guile,Gen Adon from what I've read, etc.) flat-out weaker is just bad and frustrating design.
Posted by Jaf on March 12, 2010 at 10:59 a.m. #37
Yeah I read that Guile's command to put on his sunglasses is down+HP+HK like Dudley's rose throw. Can they fall off like Vega's mask?
Posted by NA on March 12, 2010 at 11:07 a.m. #38
@25
Note that Ibuki almost certainly has lower health than most of the cast, as that was the case in 3S.
Posted by Someday on March 12, 2010 at 11:14 a.m. #39
Yeah, Fei and Cammy got "good" options indeed, while Sagat got new FADC-ultra.
Nice move.
Posted by Guile on March 12, 2010 at 11:22 a.m. #40
i know u guys say guile never had a non charge ultra (though mvc2 is an exception), but if there was a time for him to get one, its NOW
SH is not what people thought it was. It only gets 2 hits as an anti-air! Its probably not comboable from a flash kick (and really tough if possible) or anything. The only advantage over the flash explosion is its easier to do and probably easier to punish fireball spamming (although even in that its limited cuz of the startup)
if u make it non charge and let it get more than 2 hits in air, then it might actually help guile. Hes bottom tier for goodness sake, give this guy something. Have u seen how lopsided his matchups are? The only worse off character currently is Dan.
So far, guile appears to have gotten NERFED. Yes, NERFED. Standing fierce, one of his best moves, got nerfed. Good luck fellow Guile players
And stop that nonsense rhetoric like "we need imbalance for fun" or "switch to deejay" (who doesnt got nothing to do wiht guile except one move and being charge)
Looks like he'll be competing with Dan for the worst character and probably going to lose out.
Posted by Stingah on March 12, 2010 at 11:30 a.m. #41
@42
Yeah if Dan got improved from what little we have been hearing, Guile maybe the cheese that stands alone at the bottom.
Posted by SoundwaveButcher on March 12, 2010 at 11:38 a.m. #42
time will tell
ill just stick with U1,abel wont be nearly as good with u2,if U2 has better match-ups vs gief or can catch jump ins it be a different story,still gief will rape abel with any ultra,if gief U2 can catch wheel kicks abel is done
Posted by Psycho on March 12, 2010 at 11:41 a.m. #43
@ 42 they nerfed his standing fierce? in SSFIV? What the hell? OMG WTF is going on? have you seen Dee Jay's standing fierce? it knocks the enemy out.
Posted by SmoothJK on March 12, 2010 at 11:55 a.m. #44
Capcom pooped on Guile because to the random casual scrub, Guile's style is "boring." Capcom figures that if Guile was too strong, a lot of people would use him, leading to more "boring" matches. Way to cater to the casual fans while ignoring the pleas of the old school players.
(All this is assuming Guile did get relatively worse. If he turns out to be better, I will gladly eat my words with a big smile on my face.)
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 12:08 p.m. #45
I never heard about his standing fierce anywhere. Where u find that?
Posted by Paraside on March 12, 2010 at 12:18 p.m. #46
I don't know you guys, but I hate Gouki's new ultra, they could do something more serious or I don't know... AND I hate the fact that almost every new ultra must have SPINS... They don't have more creativity or WTF!
Posted by Guile on March 12, 2010 at 12:25 p.m. #47
ya we gotta keep in mind of course that these are the details so far. Something new can still come up, especially when serious Guile players get their hands on SSF4
Posted by Cammy on March 12, 2010 at 12:40 p.m. #48
Someone said that faster FA will give more chances to land ultas. I belive that will help Guile a bit.
And I also don't like to see one ultra simply better than the other. The most evident case is Chun-li. There's just no reason why you would chose Ultra 1. Kikousho combos in a lot of ways (some even waaay to simple), its a QCF comand, and even hits full damage if only the end touches. It's insanely better than Ultra 1!
That makes me said. I wish we had to think about what ultra to use, depending on our match, but with some, like Chun, is just a matter of: "okey, so is this guy bad enough so I can beat even with ultra 1, or do I need ultra 2?"
