Makoto Super Street Fighter 4 videos from Flash Metroid

This is insane. I saw these a few days ago and I was wowed. Good to see that someone put some time into her... Unlike most of the quitters/losers out there who were saying that "R.I.P. Makoto" crap or something along those lines that implied that she sucked. I bet they're sorry for that, Haha!
First.

nice makoto

Its true that makoto is a good rushdown player. but she has no wake-up game.

The biggest problem with Makoto is that her 3rd strike playstyle doesn't carry over very well into ssf4.

Her hyper aggressiveness is much more difficult in a slower paced game. Throw in the fact that reversals are much stronger and it makes Makoto just out of place.

She's just as strong as she was in 3s, but there hasn't been much information on how to translate her playstyle from 3s to SSF4.

Coldblooded use of that axe kick! That's tight seeing well known players exploiting her LP & MP because they are solid for 2in1 Hayate rushdowns. Makoto still needs buffs but this proves an old point I was trying to make about her needing to exploit her good pokes like Chun-Li to play her well in SSF4 compared to 3S.

makotos walk is horrible and the fact that she has to be able to keep her opponent close to her in order for her to be efficient puts her of course on the bottom on the list. she also has poor zoning abilities and is very outmatched to most of the old cast. it takes a special breed to be good with her. id like to fight some of the good makoto players out there. if there are any, drop me a fight request on the ps3

psn id: darko_p86

the problem i have is that makoto just isnt fun to play as

@4
I totally agree. To me it seems like people are just lazy and don't want to re-learn Makoto and instead come to this site to complain about how they suck with her (she's not even my main).

@darko_p86

Makoto's walk was ALWAYS horrible. Her dash compensated so well in 3s.

I mained Makoto in 3s and I gotta tell you. They were faithful to her in SSF4 but she's just out of place. She feels ridiculously slow compared to her 3s version and that just kills her so hard.

Cool, I wonder if Flash Metroid will use Makoto in tourneys.

Come to think of it, I need to see Flash fight a Guile and some Shotos. All those videos were against characters that aren't heavy zoners or people with nasty anti-airs. I'm curious now!

She still low tier. Even when she is in she has a tough time maintaining the momentum. I want to see her play a zoning character...the outcome will not be pretty. Do keep in mind the flash Metroid is a phenomenal player. He can make any character look good.

Fucx this site I emailed this to the guys who run this site and got no credit. Fucx event hubs!

It truly is an odd case with Makoto. She was my main in 3S, and I was hoping that she would be somewhat the same in SSF4. To me, it seems like she doesn't have the same play style, like what Chow said in post #4. I've been trying to find out how to play with her, but it's been really difficult. Especially in regards to #3, with her having no wake-up game.

Also, am I the only one still using Abare Tosanami? Because every video I see of her, the player is using Seichusen Godanzuki.

FlashMet is a good player, but dunno, it seems like the opponents in those vids made really dumb mistakes that led to Makoto's victories.

I mean, Vega, he started pressuring then backs off?
Cody, missed Ultra?
Juri does nothing on mak's wakeup and eats an EX Oroshi? (Mak has no moves that can't be thrown out of)

Other than the missed Ultra, all this sounds like they simply didn't know the matchup. Once they do, Mak will certainly not look as good.

Makoto's rushdown is scary, but when you go into the offensive against her and push her into a corner, she has zero 'get the hell off me' move and will probably die.

This is just nitpicky, but I dislike how quick her Karakusa is in SSF4 compared to how it was in 3S. Felt like landing it in 3S felt like a bigger "Oh Sh*t" moment for the other fighter than it is in SSF4, especially since the focus on landing it has dropped, I think.

Great Makoto!!! Learn how to actually spend a good chunk of time with her, and this is the result! So what if she is low tier right now. If I remember correctly, when vanilla first came out in arcades, Viper was "low tier", and look at where she is now.

Makoto isnt as bad as most o you think, i main her right now.IMO her wakeup game isnt that bad, although it does suck. Her Great dash allows her to get out of tight situations. She doesn't have to stay on the inside as well, her dash allows her to move across the screen quiet easily.

@darko_p86

add me
PSN ID : pandaofthebamboo

and her bad match up arent zoners there are some gapplers and bision and rog ( maybe others)

not discreditin Flash M, but i wanna see some makoto vs shoto's, otherwise shes just a gimmick character.

That vega was alright

@ IrPanda

I will as soon as i get my ps3 back. i let mu my cuz borrow it.

