Last updated on April 26, 2010
This video walks you through the very basics of playing Vega, but also gets into advanced tactics and combos. Although some of it is in German, it contains English annotations. Watch ►
Movie by WWMajin
Speed and range, this version of Vega is most like his Super Turbo counterpart. His EX moves compliment his normal arsenal really well.
Vega's main problem is that his damage is on the low end, so you're going to have to hit your opponent a lot to finish them off. He also dizzies faster than most characters.
He lacks options to keep offensive pressure on his opponent, so most players lean towards a defensive style with him.
While Vega is considered to be one of the worst characters in the game, Street Fighter 4 is very balanced, so it's still possible to beat people with him consistently.
• Strengths •
+ He's very fast.
+ Excellent range on most of his normal attacks.
+ Leaping Kick (down-forward plus Hard Kick) is a great normal attack.
+ Not easy to anti air him because of the speed and trajectory of his jump.
+ Strong 'zoning' game and tons of pokes.
+ Crouching Medium Punch is still great and can be Canceled.
+ His Ultra is great against people who throw a lot of fireballs.
+ Nice range on his Focus Attack.
• Weaknesses •
- Low damage output.
- Has a low stun rating, meaning he gets dizzy quickly.
- Trading hits with your opponent is almost always a losing scenario.
- Losing your claw hurts your range considerably.
- Hard to get your opponent off of you in some situations.
A (2) next to an arrow means to hold the joystick in that direction for 2 seconds to 'charge' the move.
With moves that charge by holding back or down, you can use the diagonal positions to charge up as well. For example, if you're holding back, you can jump backwards or block low and still maintain your charge.
• Rolling Crystal Flash (Rolling Claw Attack) •
Does good chip (block) damage, and is useful to in some combos. Also you can Focus Attack Dash Cancel this roll to throw your opponent off guard who's expecting to have to block further attacks. If you catch them off balance, simply walk up and throw.
A alright trap is to repeatedly loop Crouching Medium Punches into a Light Punch Claw Roll. Chip damage is nice and you can bait your opponent into doing something dumb.
You can also Cancel the Claw Roll into Vega's Super move, which makes it difficult to counter. See the Super Move section below for additional information on this technique.
Also, the Medium Punch version of this move now causes more block stun in Super Street Fighter 4, which allows you to score more chip damage without your opponent being able to counter.
(when close)
• Flying Barcelona Attack & Izuna Drop (Wall Dive and Throw) •
You can also use the diagonal-up positions to execute this attack, he'll normally jump off the wall his back is facing, but pressing diagonally-up towards will make him jump off the other wall instead.
Executing this attack makes Vega quickly dive at his opponent after jumping off the wall. Press the joystick left or right and a Punch button when you're close to grab them. If you press Punch at any other time while diving, Vega will attack by spreading his arms.
This move is not as fast as it was in Super Turbo, so your opponent has more time to react to it.
To mix things up, fly over your opponent's head to hit them on the reverse side (their back) to "cross" them.
When you get your execution and angles down, you can time this so it's difficult for your opponent to correctly guess which way to block. And when they start focusing on blocking — throw them with the Izuna Drop.
• Sky High Claw (Aerial Claw Attack) •
Vega's Sky High Claw is alright. There's a high risk, low reward factor going in most situations with this attack because the damage isn't great.
The Light Punch version makes you fly at about mid screen level, while Hard Punch will hit most characters in the chest if they're standing. Medium Punch is a mix of the two.
*Armor Breaking*
• Scarlet Terror (Flip Kick) •
While this isn't as good as it was in Super Turbo, it's still a nice defensive move, especially against jump in attacks. Damage is also good (for Vega), so you'll want to bait jumps and connect with this whenever possible.
You can juggle with Vega's Flip Kick with a second one, but only in certain situations. Here's the breakdown.
To juggle with the Flip Kick, you need it to only connect one time, it if hits twice you won't be able to juggle with another one.
or
• Back Flip •
Vega flips away from his opponent. The punch version of this move lasts a little longer and causes Vega to hop further back.
This comes out very quickly, and is sometimes the best way to escape a projectile Ultra or Super. Not something to use frequently because it can be countered if your opponent knows you're going to throw it out, but it's still handy in certain situations.
• Claw Throw •
This will make Vega throw his claw up into the air and it comes down and sticks into the ground. Once thrown, you have to walk over the claw to pick it back up.
The button pressed determines where the claw goes. Light Punch is behind you, Medium and Hard throw it in front of you.
There doesn't seem any reason to actually do this move, as it rids you of your claw.
• Mask Throw •
Takes 50% of your Super meter and makes you throw your mask on the ground. This increases your attack power, but lowers your defense (stamina) until your mask is picked back up.
• EX-Rolling Crystal Flash (Rolling Claw Attack) •
This is almost the same as your Hard Punch Rolling Crystal Flash, except it's invunerable to fireballs. It has a long start up time though and damage is mediocre, you're probably better off using other moves.
(when close)
• EX-Flying Barcelona Attack & Izuna Drop (Wall Dive and Throw) •
Hits once on the way to the wall and then again when he's coming down. The EX version also has better throw range than a normal Izuna Drop.
This will probably be the main move you use in combos, because you can Cancel into it from several of his normal attacks.
It is not an effective anti-air move though, and it can be difficult to land the Wall Dive part if your opponent is in the corner. Works best when the other fighter is mid-screen.
But this does pretty good damage, and it's probably what you'll be spending most of your EX meter on.
Also if this trades hits on the first attack, it launches the other fighter up into the air and you can juggle them as they come down with pretty much anything.
• EX-Sky High Claw (Aerial Claw Attack) •
The EX-Sky High Claw hits twice, and comes out a bit faster than the normal version, it also goes through projectiles.
It's effective at knocking players out of their projectiles when you do not have an Ultra meter to punish them with.
*Armor Breaking*
• EX-Scarlet Terror (Flip Kick) •
(when close)
• Super — Flying Barcelona Special & Rolling Izuna Drop •
Unlike Vega's Super move in Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo, if you don't land the Izuna Drop (Throw) it still zaps all of your Super meter.
It does have better range than Vega's normal Izuna Drop, but the all or nothing nature of this move and the fact it doesn't do a lot of damage is a big turn off. You're probably best off using your Super meter else where.
*Armor Breaking*
• Ultra 1 — Bloody High Claw •
Vega jumps off the wall and does multiple claw slices to his opponent. You can control which wall you dive off of by ending the motion towards the corner of choice in the diagonally up direction.
Vega flies diagonally downwards from whichever corner he hopped off of — meaning you probably won't land this if your opponent is near the wall you jump off of. Also you need to hit the wall before you're safe from counter-attacks.
This move goes through projectiles and is a really effective attack against fireball spammers. Try to be inside of 3/4ths of a screen's distance to the wall, and if you react quickly you can slice the crap out of your opponent simply for throwing out a fireball.
His Ultra comes out very quickly, so you should know almost instantly if your opponent blocked it or not. Even if they block, you land at an alright distance away from them. You can still be punished, but it isn't easy.
In Super Street Fighter 4, this move has been improved by making Vega hit on the way up when he jumps to the wall. This makes his Ultra 1 MUCH better, as it can now be used as anti air. Some players claim that this is one of the best Ultras in the game now.
• Ultra 2 — Splendid Claw •
This makes Vega slide into his opponent, if he connects he'll do a series of attacks ending with a dramatic claw slice.
• Down-Forward + Hard Kick (Leaping Kick) EX-Wall Dive •
Nice damage on this, and all you have to do is connect with a Leaping Kick.
• Jumping Hard Punch, Crouching Medium Kick, Link into Crouching Medium Punch •
Easy combo and it doesn't require a charge.
• Jumping Hard Kick, Crouching Medium Kick, Hard Kick Flip Kick •
• Jumping Hard Punch, Standing Hard Punch, Link into Crouching Medium Punch •
• Jumping Hard Kick, Crouching Medium Kick, Cancel into Light Punch Rolling Claw •
• Level 2/3 Saving Attack, Dash Cancel, Down-Forward plus Hard Kick, EX-Wall Dive •
• Crouching Light Punch 2x, Crouching Medium Punch, Cancel into EX-Wall Dive •
• Cosmic Heel (Launcher) •
Vega hops forward with his leg out. If this lands it launches your opponent up into the air so you can juggle them.
Really good move. Fast, and gives you the option to move Vega forward very quickly. Great recovery time, and you can juggle your opponent after landing it. If you miss entirely you can throw your opponent after wards.
• Piece of Mercury (Overhead) •
In Super Street Fighter 4 this is now an overhead attack that must be blocked high.
Note this is not a complete list of all of Vega's normal moves, just the ones we think are noteworthy.
• Medium Punch Claw •
This is still a great poke. It's very fast, the damage is alright (for Vega), and if you do it early enough you can use it to stuff (stop) other attacks. Can also work well when you're almost a full screen's distance away as an anti air move.
You can throw this attack out somewhat randomly and use it to bait the other fighter into Shoryukens and the like so you can punish when they miss.
And you can Cancel out of this attack into some of Vega's special moves, which makes it all the more useful. Plus you can Link into it after a Crouching Medium Kick.
• Slide Sweep •
A low attack with a lot of range and it should be safe if blocked as long as you hit your opponent at almost the very end of the animation. Use it sparingly to keep your opponent off guard, and to slide under jumping attacks and throw the other fighter when they land.
• Kara Throw •
The range on this Kara Throw isn't exceptional, but it's not too bad either. It's roughly the same range of Akuma's Kara Throw in Street Fighter 3 Third Strike.
(In the air)
• Air Throw •
Vega's Air Throw has good range. Use this whenever you can anticipate a jump.
Contributions to this guide by UltraDavid, Sev, Reno, Jinofcoolnes, Nagata Lock II, Pat the Great, Chocolate Sausage, Bebop3000, BrentoBox, Sambo, Ryodragoon, Som*, Arlieth Tralare, Gadgetxguy, SFilp and Tatsujinken.
Posted by blind101 on August 26, 2008 at 8:55 a.m. #1
great job cant wait to use these moves today
Posted by yoyo on August 31, 2008 at 1:26 a.m. #2
can u control which wall you jump off of for the barcelona attacks?
Posted by heidrek on September 11, 2008 at 3:04 p.m. #3
What is the point in his Claw Throw move? It seems to just go straight through them with no damage, really just a taunt that costs you the claw?
Posted by Michael on October 19, 2008 at 4:08 p.m. #4
I've seen people purposely take off their mask!! how do yoi do that and does it make a difference?
Posted by Cost on November 11, 2008 at 6:23 a.m. #5
notes on "barcelona attack"
* can be executed with diagonals instead of up-direction
(2)down, upback+K = jumps in the back wall,
(2)down, upfoward+K = jumps in the front wall.
** warning: charging barcelona while blocking (downback) for jumping in the front wall (upfoward) can trigger an unwelcome "scarlet terror" by mistake (the 2 moves have almost same button sequence)
Posted by panda on November 20, 2008 at 3:26 p.m. #6
Karathrows? Again? I hated having to learn those...
Posted by Vega Lover on December 30, 2008 at 11:22 a.m. #7
I really love using Vega in SSF2HDR because as a mostly defensive character, he is a fun character to use. I have spent the last few days learning his skills and pulling off his super is really satisfying as it is one of the most difficult to do in the game.
That's why I am disappointed that this time your Super meter is drained even if you dont land the Izuna Drop and I think that's unfair as Vega's is the weakest character in SF.
Posted by VegaNoob on January 7, 2009 at 6:58 a.m. #8
Just a quick couple of questions if anyone has the answers.
1.When doing his Ultra do you need to hit the exact same thing as when you do the Izuna drop even though he is just slicing through them? Or is it just the punch without the direction press. (I don't understand that)
2.Can you do the same button (rotation) sequence you use in hdremix for the super/ultra? (charge back+down-back+forward,up+back)
Thanks in advance for any answers. I haven't been able to play sf4 yet.
Posted by haloly on January 7, 2009 at 8:06 a.m. #9
Vega rocks!!! He's not the worst character! He is in fact one of the top.
I have used him to beat skillful opponent using characters such as Sagat, Zangief, Blanka, Guile, Ken, Ryu and Akuma with the following steps (I was called cheapo a few times for trashing them!):
1) Start of by walking towards opponents, then use crouching medium punch to irritate the hell out of them.
2) If they jump, you jump and air slam them. Because of Vega's speed, his air slam hit 90% of the time. You can also use jump + hard punch to kill off opponent's jumps.
3) If they keep blocking because of your crouching medium punches, use down-forward plus hard kick to get near them and perform a normal slam immediately!
4) Occasionally, perform your Flying Barcelona Attacks as a air slam, cross or overhead to irritate them more! Opponents love to jump directly up and use HK or HP to stop this attack, so just "fly" to the centre first by pushing the joystick up after bouncing off the wall and then immediately push the joystick towards opponent for a burst of speed to slice at them. By doing so, their jump up + HK/HP would be exhausted before you slice at them.
Cheers! Go try these 4 steps and conquer the game!
Posted by Tizoc on January 12, 2009 at 4:05 a.m. #10
Say how do you do DF+HK then combo with a backflip?
Posted by noobzor on February 10, 2009 at 7:37 p.m. #11
How do you do a kara throw? Cant do it
Posted by jakey_J on February 11, 2009 at 1:06 a.m. #12
id say im a pretty good vega player but i just cant hit the diagonal ex wall dive combo he just keeps going backwards
Posted by axinthevoid on February 14, 2009 at 12:56 p.m. #13
Vega is not one of the worst characters in the game, I don't know where you got that idea from. He's one of the main characters I play with.
Posted by SF4 MONSTARZ on February 15, 2009 at 2:27 a.m. #14
Vega is an animal!!! I always liked him because of his claws and narsisistic attitude! He is another character I will be training with like a mad man!! Thank all Vega fans for all the helpful advice and lets show em' "Vega is a bloody brilliant fighterand he'll kick anybody's butt!" (in the right hands of course)
Posted by Chargi on February 15, 2009 at 2:24 p.m. #15
Ultra/Super can also be executed by DB, DF, DB, UB instead of UF. The only think I hate about it, is when you don't do the motion right, you waste precious EX (at Ultra) :(
Posted by Los on February 18, 2009 at 2:03 p.m. #16
Going to the Game Stop tournament and using Vega but really want to use Fei Long but they might not have Fei Long to choose so playing it safe with Vega and I hope to kick ass playing with Vega
Posted by Dio Brando on February 18, 2009 at 3:51 p.m. #17
Ugh, I have a hell of a time preforming the ultra. I keep using his backflip move.
Posted by Backin93 on February 18, 2009 at 4:21 p.m. #18
All were owned by Me in a Vega suit... From UCI to Riverside to Northridge, ppl pulled their quarters off the machine because they got so pissed... ahhh vega...
Posted by TheWidowMaker on February 18, 2009 at 7:37 p.m. #19
I owned this guy with vega PERFECT... hes a shoto/sagat player... A really good tip i know is that, when you go for the izuna drop.. depending on how fast/where you want to go you can control it with the direction, So example... i do the move, and opponent thinks im coming close... trys to anti air (dragon punch) but i dont go anywhere near him... giving me the opening to pull off a super! experiment with it...its really effective, let me know how it goes... anyone who could give me advise?
Posted by Anon on February 19, 2009 at 4:05 p.m. #20
HELP! CAN'T DO VEGA'S SUPER/ULTRA!
Posted by laz on February 19, 2009 at 8:38 p.m. #21
I cant do it either how do u do it?
Posted by Ken is Lame on February 20, 2009 at 8:18 a.m. #22
I use ps3 and set my 3 kicks to the R1 button.
Charge Down+Away from the opponent.
Quickly Roll to Down+Towards the opponent.
Roll Back to the Down+Away and then cross diagonally into a Up+Towards the opponent.
If you use Hard Kick, it will set up up with the Super Izuna Drop.
If you use the 3 kicks it will set you up to do the ultra.
It's a very hard move to master. But totally worth it.
Posted by z3poxx on February 20, 2009 at 8:21 a.m. #23
I got my copy of SF4 and I did try out one of my SF2 favorites Vega right away and to do his super is not so extremly hard as it seams.
First when charging be sure to charge enough duh...
Then be quite fast when preforming the down-right down-left movment.
Then instead of going up-right go just up worked for me when i was fooling around in challenge mode.
ps. i used a regular 360 controller to pull this off.
Posted by Bridgecrew_Dave on February 20, 2009 at 10:35 a.m. #24
Also for his super and ultra, try Charge down-away, then go down-towards, then just roll a half circle back from down towards to up away and hit your kick.
I've found this is the easiest way to do his specials.
The Ultra still makes me do the backflip 50% of the time though.
Posted by S.O.S on February 21, 2009 at 1:11 p.m. #25
HELP!! I am having difficulty pulling off vega's level fourth trial. Specifically the first one in the set.
1. Jump heavy kick
2. Medium kick
3. Light rolling crystal flash
Posted by Blarg on February 21, 2009 at 2:59 p.m. #26
Bridgecrew_Dave:
The thing about that though is that his ultra won't land if the opponent is too close to a wall, so it's smart to go for the wall they are farther away from.
For example, if your getting caught up in the corner, leaping to the opposite wall instead of half circle to leap to the wall you have your back to is smarter than trying it where it's very likely to miss.
For me I get it about 50% of the time, but I need to practice more because in a real match you can't afford to make mistakes.
Especially with Vega.
Posted by pleasehelp on February 22, 2009 at 1:43 a.m. #27
I agree with S.o.s., the vega trials are very confusing and difficult when they ask you to execute a charge move directly after another attack. For example, how am i supposed to go from a [crouch]LP into a Rolling Crystal Flash? The RCF is (charge)<- , -> , P...so that means you need to be holding back on the D-Pad as you are crouching in order to execute this combo. This is completely impossible, unless there is some method I've never heard of. I dont know if S.O.S. is having the same problem as I am but I could really use some help, thanks!
Posted by Brsrkr on February 22, 2009 at 2:24 a.m. #28
To do the rolling crystal flash after a flying hard kick and a medium punch, you have to hold back and CHARGE while you're already in the air, then calculate the 2 seconds the attack needs and poke the opponent with some claw attacks, then IMMEDIATELY push forward and execute the roll.
If you're not sure about this, just go on Youtube and look for the "Street Fighter 2 Strategy". There are some general combos with each of the characters.
Posted by XD on February 22, 2009 at 10:31 a.m. #29
S.O.S after the Jump heavy kick(or when you are doing it) just press and hold back and down on the d-pad(u are charging for RCF) then do the medium kick after that push forward and press at light punch (that is RCF) or when you are doing the jump heavy kick press and hold back ( charging for RCF ) push at medium kick then forward Light punch. I never played SF4 but it maybe works I did this on street fighter alpha 3.
Posted by Bart on February 22, 2009 at 11:21 a.m. #30
Can I have assistant please is there a cheap move to kill seth with Vega
Posted by Seth is lame on February 22, 2009 at 2:46 p.m. #31
No, there isn't a cheap move that Vega really has.
His ex scarlet terror is a great move if he's putting pressure on you from up close though.
His flips are pretty handy as well.
Posted by Bloody Claw on February 22, 2009 at 4:19 p.m. #32
http://www.petitiononline.com/capcomi...
Posted by The Psycho Spashin Ninja, Jink on February 22, 2009 at 9:15 p.m. #33
I won 2nd place of the 1st round at Calumet City of the Game Stop's national tournaments. On 28 I'll complete on the 2nd round. I use Vega (Claw) and it wasn't too hard to compete. I got defeated by a Ken player. It was a close match, he Hadoken at me, then I failed to do his Ultra and end up jumping at the Hadoken, XD. Lot of fun!
Vega's cross ups and zoning can piss the blood out of anyone.
I used cHP,d(crouching)MP link for punishing and build meter, and canceled the dMP with EX Barcelona Knee or EX Sky High Claw for anti-jump and cross up mix ups.
The other very effective mix up I did was; when ever anyone jump at me to land attack into combo, I'd jump snap at them with MK. Then, when started to interrupt me with their snap jumps, I would then wall under them as they whiffed jump snaps, then punish then in the air behind them with dHP. That leaved me with reset advantage for throw/meaty mix ups.
My favorite link are LK,LK,dMP and cHP,dMP.
And later I did this link combo: land-HK,dMK,LK,dMK. It is sweet if you like link combos a lot but it does 251 damage, which is less than land-HK,cHP,dMP which is 256 damage.
Vega rocks! He's a crazy Spanish ninja!!
Also, by taking off the mask, HP does 132 damage instead 120 as he does with mask on. I will consider playing a more offensive style by using the Focus and EX Focus mix ups, and with mask off.
Play ala Contra, hehehe.
Posted by The Psycho Spashin Ninja, Jink on February 22, 2009 at 9:25 p.m. #34
Correction: ...when THEY started to interrupt me with their jump snaps, I would then WALK under them...
Sorry. :)
Posted by HEKTIK on February 22, 2009 at 11:50 p.m. #35
anyone know where i can get a printable version of this?
Posted by Onyx on February 24, 2009 at 7:21 a.m. #36
When Vega loses his claw he slightly loses attack power for any attacks that use his claw in addition to losing range. This includes his ultra combo. Kicks and throws are unaffected. When he loses his mask his damage for all attacks is slightly increased, but the damage that he receives is noticeably larger. Removing your mask (or refusing to retrieve it after being knocked off) is only really useful if you're pretty confident that you're not going to get hit a whole lot. Even then it isn't really worth using half of your EX meter.