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 1:07 p.m. #49
yes some characters have a tough choice between ultras while some would have to be dumb to choose one ultra over the other like chun. Unless there just trying to handicap themselves.
Posted by SmoothJK on March 12, 2010 at 1:17 p.m. #50
Does anyone have confirmed info about standing fierce for Guile? If true, that is just depressing...that's one tool that actually makes him competitive.
Capcom: "Let's make Guile even MORE charge dependent and unable to move around!"
Oh man, I hope that's just a dumb rumor.
Posted by JerseyFame on March 12, 2010 at 1:25 p.m. #51
Lets talk about charge characters for a moment...
For guile to do a flash kick into sonic hurricane he has to
charge down + up k + (med k + med p) + dash forward + back (quickly, hold for 2 seconds) + fwd+back + fwd + 3ppp
how is that easy? how is that useful in the clutch...how is that scrub friendly like shortcut motions, auto block and double quartercircles?
u guys hate guile players because we owned you for a decade...
fine...i can still beat you scrubs.
Posted by HarkMammil on March 12, 2010 at 1:41 p.m. #52
Whew . . . there sure is a vocal Guile community. I feel you guys. I'll admit I don't miss Guile match ups though. A descent Guile player always scared/frustrated me a bit.
Any Rose people/groups/etc. out there?
Posted by irrenmann on March 12, 2010 at 1:42 p.m. #53
@21
L: "When does Ultra selection occur? Do you select it when you pick your char (like colors/costumes/taunts)? Or do you pick the ultra after each player has chosen characters? Seems like it might be further fodder for counter picking if it's not the latter."
Not to worry. It's set up so it doesn't allow for counterpicking that way.
Posted by MAXOUT12 on March 12, 2010 at 1:45 p.m. #54
god you guys seem to bitch about guile a s--t ton im not saying hes strong character but damn it seems like the two characters no one will play will be guile and akuma. One because all of you think he sucks wich confuses me since i have seen plenty of good player play as him and never bitch about you the wish he could do this or do that. and the other because his ultra was something different then what we expected. I don't get how akuma kick some one in the air spin up to the person kick them again in a way that the blood splatter makes his symbol in middle of the air is being less serious. i mean the spinning does bring me back to taz manian devil cartons but when the kick hits and he says the other realm awaits yea kind of painful. looking if you wanna complain about an ultra it should be the oil coaster. I've been telling myself its ok since he can control oil and he is a joke character but still that ultra is quite ridiculous
Posted by ricefarmer on March 12, 2010 at 1:59 p.m. #55
guile is the new dan
Posted by massi4h on March 12, 2010 at 2 p.m. #56
@53: you have your motions wrong. If you were to do flashkick FADC ultra, you'd do it like Balrog's headbutt to Ultra but do a dash ultra. So charge down-back, then up-back + k, focus (while still holding up-back), f, f, b, f+3p. It's not that hard especially if you can play balrog where headbutt to ultra and dash ultras are both very important to his game.
I kinda feel sorry for Guile players, I think Dan might be better than him now especially with Koryuken FADC Ultra. Just depends how easy he can hit confirm into his Koryuken.
Posted by Guile on March 12, 2010 at 2:10 p.m. #57
at 58 and 53
ur both wrong, but at least jerseyfame has the right idea
yes it is like balrog + dash cancel.
but its going to be hard
trust me, u'll see im right about this unless new details emerge.
going from up-back to cancel dash forward is not an easy motion in game
in the training move sure, but not IN GAME.
thats what jersey fame is trying to tell u. in theory it works, but just like the gilleycombos, people arent going to use this in game.
Kind of reminds me of ex-sonic boom dash cancel to ultra. I cant even recall ever seeing that used with guile in tournament play although in theory it shoulda been straightforward in the corner.
And another thing: why the hell would u want to combo into SH if it only adds 2 hits?
USELESS!