NinjaCW also has a decent Makoto...
http://m.sf4tube.com/videos/player/ni...

This dosent show how good makoto is it just shows how good Flash is. It still remains that Makoto still kinda sucks.

And her problem is against zoners its against people that can abuse the opponents wake up and abuse characters without good reversals like grappler's Cammy and Rufus.

Cool?

Let's see Makoto get away with those tactics against a good player. Maybe then we'll see how reliable that mp xx hayate pressure is.

makoto does well vs low and mid tier in the hands of top player, news at 11.

Its not easy to zone out Makoto where do you get this from?? Only characters who can probably do it well is Seth and probably guile.

You gotta put work into Makoto, at the beguinning I decided to use her (Over presumed to be used Guy who is on the side lines now) and I was losing bad I mean losing streaks all day, but as I learned more of her trickes became more aggressive, and a bit reckless, im starting to learn my match ups and win with her. Im getting tons of game mail telling me how scary my Makoto was.

The thing is I never played Makoto in 3rd Strike so I never got stuck in this mindset that I had to play her like 3rd Strike, I think playes who never played her in 3S do much better because they use her as intended in SSF4, Say what you want Makoto does NOT deserve to be in the low tiers and im glad Flash Metroid is proving that.

It's surprising that the good players I've seen using Makoto all used very different styles... I guess it's too soon to tell if she is good or not.
She was my main in third strike and the thing I miss the most is being able to combo karakusa into abare tosanami, wich as #14 I still prefer over ultra I

Decent fights, but if this is supposed to convince anyone that Makoto is anything more but fodder for any character over mid tier, then it fails to deliver. Her rushdown is gimped, her risk vs reward is terrible, and she has such limited defensive options that it would be safe to say she has none at all.

She is just a bad character.

The problem with Makoto is you have to be Flash Metroid to use her. For the rest of us that basically suck by comparision, there is little to no hope.

I don't know about high level play but online I can win with her against the majority. You just have to play with her differently on this game like everyone says. I agree with her being low tier since I have to work very hard to win with her and majority of people don't do much to beat me lol

Regardless of what others say, Makoto is a great character in Super. The only thing that really stood out for me that I didn't like was her normals. THEY SUCK compared to 3's. Give her crouching m.k a little more range and speed.

She may not be as good as Flash Metroid here, but my fiancee likes to use Makoto in Super SF4.

If anyone wants to spar with her, or me (I use Hakan, Guy and Sakura as my mains), our PSN is:

SaitoKojima

@33
I think actually her normals are one of the better parts of her playstyle

@30

I agree. If u want to make a statement about her abilities break her out in tournament play/serious matchs. He shows some good stuff but it wasnt like she dominated or showed something new in any of the vids and that fight versus vega came down to a lucky ultra. I want to see her match up versus tougher characters like ryu,zangief and balrog and some tougher opponents. She isnt as bad as hakan but i dont think she will do so well versus the higher tier characters.

Even the best players in the world won't know what are a character's strengths until someone put enough time into it. Yeb put time into Gen and Inthul put time into Fei Long. You talk about how bad Makoto is now but when she starts winning matches, you'll start talking about how good she is like you always knew it.

aww c'mon guys she doesn't look bad,

i love makoto flash M is nice with mak but against some shotos its rape so i use guile and makoto

@Garcian_Ulmeyda

You were credited, although I just used your email address at first instead of your username. I updated the story and instead used your username.

@36
Makoto owns Geif hard!! once you know the match up. she does normal against ryus especially since they nerfed his l.srk. it gets beat but a lot of meaties, but going against a competent rog or bison is hard! She not that bad you just have to know how to play here....

ninjacw just won a tourney with makoto

I've said it before, I'll say it again:

Super Street Fighter 4 is still a relatively balanced game. Sure, there's some terrible matchups, but overall, it's still fairly balanced. If you put in the time, you can be good with just about any character, IMO.

dude makoto has been out for like two months..... people dont understand how long it takes for tiers to develop

she plays pretty much the same as third strike but in super 4 she has better defense because projectiles are more important in 4 and because of focus it adds more defense against it combined with her awesome dash capabilities

plus she has good normals ex. c.mp s.mp and the recovery on her f.mk is quick enough to reduce spacing

shes a well made character

Interesting. Would love to try her if SSF4 come out on PC.