I've tested this in training mode and against other players. If you lose your claw you should probably make an effort to grab it, especially if you plan on doing an ultra combo.
Posted by Blank on February 24, 2009 at 10:21 a.m. #37
So, it says that you can throw your claw at your opponent, but when I do the move vega just tosses his claw up. How is this move useful in any way?
Posted by Bridgecrew Dave on February 24, 2009 at 8:48 p.m. #38
Blank:
Different Strength punches throw the slaw different directions. It's never really that useful though. It's more of a taunting move then anything.
Posted by Tenchi on February 25, 2009 at 12:05 a.m. #39
I always hated vega actually.... Simply because the dude was hard to fight against. Even in the SF2 days. Now I just started playing with him and I have him down already. I used to be a major shoto player until I started using Blanka back in cvs2. I have to say that the main problems I have are with ken. If you dont pay attention and abuse barcelona, you will be punished. I enjoy playing mind games with this guy.
Posted by MRHAMBURGERR on February 25, 2009 at 1:45 a.m. #40
YODALEY-HEE-HOO!
Posted by Blackdealth on February 27, 2009 at 6:34 p.m. #41
Dont think theses combos work
• Jumping Hard Punch, Standing Hard Punch, Link into Crouching Medium Punch, Cancel into EX-Wall Dive •
The EX-Wall Dive will not connect if your opponent is crouching.
• Level 2/3 Saving Attack, Dash Cancel, forward plus Medium Kick, forward plus Hard Kick, down plus Hard Kick •
Posted by Blackdealth on February 27, 2009 at 6:35 p.m. #42
Also does any one else find it hard 2 go int focus after a slide?
Posted by blackdealth on February 27, 2009 at 7:58 p.m. #43
sorry about that that this works but not in the corner
Jumping Hard Punch, Standing Hard Punch, Link into Crouching Medium Punch, Cancel into EX-Wall Dive •
The EX-Wall Dive will not connect if your opponent is crouching
Posted by Todd S. on February 28, 2009 at 5:25 p.m. #44
Here's a nifty combo I found:
Lv. 2/3 Focus -> FADC -> c.MK -> Light Scarlet -> EX Scarlet
Posted by CoL on March 6, 2009 at 4:03 a.m. #45
If you are trying to do vegas ultra or super you need to use the analog stick. Its too hard to pull off with the dpad.
Posted by Rudy C on March 6, 2009 at 8:26 p.m. #46
what i do his special with the dpad son .... col its easier on the dpad and...... F*** Sagat
Posted by Trill on March 6, 2009 at 10:25 p.m. #47
man that last combo on his 4th trial is crazy I can't figure out when they want me to charge for the barcelona thing it's like focus attack, diagonal forward down HK, then EX barcelona into izuna drop, I guess you can start charging with the focus attack but when you have to hit the HK part I seem to lose it, I did pull the jump off once but it might have been too slow...;_;
also when you do his flip forward into ex flip forward attack do you have to charge for the second one? I did but i just barely pulled it off but I saw in a video a guy did it much quicker
Posted by carb on March 7, 2009 at 10:26 a.m. #48
As far as the 4th trial goes, you should charge the EX barcelona from the moment you input dwn+fwd+HK. During the juggle state, if you've been holding dwn+fwd+HK and just before the opponent hits the ground, finish with up+fwd+(kk). You should know what to do from there.
Posted by Shanic on March 7, 2009 at 4:28 p.m. #49
I can't pull off hard trial numero 2 I can do it up to light crouching kick bu then when I get to light scarlet terror followed by ex scarlet terror they wont connect.
So I do
Jump heavy punch
Crouch light punch
crouch light kick
-DAN BLOCKS HERE-
light scarlet terror IS BLOCKED
and ex scarlet terror hits.
am I doing it too slow or something? :(
Posted by The Psycho Spanish Ninja, Jink on March 8, 2009 at 3:01 a.m. #50
Claw's trails are not that hard.
Canceling RC into Su is very, but very awesome.
At first, I thought that Claw's Bloody High Claw was quite useless. But now, I'm landing it more than my opponents landing me their Uc. I just do the same meta game reaction I use for anti air mix ups, but with move charged.
;)
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on March 8, 2009 at 3:09 a.m. #51
W00t! i completed vega normal trial mode i
never thought i would get pass lv 4 firtst part
i kept tryin then i threw my mask off and i
was able to do the combos but hard trial
IS TOO HARD!! LOL
Posted by et on March 8, 2009 at 1:01 p.m. #52
hell yea, im stuck on hard trial level 4!!! help me!!!
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on March 8, 2009 at 11 p.m. #53
WHAT vega trail not that hard well it is easy but the first
combo to do on lv4 is a bitch! dan would block your Rolling Crystal Flash all night.
Posted by Anonymous on March 9, 2009 at 8:59 p.m. #54
Thanks for the info on Vega, but I'm somewhat disappointed that he's considered low-tier, although nobody gives a rat's arse about Dan being the worst in the console version. I was also worried that I may have to switch over to Sagat because he is considered the best character in the game.
Posted by Vega rules on March 13, 2009 at 4:46 p.m. #55
@ #54. you would switch to top tier...
Posted by anonymous on March 14, 2009 at 1:57 a.m. #56
where is the story page for vega?????????????? everyone else has one.....whats up with that??????
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on March 15, 2009 at 12:59 p.m. #57
almost won the Regional championchip with my vega... so close but ah well ima make sure to win next time, with enough work hes a decent and fun character to use aside from ryu, Sagat, Gief, and Balrog which is all that I saw at my tourny
Posted by The Psycho Spanish Ninja, Jink on March 15, 2009 at 5:41 p.m. #58
For me, the only evident weakness Vega has is his hit priority. Vega get easily gets traded or hit on those situation.
As for not having a reliable anti air attack, you can always dash under jumping opponents and punish their whiff with dHP (110 damage).
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on March 15, 2009 at 8:59 p.m. #59
@ The Psycho Spanish Ninja
I always found that scarlet terror was good for trading hits in the air because you could hit the ground no matter what situation you were in before them and set them up for all sorts of shenninagans... but ya he has zero move priority with any of his moves, but whats bad is that once vega gets knocked down its pretty difficult to get someone off of you for a good while, excellent defense is the key for him to set up his excellent offense.
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on March 16, 2009 at 3:23 p.m. #60
@ x Who Is Aplha
It's not hard to get someone off of
you when knocked down when getting back up
don't rush your Scarlet Terror just crouch back (but watch out for unexpected throw)let your opponent throw some shots while blocking in the middle of that SCARLET TERROR!
there you go lol why i soon after that i izuna drop them when they get back up.They just block.
Posted by London Dry on March 17, 2009 at 8:11 a.m. #61
Was experimenting with the anti-air flip kicks and found that light kick works in that situation as well and for juggles it's actually always better to go from light kick.
The damage breakdown for anti air scarlet terror
lk -> 100
mk ->hit 1 = 60, hit 2 = 80, total =140
hk -> hit 1= 60, hit 2 = 100, total = 160
EX -> hit 1 = 70, hit 2 = 110, total = 180
Since the mk and hk juggles only can get the first hit of each, the max for any combination of those two is only 120, meaning you're better off doing each as a stand alone 2 hit combo over the juggle, Light kick always gets 100 since it's 1 hit so lk to mk is as good as a 2 hit hk. When you do the lk to EX it counts it as the second hit of the EX so you get 100 plus 110 for a total of 210 damage, the best by a good margin.
So here are your best options for scarlet terror anti-airs, assuming you do get stuffed due to lk lower priority.
with one bar:
LK to EX = 210
just EX 2 hit = 180
no bars of super:
HK = 160, damage ties with lk to mk or lk to hk but it's easier and safer just to hk and save the charge for something else. I think I've tested all the combinations of anti air flip kicks the game allows but if you think I left one out I'll give it a shot.
Posted by Blackdealth36k on March 18, 2009 at 2:56 p.m. #62
If u ever wanna fight the best Vega Palyer Hit Me Up No Joke Was Ranked In The Top 1000 Players until i left my bro with the game for a weekend Gamertag BlackDealh36k
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on March 18, 2009 at 11:18 p.m. #63
@ Blackdealth36k-
I'll take your challenge lets see how good you really are i will post back to say who is the winner if i do lose anyway.
>: )
Posted by Etudahart (xboxlive) on March 19, 2009 at 1:51 p.m. #64
Vega is the best Char in this game to me along with Abel. I use a couple of killer stategy's to win with Vega and they work every time.
1. Vega's Flying Barcalona's cross up wirks almost everytime... and after doing it 3 times, it throws ur opponents game plan out the window. Also fake the flying barcalona and hug the wall to also scare ur opponent out of their ballgame.
2. Fierce punch has great reach and damage, dance with ur distance and strike with it like Ali's jab
3. EX barcalona works everytime with the proper body language. After dropping an opponent, if they see a crouching vega there first thought is to jump in. as soon as ur opponent stands use ur EX bacalona and catch with the Izuna drop. (my favorite move) ALOT of damage.
4.Body language can get u half their energy bar EASY. after dropping ur opponent one... walk back to look like ur retreating.. but when ur opponent gets up low fierce slide for good damage. Dumb opponents can get caught swith this around 2 or 3 times.. to switch it up walk in on the opponent to intice there attacks but when they get up use the short back flip to parry Uppercuts, supers, and grabs all day. I usually come back with a grab after this. after doing these steps several times ur opponent is scared while getting up, which makes for an easy grab everytime. Its all a mind game and vega is very scary.
5. use ur back flip to go through fireballs, also to make the opponent react with a fire ball or a jump or even a taunt. Coming out of a back flip use ur ultra to punish their confidence.
Im Etudahart on XboxLive rank 1422 . ill take on any challenge. Great website madude.
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on March 19, 2009 at 3:08 p.m. #65
Im back with results......
Well i got my ass kicked five times in a row are matches were close but i coudnt get the final kill he is a great vega user so thats that.
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 19, 2009 at 3:28 p.m. #66
Good advice Etudahart....2 be really good with vega u gotta have different styles with him always thrwing ur opp off esp in 5 round matches I think im so good with vega because im very aware of what my opponent can do from ken to Gen
Posted by London Dry on March 20, 2009 at 10:25 a.m. #67
The jumping fierce punch, close standing hp, link to crouching mp cancel into EX wall dive (izuna drop) is character specific. Some characters require a crouching lp linked in place of the crouching mp due to the mp having too much push back. Also you can start it with a jumping hk for roughly the same damage.
Medium punch link works on:
Abel, Sakura, Rose, Zangief, Rufus, C. Viper, Sagat, Balrog, Guile, Dhalsim, Chun Li and Cammy
the lp link works on:
Gen, Fuerte, Bison, Vega, Fei Long, and Gouken
Some characters are questionable whether is works on them at all, they are:
Honda, Blanka, Ryu, Dan, Akuma and Ken
Tested by Aegis Neglector (on SRK) and witnessed by London Dry
* Also the part about not hitting a crouching opponent is a fallacy because the close standing hp will stand up any character from a crouch.
Posted by The Psycho Spanish Ninja, Jink on March 21, 2009 at 5:24 a.m. #68
Vega can combo jHK or jHP into dfHK by hitting the opponent's foot with jHK or jHP.
Vega can also combo Focus2~BackDash~Ultra. It does about 400+ damage.
Vega can Focus2~FowardDash~cHP~dMP~ExBarcelona~Izuna.
Posted by Phinny on March 21, 2009 at 12:29 p.m. #69
@ #68
First combo you described isnt a combo at all. its just a convenient link.
Second, the ultra alone does about 500, however, I guess the focus might be a good setup and assure you that the ultra will hit.
Third one however sounds pretty useful. Gonna have to try that one out.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 21, 2009 at 7:20 p.m. #70
Umm...no offense, Phinny, but are you suggesting that just because something is a link it doesn't qualify as a combo??? I don't know if you've noticed, but the brunt of SFIV's combo system is link-based. So, according to your logic none of said combos are combos at all -- they're just "convenient links". Eye r confoozed...
Posted by al2k on March 21, 2009 at 8:48 p.m. #71
need help getting the izuna drop in stead of the claw attack. any good tip out there?
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 21, 2009 at 8:56 p.m. #72
Depends: are you trying to Izuna after an EX Wall Dive or a normal Wall Dive?
Posted by al2k on March 21, 2009 at 10:04 p.m. #73
it was much easier to get the drop in remix
Posted by Chompy on March 21, 2009 at 11:37 p.m. #74
Vega is god in this game. leaping kick link with EX-Flying Barcelona Attack & Izuna Drop is sick, and it's better if you take of your mask(when you don't have the mask, you do more damage).
Posted by dave on March 22, 2009 at 1:03 a.m. #75
it should be noted that vega's bloody high claw ultra does in fact, NOT do much chip damage at all. it does about as much chip damage as a haduken. and its not safe at all when blocked, since vega bounces back, easily allowing for the opponent to punish with their ultra
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 22, 2009 at 1:41 a.m. #76
Guys, there seems to be a misconception that Vega is best played without his gear (or at least his mask). I can't stress enough how wrong this theory is! Vega's defense is none too spectacular as it is, so he needs all the assistance that he can get. I am very new to EventHubs, but I've been posting on SRK for years. I've been playing at high-level for quite some time, and there is a very big difference between casual play and tourney play. I'm not saying meaning to sound pompous or uppity -- I'm sure plenty of you also play at tourney level, as well. Anyway, my point is that removing your gear is best kept in fun matches against friends. It's much like taunting: it serves no real purpose despite the damage boost. Vega is more than capable of inflicting the damage he needs without show-boating too much in the process. I've been reading a lot of the comments thus far, and I've seen a very eclectic collection of strategies and tricks. There is, of course, a preferred way to ascertain victory given his limited damage output and less-than-desirable defense.
- First and foremost: DO NOT GET RID OF HIS GEAR!!!!!
- Vega's pokes are still the core of his strategy.
- Not all opponents are created equal: projectile characters are fought very differently than grapplers, rushers-down, and fellow pokers. EX High Claw is really the only version that should be used, as it safely and reliably goes through projectiles.
- Vega's Ultra goes through projectiles as well, but given the daunting punishability of it, it should generally only be used from full-screen. This way, Vega is already close to the side of the screen, cutting valuable milliseconds off of the actual animation of the move.
- Both EX Scarlett Terror and EX Wall Dive are quite vulnerable on start-up. It's not particularly useful to use them as wake-ups, especially against Shoto types.
- Vega's kara throw is much more valuable than people give credit. Two cr. LK's will put Vega at just the proper space to utilize the kara.
- x3 attack back-flips are AMAZING in this game. They will go through pretty much anything that any opponent can throw at you.
Again, I'm not meaning to come across as some know-it-all jerk, because I'm far from perfect. This is simply a compilation of tactics that I've gathered after using Vega personally and watching high-level Japanese footage. Vega is definitely not one for big, flashy combos. He's a rather straight-forward character that should be played in a fairly utilitarian manner, much like Guile.
Posted by de bunk da junk on March 22, 2009 at 8:29 a.m. #77
@ Etudahart
hey you still playing?
im a add you and we'll have a game or two hey :-)
Posted by de bunk da junk on March 22, 2009 at 8:33 a.m. #78
hey i really want to try something out...anyone wanna play? you have to be vega. im gonna be guile. i get the feeling guile will kick his a** because guile has crazy cool recovery time on some moves
Posted by Mike on March 22, 2009 at 10:07 a.m. #79
This is beyond a joke... I considered myself to be at least an average Vega player, preferring him to the other spam characters..
But his trial takes the piss :(. I simply cannot do his 4th trial, even the 1st part. I charge for plenty of time in the jump, land both kicks, but on the 50% of the tries he DOES the damned RCF, Dan just blocks it... Seriously, wtf??
Posted by al2k on March 22, 2009 at 10:27 a.m. #80
I'm tring to get the izuna drop consistantly on my opponent whether they are standing or crouching(not jumping), but instead the claw attack seem to come out more often leaving me open if i whiff or its blocked. In sfft remix the drop was easier to do. the funny thing is that it easier to do his triple izuna drop super consistantly. Wierd.
Posted by Phinny on March 22, 2009 at 3:20 p.m. #81
@ #70 aegis
Its only 2 attacks though that just happen to link together. its one link. if it was 2 attacks that just juggled the person, I would call it a juggle. if it was a move that canceled one attack into another, I'd call it a cancel. However, if you use a combination of these together, I'd call it a combo. I consider combos to be 3 or more attacks/2 or more links/cancels/juggles together.
No offense...
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 22, 2009 at 9:16 p.m. #82
Back @ Phinny: no offense taken, but regardless of what you, personally, consider a combo the fact remains. This is a very fundamental concept that's been around since the dawn of fighting games. If you can string two or more attacks the likes of which your opponent cannot block together successively it is a combo...period. Whether it's due to a chain property or a link property, it's still, by definition, a combo. When you perform the aforementioned link (jumping HP/HK -> Cosmic Heel) the game's combo counter will register two consecutive hits, thus making it a combo. Again, regardless of what you perceive to be a combo, if the game says it's a combo, then it's a combo. Furthermore, from Cosmic Heel you can cancel into EX Wall Dive or simply reset for a mix-up. I mean...I don't really know how much more black-and-white to make it for you, bro. lol I'm not really sure I understand your logic here.
Anyone else, please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If you can come up with some profoundly astute reason that explains how I'm misinformed in my statement, I'm all ears...err, eyes, rather.
Posted by London Dry on March 23, 2009 at 3:31 a.m. #83
Aegis Neglector is completely correct about this combo debate. It's a branching type hierarchy. A combo is the broadest term that encompases chains, links, cancels, targets, juggles or any combination thereof. The types of things that make up the combo have no effect on the set of moves being a combo; 2 links are just as much a combo as 2 links canceled into something or those same links used to set up a juggle.
Posted by Anonymous on March 23, 2009 at 10:10 p.m. #84
@ Vega Rules:
What if I keep getting creamed by Sagat, Rufus and Zangief players while I use Vega? Especially since that they're considered some of the best characters to use (with Sagat being the top).
If I'm going to use Vega, then I would need to find a way to counter their strategies and prove them wrong.
(My apologies for this comment, because I am a newbie here).
Posted by ZombieRommel on March 23, 2009 at 10:28 p.m. #85
Here's what I've found vs Sagat:
Do Flying Barcelona Crossups whenever you can... soon a good Sagat player will catch on and begin doing the Tiger Uppercut to stop you though... here is where your mixup game is critical. When he starts doing this, just do your Flying Barcelona off the wall but DON'T go near Sagat. Just land on the ground at about sweep distance. He will do the uppercut and whiff at which point you can press down and Fierce whenever he's coming down from it and hit him with your claw at a good range.
Sky-High Claw: do NOT use the regular one. He can easily hit you out of it with his fireballs. Use the EX version to fly through the fireballs and slash the overpowered bastard in the face. Expect a Tiger Uppercut upon wakeup if you're close to him after the Sky-High Claw. Use a variation of PPP and KKK flips to get distance away from him. Do NOT fight him up close. That is what he wants. Instead keep a distance with the flips and with the Barcelona jump and bait him into attacking with feint Barcelonas while occasionally doing the real Barcelona cross-up.
If he starts to get really aggressive and chase you while you're flipping away, charge down-back for Scarlet Terror to knock him out of his jumps. Mix in a crouching MP or a slide if you're daring whenever he starts to aggressively chase you as you're likely to get a counter-hit on him.
As for Rufus, I haven't played enough of them to comment. Zangief is still giving me problems simply because Vega takes so much damage from him. I can him him 20 times and all he has to do is hit me 4 times and piledrive me and I'm dead. The most effective strategy so far has been to poke him with crouching MP/ standing FP with the occasional Sky-High Claw thrown on. Backflip away from him while charging down for the Flying Barcelona (to get away from him, not to attack him. Use EX Sky-High-Claws and use Scarlet Terror if the player you're fighting likes to jump into you to do the piledriver. Whatever you do, DON'T get cornered as you are basically toast if that happens.
Posted by ZombieRommel on March 23, 2009 at 10:32 p.m. #86
I do have a question: What is the most effective motion for the Ultra? It is a giant bitch for me to execute this move consistently. Half the time I flip, and half the time I do EX Barcelona jumps. :\
Posted by London Dry on March 23, 2009 at 11:12 p.m. #87
@ ZombieRommel I suggest using the shortcut motion from SF II that I stated in the HD Remix Vega thread "Instead of charge DB, DF, DB, UF, Kick then direction + Punch when close, you can charge DB, go to DF and then make a 3/4 circle backwards ending at UF. Spelled out that means charge DB, go to DF, D, DB, B, UB, U, Uf+Kick then direction + P. It is technically more inputs, but it's less jerky than the old school way." Note that this is for the cross up version of the old super, of course now for the Ultra you need to input 3 kicks instead of one. Also the ultra is usually best done off your own wall, in that case, stop at up back for this shortcut motion.
Posted by London Dry on March 23, 2009 at 11:23 p.m. #88
Zangief can get hit by Ex flying barcelona and ultra pretty much anywhere on screen which means if you play it smart you can punish whiffs with them. A smarter use of the EX barcelona would be to cancel it out of a crouching medium kick or punch into an opposite wall Izuna drop for only 10 less damage than a cosmic heel into Ex izuna for a less risky lead-in. The keep away poke gameplan is definitely a good way to go though.
Posted by ZombieRommel on March 24, 2009 at 12:55 a.m. #89
Thanks London, I will try that method.