Posted by Orberen on March 12, 2010 at 2:15 p.m. #58
Unless ultra 2 for chun li can counter a fireball at almost full screen like ultra one can then there will still be uses for ultra one.
Posted by Bibuki on March 12, 2010 at 2:29 p.m. #59
I'm a Guile mainer, and what I don't understand is how people can complain about us complaining too much. We use Guile because of his style and the fact that he's not easy to win with. But all we want is his moves to work like they should. Why make him weaker on purpose? just give him his tools and we won't complain. fix FK, faster c.mk, a bit more range on some normals, that's about it. I don't care about more damage, and we can win w/o using ultras, and please don't touch s.fierce come on!
The guy interviewed if f@ckin' laughing at all Guile mainers, which is unacceptable. Can't believe this idiot works for Capcom.
And Guile indeed seems like the new Dan.
Posted by Tango_Sucka on March 12, 2010 at 3:06 p.m. #60
whats the sketch with guile? i think hes pretty hard to fight, but maybe thats because i'm a cammy man. but it seems whenever i fight guile he has sufficient tools to kick my ass. I dont get what things ppl want from him
Posted by MadnessFamilyguile on March 12, 2010 at 3:13 p.m. #61
Wow...i wonder if there are seriously that many Guile players on these boards or if it's just the same guy with multiple accounts...
Posted by MDLG on March 12, 2010 at 3:14 p.m. #62
@#50
i do agree with you that U2 is superior than U1, but only to a certain extent. the main thing about U2 is that it is easily combo'd into, while U1 is not. the thing about U1 is that it limits a lot of what people can do. so everyone knows that U1 can go through hadoukens and tiger shots.. but did you know that you can punish blocked ex banishing flat, whiffed lariat, blocked blanka slide/sweep, blocked rufus cr. fierce, dash ultra whiffed vega wall dives/bison devils reverse, blocked honda headbutt.. U1 is very situational but its not completely useless
Posted by Dribozyme on March 12, 2010 at 3:19 p.m. #63
"Keep an eye on Ready Up, fight fans for an exciting SSFIV announcement coming soon!" Hmm, what is this "exciting SSFIV announcement" going to be? Guile, Dhalsim, Fei Long, Gen, Honda etc. buffs maybe?
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 3:46 p.m. #64
Doubt it. Probably the bonus we get for having the sfiv disc.
Posted by NA on March 12, 2010 at 4:10 p.m. #65
@65
No, character tweaks aren't something that anyone would hold back on talking about at this point.
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 4:16 p.m. #66
I don't use guile because he's good. I just like his theme song.
Posted by Douchebag on March 12, 2010 at 5:37 p.m. #67
Here's my two cents on the matter concerning Guile. This will sound preposterous to some of you, but I believe every character should be converted into motion-inputs. It is true; trying to consistently execute Guile's Super/Ultra input is a pain in the ass. With motion inputs, it may increase the effectiveness of Vega and Guile because they can now launch their special moves repeatedly like the Hadouken douchebags.
IMO, this should be implemented in the next installment.
Posted by massi4h on March 12, 2010 at 5:47 p.m. #68
@59 no you're wrong. His motions probably won't work and if you need quite a bit of delay it won't be hard to hold focus and move the stick to back, then do a standard dash ultra which is not hard. Of course I and most others find it easier to dash ultra with someone like cammy with a non-charge ultra, but unless I read wrong, Guile's new ultra is the same command as everyone else's charge ultras not his U1 command.
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 6:04 p.m. #69
could proba Lu just weak fk a jumping player and sh them as there comming down like ryu and his metsu hadoken. May connect better than fadc.
Posted by JerseyFame on March 12, 2010 at 6:05 p.m. #70
@72
Its still impossiblu hard...meanwhile you press fierce kick and if it work u do a double quarter circle plus punch...wow thats really hard for Rufus...yeah right.
Why make it harder for us to win capcom. We continued to play and win even with THIS horrible version of Guile in hopes you would see his fans are loyal and he deserves to be fixed...but nooooooooooooo!
