List of changes in Tatsunoko vs. Capcom: Ultimate All-Stars

Spotted through Capcom Unity that FrustratedSquirrel on the SRK boards has compiled a truly impressive list of changes from Tatsunoko vs. Capcom to the Ultimate All-Stars upgrade.

If you played the original title or heard a bit about it and want to know what's changed, I don't think you'll find a better list anywhere.

Here's a grab from the page.

UNIVERSAL/SYSTEM CHANGES
+ Throws are more useful (tick throws exist. You can throw someone while they are attacking, can throw after blockstun, etc.)
- Characters fall faster now.
- Megacrash pushes up and away. Can still combo after a megacrash.
- Baroque is not as potent.
+ Giant characters cannot be so easily comboed/infinited.
+ Characters gain a bit more meter while being hit.
- Cannot force the opponent into a corner after a juggle via the air combo trick.
* Stage-specific music.
* New character select screen (with gear-like selection reels that leave the number of new characters to be included ambiguous).
- Damage scaling on DHCs (Delayed Hyper Combos) is more severe, devaluing hyper combinations somewhat.
+ Characters now have more proration as their health bars get lower (guts).

Posted by Damage Failing on November 2, 2009 at 3:38 p.m. #1

Why do so many games keep putting more and more damage scaling? :( I liked the older games where a few combos killed you. But I know I'll never get my way so back to the drawing board with combos I guess.

Posted by Damage Failing on November 2, 2009 at 3:39 p.m. #2

My bad, only on DHC, but still... Damage scaling.. Not nice :(

Posted by jammasta on November 2, 2009 at 4:05 p.m. #3

Stage specific music as opposed to character themes sucks majorly (unless each character has a stage). Then again, music isn't the important part of it, it's just an extra that I happen to like a lot >_>.

Posted by classy on November 2, 2009 at 4:13 p.m. #4

leave it to capcom to do even more damage scaling, to a freakin game that is all about combos... dont ruin ssf4 by only making 2 hit combos useful this time ok?

Posted by Duelle on November 2, 2009 at 5:19 p.m. #5

You people are morons. Damage scaling is the best thing that's ever happened to fighting games. Without damage scaling many bread and butter combos in SF4 would do something like 5-700 damage. Without damage scaling El Fuerte's loop would be unbeatable. Games between very technically skilled players would boil down to who could get the first hit and then do one combo and win.

Damage scaling makes a lot of sense in games where you can cancel moves to continue a combo. Not all games have this feature; ST is an example. ST is fine without it because of how simple the engine is. It just does not allow for very long combos. Now think about Seth's corner combo or E. Honda linking 4 jab -> EX Hands (difficult but possible) and you might finally begin to understand the practicality of it. Due to the nature of TvC's fighting engine, it makes even more sense to have scaling in this game, unless you like losing because you didn't hit first.

Posted by Duelle is Right on November 2, 2009 at 6:11 p.m. #6

"You people are morons"

Posted by Balloon on November 2, 2009 at 6:18 p.m. #7

The chances of me getting flamed for mentioning Brawl is high, but I have to bring up something that they have that is a better alternative to combo scaling (at least in my opinion). That's move decay.

Don't punish a player for executing technically difficult combos; punish them for using the same move over and over, even in the form of light string combos. This encourages variety while dealing with things like infinites and fireball spamming.

Ironically, the Smash community mostly hates how high move decay is in Brawl.

P.S. I'm not calling zoning (w/ projectiles) a cheap tactic, but as of now it's a relatively low risk/high reward tactic.

Posted by classy on November 2, 2009 at 6:39 p.m. #8

@duelle

your the moron, it takes time to build up a full super bar to do a double fadc combo.. and if u mess up its a severe waste of meter.. u dont get to do it for free moron. damage scaling is the reason sf4 tournments look bland, and why poongko was exciting to watch. why waste such an elegant system cuz sorry ass people can't do combos. its a fighting game for god sakes cry babys.

@balloon
thats a great idea but, you already waste 2 meters for 1 fadc.. so ur already paying alot. i agree tho.. sf4 punish good players for the sake of stupid noobs.. capcom originally wanted revenge meter to kill the winning opponent off an ultra.... how stupid is that?

LIKE I SAID HUGE COMBOS IN SF4 ARE HARD TO DO AND ARENT FREE SO TONE DOWN THE DAMAGE SCALING SO IT CAN BE WORTH DOING THE COMBOS

Posted by Chris Vega on November 2, 2009 at 8:06 p.m. #9

Ah damage scaling a scrubs best friend. Damage scaling is a joke. If you truly know how to play the game you should be able to stick defense and avoid big combos. But if someone is skilled enough to pull of combos on their opponents why should they be punished because their opponent can't play the game and learn how to stick proper defense. But what can you do? This generation of fighting games are designed for weaker players to be able to compete this way more money is made, not only from the hardcore fighting fan but from the scrubs as well. I mean picture if they put damage scaling in MvC2 Nuff said.

Posted by Anonymous on November 2, 2009 at 8:26 p.m. #10

I always thought move decay would work for SF4. However it would only hinder characters like Seth (low damage output/always ends combos with the same move) and make characters with a myriad of combo enders, like Akuma and Ryu seem better. It could work if it was implemented properly and different characters and moves had different rates of decrease.

Posted by Nyoronoru on November 2, 2009 at 9:30 p.m. #11

The only thing I disagree with is the DHC damage scaling.

There's almost no excuse to use LVL3 setups anymore unless you have a really, really good excuse now.

Posted by classy on November 2, 2009 at 9:31 p.m. #12

@chris vega

you'd be surprise what the noobs complain about on this site, i thought only hardcore street fighters come here but nope, u got people complaying about fadc dragon punches are cheap, mashing button moves are cheap.. things that been in since sf2 is cheap..

im tired of the noobs on this site

Posted by Geese on November 2, 2009 at 10:05 p.m. #13

In all honesty, damage scaling has its place in certain games. While I have never seen it used perfectly, I can't imagine SF4 without some kind of scaling.

As for move decay, it is an interesting idea for fighting games. If it worked sort of like chip damage and wasn't as extreme as it is in Smash Bros. than I can see it working in a Street Fighter game. But that sounds like something crazy that SNK would make.

Posted by Firegod on November 2, 2009 at 10:17 p.m. #14

This seems to be a nice list

Posted by plumones on November 2, 2009 at 11:58 p.m. #15

@chris vega
mvc2 has a dizzy system that breaks long combos.
You need a system like that in high level tourneys where everyone has godly execution it would break down to the first hit or a whiffed move. Damage scaling makes the game. Maybe sf4 has a very strict damage scaling but it is necesary.

Posted by ATATATATATATATATATATA on November 3, 2009 at 1:47 a.m. #16

"Games between very technically skilled players would boil down to who could get the first hit and then do one combo and win."

But I liked HnK!

Posted by Balloon on November 3, 2009 at 2:29 a.m. #17

@16: You're already dead.