@36

How would she beat zangief? His throw out ranges hers and he has some decent normals(standing strong is really good). I really want to see that match because from where im seeing it zangeif would give her a really hard time. Know that i think about it who does she beat? I can see most of the characters in the game give her a hard time by either keeping her out(sagat,ryu,chun,guile) or keeping her under pressire(balrog,bison,abel,etc). Its only been 2 months but when u think about it we already know what most of the cast is capable of so it shouldnt take that long to take whatever small changes in to consideration along with the 10 new characters. UNless they figure out some god like strat that works on everyone i doubt that she will break out of the bottom ten.

Gen didn't break out till 6 months later. :P Some characters takes longer than others because no good players are using them.

By the way, NinjaCW did really well using Makoto here. http://www.justin.tv/xanadugames/b/26...

@ 46
Gief cant catch her with her dash, its a pretty fun hit and run game :).. Yea chun gives her problems as well, not so much the other 3, and yea those rob bison and abel do give her some trouble but once u learn the match ups u learn to deal with them so that its not so much of a problems althought still a bit hard especialy with bison he has everything to stop her, good meaty pokes to keep out random ex hayates and to lock her down a teleport to move away from her , a lot of moves to get in on her ....its tough but everyone else isnt that bad against here

Dunno, I main Makoto, and I'm not too impressed with Flash Metroid's Mak.

NinjaCW's though... is a different story.

@49
Im more impressed with mine :)..
*Struts away*

@48

Thats the thing, zangief can do the same thing to her. She has to get in on him to do any dmg and thats where the fun would start. And after a knock down gief can end the round in a few guesses. Her back dash will only get her so far(mix some green hand and stand rh, that should make makato think about mashing backdash). And having the extra stamina will help in the match up. And again, zangief has more throw range so u effectively take that away her command throw mix ups. Theres no way this match up is a even 5/5. Zangiefs that jump around mashing 360? no problem. But a solid one that plays zangief for real will make that a 6/4. I can see it being on par or worst then the bison zangief matchup(thats a 6/4 zangief). And in that one bison has more range on his pokes, alot better walk speed, a teleport and invin frames on dr and headstomp. Makato has NONE of that and to make things worst she relies on a command throw that will lose to giefs and her dash punch which im pretty sure gief can slam on block. I swear, im so bored i could do a quick matchup list on her now lol.

And as for learning the match up, it helps but it doesnt change the fact that its a hard match. Its like guile v bison and blanka v balrog. U can know the in's and out's of the match and it will STILL be an up hill battle at best.

Flash was clearly the best player and the only Pro at CEO yesterday. During casuals he stomped scrubs with Mak pretty fiercely.... but during tournament play? He used Mak for exactly one game, lost, and immediately switched back to Viper.

It was actually pretty disappointing.

Funny how Makoto herself says, "Don't underestimate me!"

@chickenwing

but if makoto maintians a distants from the start it is very hard for her to be caught and she can close the distance relatively easy when every she wants. Do you play makoto btw? you should try not to talk about match ups u dont really know about and are just guessing.
the only thing Geif can do to catch makotos dash is green hand which is very unsafe. And she doesn't rely on her karakasu.

and btw i said Bision is one of her worst match-ups then probably gief and honda everyone else is not that hard once u know how too play her.

FM's Makoto is not impressive. NinjaCW is better, and I bet that with time, Makoto will show more potential. Or maybe not (wry smile). After all, even J began using Chun at some point...

FLASH METROID isn't doing anything remotely impressive or he isn't even applying a different strategy than a whole load of other failing makoto players ,if you simple minded people only have to see some well known name person win a few matches to lose your senses your all short sighted .
Makoto is inferior to just about everyone in ssf4 don't matter how you look at it ,this ZANGIEF comparison is crap when you consider gief has priority and above average health look at all of these matches and you see a ton of obvious mess ups by the opponents and can makoto jump in the air so much against shoruken characters ....
Makoto dash punch is neither two hits nor a focus breaker which which allows the opponent to beat it out once read pretty easily and her comand grab is beaten by normal throws and has less priority than abel's and ehonda's grab.

@55

If that was true then bison would beat zangief(like i said, bison has better pokes, a good dash,and alot more ways to get out of range), and he doesnt. I dont have to play makato to understand the tools and strats that would be used in this matchup.

@52

that pretty much sums it all up. If she was good and he had confidence in what she would he would have stuck with her. Look at when they had diago playing guile during that event(i cant recall which one), he came out and stuck with guile and was able to win versus valle and raw versus wongs rufus. Regardless if he was doin killain a favor or not by picking him it sounded that guile could bring the goods. SOmeone needs to do the same with mak, until then im just gonna say she sucks.