Posted by Invader_Darko on March 12, 2010 at 6:15 p.m. #71
in sure once people get the game and do guiles trials again and mess with him a bit people will find out they over reacted. We will see.
Posted by m1northreat on March 12, 2010 at 6:23 p.m. #72
elfs Ult2 can hit rog off a blocked jab dash punch! woot! very good news.
Posted by NecroGiant on March 12, 2010 at 6:39 p.m. #73
regardless what they do with guile im still gonna main him no matter what. when you win with him is a burn on the person you play when they pick top tier cuz it shows them that you don't need to pick top tier to win you can use a character that isnt really that good and still win. i hear constantly that guile sucks but just man up and and beat them down! show them that guile players are good and guile isnt a crap character.
Posted by Cammy on March 12, 2010 at 7:03 p.m. #74
XD People sure love Guile.
Almost no complains for other low-tier characters
Posted by DeeJay on March 12, 2010 at 7:04 p.m. #75
^
No Kidding. lol
Posted by Guile on March 12, 2010 at 7:04 p.m. #76
@72.
why dont u read my post before responding
THATS WHAT I SAID
i said the motions are like u said
u go: charge down to upback kick, slide quickly back (preserving ur charge) and then go dash forward, back, forward, back, forward ppp
i said i agree with ur motions
i disagree that its going to be practical
its going to be feasible in the training room, but too hard to pull off in battle assuming you are not dagger g or geom modinside or gilley or nico mark
meaning: ur not gonna see most tournament players pull it off just like most do not pull off super into ultra combos (although everyone CAN do it)
dont worry, watch....ur going to find out when the agme comes out that im right and i will glady eat my words with bbq sauce and fries when we find out most except the very best guile players tournament players are not going to consistently use the flash kick fadc to SH
can u pull off all the combos in the gilley videos consistently in battle? if so, disregard my statement here
besides even if the sonic hurricane was the easiest move to combo into it only gets 2 hits (thats a fraction of its total hits) when it hits ur opponent in the air. that makes it do GARBAGE DAMAGE. so i wouldnt even do it even if it were the EASIEST combo in the game the way it is reported to be right now.
Posted by Pusha_T on March 12, 2010 at 7:05 p.m. #77
@75--I feel the same way, people are jumping to conclusions about guile. they will never truly know until they get the game and see for themselves. I'm gonna take what that mr.wizard dude said with a pinch of salt.
Posted by Guile on March 12, 2010 at 7:08 p.m. #78
sorry correcting my motions:
*u go: charge down to upback kick, slide quickly back (preserving ur charge) and then go dash forward, back, forward, ppp
and the reason we're complaining about guile is cuz hes going to be the worst character in this game the way its shaping up even when they promised to fix em. its frustrating when u hear about em being nerfed instead.
Posted by Sakura on March 12, 2010 at 7:14 p.m. #79
Glad I'm not a Guile Mainer...
I'd hate to spend all my time b*tching on forums...
Posted by griever2000 on March 12, 2010 at 7:18 p.m. #80
@sakura
I agree with you 100% :D
but I must say sometimes it's fun to play with him :) (WHILE ATTACKING!! NOT STAYING IN THE BACK ALL DAY LONG -_-)
Posted by SonicFlash122 on March 12, 2010 at 8:08 p.m. #81
Needless to say, I'm very disappointed to hear that Guile isn't being taken seriously in SSF4. I am going to wait until I pass judgment though because everything up until the game is actually released is just pure speculation. For all we know Guile could've got some of the best buffs in the game. I'm maining Guile again, good or bad. I've just gotten so used to his play style that I feel it's my own.
I saw some of you talking about the FADC>SH after a Flash Kick but to be honest, I don't think this will be possible unless they some how change the mechanics of the game. If what you guys are saying is possible then in the current SF4 engine, Guile should be able to do a Flash Kick>FADC>EX Sonic Boom, but he in fact can not. There just isn't enough time to charge for the SH so I don't think this will be the way to combo into the SH if he does have a legit way of doing so.