Do you think that vegas LP and LK are good for anything? I tend to mash on them when the opponent gets in my face if I can't do anything else.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 24, 2009 at 11:43 a.m. #90
@ Anonymous: Never, EVER apologize for asking a question, ESPECIALLY when you're new. Even the best players in the world asked/ask questions and were new at one point. :)
Anyway, definitely take heed ZombieRommel's advice on Sagat. Just be careful: as he said, a good Sagat player will eventually catch on to your Barcelona Attack cross-ups, so you sometimes want to pull up short to make them whiff. At the same time, however, if they're a good Sagat they'll also be expecting things like that. Often times, Sagat will simply wait until the last, possible second to see where you're going to go, then decide what the appropriate course of action is. If you attempt the cross-up they can Tiger Uppercut. If you fake and land in front of him, he can simply use any ranged low poke into free combo or just standing HK. Just be careful and use caution with whatever tactic the situation calls for.
@ ZombieRommel: Both are FANTASTIC pokes. Remember that cr. LP links into cr. MP as well as into itself. Close, standing LK is a surprisingly good move that can beat quite a bit up-close.
Posted by Phinny on March 24, 2009 at 1:09 p.m. #91
@London
You can stop at UB when you're making the back circle motion. You don't need to continue to U, UF. It still works, and it makes you jump behind, so it's actually to your advantage.
I use a 360 controller to do this (no money for stick =/)
I just do it all in 2 smooth motions
Hold DB, then move the stick to D, DF, then bring it back up to D, DB, B, UB + Left trigger (all kicks).
Posted by London Dry on March 24, 2009 at 6:44 p.m. #92
@ Phinny: I was actually referring to the motion used to go to the opposing wall. You're correct: you can stop at UB, however this will cause Vega to jump to his wall. If you want to do a cross-up Super/Ultra, then you can stop at UF.
Posted by Phinny on March 24, 2009 at 7:28 p.m. #93
Any advice on how to play against cheap tactics? Anyone?
Anything against Ryu, KEN, Guile, and Zangief would be MUCH appreciated.
A kid playing Zangief killed me today, and he just spammed that spinning move. I just couldn't get away. I tried spamming all 3 punches on wakeup, but he'd always be next to me when I finished flipping, and I'd be vulnerable. Next thing I know, he has me up against a wall, my mask and claw are gone, and I die in 2 more hits. I did try doing low attacks and his sweep to neutralize him, but for some reason, I still got hit. It was also kinda hard to get a flying barcelona attack off on him when he did the spinning. I felt like such a noob. Didn't help that he set the rounds to 1 either <_< ruined my 12 win streak =/ Playtime for me on SF4 says 90 hours. that kid probably has 2. Is playing lowest tier really worth it with all these obvious imbalances? Sure, when you kill a sagat, you rejoice, but then that moment can be short lived.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 24, 2009 at 9:25 p.m. #94
@ Phinny and everyone else that's wondering: First of all, tier should have no impact on whether or not you play a character. No one, and I mean NO ONE, is anywhere close to what, say, Sean was in 3rd Strike, and yet some people still played him. Why? Because that's who they enjoyed. I'm not saying you shouldn't sample all of the metaphorical flavors that Street Fighter Robbins ice cream has to offer, but more important than any tier listing is the amount of pleasure that you derive from playing with a character that suits your play-style. :)
That said, Gief is ALWAYS going to give Vega trouble. The fact is Vega simply does not have the tools needed to make him a viable threat to Gief. Barcelona Attacks, whether they be frontal or cross-up, are virtually useless due to his Lariat, and the same notion applies to Sky Claw. Jumping in is also out of the question for the same reason. Should you somehow successfully land a jump-in, hope that the Gief player stepped away to have a piss or something, because if you slip up even the SLIGHTEST in your follow-up combo or try to tick-throw you're inevitably staring down the throat of an SPD -- it's just the nature of the beast (literally).
So what's the bad news, you ask? Well, Vega has to rely on his low-damage, weeny pokes to even fathom ascertaining victory in this match-up. Long range pokes are vital to your survival. This entales cr. MP, standing HP, max-range cr. HK, and standing HK. Gief is going to be applying pressure -- that's just how it is. This is very likely going to cause the loss of your gear...multiple times. Stay calm. Don't panic and feel as though the round is automatically over. While you want to retrieve your gear as quickly as possible you don't want to get killed in the process. Maintain your poking regimen, and keep him at a safe distance. Try to constantly be storing a charge, because if you happen to land cr. MP you can instantly cancel into EX Barcelona Attack for some much-needed damage. Upon landing, you can pick up any gear that's close, but, again, don't let this concern ruin what footing you have at this point. A common misconception is that x3 P is a good escape tactic against Gief. BZZZZZZ!!! Wrong!!! Because Vega takes so long to flip Gief has more than ample time to retaliate with an EX Green Hand without even walking forward first. If you're going for an SPD bait you're better off using the x3 K flip. This way the Gief player has a much smaller window of opportunity to punish your escape attempt. From max distance, Vega's LP and MP Crystal Flash Rolls can be used to begin a low block string, though it's risky at best. If Gief tries to jump in on you EX Scarlett Terror might be your best defense. Worst case scenario it will trade, but you will get the knock-down.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 24, 2009 at 9:28 p.m. #95
cont'd...
Unfortunately, there is no lather-rinse-repeat system for beating a good (or scrubby, for that matter) Gief player. You must always keep your wits about you, and play smart. Capitalize on any mistakes to achieve combo damage here and there, and, for the love of God, do NOT go toe-to-toe with him!!! I know it sounds hopeless, but this fight can go your way with practice and patience.
Sorry for the insanely long-winded response, guys. I know I didn't encompass the aforementioned projectile characters, but if need be I'll come back to them. In the meantime, take heed my advice: it might save Vega's life. ;)
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 25, 2009 at 9:19 a.m. #96
Vega Lovers...hahha.. I just hit a milestone today and hit an 8 hit combo with Vega..on the verge of putting video on youtube..gotta get my cpu back tho..havent heard anyone say that b4 so I must be the first even tho i'm not probably...also thought i found a way to combo into the ultra it just wont go tho i'll keep trying tho
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 25, 2009 at 4:38 p.m. #97
@ Blackdealh36k: I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but someone beat you to it, bro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c32b6W...
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 26, 2009 at 2:54 p.m. #98
MAn ya'll sure that video is real its a lil blair witch...
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 27, 2009 at 2:46 p.m. #99
@ Blackdealh36k: Ummmm......why, because you can't do it? lol No offense, bro, but can you do Urien's advanced knee-drop unblockables? Can you do Yun's "Keeper Jin" combo? Can you do Bison's "Paint the Fence" or Sakura's "Sho-sho" combo? All I'm saying is just because you can't personally do something it doesn't automatically mean that it's all trap-doors and mirrors. I mean, I consider myself to be a pretty well-rounded fighting gamer, but if I thought that everything I couldn't do was fake, well....let's just say there would be a LOT of fake crap. lol
I'm confused: what, exactly, makes you think that this video is so illegitimate? I'll go through and break it down for you step by step if you need me to.
Posted by al2k on March 27, 2009 at 6:21 p.m. #100
Claw's air-throw is dangerous! Now i got to master the izuna drop on the wall! HEEEEEEEEE!
Posted by Panda on March 27, 2009 at 9:22 p.m. #101
Vega's no longer worst in the game! Both Dan and Rose are considered worse now, yay!
Posted by Chompy on March 27, 2009 at 9:48 p.m. #102
What is the best "get off of me" attack that Vega has?
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 28, 2009 at 12:22 a.m. #103
@ Chompy: He doesn't really have one, honestly. The only time that you can use his EX Scarlett Terror as a "get off me" tool is when you're waking up when your opponent is at the top of their jump-in. Other than that just be ready to counter-poke and counter-throw when the time comes.
Posted by Aronnik on March 28, 2009 at 1:34 p.m. #104
@Chompy
If by "get off of me" you mean they're really close up on ya, Id just use crouchin pokes. You can do 3 lights, and finish it with a medium all in combo, and that puts them a safe distance from you.
@Aegis Neglector to Blackdealh36k
Thats pretty judgmental of you. he was probably showin some sarcasm and hyperbole, and was really commenting on the craziness of the vid. I prolly couldnt do it right off the bat (I maybe could if I broke it down and spent a few hours or so in training =P ; The guy provided the exact movements in the video description), but I don't think its impossible. You don't have to jump to conclusions and say "YOU THINK ITS IMPOSSIBLE BECAUSE YOU THINK YOU'RE ALL THAT AND YET YOU CANT DO IT". You have no idea who he is. You don't have to turn everything into an easy argument for you just so you can win and get bonus points. That's mighty scrubbish.
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 28, 2009 at 3:39 p.m. #105
@Aegis Neglector - I can obviously see that is was done the only think i wanted to see is if it was actually counted as a combo by the game...for ewxample if autoblock was on or not...I love Vega and consider myself one of the top players with him..if theres a combo to be done in game i wanna learn...sorry if i c came off any other way
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 28, 2009 at 4:05 p.m. #106
@ Aronnik: First off, what, other than this, have I apparently turned into an easy argument??? Funny: looking back on my comments up to this point I've done pretty much nothing but HELP people in this thread. I've been courteous, I've been thorough, and I've only posted when I actually had something worth contributing. Frankly, I couldn't give a squirt of piss about impressing people in here, nor do I have a need for "bonus points" -- the guy at the ticket counter informed me that they're all out of whoopee-cushions. I'm here trying to give advice and support, and thus far all I've gotten has been Phinny telling me I don't know what the hell a combo is and Blackdealh36k telling me that I don't post legit videos. You guys on Eventhubs sure have a strange way of showing gratitude.
Second, I was simply going off of his previous post, in which he said: "havent heard anyone say that b4 so I must be the first even tho i'm not probably." See, to ME, that's a lot scrubbier sounding than what I said. To me, that sounds a lot like, "Well, since no one else has posted a video of it, I must be the only person so far that can do it...hehe, just kidding...but not really." Also, why did you go off on some tangent about being able to do it in training mode if you had enough time??? This whole deal here...
"I prolly couldnt do it right off the bat (I maybe could if I broke it down and spent a few hours or so in training =P ; The guy provided the exact movements in the video description), but I don't think its impossible."
...was the most out-of-left-field comment I've read in this thread yet. Kudos.
Well, I guess I've already gone on long enough...plus, I have to go to the bathroom. So, to whom it may concern (especially Blackhealh36k): I'm genuinely sorry. I didn't mean to offend you, nor did I mean anything personal by my comments -- if you knew me, you'd know that's just how I get sometimes. lol Consider it my way of employing "sarcasm and hyperbole"... And thank you, Aronnik, for showing us that you know a Yale-esque synonym for the word 'sarcasm'.
attentive : punctilious
depressed : lugubrious
sneaky : clandestine (we would also accept 'surreptitious')
There are a few more in case your well runs dry...on the house. ;)
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 28, 2009 at 4:35 p.m. #107
you are right probably shouldn't of doubted the video that was very Glib Of me....furthermore...lol he could add another hit to that if he finished off with a slice instead of the Drop......I'm waithing for someone..to find a way to combo into the ultra then i would be impressed
Posted by x Who is Alpha on March 28, 2009 at 8:45 p.m. #108
Im not going to try to sound arrogant here but so far from what ive seen im one of the best Vega players, but thats only from what ive seen. Heres my advice, and by the way im not looking for any retalition from this either, I see how everyone takes advice on here when they dont think its right themselves.
As a vet of vega to take on Gief its all about patience, get your pokes in here and there and keep your defense perfect, if you give him an inch he will take a mile and easily stun or heavily damage you, and im serious about easy stun, it only takes two headbutts to stun vega. I use the heavy claw in the air to beat the lariat believe it or not, if you jump ahead of time and position your claw to be right on the center of his body it will be the lariat every single time due the distance you have with that attack, and also on a side note it also beats blanka's electricity everytime. But ya gief is all about patience and anything you can possibley combo whenever you find the moment. I know im being very vague about the combos and thats because in most situations that your in you'll find yourself just at the very tip of the poking distance so only certain combo's will reach.
For facing sagat, pretty much just being cautious always works, never jump unless you have the advantage as in he's been tripped or is flat on the ground. Using the Izuna drop is pretty easy on him too due to his hitbox being enormous. Your ultra is also very useful on him as well since he always uses his projectile in just about every situation. The fierce claw isnt really that useful in the air since he has the insanely prioritized tiger upper cut, but MP+ light Crystal Flash tends to catch Sagat players off gaurd.
That is my advice but if you want a real demonstration you can add me on xbl my gamertag is x Who Is Alpha. I can give you a brief Tutorial on Distancing and other tactics.
Posted by Chompy on March 28, 2009 at 9:27 p.m. #109
@ x Who Is Alpha
thanx for the advice, there is something i need to ask that makes me confused. in one part you said that you used "Heavy claw" and in other you said "The Fierce Claw". witch one is Heavy punch? and what is the other?
Ohh and sure i would add you to xbl so you can show me a move or 2. you learn new stuff every day, i always say. but i need to get xbl first. lol
Posted by Aronnik on March 28, 2009 at 11:14 p.m. #110
@Aegis Neglector
I'm sorry I made you write an essay lol. Was a good read. Your profs and/or mom would be proud. 99/100 (no bibliography)
@Chompy
Fierce claw = heavy claw. I forget which ones specifically, but some fighters use light medium and heavy instead of light medium fierce
@x Who is Alpha
I tried doing fierce claw against blanka's lightning, but it never works. I spent about 15 mins with blanka playing back lightning, and me jumping at him with fierce claw at many different heights. Never worked. Only thing I know against Blankas lightning is Fierce low kick standing a distance away from him, and medium crouched punch (again a little far away, but still tricky to land).
Posted by Phinny on March 28, 2009 at 11:32 p.m. #111
@ Aronnik
You're so mean :P and by claw you mean punch, right? just trying to verify.
@ Aegis Neglector
Aw man you're giving the community too much credit! Dont assume the community hates you just because 2 people go against you in one insignificant little instance! The community <3s you and your halp.
--------------
Also! I was able to land an izuma drop on a Blanka doing electricity, but I havent been able to since. So I do think there are some ways to beat that besides being on the ground all the time.
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on March 29, 2009 at 7:44 a.m. #112
Woops sorry, didnt mean to say claw, guess I use vega a little too much lol
@arronik
The heavy claw beats it. The only situation I would use this tactic though is when someone is attempting to reversal with blanka, it beats his upwards roll most of the time and the electricity everytime if you time it right. If you want a demonstration i'll show ya. Also if your on the ground already a heavily crouch kick will beat it everytime so long as your at an appropriate distance.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 29, 2009 at 9:34 a.m. #113
@ Moronnik:
Well, ya know. I had to put those advanced rhetoric classes to good use, otherwise my mommy wouldn't have let me keep taking karate lessons. However, I'm glad you were able to derive some amount of enjoyment from it even though I didn't include full-color pictures to assist in your understanding. In case you didn't catch it, again, that was me using a heiper-bowlee (no bibliography...whatever the hell that means).
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 29, 2009 at 9:39 a.m. #114
OHHHHHHHHH!!!! Now I've got it!! "No bibliography," like, that's why I only got 99 instead of 100! Ahh, hahahaha! Now THAT was clever, hommie. *Whew* I almost let that gem get past me!
Posted by Chompy on March 29, 2009 at 5:47 p.m. #115
I always use EX-Flying Barcelona Attack on Blanca's lightning, and it always works. but you have to be at exactly 90○ over him.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 30, 2009 at 8:50 a.m. #116
Hey, guys, I just discovered something about Vega's EX Barcelona Attack in the corner. I don't know if I'm just regurgitating something that's already been stated prior to this post, but London Dry and I found that outside of ground cross-up shenanigans there is virtually no reason to ever use Vega's claw follow-up. We found that even in the corner you can make the Izuna Drop work if you employ the proper trick. To do this, perform the EX Barcelona Attack, but instead of immediately holding towards your opponent delay the forward input until they have fallen down directly beside Vega. This will cause Vega to "hover" next to the wall giving you ample time to space the throw correctly. When your opponent is next to you THEN hold towards them and press punch. This will keep you from going past them or over them in the air. Hope this helps. :)
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 30, 2009 at 9:07 a.m. #117
Also, here is another combo that does decent damage with no meter expenditure:
Focus Attack (lvl. 3) -> Cosmic Heel -> HK Scarlett Terror (316 damage)
Of course, using a lvl. 2 or counter-hit Focus Attack will work just as well, but it does significantly less damage.
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 30, 2009 at 9:03 p.m. #118
@ Aegis Neglector But there is reason too use the claw because if you hold up it hits twice
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 30, 2009 at 9:31 p.m. #119
I'm telling you guys, that's not a wise choice. Go to training mode and check the damage. It doesn't matter if it hits 27 times; the fact is the Izuna Drop does more damage. lol Ultimately, your goal is to deplete your opponent's health, not to see how flashy you can make your combo look. It doesn't make any sense to do a 2-hit move that does less damage than a 1-hit move.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 30, 2009 at 9:36 p.m. #120
EX Barcelona Attack -> Izuna Drop = 200 damage
EX Barcelona Attack -> 2-hit Claw Dive = 190 damage
On top of that, the Izuna Drop will put about 1/4 of a screen away from your opponent. The 2-hit Claw Dive puts you almost an entire screen away from your opponent. I mean, if you really, REALLY just want to use that move, go ahead I guess. It just doesn't seem like that's very smart gameplay, bro.
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 31, 2009 at 12:10 a.m. #121
ok thats it I gotta Kick Ur Ass with Vega....so the board respects my Authority...I really just like how the extra hit Looks..every right up says vegas not a combo character so it feels goood to do 6 7 and 8 hit combos...doesnt more hit helps make ur apponnent dizzy....
Posted by Aegis Neglector on March 31, 2009 at 12:49 a.m. #122
@ Blackdealh36k: It doesn't matter that it does more stun, IF it does more stun (I haven't checked). Vega's goal is not to stun his opponent -- that's not where his ability lies, nor are you generally capable of a relentless enough offense with him to cause a dizzy. However, if you really want to show me how little I know with Vega, feel free to friend me on XBox Live. My name is Aegis Neglector on there, too. I guess just hit me up some time.
Posted by Blackdealh36k on March 31, 2009 at 9:57 a.m. #123
I respect ur Opinon..u do make Alot Of Sense But im Not Gonna Chase U around Line #65 Alreay proves im a Great Player if u wanna play hit me up..I have Nothing else 2 Prove
Posted by andyfilth on March 31, 2009 at 3:11 p.m. #124
hi all. i've always been a vega main, but haven't really played sf seriously since the super turbo days. lots of good advice on here (thanks!), i just need to sharpen up my skills (or get a joystick - i'm sick of accidentally doing a scarlet terror instead of izuna drop/vice versa).
but it's good to see there are actually other people out there who dig the claw - everyone who ever challenged me on the arcades as a kid was ryu, ken or akuma. their derisive remarks pertaining to his sexual orientation as they whooped me still haunt my waking hours. i'm after some "....revenge!" as vega would say.
anyway, i seem to be having major trouble when i face anyone who is throw happy. someone playing as m.bison (who really wasn't very good, except for his throwing ability) cleaned my clock last night cause i'd block his attack only to get thrown - any advice on how to avoid throws, especially when coupled with a cross up? is back-flipping away the best plan?
and does anyone else think they need to increase vega's attack somewhat? i mean, the guy has a friggin' claw and hardly deals any damage with his punches. it's an outrage.
Posted by ljay103 on March 31, 2009 at 4 p.m. #125
tired of playing ryu/ken/sagat etc?
I KNOW I AM!!!!
try GUILE - PSN: LJAY103
Posted by Stitclink on March 31, 2009 at 6:53 p.m. #126
I need help in challenge mode on number 4 normal the first combo i don't understand when or how i am supposed to charge the rolling crystal flash please some on help!!!!
Posted by andyfilth on March 31, 2009 at 6:58 p.m. #127
Stitclink - is that the jumping heavy kick, standing medium into light crystal flash?
if so, begin charging back as soon as you begin jumping in for the heavy kick.
hope that helps.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 2:35 a.m. #128
@andyfilth
My best advice to avoid throws is simply learn to tech them. Since you already recognize the situations that are causing you to get thrown just start inputting your own throw when you feel that is about to happen. Even better is if you can use Vega's kara throw, then if your opponent whiffs their own throw because of misjudging the distance you end up throwing them.
I wouldn't advise backflipping in that situation since if an opponent can recognize and condition you into backflipping when they make you think a throw is coming then they can just hold off and retaliate against the backflip. Teching throws gives you a neutral reset for the situation.
Posted by ove on April 1, 2009 at 4:56 a.m. #129
@ Stitclink
Just do as andyfilth wrote, but it sure is a pain in the ass to pull that combo off! Comparing this "load-combo" to other characters (e.g. balrog) you have to keep back on the controler for a lot longer period of time. I hit balrogs "load-combo" 9 out of 10 times, but with vega it is the opposit 1 out of 10.. But thankfully the rest of the combos in trail 4 is easier to pull off! =)
@ London Dry
What is a kara throw? I also wonder what a tick throw is? I have seen people use both of these terms in this and other forums but have never seen any explenation of them. These terms aren't even listed in the eventhubs street fighter lexicon.. Thanks for the help!
Posted by Vega dance on April 1, 2009 at 6:28 a.m. #130
I find Vega's basic moves are great to use in general then use the specials when you wanna be a little cheeky.