@59
Bisons cant get in and out of geifs zone as fast as makoto. NO one has a dash like Makoto, she cant cross the entire screen in 2 dashes, bison also doesnt have a move that can almost instantly hit his opponent from completely across the screen ( ex hayate). And yes sometimes you do need to play with them to know what they have to work with.

WEAAAAAK VEGA

Dude, Makoto got some muscles.

@60

dude, u can hit from across the screen but are then safe? ANd bison has alot more mobility then makato, thats not even an arguement(i been playing him for a year now). U keep bringing up her dash, it aint gonna save u. Its a big dash which makes it easy for me to smack u in the face when u come forward and the back dash will simply put u in the corner faster which isnt a good place for her to be in.

i main makoto and im not a street fighter god, or a fighting game guru. but i do know that no matter how high or how low tier a character is, you can still win, it depends on you. tiers are important, but there not the only thing that decide a match, and now that ive stated the obvious, makoto is a difficult character, you have to be fast and offensive in a defensive game, when i use makoto, i focus on her current tricks, like her ->+MK into the karakusa, and her good ass c.MP into Light hayate. the moraal of my story is, she isn't everyone's cup of tea, but she definitely isn't a piece of crap.

My gamertag is deaths conondrm.

I main Makoto too, but I do think she is crap.

Against people that doesn't know the matchup, a Makoto player can look like god to the less informed. Bang-bang-boom, dizzy, then win.

Against people that actually KNOWS the matchup? You're in for quite a frustrating bout.

Why do I still pick her? Simply because I'm a nonconformist. hehehe

Rugged Hawaiian is a fantastic Makoto on XBOX

First off, there was no credit from the site which uploaded these videos... They're from http://www.option-select.com by the way.

Flash did indeed use Makoto vs. that Ryu at CEO, I watched it, the only reason he lost is because he somehow messed up the input for ultra after the EX grab.

Also, the people he's playing ARE good. Makoto's pressure game is nasty, and Flash is a beast.

@chickenwing
Ive payed bison for a while to , he can get around fast but makoto can get around a lot safer. you are speaking from a point of veiw where u have not playe d makoto much and she is a character that takes a bit of time time to fully grasp (more than average) and ive seen how bison can move for about a year, playing with him and playing some great players who use him. So in my opinion seeing that i have seen and played with bison for about a year and that i have played with makoto a lot more than you i am telling you that can be very mobile , not as much as bison but for her its is a lot safer and until you play her far at least 3-5 weeks you may not fully understand, right now you are assuming especially since u hav not played with her very much. And if u still dont believe me meet me on psn and ill shoe you how MAK can deal with Geif. So its either u just stup up and tell me ok :), or add me on PSN . my id is pandaofthebamboo

@69

Im on xbox.

U can talk all u want. I fight a friend that has mained her since 3s. I know what she can do and from the videos we just seen my friend didnt do so much different. She doesnt have the tools to turtle up and if ur fighting someone with good normals/reversals ur gonna have a hard time. I did a honda v makato and i seriously got him scared to go for anything in close since ochio eats it all up. But regardless at the end of the day nobody is useing her versus top comp. FLash tryed her one match, lost and went back to viper, and the other videos posted were against ur average xbox/ps player and STILL makato found her self in situations where she couldnt produce.

@70
Thats what you always do, u always assume someone is a certain way from a previous game when this is not always the case. im not talking about 3rd strike im talking about ssf4 and i could argue from the videos ive seens that hakan is the best in the game, he has good range on attacks and a long throw a great anit a throw and other moves ive seens.... you get my point ????

Why don't you two have a first to 10 and see who's theory is better?

Because he is on xbox and im psn.....And he is the guy who said cammy's hooligan should be able to also grab you on crouching which means when a full speed ex one comes at you cant do anything but take the grab :S lol.....

@72

Hes not even useing theory, hes basing his opinion on his wins over some lame gief that spends the whole time jumping around and mashing 360s and isnt smart enough to smack the back dash. He isnt compareing tools and strats. So honestly the arguement is a waste a time with him. Im just bored right now.

@73
Ahh, HIT HER. It isnt that hard to smack her out of her hooligan throw, ex or not(if u react fast enough u can juggle her into an ultra with rufus,bison,etc). U can hit it with a regular anti air normal or nuetral jump attack. Her hooligan grabed croching players in every other sf game and it wasnt broken(i find myself geting throw alot by it in those games because im used to it missing when i crouch), having it not grab crouching players takes away from her offensive abilities(shes supposed to be able to mix the throw with the low hit) and makes holding down back the best thing to do when she goes for the hooligan since it defeats both of her attack options which only leaves her open for a punish. If shes gonna go for it the risk v reward needs to be there, right now it isnt and thats why u rarely see her do it.