Posted by Th3_JoK3R_J on March 12, 2010 at 8:22 p.m. #82
Where's the love for Vega? =(
All this Guile mumbo jumbo talk how come he's so special? lol
Posted by Psycho on March 12, 2010 at 8:43 p.m. #83
many source said that Vega could combo his new ultra is that true?
Posted by eventhubs_GOD on March 12, 2010 at 8:56 p.m. #84
@62 i main cammy 2 and guile gives me trouble 2 mostly charge and defensive characters give cammy trouble it takes more patience than usual
Posted by Blanks on March 12, 2010 at 9:59 p.m. #85
I don't think It's really about Guile (though he's SF iconic), it's that certain characters (including Vega and Cammy) are getting the shaft and being left behind, seemingly intentionally. I just don't see the benefit of an imbalanced roster :/
But it is funny that I'm busy b1tching about it when I don't even play as one of the nerfees... And I'm totally getting SSFIV day one;)
Posted by Bibuki on March 12, 2010 at 10:11 p.m. #86
I almost never play anyone else but Guile, let alone play a motion character. But tonight I tried a couple of matches with Akuma, since I want him for my sub in Super because of his jawdropping alt costume, and it felt so weird to have all those powerful tools. I won all of my matches, it wasn't always pretty, but I don't rely on spam at all. I actually forget I have fireballs, and I tried to flashkick once haha!
Now I can see why high tier mainers cannot understand our complains.
Posted by sabrewulf on March 12, 2010 at 10:17 p.m. #87
about the motion stuff.
if the U2 is going to something like holding back(2), foward, back, foward x3punches then i think is posible
holding down back, up back+k FADC dash, back, foward+x3p. whit this motion u will never get ex sonic boom, however maybe its posible SH
Posted by Bibuki on March 12, 2010 at 10:23 p.m. #88
@sonicflash122
thanks to you dude I now punish harder (s.hp into FK)
as for the FK FADC SH there's all the time you want to charge the SH. you're already charging from the start. you can do forward dash into ultra1 right? it works for any charge ultra you must know that. but of course Flash Kick>FADC>EX Sonic Boom is impossible, the dash prevents it from working.
that said capcom probably made it whiff for no logical reason, except for the fact that it's Guile's ultra.
Posted by massi4h on March 12, 2010 at 10:29 p.m. #89
@80, ok great we sorta agree. I do disagree with a few things in your post though. The only characters you can do super to ultra iirc are Gen, Guile, Sagat, Ryu and Ken. Ryu players use it now and then as a finisher. So do gen players though nowadays fadcs are much more important to gen. Sagat does more damage off an fadc iirc and ken isn't very likely to have full meter and super to ultra scales alot. Guile is usually better off using his super bar for EX sonic booms and flash kicks and I guess flash kick fadcs.
IF flash kick fadc utlra somehow becomes plausible (maybe you have to wait a bit before your dash or dash back or something), then tbh the motion is alot harder than doing a dash ultra 1 with guile which I know most top level guiles can do. If its a pro tournament with high level players, the people who main characters should not have trouble with the harder combos their character can do, unless their filled with say lots of 1-frame links. Another example is, I can't do viper's really hard combos consistently so I don't pick her or I play her and spam burn kicks lol. Anything that she does is 10x harder than flashkick fadc ultra. And no lol I can't do gilleys combos and I don't main guile.
@85, you can't dash and do any charge special in SF4 since there is no charge partioning. But you can dash to super/utlra perfectly fine because it gives you something like 40 frames to activate after you let go of the charge.
Posted by KilerG2000 on March 12, 2010 at 11:48 p.m. #90
@sonicflash122 as bibuki said thanx 2 u I could punish hard with sf fk :).
though it whiffs alot cause its a hard link like most of guiles links but i think with time ill get better.
Posted by SaitoKojima on March 13, 2010 at 1:50 a.m. #91
I'm pretty sure people like Sakura BENEFIT from the new Ultra.