Oh and his dodging backflip move is fun to use when you wanna get your opponent frustrated, hehe!
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:15 a.m. #131
@ ove
A kara throw is when you cancel a normal move that scoots your character forward during its early portion on its beginning frames into a throw. This makes the character slide forward slightly right before the throw adding extra range. With Vega, you press standing HK and then hit throw very quickly, almost as if you're hitting them at the same time but not quite. If you watch Vega's normal standing HK you see he pivots a bit on his toe in such a way that the center point of his model is moved slightly forward. When you do the normal HK he ends up pivoting back to the same position but when you cancel it quickly into a throw you get that little pivot forward right into a throw with next to none of the frames of the HK coming out. That's a kara throw. There's actually a solid explanation of it in the advanced section of the third strike guide on this site.
The easiest way to test if you're getting the technique right is to hit normal throw and watch how your character ends up in the same place as when he/she started the animation, then try the kara throw input, if your character moves forward when the throwing animation comes out then you got the kara throw.
The way I perform the kara throw with Vega is to use my ring finger to hit Hk then sort of roll my wrist quickly and use my thumb and index finger to hit throw.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:15 a.m. #132
A tick throw on the other hand is when you use a quick attack, usually a low LP or low LK to put your opponent in block stun, then throw on the first frame that they recover. When a character is in block or hit stun the cannot be thrown, not even by command throws. This is why you can't combo in to Zangief's SPD etc. Tick attacks are attacks you count on opponents blocking so they are stuck in block stun and can't retaliate, then time it so on the first frame they recover you can throw them. In the HD Remix section labeled intermediate on the site there is again a solid explanation of tick throws. You can also use a combination of a normally non functioning tick set-up into a kara throw to create a tick throw that wouldn't normally work.
Fortunately Vega is a character that demonstrates this perfectly for both examples. For a regular tick throw set up use two crouching LKs wait a spilt second then throw. You know if you did it too early if the throw whiffs or doesn't come out at all. Too late is harder to tell, in training mode it's a guess, in a match you'll probably get hit with some sort of retaliation move. I suggest practicing doing it to early til you hit the sweet spot in training mode and then take it to real gameplay.
Now for a tick into kara. If you do two close standing LKs with Vega and try to throw it will whiff, this is not a matter of timing, it's because those LKs put you out of Vega's throw range. However, if you apply the kara technique it adds enough range to the throw to make the set-up successful.
Hope that gives you all you need for that, if not consult the guides I referenced here, then try the shroryuken.com wiki or come back to me.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:24 a.m. #133
Sorry this is a response to something a way back but:
@ Blackdealh36k
The two hit claw of the flying barcelona does the same stun as the Izuna drop (both 200). Regardless, if Vega has the option of more damage vs. stun you should take the damage every time. He has enough of a hard time dealing damage as it is and that extra 10 points could be the difference between winning with a jab or chip damage on a RCF and losing a match.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:29 a.m. #134
Oh and to be thorough, ticks work out of hit stun as well as block stun but there is a "blocking is safe" mentality that you want to capitalize on here. The rule is block low react high and if you block those two low tick kicks you can still be thrown. I should know, despite being fully aware I still fall for it as do many others, hence what makes it a good tactic.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:29 a.m. #135
Oh and to be thorough, ticks work out of hit stun as well as block stun but there is a "blocking is safe" mentality that you want to capitalize on here. The rule is block low react high and if you block those two low tick kicks you can still be thrown. I should know, despite being fully aware I still fall for it as do many others, hence what makes it a good tactic.
Posted by London Dry on April 1, 2009 at 10:29 a.m. #136
Sorry for the double post.
Posted by Phinny on April 1, 2009 at 2:17 p.m. #137
Hey I'm having a LOT of trouble beating blanka. I guessed wrong when I thought I'd have a leg up when I could get past his lightning. NOPE! now I worry about all his rolls, his 2 for 1 kicks (like guile's low fierce kick, 'cept its mid for blanka) and his sidestep (or hop =/ ) Totally throws my game off. Got perfected on by some guy.
BTW Blackdealh36k and Aegis, I sent messages to you both on XBL. We gotta fight sometime.
Posted by andyfilth on April 1, 2009 at 4:52 p.m. #138
thanks for the advice London Dry, i'll get practicing on those moves tonight.
@ Phinny - some blanka player wiped the floor with me recently too. i had no idea what to do really, since i've never faced a good blanka player before. the only thing i found worked with any effectiveness was throwing out an occasional ex sky high claw and lots of crouching mp and mk work to avoid his electricity.. and just do the occasional flip to throw him off too.
but like i said, i was a shadow of my former self after that fight, so my advice is probably totally wrong.
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on April 1, 2009 at 8:33 p.m. #139
@ Everyone
Blanka has a clear advantage over Vega, but it doesnt mean you cant win, trust me the only way to win is to poke at the life and catch him anytime he decides to roll at the wrong time. I always beat the upwards rolling ball attack with the Fierce Punch in the air, if IM coming down on the blanka player and I know hes gonna do it I always use the claw ahead of time and it beats it. Grabbing and putting pressure is always a good way to win against blanka, the air grab is definatley a great way to throw blanka off since blanka players tend to be very jumpy.
Posted by BlackDealh36k on April 2, 2009 at 6:06 p.m. #140
Im not gonna lie I used to fear blanka till i went to training mode put it on hard and fought him its all about attacking him from the right angles and knowing how to counter his rolls.....now i win about 3 out of 4 matches but with a really elite blank player its still very tough like "Who is Alpha" Said....Can't except friend request right now .... kind of away from my streetfighter sucks 2 a couple days fropm not playing u lose alot of skills
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on April 3, 2009 at 9:11 a.m. #141
One last word of advice, know if your picking vega you never have an advantage over someone else, your always on equal ground or at a disadvantage, this character takes alot of skill to play and even more skill to master. I havent lost in 2 weeks with Vega so im moving onto a different character for now, but just know that it is possible to be great with him, you just have to put tons of effort, go to training mode and see what beats what, trap grabs are a strong plus with him, most people get easily disoriented against him. You just have to play Sporatic and efficient. For now im going to retire vega for a bit and move onto Gouken, Good luck to everyone, but if anyone wants tips or wants to battle my Vega i'll take requests. Im still going to use him to win the tournaments around my area until I get gouken (I really need the money and so far 150 dollars a week from beating everyone is pretty sweet xD). so ya.. you can reach me on my Gamertag which is x Who Is Alpha or on my youtube channel which is xwhoisalpha, dont mind the tournament videos on there lol most of them were from around when I first got the game and was still figuring stuff out.
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on April 4, 2009 at 1:10 a.m. #142
Yep that's a nice move going to Gouken
TO EVERYBODY "x Who Is Alpha" is a beast with Gouken trust me i know this through painful experience facing him lol :(
once he hits you get ready for some nasty long combos on u
and you'll just say "COME ON MAN AT LEAST LET ME HIT U ONCE!"
and his Vega is something to FEAR! lol as not trying to
"DICK RIDE" lol as APLha says "POKE POKE POKE"
Posted by ove on April 8, 2009 at 5:40 p.m. #143
Hey guys, I need some help! I've been playing with vega for a while now and is starting to pick up quite a good game I think. But I have problems fighting some certain characters, espacially cammy!
It seems like it is impossible to harm cammy :S no matter what I do she allways has an answere to it! Her low spiral arrow beats borth rolling crystal flash and scarlet terror, her hooligan throw beats both izuna drop and vegas air throw and all of her moves seems to come out way faster than vegas..
I played for a whole hour on the hardest difficulty setting in arcade mode without beating her. I only won 3-4 rounds in total and lost to quite a few perfects. And usualy I win without having to use any continiues at all when I'm playing with my main char balrog!
I'm desperate! What am I supposed to do to beat cammy with vega?! Which moves and tactics am I supposed to use? I'm grateful for all the help I can get!
Posted by andyfilth on April 8, 2009 at 10:21 p.m. #144
@ ove
i hear you on cammy, she can be a massive pain to beat. i find that using the EX sky high claw is usually not a bad idea (if/when you have it).
learning when to use your throws (ground and air) is essential, because she'll get in close to attack you - just be aware she will attempt to throw you as well, so be quick.
there isn't much point in trying to do a focus attack unless you have her already on the ground, because most of her hits hit twice and they come out quick.
i also use lots of LP rolling crystal flashes because they come out quite quick (and at least give some chip damage if she blocks), followed by MP or MK pokes or a kara throw.
another great move is the leaping kick (down forward and HK) because you can juggle with it if you connect.
i think overall the best strategy is not to get too fancy with special moves, just try and poke her to death with crouching/jumping MP and MK, and only use the special moves if you're certain they'll land. she'll punish you with combos if she blocks anything where vega has a recovery time.
hopefully that's of some help for you. all the best!
Posted by I have the power on April 14, 2009 at 5:10 a.m. #145
I find things very random with Vega, the only character that I'm never sure if I'll win with.
Fun to keep the opponent guessing...
Posted by 232 on April 15, 2009 at 10:51 a.m. #146
what vega considered the worst character in the game? He's FAR from that. He's one of the best imo. You can trick and frustrate the hell outta people once you master him. He's easily one of my top favs in the game.
Posted by saikotik on April 16, 2009 at 11:54 a.m. #147
i love using vega, but i get my ass handed to me when im playing guile. i dont have any problems with anyone else, just guile. guile will meet me in the air constantly and air throw me. any tips? im in dire need of help.
Posted by Masked Nobleman on April 16, 2009 at 11:19 p.m. #148
My main strategy when dealing with Guile is a patience game. You need to wait him out. Guile players are defensive, so if you go in full bore you'll end up eating a Flash Kick. He may throw some Sonic Booms to try to lure you into action, just use the short backslash to open up some space between you, or simply jump the projectile.
Eventually he may start getting fed up with you and then you've got him. Punish jump-ins with Scarlet Terrors, and crossup with the Flying Barcelona when you're safe. Save up some of your super bar for the EX Sky High claw to throw in some damage when he tries to nail you with a Sonic Boom. Try to avoid using your Ultra until he's in a situation where he absolutely cannot defend. Punishing a whiffed flash kick or a bad jump is a good idea.
Stick out the fight, you'll make it. =)
Posted by saikotik on April 17, 2009 at 3:26 p.m. #149
@masked nobleman
this guile was offensive to his max. it was very minimal that guile was in turtling position, and he knew when i was going to slide. the guile player is one of my buddies and one day i just want to thrash him hahaha. he's not your average guile player who turtles and spam sonic booms. he gets me with that upside down HK and flash kicks me. an aggressive guile is rare to see and i want to be able to punish him.
Posted by Anonymous on April 18, 2009 at 10:37 p.m. #150
I got owned by a Balrog user, and I am new to using an Xbox 360 controller.
Is there a way to get past 'Rog's rushdown strategy, as well as being able to make use of the controller so that I can have the advantage? I will give my thanks to the person who can tell me.
Posted by yogi on April 21, 2009 at 7:39 a.m. #151
@anonymous
use vega's flash kick like move to counter rog's charge. if you miss you'll at least get away from it, you might trade damage or take priority but remember that rog has an anti-air game so avoid getting in the air, unless you can knock him in the air and perform an izuna drop which is pretty sweet. his crystal roll is sweet. dont abuse vega's slide either. the rushdown strategy shouldn't be a problem. stay against a wall and make him come to you, charge low and do one of his D,U+K moves. or you can wall jump and punish accordingly.
Posted by mike c on April 22, 2009 at 6:56 p.m. #152
i cannot finish vegas hard trial 5 please anyone know how to finish this?4th hit never goes through
Posted by TH3 JoK3R J on April 23, 2009 at 3:54 p.m. #153
@ mike c, As a person who completed vega trials *sniff* lol
when u doing them light kicks it's not about timing its about how fast u press them once u get to the LK's press the hell out of your LK button it worked 4 me : )
And please dont forget to crouch Mp cause i got pass the 2 LK's and got too excited and forgot crouch mp so yea.
Posted by chopper255 on April 27, 2009 at 6:03 p.m. #154
I disagree with vega being defensive minded. His speed and kicks are extremly efective. Always stay on top of the opponent. Open up with a flying claw. Vegas hard double kick is the best in the game. Jump kick then folollow up with the double hard kick. After 2 combos with this the opponent will be going to bloack. This is when Vegas sweep is extremly effective. This is one of the few sweeps that are "all in". Use sparingly but can keep them off balance due to your agressive play. Whenever knocked to ground supplement vegas rolling attack into double kick....pisses people off
Posted by Masked Nobleman on April 28, 2009 at 11:12 a.m. #155
@chopper255
I agree that Vega can definitely have a strong offensive game. The thing is, it depends on who you're dealing with. When facing characters like Sagat, I find that an offensive strategy is much more effective than a defensive one. Lay on the crossups with the Flying Barcelona, keep pressure after knockdowns (I tend to use the Fierce Rolling Crystal Flash. It's pretty effective), and use your EX Sky High Claw when dealing with projectiles, and you can definitely keep the damage coming.
The problem is when you get into fights with characters that are primary defense. Guile can destroy you if you're not paying attention, and Blanka's defense tactics can be nasty!
Posted by y2k_watts on April 29, 2009 at 5:08 p.m. #156
Havent tried Championship mode yet. Are there alot of Blanka players on it. That is one character who always kicks my ass.
Posted by Masked Nobleman on April 30, 2009 at 8:24 a.m. #157
There are a few Blanka players on Championship mode, but since it's a double-blind select, you don't run into as many as you would in Ranked Match.
You usually end up fighting 8,000 Ryus and Kens as a result of them not being able to tell who you're selecting, but as a result, you can learn to take out shoto players pretty consistantly with all that practice.
Posted by VEGA'S CLAW on May 1, 2009 at 7:44 p.m. #158
great info!!!!!!
Posted by saheykid on May 7, 2009 at 2:59 p.m. #159
for the life of me, i cannot seem to hit the combo to remove the mask. i can remove the claw 95% of the time. what's the difference between removing the mask and the claw in terms of buttons pressed?
Posted by saheykid on May 7, 2009 at 3:08 p.m. #160
nvm, got it >_>
Posted by vegamain on May 8, 2009 at 2:15 p.m. #161
cosmic heal beats out blanka ball if you time it right -- just feel like sharing that tidbit for those who have trouble w/blanka
for cammy if she spiral arrows too close to you grab her, otherwise you should wait for her to cannonspike and then punish
Posted by Prototype909 on May 9, 2009 at 7:45 a.m. #162
The main problem with Vega is that where other characters have at times high damage + low priority or low damage + high priority, Vega has both.
His moves do very little damage, he almost always trades on special attacks or will get overridden entirely. His claw comes off easier than ever before and now his mask can come off (Pretty much means you lose if you get hit by a super or an ultra once it comes off). Not to mention Vega's best advantage in past games was his speed, SF IV slowed down the game itself a WHOLE lot and Vega is worse off because of it (Easier to predict what he's doing when he isn't traveling across the screen at 150mph).
Then there's his Ultra which will hardly ever get any use against higher skilled players due to its limited punishing uses (Even then, that strange 70% angle it goes at makes it miss if they aren't PERFECTLY the right/distance height away. A straight line across the screen would've been better).
So Capcom could fix Vega in three different ways. Make his mask/claw harder to come off (So that he isn't completely helpess on offense without his claw or even worse than before on defense without his mask), give him more priority (So he can actually get people off of him when he gets trapped in the corner), or raise his damage output (So that he can make up for his low priority specials).
Posted by Masked Nobleman on May 9, 2009 at 8:29 a.m. #163
I agree with you completely regarding Vega's priority. It needs a buff to give him a viable way to get out of cornering.
His ultra on the other hand, I have no problems with. I tend to use it defensively, mostly for punishing jumpers or other whiffed attacks. His attacks could stand to do a LITTLE more damage, but it's not to the point that it bothers me.
Posted by Prototype909 on May 9, 2009 at 8:35 p.m. #164
The Ultra thing is more of a pet peeve for me if anything. I just tend to try and be a bit too flash at times and it gets me killed.
Posted by andyfilth on May 10, 2009 at 11:46 p.m. #165
i agree with Prototype909 - my win rate would be vastly improved if vega had any one of those improvements. i pick him probably 90% of the time online, and have around a 46% win rate - but i refuse to change characters. vega is just too awesome, and i'll continue using him until i consistently bust skulls.
i've lost count of the amount of times i've lost because i *just* missed someone with the ultra - you have to be 100% spot on with it. it could stand to have a touch more range.
and unless you're stuck in a corner and jump off the wall you're up against, or they're in the process of jumping at precisely the correct angle, they have way too much time to react. "don't mind me sir, just stand right there and enjoy a cup of tea while i jump onto this wall, do my animation that indicates an ultra is coming, then fly the whole way back across the screen and hit you with it".
Posted by OutrunZeroX7X on May 11, 2009 at 5:40 a.m. #166
vega is a counter character mainly the ultra is for dumb ppl that spam the dragon punch moves basic vega play is to charge while in the air (soon as u jump and even while your doing ur dash claw or the izuna u can be charging what ever charge move) If u want to play a really good vega player play my boi Xaldin32 XBOX LIVE ONLY.
Posted by DSM_GSX_1997 on May 12, 2009 at 11:42 a.m. #167
just a question but i've been playine around in trial.... it took me about 2 hours but i worked the timing down so well that i was able to time an ex/hk scarlet terror into bloody high claw... sorta. pausing at the moment of impact i should definately connect but it's not connecting. it goes right through. i tried modifying it to a lk scarlet terror and i can just ALMOST get it but there isnt enough height on the scarlet terror (even with my back against the wall or with opponent's back against wall). is scarlet terror the only way to connect it? apparently you can only do a 1 hit move knocking them into the are if you're going to connect with a 2nd hit. i tried modifying it again by setting computer to jump but for some reason i end up doing an ex izuna drop every time. i cant figure out why i cant bloody high claw after but if someone could test something out to see if it works let me know. my ps3 screen name is the one above if you want to spar or whatever. sorry for the semi crappy wording i'm sorta tired XD
Posted by andyfilth on May 12, 2009 at 6:46 p.m. #168
i'm sure most people here have probably figured this out by now, but for any of you who might be struggling against seth on hardest difficulty, it's made a lot easier if you use vega's LP rolling crystal flash regularly. at the start of the round, jump in and either throw seth if he jumps, or combo him if he throws out one of his dhalsim style punches (this is pretty much how he starts every round). stay out of reach while he is down, but if you're confident with your timing, charge your MP+MK and launch into another combo.
when he's on the floor, make sure you're just out of reach of his pile driver. crouch block as he attacks you (high block if he leaps at you off the wall), and use an LP rolling crystal flash any time there's a gap in his attacks - it's armour breaking so his EX moves can't get you.
if seth does get you on the ground, don't be tempted to try and hit him with a wake up - he'll nail you every time unless you can perform an ultra. back flip away to avoid his spinning pile driver, and continue with the same strategy. just keep an eye on when his ultra is charged - he can throw it out the instant you're open, and unless you're blocking low it will hit you.
i can beat seth every time using this - and although it won't win many style points, neither does he with all his cheap moves :P
Posted by shadow050 on May 13, 2009 at 7:48 a.m. #169
hey... just thought, a good "get off me' attack for vega might be the ex rolling claw move. i might hvae to test it outfirst though. just thought it might have a chance since i know you can bypass some attacks with it (such as fireballs)
Posted by shadow050 on May 13, 2009 at 8 a.m. #170
the hardest thing i have with playing as vega is remembering to "BE CHEAP" lol. sure, my moves failed to come out at times andthat's frustrating... but if i simply remember to fight dirty as all possible, i'd win a lot more lol.
i notice when i typically lose, i fought against someone who was fighting more cheaply than i was lol. such as ken/ryu players who just love to hop over me with a med. kick (to try to hit the back of my head), throw a ton of little jabs, and if i'm blocking the grab me... almost everytime lol. or what's worse, and mroe simple... walking towards me as just trying to grab me each time -_-
rule of thumb for fighting with vega... BE CHEAP! he is a ninja! ninjas have no need for honor and such so being cheap as hell with him is "OK" :-)
Posted by andyfilth on May 13, 2009 at 6:35 p.m. #171
@ shadow050 - the ex rolling claw move isn't so good as a get off me move because of the really slow start up rate, which leaves you open to attack for at least 20 frames.
but i agree with the cheap tactics - any online player will be as cheap as possible if it earns them a win (zangief's spinning lariat = ARGH). and while i consider excessive throwing to be pretty poor form, it is a legitimate move, and all is fair in love and street fighter.
Posted by Masked Nobleman on May 14, 2009 at 10:09 a.m. #172
If a throw is the move to use in a given situation, you should go for it, I don't think that too much is cheap in Street Fighter (although some moves are pushing it). But it's true, people will fight their hardest to make sure they don't lose online, especially in a championship mode final match. So you have to make sure to lay it all out there as well.
Posted by shadow050 on May 22, 2009 at 9:24 a.m. #173
well... anyone can find me on the PS3 version of SF4, under the same name you see here "shadow050"
here's another tip if people haven't already figured it out...
until like, last week, i normally did the wall dive using the weak kick button. i did itusing that one because it was the most convenient button to press... but i have found the error of my ways.
there are a couple of reasons:
1) i always wondered why it was SOOOO hard to grab (the izuna drop) people with the move... using the weak kick button, it's apparently the hardest to execute the grab with... when i use the strong kick, i noticed it was MUCH EASIER to execute the grabs... it seems to have a wider range in which it can get the enemy
2) even when you miss the grab, and instead execute the striking attack he does (where he spreads his arms) it has a higher hit rate. my PROOF of this is the fact that i have successful hit zangeif with this attack even when he does that annoying a$$ spinning lariat move. BUT keep in mind it's not absolute, and there are times when i got hit only. but like i said, the hit rate is higher, and sometimes only land a hit, sometimes we both got hit, and sometime only i got hit when starting the wall dive move with the strong kick... BUT... each and everytime i do the move with the weak kick ONLY i end up getting hit.