No move should be able to grab u in the air and crouching with auto tracking , not everyone has moves that would hit her out of it effectively.

Im basing it on the fact that i know how makoto works and how geif works and its pretty hard for him to catch her and lock her down . You are assuming from ur limited knowlegde of makoto.

btw stop talking about other games this is ssf4 no sf3 or hdr.....

I think my makoto may be better, i dunno. and personally, i love fighting guile's and sagats. i beat their asses. it makes me happy lol.

@50 i feel the same way you do. dont forget t hawk is another terrible match up. TERRIBLE MATCH UP. also seth.

Hawk aint so bad ( its bad doh) but i never lose to him again, i just keep out and wait for errors .....if he decides to wait it out to i know i can biuld meter a lot faster and safer than he can lol...and makoto can be a big treat with a full bard :) .....

@75

LOL, thats why hooligan throw was totally broken in other games. ANd yes most people have a way to deal with it(everyone can nuetral jump attack). ANd if u have a hard time dealing with it o well, cammy has an advantage. Not everyone can deal with rufus dive kicks but i havent seen them get nerfed.

ANd im baseing my arguement on the fact that gief has alot of tools that WILL negate alot of what makato has. U can turtle all u want with her but guess what, gief can do the same and with the stamina/dmg output advantage he will do alot defensively then makato can. U can back dash all u want, gief can take his sweet a$$ time walking across the screen and throw out some random jabs and strongs to smack the random dash punch and simpley corner guard u for 99 seconds. U admitted honda was a bad matchup and honda isnt that much faster then gief(i her ex dash punch can punish headbutts though) and why is that? Ochio will destroy her in close, he does made dmg/above average stamina and can out turtle her. Gief can do the same.

One thing u cant argue about is that dr rockzo is in fact a rock n roll clown and he does cocain.

@80 There you go talking about other games again.......
And you can block the dive kick, having a move u cant block or tech thats is unblockable is broken imo (unless everyone has it)... especially since grabs can a lot of the time beat meaties .....if you name one other move in SF4 or SFF4 that has auto tracking, good start up, can hit you in almost anywhere on the screen no matter ur state ( crouching, standing or in the air) , i would admit wrong, but there are no moves like this is SF4 and it would be imo game breaking for her to have this ...

And this is my point you are just making a lot of assumption of what would beat what. Yes geif can turtle it out as well but makoto can control the space well in that match up and has the safer moves...llet me give you examples... match starts makoto breaks away to get space, her lp.overhead builds metter faster that gief lariete plus she can punish the lariete with ex.hayate, so he cant build free metter on her.. if he apporches her on the ground she can ex.hayate (but thats not safe so i wouldn't)..close the space faster than him and poke , or compeletey and go for karakasu or normal grab. Geif could defend but he would be at a disadvantage because he would have to react with either lariete or a poke and if he reacts wrong he can be punished ...So at full screen makoto has advantage.... if geif manages to knock her down in the corner he has little safe option he can go for spd but if she dashes back he gets punished , cross up but makoto has her AA or can dash out under him to the next side, he can meaty (probably safest option) but makoto can possible punish with ex-karakasu or ex over head and break away to next side......the meet up mid screen...geif knocker her down, he goes for green hand to stop back dash, but green hand is very unsafe and can lead to free karakasu cross ups can be AA'ed or dash under to break spd range meaties can be dashed out of...the only thing he has to sto her dash is green hand which is very unsafe....geif gets life lead and turtles he cant run from makoto very well because of her dash ( & hayate) cant defend from air attacks well ( her j.hp shuts down lariete a lot) . Best options random pokes to keep her out but he cant do that for long before he small hitboxes find a way in on him :)........

Honda beats her because head butt cand snuff out random hayates , only ex hayate can punish hp.headbutt.. his command grab beats everything she has so she cant come in close, and he has a decent AA for her so ites very diffifult to get in on him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cf4OAq...

@ chickenwings I played a Makoto user I main Gief and it's a patient game she has the fastest pokes out their and kept me out the whole round until they slip up it's the only way. Your probably thinking of the usual all out offense Makoto's yeah they will get beat, but the ones that know the matchup well will stop you cold.