Posted by BALANCEmyazz on March 13, 2010 at 2:54 a.m. #92
WTF!!!
Capcom is wrecking guile and vega so they wouldn't be able to hurt they're poster boy.
If that then make him a solid mid tier at least for god sake, he is an original not like most of the new cast which are top and mid tiers now (rufus, viper, abel, fuerte, akuma, seth ETC).
I just cant beleive they gave guile nothing at all to help his match ups.
not one combo into ultra.
no easier links
fk is same old f*cked up
an so on.
CAPCOM NOTHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHING WHY?
F*ck UR SUPER SF4. and F*CK YOU 4 wrecking the family man.
I hate KOF but hope there is a 13th edition and hope it kicks ur street fighter s*it
Posted by Psycho on March 13, 2010 at 8:19 a.m. #93
@ 92 he could land it after an ex-scarlet terror since he can juggle an ex-scarlet terror after another ex-scalet terror, bah who I'm I kidding, I miss HDR's Vega :(
Posted by MadnessFamilyguile on March 13, 2010 at 11:57 a.m. #94
Anyone....SERIOUSLY think that Ono would have SPECIFICALLY mentioned buffing guiles normals...and then not have done it....?
Anyone? Anyone at all?
Posted by SonicFlash122 on March 13, 2010 at 12:02 p.m. #95
@KillerG2000 @Bibuki
No problem guys, glad to see that the S.FP>FlashKick is being put into your games. It's definitely a step up from the C.MP>FlashKick. I appreciate you all taking a look at the vids and I'm glad they helped.
But Bibuki on the SH note, I understand what you are saying, but I still don't see how it will work. The reason that I compared the SH to the Ex Boom in the current engine is because that's the one special that has the most in common with the SH (assuming that the SH input is indeed B,F,B,F+3P's)because of the motion similarities. I do understand that you can dash into Ultra's with charge characters, but for some reason I think the canceling of a special move via FADC messes up the charge in this game. I've tried doing a FlashKick>FADC>EXBoom and the Boom won't even come out. This means that the 55 frame needed to charge for the Boom or in this case SH is not available. I pray to God that I'm wrong on this but I've just been trying to figure out the mechanics of something like this. I just want to understand how it will work before I get ahead of myself. I do see what you are saying though and for the sake of Guile's match ups in SSF4, let's hope you are right. I'm going to reserve my opinions until the game comes out though because until someone comes out with a vid of Guile actually doing a FADC>SH in SSF4, this is all speculation.
Posted by b4ym4n on March 13, 2010 at 5:22 p.m. #96
@97
Who gives a crap about Guile's normals? Until he has a viable way to combo his Ultras, he will continue to be utter garbage.
Posted by SonicFlash122 on March 13, 2010 at 7:01 p.m. #97
@b4ym4n
Improving Guile's normals is a HUGE deal. Good Guile players like Dagger_G, Rebelo, GeoM, and Dieminion use Guile's normal to their full potential. Anyone who plays Guile seriously will tell you that his normals are what wins most matches. If they improved them (range, recovery, priority, etc.) then Guile with will be a much better character. I'm looking forward to it. If you need convincing of Guile's normals being the key to success with him, just take a look at this vid of the top Guile player in Japan battle points wise. He uses nothing but normals. His name is Yazu. The Ryu he is playing is the second best behind Daigo to my knowledge so the comp is no slouch. I'm just trying to prove a point here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_AFO1...
Posted by massi4h on March 14, 2010 at 3:19 a.m. #98
@98, I already said it. You can dash Super/Ultra because it gives you something like 42 frames to input. While you can't dash and do a special move at all. FADC doesn't make a difference...
Posted by b4ym4n on March 14, 2010 at 10:01 a.m. #99
@SonicFlash122
I already know all of this. I understand what you're saying; but, the fact of the matter is, Guile needs to be able to combo into his Ultra. End of story. Until then, he won't be anything but low-tier. Grinding out slow, painful wins is great and all; but, the SF4 system is about Ultras.