3) the attacks dealt from starting the wall dive with the strong kick DO MORE DAMAGE. it's not at all about which punch button you press (it seems). it's all about which kick button you begin the move with.
hope this helps some people.
oh... and don't forget to fight cheap! lol.
lastly, has anyone found a good use for vega's down-forward medium kick attack (the one where he does a little hop, and drops his heel on the opponent)? i think it'd be SO useful if it could hit enemies doing crouching blocks, but i don't think it does.
Posted by Masked Nobleman on May 22, 2009 at 1:23 p.m. #174
Unfortunately the 'Piece of Mercury' (df+mk) is pretty much useless. It should be an overhead, but it's not, and it's execution and range are pretty poor. You're better off using the Cosmic Heel as a command normal.
The Piece of Mercury used to be his standing Roundhouse Kick in Street Fighter Alpha 3, but it wasn't looked upon favorably so they went back to his original SFII Roundhouse animation when he appeared in Capcom Vs. SNK.
Posted by Masked Nobleman on May 22, 2009 at 1:24 p.m. #175
*execution time
Posted by Yuske Urameshi9 on May 22, 2009 at 7:45 p.m. #176
The piece of mercury happens to be a great move if you are someone who has excellent reflexes and can predict a cross up; not only will you avoid the attack but you can usually do a hk and punish the crap out of most opponents for good damage (or an even quicker mk if you know they will immediately go on the offensive.) Even if you decide not to attack afterwards it wlll put you far away enough not to have your shield broken if you focus cancel the hell away from attacks like shoryuken
if you happen to love combos you could hold down the diagonal command for the kick to start a charge for an ex barcelona if you catch them with a crouched medium punch first (if not, you will be crouch blocking from the other side,) very useful for us vega players!!!
Another simple and effective use for the piece of mercury is to get a little closer to some oponents after a failed super move so you can kara throw them before they have a chance to tick throw you with low attacks. Yes the cosmic heel is the best in most situations but you tend to grab with a higher succession rate with POM because it shakes players more for some reason ::shrug::
XBL gamertag is the same as my name in case anyone wants to spar and share other ideas
training mode is golder, period
Posted by Yuske Urameshi9 on May 22, 2009 at 7:48 p.m. #177
which is like golden but a typo
Posted by vega bones on May 26, 2009 at 10:05 a.m. #178
Coule any1 tell em about kara throws? I am new to street fighter, and i cant seem to get it to work, how is the move timed? I'd really appreciate any help!
Posted by sly vega on May 27, 2009 at 9:53 a.m. #179
does any one know how to do the two hit air slash when you do the ex flying barcelona.. ive done it a couple of times, but I cant seem to do it on command.. help anyone..
btw taken down almost all of the ken, ryu, sagats ive faced with vega.. i have trouble with blanka. It seems on the G2 level on championship mode, like a third of the players use him and its hard for me to counter what they do.. if anyone can help me out with this also, it would be much apreciated
im on xbox live with the gamer tag "Sly Stall0WNED" (the 0 is a zero not a capitalized O)
Posted by sly vega on May 29, 2009 at 11:14 a.m. #180
if anyone wants to share vega strategies on xbox live.. hit me up.. my gamer tag is in the previous post
Posted by vega bones on May 30, 2009 at 11:46 a.m. #181
#181 sly vega
I think that this move seems to come out if you r directly above the opponent, litterally bang ontop of their head, and press punch without any directions while keying punch. This generally seems to work.
Posted by will on May 31, 2009 at 6:15 p.m. #182
I am having a small problem when fighting zangief. How do you react to someone that spams the spinning pile driver? I mean once he catches me he times it so that he is right on me when I wakeup and he gets me again. You can't get up quickly after a grab so i'm not quite sure what to do once I am trapped in the first one.
Posted by Joe Somebody on June 1, 2009 at 5:05 p.m. #183
#will
Use the backflips
Posted by at@ on June 9, 2009 at 2:54 a.m. #184
Does anybody know some good Anti Air moves beside the High Kick, and Scarlet Terror? Also what are some good wake up moves for vega besides scarlet terror?
Posted by Yuske Urameshi9 on June 10, 2009 at 4:44 p.m. #185
To clear the air, yes the double hit on the barcelona attack is performed by pressing the punch button with no direction held. As for a good anti air attack, i feel like the standing medium kick does the trick quite well when the opponent is not too deep. As for the giefs who spam SPD, the crouching medium punch is cancelable so a good tactic to set yourself for combos and distance is to cancel crouching mp with a single backflip, that way if he tries to grab after a poke he leaves himself open for any number of quick strikes: ex barcelona, piece of mercury, lp crystal flash etc.
Posted by Jink on June 16, 2009 at 7:30 p.m. #186
dfHK owns all.
Posted by x Who Is Alpha on June 17, 2009 at 5:03 p.m. #187
check out my Youtube account youtube.com/xwhoisalpha for Vega Videos and championship matches.
Posted by Jason M on June 18, 2009 at 7:22 a.m. #188
I'm stuck on the 4th trial with Vega. Do I need the turbo button on the 6 button style contoller to pull this off? I've tried everything and I just can't hit the crystal flash after the mk.... I start charging as soon as I jump in for the hk, hit the mk and the 3rd hit NEVER lands? Any advice would be welcome. JM
Posted by Kage on June 21, 2009 at 1:13 a.m. #189
Anyone have any advice for Vega during wake-up to counter a jump in cross-over attack? I play an ok Vega, but no idea what works well besides blocking.
Posted by Yuske Urameshi9 on June 22, 2009 at 12:59 p.m. #190
if you expect the cross-up then charge the opposite direction for a crimson kick
Posted by Valter on June 24, 2009 at 5:27 p.m. #191
How do you land his 4 hit claw attack during the super? Do you have to time the punch button early? I'm trying to do it instead of the Izuna Drop version.
GT: Valter5118
Posted by haywood on June 24, 2009 at 11:33 p.m. #192
i love vega. i thought he was a cheap pansy until i learned some of his intricacies. only prblm i have is doing his ultra consistently.
Posted by haywood on June 24, 2009 at 11:37 p.m. #193
dude,vegas ex kick flip is great 4 weakup, just use ex version. sometimes i whiff tho.
Posted by London Dry on June 28, 2009 at 7:03 a.m. #194
There is never any reason to do the multi-hit version of flying barcelona or the super, they do less damage and stun plus can be blocked. Just grab.
Posted by London Dry on June 28, 2009 at 7:13 a.m. #195
Ex flip kick is OK for wake-up but it comes out at the same speed as HK and still has no invulnerability so it will get beaten by meaty attacks. The biggest perk is the extra damage it does especially if you catch someone with the counter hit, but given the 0 invulnerability your opponent pretty much has to make a miscalculation for that to happen.
Posted by London Dry on June 28, 2009 at 7:32 a.m. #196
Looking back I may be wrong about the lesser stun of the multi-hit claw but at best it's only equal and the damage is still worse. If you're close enough to chip them with that move then you're already close enough to throw so there's no reason to risk the chip not killing them when you can just get the unblockable throw. Again, in short, just grab.
Posted by just anothda guy on July 2, 2009 at 12:03 a.m. #197
hmmm, thats funny, hes one of the funner characters to play, and i own with him, ahahah, i can play all characters really good and perform there combos flawlessly, and id say that if you use him right, vega can be quite annoying, but that goes for everyone, i like using dhalsim, just because i always win and just because hes anoyin as hell...
Posted by any tips? on July 2, 2009 at 8:58 p.m. #198
any good mix-ups for throws or kara-throws beside down-forward (HK or MK) into a throw? One thing I've tried is jumping HP, standing HP, crouching MP etc., mixed with jumping HP, standing LK (the knee) then throw. Trouble is it doesn't seem to go off as smoothly as I've seen Cammy's, Ryu's or Rufus's close combat throw mix-up.
Posted by kage on July 3, 2009 at 1:43 p.m. #199
I think u just need to work on the timing more for mixing in throws. One thing you can also try is focus attack 2/3 --> dash --> combo or throw.
Posted by Aegis Neglector on July 4, 2009 at 9:56 a.m. #200
I would just like to announce my ownage of Blackdealh36k yesterday, who rage-quitted halfway through the second round.
He then went on to send me a message saying "my power went. that was close, let's go again sometime" in an attempt to save face.
All i can say is:Blackdealh36k, you tried, and failed...as i expected.
I particularly enjoyed the way he tried a random ultra and quit just as it was blocked.
Posted by Dave on July 4, 2009 at 9:40 p.m. #201
Vega's ultra is pretty much uselessin high levels of play. Its great against fireball spammers, but wont go far in the long run.
Vega's biggest problem is lack of priority. you can crouching light punch him out of a reversal ex-scarlett terror for crying out loud.
Needless to say, if a decent rufus of balrog gets him in a corner, expect to lose at least a third of your energy before escaping...if you can.
Vega is a terrible offensive character, I always play a ranged game with him. Crouching medium punch and jumping fierce punch are my best friends
Posted by andyfilth on July 6, 2009 at 9:24 p.m. #202
@ Aegis Neglector - haha! you never know though.. my connection lags something fierce at times - i think mostly against people in the U.S. (could be wrong though) - possibly cause i'm in australia and our internet capabilities are famously slow.
there have been several fights where i've tried to do wall dives and it was lagging so bad the claw dive wouldn't come out, despite me hitting the punch button as soon as i left a wall. or an animation would skip dozens of frames and the two characters would reappear in completely different positions. extremely annoying.
i'm sure some people have thought i was rage quitting, when in actual fact the game was just unplayable due to lag. then again he did claim a power outage which is dubious at best.
Posted by kage on July 6, 2009 at 9:59 p.m. #203
@ andyfilth and Aegis Neglector
a power outage isn't dubious! That's what happens when u push the power button in the middle of a fight! :D
Posted by kasp3r on July 7, 2009 at 1:35 p.m. #204
alot of people say Vega is the worst character. he is by far one of the most overpowered characters in SF 4.
Posted by andyfilth on July 7, 2009 at 8:33 p.m. #205
@ kasp3r - what makes you say that? with the difficulty of executing decent combos, weak attacks, low defensive rating and low priority moves, i don't really see how he could be considered overpowered at all.. unless you know something we don't?
in my opinion his only major advantage is being able to backflip away when in danger. i feel very exposed when using any other character because i don't have that ability!
Posted by noob on July 9, 2009 at 9:26 a.m. #206
Does Vega have any multi-hit combos like Ryu's or Akuma's >10 range?
Posted by Kasp3r on July 10, 2009 at 3:11 a.m. #207
Vega's crossover attacks are lethal. you bypass most defences and your opponent never knows if your gonna land behind or infront.
my main is Guile, and my friends is Vega. He annihilates absolutely everyone he plays. I guess Vega needs to be in the right hands.
Posted by London Dry on July 12, 2009 at 4:59 a.m. #208
@ noob: Vega has an 11-hit combo, but it's debatable whether it's worth doing or not due to the fact that costs 3/4 super meter. He's not really a large hit number combo character.
@Kasp3r: Guile's crouching fierce should almost completely nullify Vega's flying barcelona cross-up game. Just about anybody that has a crouching fierce that goes straight up will beat the wall dive, especially Sakura. It's such a telegraphed move in that you should be able to take it out on reaction.
Posted by noob on July 13, 2009 at 5:50 p.m. #209
Thanx London!
Just saw that 11-hit combo on youtube. Still working on replicating that on command. don't think i'll ever get it.
A bunch of new SF4 Vega vids on youtube from the PC/Windows players! Some cool stuff. Check out: 1:17 into this video: http://www.youtube.com/user/spartasan...
Anyone able to replicate the cr lp, cr lk link into a lp rolling crystal flash? Never saw that before and can't seem to do it on my xbox.
Posted by jeremie on July 21, 2009 at 2:16 p.m. #210
does anyone know how to get out of corner traps....i seem to lose when i get stuck in the corner
Posted by noob on July 21, 2009 at 6:56 p.m. #211
@ jeremie
i'm assuming you mean getting up from being knocked down ---
unfortunately vega doesn't have any good anti-air options when getting up. The Scarlet terror (even the EX) get's stuffed by most attacks, and is best used when the attacker is in the air in _front_ (not directly above). your best bet is to hope for a mis-timed jump and then use the EX Scarlet Terror, or block and be prepared to counter-throw or block.
Don't forget that you can wall-jump out of the corner (normal wall jump - not the charge izuna) if you're already standing and have some breathing room to do so.
Posted by jeremie on July 22, 2009 at 2:56 p.m. #212
@ noob
thanks alot....ill be sure to remember that for when i next play online
Posted by kage on July 23, 2009 at 8:35 a.m. #213
@ noob #211
Go through Vega's hard trials - one of those (I think #2) links a cr lp into a cr lk. It's definitely possible - you just have to figure out the timing
Posted by y2k-watts on July 23, 2009 at 4:26 p.m. #214
How do you do his double flip kick? I can do the LK to EX one but how about the scarlet terror juggle without EX?
Posted by Kage on July 23, 2009 at 4:59 p.m. #215
@ .#216
the Scarlett terror will juggle if u get one hit on an airborne opponent with a med or hard ST. Immediately follow with another med or hard ST although the timing for this is somewhat tricky. I've had better luck with the EX ST for the second hit.
Posted by y2k-watts on July 24, 2009 at 12:30 p.m. #216
@kage yeah I was trying this on training mode with having Ryu jump in roundhouse and couldn't get the 2nd scarlet terror to link after i antiair ST the 1st one. Maybe character specific? Need to test more.
Posted by shannaro!!! on July 25, 2009 at 1:52 p.m. #217
I was able to create the legengary paper rose (origami), and hell yeah it was tough! After tons of effort, the completed rose was absolutely beautiful. I thought about Vega's Bloody High Claw. As the enemy gets hit, rose petals come out instead of blood. Real pretty but its probably one of the weaker Ultras in the game.
Posted by jibbs on July 26, 2009 at 1:29 a.m. #218
i cant do hard trial 1...firstly how fast do i have to input the cr.med punch after the cr.light punch? i try and spam the two after the jmp.high punch but sometimes it doesn't connect...also the light rolling claw is kinda hard to pull of after all that...any tips?
Posted by London Dry on July 26, 2009 at 9:59 p.m. #219
I haven't bothered with the trials in a long time, but I have a couple ideas where you could be going wrong. First of all you said "spam" for the c.LP to c.MP; it's a link you can't do that, ever. Links require you to precisely wait for the recovery of the first move before initiating the second. Hit c.LP wait for it to come most of the way back then hit c.MP. If you're not even getting the j.HP to c.Lp then you need to wait longer in the jump before hitting HP. To get the roll you should be holding charge downback as soon as you jump, the rolls have longer charge times than his other specials by about 15 frames so you need that extra time right from the beginning.
Posted by jibbs on July 28, 2009 at 10:53 p.m. #220
oh so "link" is what i've been missing...ahhh...thanks
well with vega the trial moves isn't really practical in real fights...so no reason to do them really. Well if you want the sig and icon...but having a vega sig/icon isn't really very good as ppl will counter pick you most of the time...
also a little noob to noobs tip: I use the barcelona/izuna the moment the guy opponent stands with some cross up action...and I just keep doing that until he/she does something about it...so far this tactic has got me as far at g2-e and 2000bp..
Posted by Hova 13 on August 2, 2009 at 9:17 a.m. #221
how do u that double punch after Flying Barcelona Attack? its like a double hit instead of just that 1 punch button during the attack
Posted by jeremie on August 2, 2009 at 10:49 a.m. #222
@ Hova 13
do you mean during the flying barcelona attack? or when vega is on the ground?
Posted by London Dry on August 2, 2009 at 12:05 p.m. #223
@ Hova 13
This has been covered several times earlier in the thread but I'll repeat it. If you are in close enough range to land the Izuna drop throw but don't press a direction and punch button, just a punch, Vega will do the multi hit claw attack. I've advised several people against using it because it does less damage than the throw and you run the risk of being blocked. If you're close enough to land the throw, just throw. It's basically another wasted move given to Vega like throwing off the claw and mask intentionally. The same rule applies for doing the multi-hit super instead of the throw version, the throw is better in every way.
Posted by Hova 13 on August 2, 2009 at 9:40 p.m. #224
i still cant do it...just a punch does not do the multi hit for me...any video u can suggest or do u have xbox live...if u do add II YaMZ II or H o V A XIII
Posted by London Dry on August 2, 2009 at 10:32 p.m. #225
It's important to be right overhead, just like if you were going for the throw. The animation is basically getting a hit when Vega starts opening his arms and then spreads them like normal. So you have to be very close, right on top of the character's head. I suggest trying it on a larger character like Zangief or Sagat.
I'm not going to suggest a video because more important than showing you how to do that move is telling you NOT to use it. It adds zero value to Vega's gameplay, not even for chip damage because if you are close enough to get the multi hit claw for chip you are close enought to throw for guaranteed unblockable full damage. That's all the help I'm going to give since there's really no purpose in you learning this move except to say that you can do it.
Just please take my advice and drop this multi hit move altogether and never use it in a match, maybe for a combo video, but not a match. It makes no sense.
Posted by Oliver on August 3, 2009 at 11:23 a.m. #226
Vega doesn't suck. And he isn't that hard to use. It's about HOW you play. Somebody who has played Ryu thousands of times is going to find him hard. I have beaten a rated 3000 Sagat with him even though my rating is much lower.
Posted by London Dry on August 3, 2009 at 3:41 p.m. #227
Ok Oliver who were you actually responding to with your "Vega doesn't suck" comment ? The simple fact of the matter is that Vega is one of the worst characters in SF IV for all the reasons people have used above.
People need to stop using the argument that it's about HOW you play the character that makes them good. Of course it is, every character in every fighting game is about HOW you play them. If you play Sagat like an idiot you will lose, but Sagat's tools are better than Vega's. There's no comparison there. Tier lists are in the end ranking a character's tools and Vega has some of the worst in key areas, like on wake-up.
Also I see a lot of this BP rating referencing to say how good people/their opponents are. That needs to stop, Playing online with this game is pretty much unbearable to the point where my tournament going friends and I refuse to play it. Links get dropped, back dashing and cross up counter timing gets lost. This game is meant to be played in person, the fact that there are such things as online/ lag tactics proves that. BP is not a good indicator of skill. Go take a look on SRK and see how often people reference battle points.
Could we please keep the thread filled with useful information rather than unfounded arguments like this post. Honestly if this keeps up I'm going to quit posting here.
Posted by har on August 3, 2009 at 4:42 p.m. #228
Well London, why don't you just go find some leet board where the kewlz hang out. I can't believe I read that many words just to hear "Vega does too suck." Nice contribution kid.
Posted by London Dry on August 3, 2009 at 5:35 p.m. #229
If you want contributions, take a look back where I break down the damage/ juggle potential of Vega's flip kicks in post 61, detail character specific combos in post 67, explain tick and kara throws in posts 131 and 132 and teach people how and why not to do the multi-hit flying barcelona attack multiple times. Compare that to the multiple people making unfounded "in fact Vega is one of the best" arguments or asking how to do trials when there's a separate trial thread. I've contributed plenty of useful information to this thread about how to use and overcome Vega's shortcomings while all you did was take a stab at provoking me and make a useless comment and cause me to reply making yet another informationless post, Since my help is unappreciated I'll move on.
Posted by Hova 13 on August 4, 2009 at 1:36 p.m. #230
who cares who sucks n who doesnt....i still can not do the multi hit claw...dats all i want to kno...n u said hit him as close as u can...well i did like a thousand times n vega only does 1 claw...im sure thats not the way or i just fkn suck
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 4, 2009 at 1:59 p.m. #231
OMG didn't "London" already tell you it's useless but
no your still trying to freaking do it.
It's like trying to stop you from kissing the most beautiful girl in the world but he keep telling you that,that girl have Aids it wouldn't do you any good kissing her.
You get what im saying.
give up trying to kiss that girl= stop trying the multi hit thing.
Posted by andyfilth on August 4, 2009 at 3:35 p.m. #232
@ Hova 13
to do the double hit, you do the EX wall jump (has to be the EX one - don't think that has been mentioned to you yet), and if you miss them as you go to the wall (if you hit them while going to the wall you can't do it, cause they're in the air), maneouver so you're going to land right on top of their head. then it's just a matter of letting go of the joystick and pressing punch as you're right above their head.
hope that helps. and relax everyone, we're all here to enjoy the game and get as much out of it as we can. people are entitled to ask questions/give opinions.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 4, 2009 at 4:53 p.m. #233
@ andyfilth
Yes you are rite i should have explained it to him when i was writing i came back here to do it
but you beat me to it.
Posted by hova 13 on August 4, 2009 at 6:33 p.m. #234
@ andyfilth
Thanks alot...that was to easy
@Th3 Jok3R
go f*k urself n get off london's dick u stupid bitch n u would mention a girl with aids on a sf4 site...(fagget)
to those who say the move is useless well i did pay 60 bucks for the game i do play with vega so i would like to know his evry move dumb f*ks...n i wanted to kno the move bcus sometimes i would do the barcelona attack 1 claw n who im up against would do a focus n stun me...but with the double claw it would stop his focus!!!
andy thanks again
Posted by Burn Your Ego on August 4, 2009 at 10:12 p.m. #235
Throw beats focus everytime!!!!! If you're in the range for the double claw you can throw!!!!It still does more damage and gets the knockdown!!!! Better in every way!!!!
EX flying barcelona should generally be used in combo or at minimum hit on the way up off a punish to set up a juggle state and then finish with a throw. It's a waste of meter to do it in the open. If you're blocked or whiff when attempting to punish and are still trying to land a hit you should still be going for the throw or at least cross up the single claw so they focus the wrong way and then free punish for you.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 5, 2009 at 12:21 a.m. #236
You feel better hova 13 :D
I was using a that sentence as a example if you was reading.
Ok im a dick rider for agreeing with "london"???
I absolutely really want to know if im still a dick rider
for agreeing with "Andyfilth"? : ) please tell me
and to think i was going to come back to tell you
the same information "Andyfilth" told you.
Oh and im also stupid for knowing how to multi hit with the Flying Barcelona Attack but you didn't : )
I play vega too i wouldn't want to use up a ex bar to multi hit a person "to get away if he focus n stun me" but i would highly recommend ex Flying Barcelona Attack towards the opponent for a easy izuna drop. thnx for reading~JoK3R J
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 5, 2009 at 12:33 p.m. #237
lets see if this works http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73wovB... Vega Guide (Claw Tutorial)
Posted by Catalyst on August 5, 2009 at 6:24 p.m. #238
@Th3 JoK3R J
Very nice video. I've made a note to revisit this guide soon and add in your video to the section. Thanks for submitting this.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 5, 2009 at 7:44 p.m. #239
@Catalyst
Oh i am not the owner of that vid i take no credit of making it.And your welcome i wanted to show the vid to "hova 13"
for a better guide for Vega.
Posted by har on August 7, 2009 at 6:06 p.m. #240
Bye bye London Dry!
-Vega User
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 7, 2009 at 10:14 p.m. #241
@har
Why are you saying bye to him just curious
did you beat or something else?
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 7, 2009 at 10:15 p.m. #242
"Beat him"
Posted by Random Claw User on August 12, 2009 at 8:06 p.m. #243
Hey ppl. Found a few combos/tricks with Vega that I want to share with the community. I'll list them.
1) Crouching mk -> crouching hp - Nice, quick link that does good dmg/stun.
2) Jumping hk -> close standing fp -> heavy crystal rolling flash - only combo I've found that actually uses a heavy crf. You have to cancel after the first fp hit. Also, you can cancel the crf into his super, making it much easier to land.
3) close standing hp -> standing hk - good dmg/stun. I don't think it works in the corner though. Still testing it.
4) standing far lk * 2 -> crouching mp - probably Vega's safest poke combo, since his lk works like most characters' lp and has great range. You can probably cancel the mp into an ex barcelona or something, but I haven't tried that out.
5) crouching mk -> crouching lp -> crouching mp -> special
I'll try to post more at a later date if it helps anybody. Also, a few general tips.
1) You can cancel Vega's slower pokes into his short back flip, making them more difficult to punish. Also, those back flips allow you to charge a special move.
2) IMO, cosmic heel -> heavy scarlet terror is always a better choice than cosmic heel -> ex barcelona. Heavy scarlet does slightly less dmg than ex barcelona and charges guage. Also, the izuna drop may put u at a bad field position if you're not careful.
Posted by Random Claw User on August 12, 2009 at 8:13 p.m. #244
-_- Didn't finish the last portion.
Cosmic Heel -> Slide is also a good choice if you can't manage to hit the heavy scarlet after.
3) Ex scarlet terror is safe from moves in front of Vega, but not from low attacks/cross ups.
4) Focus saving counts towards your equipment loss, so be careful with it.
5) IMO, Vega's straight kick pokes are better than his claw pokes, with the exception of his crouching claw pokes. They usually come out faster, have the same/greater range and are safer.
Sorry if some of this information has been posted before.
Posted by Random Claw User on August 13, 2009 at 1:12 a.m. #245
A few more combos.
6) standing lk * 2 -> standing hk
7) standing lk -> crouching lp -> crouching mp -> special
8) crouching lp *3 -> standing hk
For some reason, close hp -> standing hk and standing lk -> standing hk doesn't work on all characters (Works on all tall characters though). You could just trade out the former for combo 8).
Most of these allow charge without spending too much time pinned to one spot, making it harder for the opponent to pressure you.
Also, can somebody confirm whether remove claw/remove mask resets the hit count for equipment removal? If yes, then those could be useful if you have some space (especially remove claw_.
Posted by ioannis86 on August 16, 2009 at 12:03 p.m. #246
Did they remove the fake wall dive from turbo hd remix?
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on August 16, 2009 at 3:01 p.m. #247
@ioannis86
No you have full control of the FBA.You can't simply press a kick button to stay where you are,just keep the direction your going backwards.
Posted by andyfilth on August 16, 2009 at 11:54 p.m. #248
if anyone would like a game sometime, i am on psn under andyfilth. i'm probably not up to the same level as some of you guys, but i don't mind a challenge.
i don't ever rage quit, but as i've detailed before, i have pretty annoying issues with lag from time to time which renders the game unplayable (does anyone else get this? seems to happen to me an awful lot). i had to quit my first g2e tournament final because of it last night - and i was winning!! against ZANGIEF!! lost over 20,000CP :(
so if you notice i start jumping around doing really weird stuff and then i quit, that would be why. my quit rate is at like 5% just because of this reason.
i've noticed i never seem to lag against other people in australia though - so if you're an aussie, let's have some rounds sometime.
Posted by Jabes on August 18, 2009 at 12:55 a.m. #249
Does anyone have anytips on how to do cosmic heel-> heavy scarlet terror? i really need to learn it but it is so hard to do!
Posted by VegaNewb on August 18, 2009 at 2:08 p.m. #250
I started to main Vega a month ago everything goes well untill im cornered and get beaten. How do i escape when im cornered, shotos and chun li are a pain in the ass in the corner :S. Need advice pls =)
Posted by Jabes on August 18, 2009 at 7:07 p.m. #251
when cornered
btw im still relatively new to vega but here's things that i use
1. backflip kkk
2. wall jump away
3. ultra if u can
4. ex fba away
5. scarlet terror
Posted by noob on August 18, 2009 at 8:01 p.m. #252
Hi, as a fellow noob this is what kinda works for me.
(1) Everything Jabes mentioned above
(2) FADC
(3) Back dash
(4) Standing HK - sometimes catches people unwares.
Posted by Kage on August 18, 2009 at 10:25 p.m. #253
It's all about not panicking when you're in the corner. A lot of times it boils down do whether your opponents going to throw or do an armor-breaking attack. Really have a tough time with shoto's/cammy with that mix-up.
What I did for awhile was at the start of the round - purposefully back into a corner and then try to get out. Helps to keep your head cool when you have a full lifebar to work with. Also lot a ton of games that way, but I got better.
Posted by kojinalkopparoqitsah on August 19, 2009 at 7:35 a.m. #254
Do some one have some links with some really good Vega player? :)
Posted by Jabes on August 19, 2009 at 9:59 a.m. #255
http://known2own.wordpress.com/2009/0...
kinda bad quality...but it's the only vega vs daigo I have seen online
although vega gets owned...lol
also youtube team tatsu
Posted by noob on August 19, 2009 at 1:24 p.m. #256
also look for "kurochevsky" on youtube. Sounds like he's from France and plays on the PC - but he plays a wicked solid game with Vega.
Posted by Alone goliat (ps3) on August 19, 2009 at 9:46 p.m. #257
Vega is Probably the most annoyng char on street fighter, and you have to use it to win, ofcourse his weak, but he has a wonderful range, just poke, poke , poke, forget about flashy combos, just piss the hell off of your opponent. Do never waste your super bar, and take off your claw onporpouse as soon as you feel safe, in order to restart the number of hits it receives. We vegas cant stay invict for long but, be sure that your better than most of your punishers, for a simple reason; Vega is the most complex character in SF. feel free to invite me on the ps3...
Posted by Alone goliat (ps3) on August 19, 2009 at 9:51 p.m. #258
btw, i play with the Dualshok, do not underrestimate me muajajajaja^,~. Claws up people!
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on August 23, 2009 at 2:18 p.m. #259
anyone got advice for a vega user against overpowered shotos? oh and that tiger fag.switched to vega recently and he is quite simply outstanding! forget blanka here is the charge character of choice.seriously does playing versus mode on hardest help cos in g-2 i get smoked.....
Posted by ??? on August 24, 2009 at 3:58 p.m. #260
hey j4zzm4n21
what system are you playing on....maybe i could help...ive been using claw for quite a while and id be more than willing to give some tips
Posted by at # 262 on August 25, 2009 at 1:08 a.m. #261
i'm on ps3 my win record is dismal these days.i used to main sagat then changed cos i hate him i now switched to fei long with vega as my second.my main problems are caused by the shotos,especially akuma not to mention sagat my main problem is the projectiles that all of a sudden get linked into anti-air moves.i try charging but always get pressured the backflip only gets me so far...
Posted by jeremie on August 25, 2009 at 11:33 p.m. #262
well im on the PS3 too....maybe we should play together to see where we stand and what we need to work on... if youd wanna do that then i wouldnt mind : )
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on August 26, 2009 at 12:40 a.m. #263
yeah jeremie i suppose getting my ass kicked by you could inspire greatness and really force me to adapt my game.my psn tag is jazzman21 once i finish bionic commando rearmed/ done some intense training i'll play you then you can see how much work i need, a second opinion is always helpful.
Posted by jeremie on August 26, 2009 at 11:37 a.m. #264
hahahaaha
dont worry...im not a pro or anything...this is more to help each other out....share what we know and further learn...ill add you sometime today when i come back
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on August 26, 2009 at 12:54 p.m. #265
ok mr. semi pro (i'll call you jackie moon ha ha ha) sounds like a plan i was just doing trials with bruce lee jr vega's normal 3 is where i'm stuck embarassingly enough but hey this site helps.i look forward to our sparring.
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 1:52 p.m. #266
so anyway, Vega is NOT the player that annoys the crap out of everybody, of all the players that annoy the crap out of everybody Vega isn't even on that list.
being scared and confused isn't the same thing as someone being annoying
Vega is one of the classiest players in the game, shotos are boring, and Balrog (Boxer), Bison and Rufus are the epitomy of annoying play styles, Zangief is almost in the same league, depending on the player.
the truly good players are Guile, El Fuerte, Vega, Honda, Chun Li, Abel, Blanka and Dhalsim (of the Arcade set) and most of the other 8 console / PC characters
of those players, nobody can say that something is "annoying" because they all have an old school skill set which requires effort at a disadvantage to the ACTUALLY annoying players
people don't even seem to be using their brain anymore, they are just obsessed with the "combo til they die" mentality at the input that they have all become simply annoying to play against.
its like "hey wake up, remember the game? or are you just staring at the buttons?"
anyway, Vega is my favorire, El Fuerte is Second and Abel Third. Those players take ACTUAL skill, rather than simply button input memorization which truly annoys the crap out of every ACTUAL street fighter OG.
of all the players, I think Vega **IS THE BEST** his tool set **IS THE BEST**
I'm not saying the most powerful or highest priority, or best combos, I'm saying that his arsenal is actually full of great awesome moves which take a true Pro to pull off
whoever designed Vega for SF4 over at Capcom, designed him to be exactly the way a True Vega LEET would play him
its one of the few players in the game that can bring the Game Play of old school SF back to the stage, as he forces players to drop the iron button gaze and rethink their game
the best part about playing him is that people see him as the weakest most incapable charater with something like the SF2 skill set, whilst the rest of the SF cast has gained super powers, and so everyone you play enters with over-confidence and arrogance, laughing at your player.
then you get to mop the stage with them round and round again
THATS why Vega is the Best.
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 1:58 p.m. #267
There's nothing like taking the so-called "weakest player" and laying waste to all in your path
I'd say TRULY great players play more challenging characters,
the more challenging the character, the better the player.
and NOT TRULY great players play super strong super powerful and overly dominating characters,
the worse the player, the greater the need to over-compensate.
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 2:05 p.m. #268
i read this entire thread, and there were alot of good tips and information
so here is my tip for the jar.
someone asked earlier what other ways there were to set up the kara throw.
this method sets you up out of normal throw range, but right about at maximum distance for the kara throw
start near your opponent, right up close, to jab position, but don't strike
from there, do the full back slash (all 3 punch buttons)
then immediately do a forward dash (Forward 2 times on the joystick) then go right into your Kara Throw
you'll find its the perfect Kara Setup.
To Kara throw, first tap HK then tap the Throw buttons, but it actually seems like you are pressing all 3 buttons together, but actually you're not
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 2:20 p.m. #269
also, there were many posts about 8 to 11 combos posted on Youtube, i wonder if anyone would post the input to any of those combos here, Youtube is blocked in the political region I'm in.
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 2:38 p.m. #270
and one other thing
there seems to be alo of people having problems with various opponents.
every opponent requires a completely different approach with Vega, you have to take a game which is unique to your opponent, so you must both master your opponents as well as master the moves which counter or are most effective.
Vega takes an extrodinary amount of time and effort and memorization of all tactics for all different players because of his "Apparent" disadvantage, similar to El Fuerte
You may not even use any of the moves you used against one player that you will use on another.
in most instances, Vegas moes must be very specific to the opponent, as opposed toother caracters with a dominating style in every match, Vega must be played tactfully and with very expertly.
you annot say "oh I have a great upper cut and spin kick, and fireball and i will beat people up with them" as you do with shotos
you have to think "I have a Scarlet Terror which works under these specifc conditions, against these attacks / opportunties, and against these specific players"
Vega is the Adaptive Enigma, the Ninja, who selects the right tool for the job, and thinks nothing of himself or his abilities.
He has a pecific Skill set capable of vanquishing all Street Fighter Foes
but learning which those will be is entirely up to you.
You will have to spend Time "Re-mastering/ Re-molding" Vega for every Character / Play Style you encounter.
and then you have to remember all of that.
which is the main reason people are so quick to brush Vega off, because of his lack of apparent abilities at first glance
but in fact he has more skills and abilities than any other player in the game, and he is created with all he needs to conquer all would-be opponents in Street Fighter
so if you really want to be a Vega1337, rethink it, you will spend as much time mastering vega as you would take mastering most of the whole rest of the cast of Street Fighter
Posted by Assassin on August 28, 2009 at 8:28 p.m. #271
And about the Mask throw, it doesnt matter which 2 punch buttons you push when doing it, it will always travel towards center stage, same with the claw
its a great way to see where you are on the stage, just toss it up and be there to catch it to see where center stage is
you pick them up with your back foot slightly moving forward or backward near the object, or with the hand-plant during a full back slash (all 3 punch buttons)
when thrown forward, a dash forward will set you up for an automatic re-suiting when its hits the ground
when thrown behind vega, holding back on the joystick before a full back slash with scoot him back just enough to pick it up with the hand-plant. if you do the full beack slash without holding the joystick back first you will be just short of picking it up
i find it extremely enjoyable to pick up my lost items during a game, as well as to throw and catch, its adds another dimenstion of challenge to the game.
yet another reason Vega is the best, he has things to play with and other business to attend to during a battle
proving (at least to me)that he was designed for the ultraleet players
comboing into his moves is one of the hardest in the game, unlike, say, Ryu, who can pull supers and ultras and other special moves out of his arse
his extremely long focus attack and extreme fast recovery and extremely fast and far reaching forward dash as well as his overall super speed make him the most dangerous player in the game
Posted by Anonymous on August 29, 2009 at 1:24 p.m. #272
Check out his Hard Trial 1 - that combo is my favorite and I use it far more then the BNB combo listed here. It is
1:Jumping Hard Punch
2:Crouching Light Punch
3:Crouching Medium Punch
4:Cancel Into Light Rolling Crystal Flash
5:EX Cancel
It can do good damage, and is much more reliable (if you have your claw) because the jumping hard punch has better priority. The other thing I like about it is that I can just use fragments of it. Any two or three steps in it can be done independently, which is true of most combos but really useful here.
Posted by vtec on August 29, 2009 at 2:21 p.m. #273
VEGA RULES!!!
The END.
Posted by X_Vegaman_X on August 29, 2009 at 2:41 p.m. #274
The dreaded question.......
for me the hardest character isnt Zangief spinning, Akuma throwing fireballs, Blanka rolling all over the place,or Gouken focus countering my FBA or SHC. all are annoying but they are beatable. for me the hardest is Vega. i can't beat him for crap. anyone know any good strategies for Vega vs Vega?
Posted by dodge guy on August 29, 2009 at 3:06 p.m. #275
Lure in ur opponent, bait for openings and counterstrike.
Mind games basically. Gain that edge.
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on August 30, 2009 at 11:54 a.m. #276
after being annihilated by a certain jeremie's vega i picked up some strategies and now am firmly on the vega band wagon this guy is a destructive force to be reckoned with my main problem is staying charged while under pressure from the shotos and blanka. a vs character guide or some pointers would be helpful.
Posted by Datsun on August 31, 2009 at 8:29 p.m. #277
was jeremie's vega good? what did he do? how did he play
btw who is jeremie
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on September 1, 2009 at 12:42 a.m. #278
jeremie's a dude from this site who invited me for sparring to give me some pointers and see a truly fantastic vega in action.he played well messed with my head and was able to be counterattacking yet annihilative at the same time.first time i'd ever seen a vega who could pressure me so well, dude is really good.seriously can someone please give me some tips for fighting shotos and blanka whilst under pressure as vega.
Posted by jeremie on September 1, 2009 at 1:41 p.m. #279
hey j4zzm4n21
honestly...all i can say is
dont be afraid to backflip out of there...but do not, by any means...abuse the backflip...
if you are even holding a charge...sacrifice it to get out...basically...what you wanna do is abuse what "range" vega has compared to most shotos...try not to get cornered and try to out range everyone....and dont forget if they are spamming fireballs...you can use EX Rolling Crystal Flash since it goes under them...and if they try to jump or cross you over...dont forget you have an air throw
if you like...we can spar again first hand..ill use a shoto so you can try to do these things with no risk of BP or championship rounds
Posted by j4zzm4n21 on September 2, 2009 at 12:38 a.m. #280
sure jeremie sparring again is a plan.
Posted by ??? on September 5, 2009 at 12:41 a.m. #281
is there any good vega players what would like to have some sparring matches?
Posted by ??? on September 6, 2009 at 2:16 a.m. #282
does anyone post in this section anymore?
Posted by Catalyst on September 6, 2009 at 2:21 a.m. #283
If you're looking for sparring partners, you should try here on the EventHubs tournament website. Lots of people setting up matches there:
http://eventhubstourneys.wetpaint.com...
Posted by jeremie on September 6, 2009 at 9:38 p.m. #284
@ Catalyst
do i just add the people listed there and say i would like to spar?
or is there anything else i have to do?
and thank you very much for posting that
Posted by Master Vega PLaya on September 9, 2009 at 1:47 a.m. #285
IM A REALLY GOOD VEGA PLAYER IVE BEEN PLAYING HIM SINCE THE CLASSIC STREET FIGHTER'S ON PS1 WERE AROUND. HES INDEED A VERY FUN PLAYER TO PLAY WITH AND SO FAR THE BEST IF YOU LEARN ALL HIS TRICKS.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on September 9, 2009 at 2:54 p.m. #286
@Master Vega PLaya
Then share your good Vega skills on her by showing
your PSN/GT and let people really know if your good
with him too bad i can't cuz my mem ran out on
360 Live.
Posted by Antonio on September 11, 2009 at 5:57 p.m. #287
I AGREEEE VEGA IS THE BEST I TOO ROCK AT VEGA SO I KNOW WUT YOU MEAN VEGA NUMBER 1 FOREVAAAAA WORRDDDDDDDDD
Posted by -anto. on September 11, 2009 at 6:02 p.m. #288
A.n.t.o..n.io.nio = (づﾟ 3ﾟ)づ (・(・ says (6:02 PM):
Master Vega Playa is from another planet
Terence says (6:02 PM):
hes immortal or something
Posted by ??? on September 16, 2009 at 11:31 a.m. #289
does anyone write on these things anymore?
Posted by nope on September 16, 2009 at 1:14 p.m. #290
nope
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on September 17, 2009 at 7:38 a.m. #291
got a couple questions.
I ran into a cpu fei long that was able to spam the first step of his 3 punch move to pressure me, and this has priority over all charge moves, as does his flame kick (if you're lucky enough to get airborn). Aside from a standing h kick, is there a good strat for this type of player for vega?
Also, i've run into some blanka's that spam electric charge and I haven't found a move yet to break him out of it. is focus attack the only way?
Lastly, is there any tips on doing the kara throw? I'm nearly to the point of simultaneously pressing HK and LK LP and the animation isn't canceling. Any help would be appreciated ^_^
Posted by Dave on September 19, 2009 at 10:11 p.m. #292
@ cowboy
The best tool against blanka's electricity it vega's crouching fierce kick (slide kick)
just make sure you're not close though, because vega will get hit on the start up animation
And about fei long, if you know the punch is coming, and he's only doing the first punch and stopping, just focus counter.
If he started adding punches, just block and punish. Or you could always just jump in the air and counter on the way down.