Posted by b4ym4n on March 14, 2010 at 10:05 a.m. #100
Oh, yeah. They nerfed his S. hp...What do you think about that?
Posted by alex24r on March 14, 2010 at 10:08 a.m. #101
The "bad match up" analogy won't work online, because there will be double blind, right? I mean, there's no way to know what ultra to pick, because some ultras might be beneficial for some situations than others.
Although not such a bad match up, lets say I pick Chun-Li, and my opponent picks Sagat. I will probably choose the first ultra. In a local tournament, this could be true, but online, this won't help in a matchup unless you get lucky, or know what the opponent will choose.(most likely Ryu or Ken though =P)
Eh...
Posted by Smorgasboard on March 14, 2010 at 10:18 a.m. #102
If your entire gameplan is to land the ultra, you are going to lose a lot of matches. You only get one Ultra the whole match and it might not even KO. Ultra are for comebacks and endgames. Nothing else.
Posted by b4ym4n on March 14, 2010 at 10:22 a.m. #103
Yeah, exactly, comebacks and endgames. Two things Guile is terrible at.
Posted by SonicFlash122 on March 14, 2010 at 5:48 p.m. #104
@b4ym4n
Nerfing his S.FP is not a good thing but according to you it doesn't matter because getting an Ultra that you can combo into is the first priority. Gief and Akuma can't combo into their Ultra's but look where they are sitting on the tier list. I'm not saying Guile doesn't need to get an Ultra that has good set ups because it's obvious that it would help him, but I would rather take some god-like normals and a more useful ultra than an ultra that I can combo into.
Posted by Guile on March 15, 2010 at 4:31 a.m. #105
@SonicFlash122.
ok heres my oopinion.
improving Guile's normals seems like it would require intricate tuning
fixing sonic hurricane can be done just making it qcfx2 (for example)
plus ultra 2s are whats being newly introduced. it seems they are more likely to tune up the new stuff rather than digging up the old stuff like normals, which are really the groundwork to a character.
it would be sick for example to have that crossup mk or bigger hitbox on his normals to get more hits, faster recovery, easier lp to mp link, better overhead (which only the japanese know how to use for some reason)
Im not saying they shouldnt open up the hood and make these intricate adjustment. But it would just take a lot more work on the normals to make noticable improvements, as u'd have to fix a lot of different details. And who knows if they'd follow through on fixing every part needed to get that newer, better guile.
unless by improving normals u mean damage. that is a request capcom can go along with easily and one which can at the same time ensure guile is fixed (its not really calculus figuring out how much more dammage would get him where he needs to be either)
Akuma and Zangief are the exception to the comboable ultra rule, but they more than make up for it in damage
(comboable ultra or lots a damage - all in the top tiers)
Dont get me wrong, his normal game is CRUCIAL.
But fixing normals is just too many steps. adding either a comboable ultra or more damage on what hes got is a one step fix to getting him to mid tier territory.
Plus: why fix what aint broken? (or less broken?)
any fix is a fix im grateful for, i just think this is more practical one
Posted by Doomsday on March 15, 2010 at 9:18 a.m. #106
The Guile players on the forum over here are really vocal about the strategies and adaptations they want to see manifested in Super. If everything is done correctly, mainly giving a more easily linked ultra setup and delivering on the increased range on his Flash kick he'll be a threat regardless and the players who are experienced with him will speak for themselves. He really only needs a bit more tools and he could be a serious threat in Super, coming from a Bison main who's played some of the best Guile's in So Cal, like Fuson 909 and Aeroplane. The Dee Jay to Guile matchup is gonna be really interesting to see, and it could be pretty even if Capcom delivers on the tuning for Guile, especially with the advantages his Sonic Hurricane is gonna give him under pressure. I'll be putting some serious time into Dee Jay to test his mettle and see what he can do in this game. Dudley is really looking like he's gonna be a beast, something to be reckoned with.