As for his kara throw, the only way to know if you're consectutively pulling it off is to go in training mode.
The training mode arena has black lines on the floor. Put the tip of your foot on the bold black like and perform a regular grab and see how far you scoot forward.
Then attempt a kara throw. If performed correctly you should see vega scoot much farther forward than he did from the regular throw.
Posted by Jeremie on September 22, 2009 at 6:20 a.m. #293
i was just wondering what are the differences between SF4 Vega(Claw) and HDR(Claw)
because the ranks on the tier lists are completely different...
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on September 22, 2009 at 7:40 a.m. #294
@Jeremie
I think that the HDR claw is more quicker then the SF4 claw and the izuna drop grab waayyy more easier to do in HDR then SF4 claw and low HK slide and pokes are better in HDR.
Again really easy izuna drop that's a very damaging move to be done so easily and fast unlike in SF4 alot of people just kicks you rite out of the move.
Posted by Anonymous on September 22, 2009 at 1:31 p.m. #295
Probably the biggest difference is that in HDR Scarlet Terror had invulnerability frames and could anti air juggle 2 hits into another hit both being the HK input. People actually had a reason to not want to get in Vega's face as opposed to SFIV were he has no invulnerability on any moves.
Also super came out looking exactly like a normal wall dive and did not lose any meter if it whiffed.
Posted by Anonymous on September 22, 2009 at 1:35 p.m. #296
oh also rolling crystal flash was a better pressure tactic and could tag on a crouching medium punch after a HP RCF
Posted by Jeremie on September 22, 2009 at 2:59 p.m. #297
@
Th3 JoK3R J & Anonymous
ahhh i seee thanks a lot for answering...i wonder how Vega would do if he were still the same... my main problems are those that were mentioned...the fact that i can get easily knocked out of all of my moves...and that i dont really have any good anti-airs since Scarlet Terror is sometimes just for show
Posted by Dave on September 23, 2009 at 8:27 a.m. #298
@ Jeremie
Vega's best anti-air is his standing fierce kick, use it when they jump in.
Vega also had better reach in HDRemix. Sf4 nerfed him in just about every way possible
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on September 23, 2009 at 8:17 p.m. #299
@ Dave
I disagree with that because i think the Scarlet Terror is the best anti-air att, i punish alot of people jumping in the air with that move i fail using with the FK most of the time but with ST i don't.
Well it feels better to me using the Scarlet Terror.
Posted by Dave on September 23, 2009 at 8:36 p.m. #300
@ Joker
the scarlett terror is not always reliable because of its terrible priority and vulnerability upon start up.
If you try using the ST on sagat as he's performing his jump in medium punch, it will stuff the ST clean, or trade if performed early enough.
I will agree that if you have it charged, the ST is the best option if you can time it correctly so that it doesnt trade with the jump in attack.
However, if you dont have it charged, the best alternative is the standing HK. Just make sure your spacing is correct.
Posted by Assassin on September 25, 2009 at 2:51 a.m. #301
well I got a SF4 arcade competition and Sagat seemed to be ruling and I couldnt seem to beat this one really great player, but a C. Viper player came along and defeated every super Sagat every single time which kind of made him the undisputed champion, but i destroyed that C Viper player every time and he was never even able to win a round against me. thats how SF4 works, someone can beat a certain amount of ccharacters, but there is always another character that can beat you.
so here are some of my strategies i use against shotos:
I dash forward alot, i hardly never dash backwards because his backwards dash is so weak and flipping is way better.
i do alot of forward dashing, stabbing a few times including Standing hard punch and forward kick, crouching medium and light punches and medium kicks, light rolling crystal flashes and scarlet terrors then get out of there fast. my game is really a jump in + attack + escape
air throws are useful if used aggressively enough
and one of my most favorite moves against shotos is the EX Sky-high claw off of the opponents back wall because it travels right through them, and t hey never see it coming. and i use the wall to my back to catch airbornes or punish fireballs
I use alot of Flying Barcelona attacks which whiff or end in the claw simply to build their confidence so i can mre easily land a bloody claw later in the game.
Scarlet terrors are very useful, I often to the Cosmic Heel to Scarlet terror if I have n EX meter.
Jumping in with HP and going to crouching MP then cancel to Scarlet terror or EX flying barcelona is good, so is landing a jumping HP and then a stnding HP cancellig the first hit into HP Crystal Rolling Flash
on Blanka, the EX flying barcelona attack with a punch button held directly over his electricity and a neutral Joystick position slashes him 2 times. if its a super it will slash him 3 times in the head.
i use forward dash + cosmic heel + Scarlet terron or ex barcelone to izuna drop with quite alot of success.
I use scarlet terrors quite well also, but they reay arent so useful when a skiled opponent is right on top of you.
in cases when i'm being "ticked" by shotos and I'm backed into a wall or they are agressively following my backflips i use crouching light punch to Kara throw, or crouching light punch to light crystal rolling flash, or light punch or light kick to scarlet terror (light scarlet terror to EX scarlet terror if im close enough)
and I do an Izuna wall drop when I have him guessing, You cant believe how easily I land Izuna wall drops straight off the regular flying barcelona once I have them scared of the bloody claw and believing i'm just going to whiff or slash out of the Flying Barcelona
I never crouching hard kick
Posted by Assassin on September 25, 2009 at 3:25 a.m. #302
another useful thing I'm doing:
usually i burn ex meter instead of doing an ultra because i'm not hitting all 3 buttons exactly right, so i usually had to wait until i had used all of my EX meter before attempting an ultra, otherwise i just waste EX meter, and with Vega, there is never enough EX meter, and the whole game all you are doing is trying to get an EX bar.
now, with no EX meter I can get the super out every time.
so I started using reverse input istead. I hold all 3 kick buttons then I do the motion and release all 3 buttons at the same time after i've done the motion, for some reason that is way easier for me and doesnt waste my EX bar.
and you would really be surprised how fast the opponents life meter disappears just from landing 2 or 3 stab combos. such as 2 crouching Light punches + one or 2 crouching medium punches, or a standing light punch + crouching medium punch + standing medium punch + standing hard punch + a standing medium kick or 2 , not unblockable combo, but very easy to land from a safe distance because of the long reach which other players cant judge or cant believe it would hit them, and then retreat.
or just jumping in aggessively with a HP or MP then link to a crouching MP then flipping out works wonders.
the key with vega is to be very aggressive but from a safe distance, and not to get too greedy, get out while you can. retreat early.
as soon as land a jump in strike, crouch strike to crystal flash, I retreat, then I get in fast strike a time or two and get out while the gettin' is good, i dont hang around to see how far i can take or how long until he wises up, this keeps the game in your favor, and you control the scenarios and keeps him on edge and gussing, not knowing what to expect or even if he will have an opportunity to counter or land his combos he is just dying to hit you with
I used to have a hard time with shotos, especially Ryu until I just started jumping in with HP to crouching MP or 2, then that opened the door to alot of other possibilities
shotos rely on intimidation and blocking them is important, and tech-throws when they want to throw you is vital, and alot of times crouching LP can beat out a tickthrow, so learn to be johnny on the spot with LP or LP + LK in those situations,
spacing is key, a jumping HP in the air will beat out most of what shotos throw out in the air, even in cases where Vegas mighty airthrow might not work
and you another really great move is simply just flying out into an EX flying barcelona, timed and aimed as a strike, its a lot like Blankas upward EX roll
learning Blanka and Guile can also help improve Vegas game, jus to get the charge characters gameplay down
Posted by Assassin on September 25, 2009 at 4:01 a.m. #303
light crystal flash and scarlet terror are both awesome moves and they moth link from MP or MK or LP or LK
light crystal flash is fast, and very hard to counter, its one of vegas best moves and can be used in a wide variety of situations
his HK scarlet terror can be used almost anytime, its awesome, has a very far reach, hits 2 times in almost every situation. while it doesnt hit directly on the ground so far, it hits much further in the air and on opponents attacking from a pretty good distance. if you are playing vega wisely, then the Scarlet Terror fits in perfectly with the rest of his distance combos. If you need it as a wakeup, you arent playing vega wisely, but it can be used as a wake up provided the opponents timing is off by a couple frames.
I use HP roling crystal flash FADC into alot of these other moves, jump HP, Crouch MP, and then either crouching LP and then a second crouching lp which whiffs, then a crouhing mp which can usually hit two more times, as it looks like you are already too far away when you whiff the second LP
HP & MP Crystal flash is one of those that can be easily beaten by shotos because its such a telegraphed move, but its fairly easy to throw into a combo, and it can be used by itself if you are far enough away to hit with the last hot two so that it might hit the wakeup uppercut anyway, or in cases where he might be unprepared as he is getting up. your roll shouldnt be too early, you should wait til the last possible frame, which might seem strange because of how slow it begins, but its harder to counter if it begins after he assumes you werent going to do it and plans on doing something other than an uppercut.
Vega's Focus Attack is useful against shotos, for absorbing fireballs, dashing forward which really moves you a great distance across the screen, then cosmic heel or claw strike combo
you can do two cosmic heels in a row, if the first is out at a good distance, which is good against sagat who thinks hes the only guy who can roundhouse two times before the opponent hits the ground.
vegas standing short kick is also very useful in backing people like Balrog off, his standing short kick stuffs about ever straight ground attack Balrog has.
Zangief likes to be hit with Scarlet Terros alot, although he won't admit it.
half back flips are really useful on people who have gotten keen to your full backflip move, and in almost every instance you can half backflip into a standing or crouching LP strike, a Kara throw, or a standing HP to HP crystal rolling flash
Posted by jm21 on September 25, 2009 at 7:40 a.m. #304
great advice assassin will definitely use it.muchas gracias
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on September 26, 2009 at 4:23 p.m. #305
Thanks for the advice earlier, and thanks to assassin for the strats.
A lot of what you are saying, assassin, is proven in that i've picked it up naturally (at least most of it) while playing vega. I still have some holes, but I think that's born from vega not being able to take punishment, and can't deal much punishment either. I say the latter part because many high priority moves, like ryu's shoryuken for example, have almost no cooldown (for lack of a better term). A true punish would be DF+HK (cosmic), ex wall, izuna or something similar (that link does so much dmg). such is the long road of a vega player eh? ^_^
I think my shoto game is coming along (still can't beat my bro's ken), but when I fight a good balrog (boxer) his pokes shut me down and his long as hell combos eat up my health. Jump ins are out-prioritized by c.HK and his jump ins out prioritize a lot too (jump hk). It's a real head scratcher.
Posted by Dave on September 26, 2009 at 4:34 p.m. #306
Tips for fighting Boxer :
1. Punish EX dash punches with backwards jumping HP, cMP, EX walldive combo.
2. Stay as far from corners as humanly possible. If boxer gets you in a corner, you're losing at least half of your health...and thats IF you can escape.
3. Keep out an eye for the rushing low smash, this move is terrible for Claw because Claw players most always idle in the crouching position to charge their moves. If you know its comming, counter with the scarlett terror. It will break right through EX versions aswell since it has armor breaking properties.
4. Try using safe jumps using HP. Try suckering boxer into a headbutt, then punishing with any combo.
5. Use claw's backflip (both versions) sparingly. Boxer's crouching HK has far reach and will punish it most every time. Also, if you abuse too many flips, it will just keep backing you into a corner, which spells death for claw.
And one final tip for Claw...
D/f+HK is great to combo with. Most people use the EX walldive afterwards, but the best bet is using the EX scarlett terror.
There are 2 reasons for this
1. All of us Claw players have had the walldive glitch happen to us many times. Where claw hits the opponent with the EX jumping portion, only to bounce off the wall far too late to land the izuna drop.
This puts the combo at risk
2. The EX scarlett terror version of the combo only does 1 damage less than the EX walldive version. So...
Option A : Use EX walldive for only 1 more damage, but has the possibility of glitching and preventing the combo to be finished.
Option B : Use EX scarlett terror and settle with doing 1 damage less and be rest assured that the combo will always land.
I'd say its an easy choice
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on September 26, 2009 at 5:58 p.m. #307
The Choice is not so easy for me. you throw out your df charge from the cosmic and have to start over with the ex st (unless there is a shortcut I am unaware of). that leaves no margin for error....or lag. In an in-the-room bout, which I do have a few, i see your argument.
also you whiff the ex scarlet and you are punished on wake up most likely. you whiff an ex wall jump, glitch or otherwise, you are pretty far away. I realize in tournament levels people wouldn't be whiffing but I can't see it being favored over ex wall, at least for joe-lazyboy.
I am just saying not to be hasty in discounting ex wall to izuna. I personally struggle with getting the 2 sec charge for the ex st so it will take practice.
Thanks for the strat on boxer. can you tell me what safe jump means?
Posted by Assassin on September 26, 2009 at 8:16 p.m. #308
I traveled to another city and played at the local arcade and i beat Giefs and Ryu's and Kens, had a little trouble on an awesome Guile player, and battled out the endless battles of a General Bison. but eventually the guy called in a pro because his friend came about an hour later and mirrored me on Vega and beat me for a long time. I couldnt believe there was a better Vega than me. I dont think he was better in actual Veg skill as me, but he was better in overall SF4 gameplay which helped him out alot, things like going forward and backwards alot, he dashed forward way more than I ever do, he did alot of whiffs on me like I do on shotos, he used his ultra immediately after I did a wall dive, which worked every time. what I figured out was that mirrored vegas are alot like they used to be in Championship edition, same kind of match up, timing wins, dont get into stabbing battles with a vega, you have a 50% of losing out. I had to start playing vega like i play El Fuerte (my 2nd) or Abel (my 3rd). vega is pretty punishable after his wall dive claw strike, if you do a half backflip to avoid the block freeze time. and just like in championship, whoever leaves the ground first to the wall dive gets punished, ex bloody claws are useful, otherwise, vegas air throw can throw vega out of most wall dives and be caught anytime from after he leaves the ground to before he extends his claw, and works best when you are closer to ega before he leaves the ground, if he is farther across the screen, and quick forward dash will improve the chances of catching him with an air throw.
as for the cosmic heel to ex scarlet terror, i found a way to get over the wall glitch. and I do this with great consistency when ex flying Barcelone in the corner, after your stike hitsand grabs the wall you need to fly straight up and towards the wall even further, then you need to direct your self down and out away from the wall and delay the grab until the last possible frame. so far I havent ran into the wall glitch anymore. but you need to be pretty conscious of everything you are doing every time, because its quite different and takes a lot more effor than the regular izuna drop away from the wall. and I think it looks way cooler than the scarlet terror, but i do alot of cosmic heels to regular scarlet terror just to save ex meter, (just flip the joystick to down and forward and to down back charge before the animation for cosmic heel begins, then execute the Scarlet Terror when the oppponent has almost hit the ground), and the ex scarlet terror i generally save for times when i need the ex to beat out other moves. but the cosheel to ex ST gets the job done, though not as sexy when doing it, i love that izuna drop after flying barcelona, its one of my favorite moves in all of SF4.
Posted by Assassin on September 26, 2009 at 8:17 p.m. #309
and i am guessing the "safe jump" against Boxer he is referring to is well-timed jumps with HP, probaby backwards. Boxer is one of those players that if you screw up one time you are dead.
the ex bloody claw from his back wall works good as part of a combo, so do whiffs and flying slashes from a distance which just reach him or hit is back side. The scarlet terror works good after connecting with crouching MK or MP, and most imprtant with balrog is never risking a hit, its better to block and get away, because as soon as he connects your dead. the best bet for close up attacks is only after a straight in charging hit or his spinning 3-button hit which you can stuff with standing LKs and go into a crouching hit combo or even a standing HP to HCRF, or another combo from there, otherwise keeping at a safe distance is all i do. but if you do a forward dash from the right distance you will usually find Boxer coming forward for a headbutt or a combo at which point you have a pretty good chance of hitting with a cosmic heel.
in all, Vega's power lies in combos, alot of them are hard to set up but comboing is the key to vega, i dont do much in the way of 11-hit combos, but I'm working up to that level, because its really the only way to get in on an opponent like boxer and do alot of damage without getting killed in the process
the guy I mirrored was just great in general SF4 gameplay such as constant re-distancing, Focus Attacks, FA dash back cancels, FADC's, tick throws, kara throws, blocking and waiting. I get really impatient and I have never played vega as a sit and wait character, which is half the reason he beat me, he did alot of camping/turtling which i never do because it drives me nuts. but he was really good with his blocks, waiting, drawing out, creating openings for the opponent to attack and then countering, and other SF4 gaeplay I'm sure he picked up from playing other characters, this guy was also the best I've seen with Guile, which probably explains alot about his game
Posted by Dave on September 26, 2009 at 9:02 p.m. #310
Safe jumps are jumps that are timed so that you land right before the enemy's reversal connects.
You can think of it as a fake out jump.
Your attack will still connect, and you'll be safe from reversals. The timing is just a little difficult to become accustomed to. You may see players in high level play vids doing it.
Another good tip is abusing the izuna drop.
If you land an izuna drop you can start charging immediatly after it connects. as soon as you recover from the animation, walldive again.
As you jump off the wall, delay the motion for a sec, then cross over at the last second possible, preferrably as close to boxer's back half as possible. You'll either land another izuna drop, or Boxer will try a reversal headbutt.
Even if he does perform the headbutt, if you corssed over at the last second he'l headbutt in the wrong direction and you bloody claw him instead, which sets up for yet another walldive.
Eventually they'll get smart and try to focus counter, but boxer has a big enough hitbox where you should be able to land the izuna drop consecutively. It works wonders for me.
This tactic is also useful against Sagat, since his hitbox is huge.
Posted by Assassin on September 27, 2009 at 5:45 a.m. #311
the EX flying barcelona from your back wall that hits with a neutral joystick position slashes 2 times and kills FA's and most other counter hits. Most characters in the game have a crouching move which completely wipes out the Izuna drop, it just depends on if your opponent has learned it yet or not, so the EX overhead double rip is really useful for building up their blocking rather than countering your flying attacks
Posted by Dave on September 28, 2009 at 12:34 p.m. #312
Good tip assassin, i play a guy who always focus counters it. i'll use that to mix it up.
Another combo : Cosmic heel, light scarlett terror, EX scarlett terror. 268 damage
Cosmic heel, EX scarlett terror only does 260
Its harder to do, and only does 8 additional damage, so use if you really want to.
Also, its better to use the light scarlett first in combos.
Example :
Combo A - Jumping FP, cMP/cMK, EX walldive izuna drop = 315 damage
Combo B - Jumping FP, cMK, EX scarlett terror = 314 damage
Combo C - Jumping FP, cMK, light scarlett terror, EX scarlett terror = 327 damage
Posted by Jeremie on September 28, 2009 at 1:53 p.m. #313
@ Dave
doesnt the Scarlett Terror whiff on a combo unless its HK or EX ?
Posted by Assassin on September 28, 2009 at 2:22 p.m. #314
thanks for the numbers
i think the main reason that mirror beat me was because he was one of the only players i've ever played with respect for vega. most other players simply are too proud or arrogant or confident to concede to a more defensive approach against vega, and not take anything for granted, the guy played me like vega might play balrog, ryu, or sagat, which made him very hard to beat
we vegas play guarded against alot of top tier characters but almost nobody plays so guarded against us, as most people just think they can just walk up to vega and kick the crap out of him, because i think SF4 was created with a weak CPU vega version, just to keep Vega more enigmatic.
and thats what made this mirror so different from every other match up. It was the only time i ever played someone who truly respected and truly feared vega, as all characters SHOULD
Posted by Assassin on September 28, 2009 at 2:28 p.m. #315
@Jeremie
Thats what I hate, the Light ST whiffs unless its in the range of crouching LK, and a pretty close one, i can only ever successfully use it on over-confident shotos trying to throw me when they are exactly ontop of me or jump in combos where i land very close. I havent really found any other way to use it besides when someone is jumping in right on top of you. i whiff that so much i pretty much just stopped using it
Posted by Assassin on September 28, 2009 at 2:53 p.m. #316
about removing his claw, taking either the claw or mask off manually resets the number of blocked hits you've taken, so by taking off the claw manually at any chance you have, you won't lose it from attacks.
the claw always goes to center-stage, if it goes forward, a forward dash will resuit it as it lands, and if it goes backwards, holding back on the joystick just before doing a full back flip will pick it up with the hand plant if the item is aleady on the ground (doing the normal back flip without holding back first will whiff)
Posted by noob on September 28, 2009 at 7:03 p.m. #317
Great to see all this buzz on the vega board! Thanks to all the notes above.
Question to Assassin or whoever might know this - anyway to combo vega's Super after a Scarlet Terror? I _thought_ I remember seeing a youtube vid on this but haven't been able to find it and certainly haven't been able to do it.
The Super i'm referring to isn't the multiple throw - but the stick neutral multi-hit.
thanks in advance!
Posted by Jink on September 29, 2009 at 4:30 a.m. #318
My wish list for SSF4:
1. I hope that Vega's claw to get unbeatable trade-hit properties.
2. I hope that Vega's wall dive bugs get removed, and that Vega can go through opponents during forward Barcelona (EX).
Its so annoying when Vega's forward Barcelona gets stock with jumping opponents, totally unable reach the wall.
3. Vega's df+MK (Piece of Mercury) should be an overhead.
4. Vega's claw and mask toss should hit opponents, just like Dudley's rose taunt in SF3. The mask hitting opponent should result in higher stunt damage.
Posted by Googie_1 on September 29, 2009 at 5:36 a.m. #319
As for the improvements of vega,
I think:-
1. Vega should deal a little more damage so you dont have to hit the opponent a million times.
2. His Scarlet terror should HAVE a MUCH highier priority.
3. His bar should comsume slightly less energy when he's hit.
4. The Rolling Claw Attack should come out much quicker with the mid/high punch.
I'd be very happy with just that.
Although Jink's comments about the bugs when jumping off the wall is a MUST. I've lost games just to that and nothing else.
The claw/mask hitting opponents is a very cool idea indeed!
Ohh what I would love, if the Sky High Claw EX (going forward) would knock an opponent into air so Vega could bounce off the wall and slice them as they fall down!! That would be cool!!
Posted by Jeremie on September 29, 2009 at 5:44 a.m. #320
All I want are some invulnerability frames for Scarlet Terror
Posted by Jeremie on September 29, 2009 at 5:45 a.m. #321
also i want his original speed and range back
Posted by Dave on September 29, 2009 at 7:43 a.m. #322
Jeremie, you are half-right
The cosmic heel combo works, but the jumping in combo only works against sagat and bigger characters.
Sorry for the confusion.
As for tweaking, if scarlett terror had invincible start up frames and the ultra tracked the enemy's position (making it hit an airborne enemy) i would be happy
Posted by googie_1 on September 29, 2009 at 9:14 a.m. #323
The invincible start up is a must i agree.
Like the idea of the ultra.
What about reverting the super to its old form where the bar only deplenishes once vega lands the Izuna Drop ?
Posted by Assassin on September 29, 2009 at 9:55 a.m. #324
@noob: i dont know about the combo, buty I suppose it would have to work off of the LKST if at all, then instead of an EXST maybe you can do the ultra? i dont know, it sounds cool, i will give it a try.
as for "SSF4" general fixes, I have wanted a move that wakes people up from stars without doing damage, such as HK+HP + forward when close, like a little slap in the face and the opponent says something cordial and bows before fighting can resume
and I would also like "friendly moves" like instead of an Izuna Drop you could do something friendly which controls the opponent in a held "grab" state, but performs a funny friendly gesture that doesnt take of any life and sets the opponent a safe distance away from you. Vegas friendly move could be a flying barcelona attack and then it grabs them like a drop but instead it just does something like a little fun toss with roses or something, and eery character would have their own "friendly" move which can be thrown into combos
as for Vega specific things, I would like him returned to his original status as "way too powerful" and join the top tier rankings, as he is a final shadaloo boss afterall
i honestly feel like the designers made him perfect and someone over at capcom cried about it, and then they systematically took him apart and dwarfed about everything he has. i feel he has been WAY over-tampered with.
his ST has been weakened, and probably had the invincibile frames removed, as well as the range made more difficult
The Wall "Glitch" i think was intentional, forcing a claw strike instead, i dont think it is a glitch at all, but a nerf
and I think his combos have been tampered with as well, his combos arent half as cool as alot of the other players in SF4, and his strength seems really diminished especially against strong characters like Gief and Sagat.
Vega was the strongest player in the game initially, so he had to be nerfed in several ways
i think we can all see what was tampered with just by what we can all see needs to be restored in order for him to be the top character in the game
i want him restored to be top tier character who owns sagat, like he used to be
Posted by Dave on September 29, 2009 at 9:55 a.m. #325
Googie
that would be nice, his super is basically useless because of the start up animation at the wall, its a dead give away that its coming, and therefore easy to dodge.
Its especially useless against any character with a teleport : bison, dhalsim, seth, and akuma
Posted by Assassin on September 29, 2009 at 10:24 a.m. #326
i think the star wake-up move is essential in SF4 because people are playing mostly on-line on MSN, and SF4 isnt even really an official arcade in alot of countries, and everyone is playing so crappy.
everyone has become so obsessed with their online "rankings" that they are getting aweay with running cheese games.
cheese has now become the standard of gameplay, and people who play with class are now called "scrubs" by the cheeseheads.
People who choose the biggest and most powerful player in the game are now "the most skilled", whereas actually the person who picks the strongest player in the game actually does so because of lack of skill
comparing past street fighters to SF4 its clear that many things have taken a turn for the worse, and been overrun by the anonymity of the internet.
never has hitting in a stun state been considered "1337" gameplay until SF4. neither has doing the exact same move 8 times in a row on an opponent who is having difficulty blocking it ever been considered "skill" until SF4.
Neither has evening out the game by letting the oponent have a round or get in a few free hits ever been known as being the gameplay of "scrubs" until SF4
SF4 has somehow become the exact opposite of all other games, and its due to the "internet syndrome." where people can litereally get away with anything in the name of a higher score, which of course used to be known as scrub games and cheese.
SF4 and Windows Live have created a portal to a parallel gaming universe where everything is the exact opposite of what it actually is
and these kind of "free-stun-state wake-ups" and "friendly moves" etc are ways to bring balance back to the game.
honestly, i feel there is like a "SF4 Council" who has been deciding what is and isnt gameplay, and they have decided to be what would normally simply be the cheapest, cheesiest, most anal, unsportsmalike, petty, and insignificant scrub game-play on the planet. which has now somehow become the ONLY acceptable thing
which is unacceptable
Posted by Kage on September 29, 2009 at 12:31 p.m. #327
@Assassin: wow I thought it was just me. I USED to give the opponent the 2nd round - makes round 3 more exciting and pressures me to play well.
I didn't expect any thanks - but i certainly didn't expect the bad attidue.
Posted by ??? on September 29, 2009 at 1:53 p.m. #328
just my opinions
about beating up someone when they are stuned or the same moves being done over and over... i honestly dont have a problem with those things.... its just that if i get stunned..it means i should have been more careful... if i keep getting hit by the same moves over and over...shouldnt i try to at least adjust to it? it would be my fault for letting that happen
i think anything goes...because no matter what, its up to the person/player to not let those things happen...
im going to take hadoken spammers as an example....i love them...i really do...cause most of them dont seem to know that i can jump over them or fly through them with the EX Sky High Claw
Posted by Assasin on September 29, 2009 at 5:21 p.m. #329
don't get me wrong, constant Haddokens is weak, but not cheap. theres a difference. which why I also advocate for there to be a charge "Kata" and an additional 3rd meter which must be filled by charging, (performing a move on the control panel in your free time, much like taking off vegas claw) except the move can be done during heated battle, and the meter gradually decreases with every fireball.
I think the Focus Attack move should charge a 3rd "Ki" meter (internal power meter) every time it is used, which will then build the amount of projectiles that can be thrown. so its either only for projectile players, or everyone in the gamee maybe given a projectile, even as small as Dan's or smaller even, some thrown like Guokens, others even lower then Sagats, etc. because an infinite supply of fireballs seems holllow and meaningless when the SF4 graphics can animate so well, the fireballs should be more powerful, and show power being built and thrown every time, for guile, shotos, chun-li, and Dhalsim, at least
but there are moves in the game which can be done repeatedly on certain characters without a powerful wakeup move, such as Giefs and Abels throws, and few others that can be repeated until the match is over without the oponent able to get out of the cycle, which is fine because its always been that way, the only difference is that now its termed 'leet skill'
and thankyou Kage, giving the opponent the 3rd round is the most fundamentally enjoyable aspect of streetfighter. especially at the arcade, there is no way that I am ever going to sit there and kick the crap out of everyone without high-level gameplay without gving them a free round. Because i just dont like to take people's money, want them and me to enjoy a full 3 or 5 round match.
when i was learning at the arcade, i was a total noob who didnt even know how to throw or focus atack, but everyone i played used the full force of their high-level game play both rounds, everytime, as cheap as they could possibly be
now that I am a top level competitor i play people who i am far better than all the time, and I would never just wipe them out 2 rounds in a row, time after time.
I sat there yesterday playing a guy who spent the equivolent of like 50 dollars playing me, simply because i am a cool player and I always let him win a round and I never annhialted him, but the kept the rounds close and interesting. i didnt just stand there and let him beat me up either, i let him work on his game play, and occasionally i just lost and switched characters in rder to balance out the money he was spending with the amount of time i was playing. which is what everyone does and enjoys about SF, until the SF4/ Windows Live marriage I think SSF4 needs to drop Windows Live and support other more neutral technologies which dont focus the whole thing on scores and points but just allow regular arcade gameplay in a better environment
Posted by Assassin on September 29, 2009 at 5:41 p.m. #330
in fact, SSF4 should come as a raw game package built ony for Arcade game play, without all the meaningless rankings, which simply makes doofs like balrog and the most cheesiest things the most popular stuff in the game.
99% of all video games in the world (including all previous SFs) have a top player by the name of "AAA" because nobody gives acrap about the meaningless score which doesnt take into account gameplay at all
the damage is done, let SF4 always be for people who need high scores in life. But let SSF4 have nothing to do with those insecurities and be a solid arcade interface, with nothing more than a name, a 3 letter name would be better.
Posted by Assassin on September 29, 2009 at 8:24 p.m. #331
honestly, i felt that it was just because i needed to get better too, but in fact, SF4 is created very biased towards Ryu, Sagat and a few others
for example: Ryu can uppercut two times and EX spin and he throw out is Ultra AND his Super in a single combo, i think the creators overly favored Ryu.
Chunli can no-shadow kick the crap out of you 2 times, then flying spin kick you, EX ground spin kick you, and then perform her ultra, and i'm sure i'm missing about 5 other things tied into her combos. they are literally endless with one powerful multi-hit move after another.
Balrog boxer is simply over powered and given moves which hit way too many times for his power
and what does Vega have? nothing which even compares in the slightest to those others combos.
Dhalsim, Abel, C Viper, Rufus, Sagat, Ken, Akuma, all have awesome combos compared with Vega, Guile, Blanka and El Fuerte
i think the creators of SF4 just figured noobs would always think they needed to improve, rather than realizing what everyone realized, that only a few characters in the game are given the combos to actually compete
and SF4 is all combo-ased, so why is it that only Ryu as a couple others have all the combos and there are so many characters with crap for combos?
it seems someone with an obsession for Ryu to win created SF4, then created Sagat and and a few others to mask his inequality in design, and then left the rest twising in the wind to become his own personal fodder
Posted by Dave on September 29, 2009 at 8:34 p.m. #332
I don't want to spend money every time i want to play ssf4.
Its nice to have a commonplace for ssf4 fans to gather and share strats and such. But if it came down to either the arcade or console, I choose the console.
I'll host at my house for people to gather if needs be.
I see what you're saying Assassin, there really is no good vibe with most online players, and bad mentality aswell.
I, however, have had the good fortune of playing great fighters online who have good attitudes towards friendly compitition.
Don't get me wrong, online parties don't compare to a room filled with competiters when it comes to a great experience. But its still not all that bad either.
Posted by Dave on September 29, 2009 at 9:09 p.m. #333
@ Assassin
Its true that characters are over-powered. But I understand why capcom might have given characters some of the movesets they have.
Vega, for example, has pretty much no use of his focus dash cancel, other than mix up games with his crystal flash (which in itself is really somewhat foolish). His focus attack is also somewhat slow for being a character known for speed.
Yet he does have moves that are more useful than initially thought.
Key examples :
1. EX Sky high claw (towards opponent) - great for crossing over attacks, especially when their back is close to the wall. They basically have a split second to block it. Most players assume that its the EX walldive, and hold back to block, only to have it transition to holding towards claw as he crosses sides. Also usful as a final chip damage strike.
2. EX Walldive (Towards distant opponent) - great for when you're winning and your opponent wants to get close to get even. It comes out so quickly that if your opponent is trying to dash in close to close the gap, they'll get hit. Backflip to lure them in and then use it, they'll definitely get hit.
Also great for a final chip damage strike if they are turtling. Even if they somehow avoid it by crouching, just bloody claw them after you bounce off the wall. Position yourself right above them so they dont know which way to counter. Useful for shoto's
If the character counters with a downward charge move (headbutt, flash kick, etc.) just crossover to one side at the last second. The reversal atack will come out on the opposite side, but they'll still get hit with the bloody claw.
3. Rolling crystal flash - Great to mix up after light and medium pokes. The light version does 27 chip damage and the fierce version does 42 chip damage, which is equivilant to Sagat's Tiger uppercut chip damage.
Not only does it do the same amount of chip damage as Sagat's tiger uppercut, but its safe on block aswell. Mix both the fierce and light versions into your poking game to annoy your opponent.
Posted by Kage on September 29, 2009 at 9:18 p.m. #334
@ noob
Hey found that youtube video for a combo into Vega's _super_. Gonna try to work on this tonight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9ZWf0...
Posted by Dave on September 30, 2009 at 12:53 a.m. #335
Thats pretty neat, but no need to practice it. I just tried it out, took a liitle time but i got it.
Its a waste of super bar lol
Posted by Jink on September 30, 2009 at 12:57 a.m. #336
SF4 is a fighting game, everything goes. Spamming for winning is not a bad thing, its being a smart player. Not hitting stunned opponents with the biggest damage you can pull on them, is not being smart.
Fighting games are about; knowledge, timing, calculated gambles, reflexes, luck, and patience.
Holding back against your opponents is an insult to them.
Giving everything you got, no mater what, is fair.
If I stun my opponents, they better pray that I do miss my punishment, because I'm going to make it hurt for sure.
Playing to the max level, is applying everything you know you can do, under any presented situation. If I have something to win a match with, why limit myself from applying it? Playing to the max, is not about being "brave", is not about being "just"... playing to the max, is about being smart.
A good martial artist is not defined by his offenses, but by his defense. A fighter's attacks are defined by his fighting style, but a fighter's defenses are defined his OWN reactions against the unexpected. Be adaptive.
Posted by Jeremie on September 30, 2009 at 1:15 a.m. #337
@ Jink
i totally agree with you....thats like telling a boxer not to finish off a dazed opponent...you just have to finish what you started... play to ones fullest or dont play at all
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 2:51 a.m. #338
except that it is unacceptable in any sport fight to hit an opponent who is unable to defend himself or fight back, or unaware of what is happening, whether its American boxing, Kickboxing, Olympic Fighting sports, Mixed Martial Arts Tournaments, or any martial arts tournament, or the UFC. its simply unethical behavior and is not being "smart" but is simply bad sportsmanship.
you wont even find that in underground streetfights such as in fightclubs etc.
the only time you will find that sort of behavior is when someone is out for blood, and then its usually a fight to the death, which is not SF4 play, as anyone who has read the stories, seen the cartoons, or knows anything about the SF4 story line, or can even read the dialogues between matches will reaffirm for you, it is not a blood match, b ut friendly sport fighting.
i've heard that argument alot, but its all nonsense from people who have no idea what a sport fighting is to justify their SF4 cheese. i there is an SF4 committee in charge of perpetuating such propaganda
and by "Arcade" i means console/ PC game play in a strict Arcade format, where you can select to go to a special screen to read the 3 letter abbreviations for champions on an obscure little list, but he actual game of SSF4 would be strictly "Arcade" style meaning no rankings and awards for cheese players who pick the strongest players in the game and ruin the whole gameplay just for own desires for points and recognition.
honestly i feel like its just a few people who have a following and influence who run cheese and claim to be the best, but its simply not possible that 1. running cheese games and 2. choosing the strongest character = equals a worthy opponent
but i think every characters FADC should be as useful as the shotos or Abels or the other players who were actually hooked up in SF4. what use is a FADC if you cant even combo with it
its ridiculous
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 3:02 a.m. #339
and you arent offending anyone by NOT doing combos which could be done without the presence of your opponent. Some of the combos are so ridiculous that you might as well pack and go home after getting hit one time.
and to top off the insanely ludicrous combos which turn your game into a movie and you might as well just go and get some popcorn, they also go ahead and keep stun states, as if a 24 hit combo wasnt long and boring enough to watch, you were then also stunned, which in SF4 is like handing someone a free 24-hit combo, and stun states usually happen during a previous combo, and I have played several games where after I was hit one time i was dead and didnt even get to play any more.
and yet there are people out there who will actually try to tell you that that is 'good' for you, and is their responsibility. which is like saying its General Bisons responsibility to do that tick thrw thing he did until you are dead in SF2 championship. Its simply more propaganda from the SF4 propaganda committee responsible for brainwashing people into believing in cheese
Posted by Cowboy_soultaker on September 30, 2009 at 1:20 p.m. #340
my two-cents:
When I used to play Akuma hard core, back when SF4 first came out, a lot of people didn't know you could avoid Raging Demon on wake-up. So if I saw they couldn't avoid it, I'd stop. I didn't know it was avoidable myself till later anyway. I'd throw the second round sometimes to keep it interesting like you said, Assassin.
Now, I've dropped akuma and picked up claw and I fight my brother, and he's really good at it. If he ever throws me a round, I am furious about it, because I'm not the same fighter as the people just picking up the game, I dont' need a pity round. If he pulls punches that hurts my claw strat in the long run because I'm adjusting to the pulled punches.
There is a happy medium, and I'm sure you'd agree with me. I get too competitive, personally, because SF has been with me for years, and people are just now picking it up and already better then me. But if you're sliding in a quarter or putting the disc in for the first time that competitive spirit isn't really ignited yet, and you could be discouraged before 15 minutes passes.
Cheese wins, that is how most on the PC get to g3-a and probably g2. It is a terrible feeling setting down the controller/joystick and thinking "I was the better player, but because this person new a few tricks they won". Whats worse is, the fact that these types of players are getting beyond g3 with their tactics. (or perhaps they are just trolls). But the good outweighs the bad i think, SF4 has rekindled a lot of fires, and started some new flames, and thanks to that we can look forward to SSF4.
PS: DF-MK, as someone said earlier, MUST become and overhead. That little change could help quite immensely.
Posted by Jeremie on September 30, 2009 at 3:44 p.m. #341
mind you...i said "dazed"
i will take UFC as an example...when someone gets knocked down from a hit...and they are still able to defend..but feel a little dazed...doesnt the other fight jump right on and start atttacking to finish it? thats all i was getting at
but that aside...cause i also see your point
when i FADC with Claw...i usually throw...or dash back when my combo is blocked...and actually if im not mistaken...after a FADC if you are close enough you can hit then with a crouching LP to start another combo...
even then....its better to save up the meter for any of his EX Attacks
Posted by Jink on September 30, 2009 at 3:58 p.m. #342
@Assasin: Stand truth to your name.
Ethics? This is a video game, no one gets hurt. In real fighting, hitting a dazed opponent is wrong, because permanent mental/physical damage is present. The moment they are unable to defend themselves, the fight is over. The stunned opponent is declared the loser of the match.
In fighting games with stun possibilities, when players get stunned, the fight continues. That's what the Life bar is for in fighting games. Empty life bar = K.O. end of the round, end of the fight.
Stuns are part of the gameplay's reckless/cautious punishment/reward system. If you got stunned, you deserve what coming up, if you stunned your opponents, they deserve what coming up.
Imagine, getting stunned by a player during an awesome match, then all of the sudden, he jabs you. (think about it) You got your self stunned, your opponent could have hit you hard or finish you, but all you get, is pity. Unacceptable, now that... is unethical.
The other thing is, stuns don't happen that often during matches involving good players. Each one of them is trying to win the match, they are balanced during the fight, they are both a threat to each other, one of them gets stunned... "Oh sh1t, I manage to stun him, this is it, I must not screw up now"
Otherwise, leaving your opponent that chance, might mean the end of your participation on that fight, gathering, bracket, or/and tournament. You lose, period.
Most players don't get this idea at first, but playing for fun truthfully, is accomplished by playing to win.
Wanting to win at all cause, is what makes you and your opponents, to get smarter, to get better.
Holding back = depriving them and yourself from knowledge through first-hand experience. "Is not fair, I wanted to see what you could have done to me, so I could learn from it and become stronger."
The world's top players don't brag themselves about this and that... they give props to each other, they get better.
About playing cheesee and spaming labels: (to anyone who think this way) stop crying and get better, learn from the player who spams against you. Give them from their own medicine.
In the end is not the player's fault who wants to master all-there-is in a fighting game, and finding something that makes him near invincibly. Is the developers fault for not doing enough test with real top-player.
"If its there, and legal, use it." As long as everyone can remember, doing big combos has never involved inputting cheat/code passwords before a match (Except in MK3).
Posted by Jink on September 30, 2009 at 3:58 p.m. #343
@Assassin: I'm not criticizing you, its your decision. I'm just stating the competitive fighting facts. When I was 18 (younger, etc/long time ago) I use to let anyone get back to the ring in SmashBros. I use to not do combos at all in SF3, I used not to do traps in GGXX. I used not do Ring Outs in SC.
When I was young... I used to think like that, ethics...
When I was young... I used not give my best.
When I was young... I got very behind.
I'm 25 now, and I kick ass using the lowest tier in fighting games. Contra!!
Its time to grow up. Everything goes!
Play to win = playing for fun. Enjoy.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on September 30, 2009 at 4:09 p.m. #344
I agree with pretty much everything jink. People have the right to be upset about cheese. But on the other side I think people who lose to such players (including myself) are more upset with ourselves for losing, for the very reason you pointed out. We didn't adjust our strat and punish them for it.
Also, to your second post, i played the exact same way. SF4 is the first fighter i researched, read and practiced with. You gotta play all out all the time, because who knows, the guy you gave a few punches to could be a huslter and sweep the next 2 rounds.
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 10:50 p.m. #345
well, unlike you, I grew up playing SF2 as part of my daily life since its release in the arcade.
well, so what is it? a moment ago it was all about the "real martial artists" and now its "just a game get over it"
no thanks, I would prefer to have the game changed, the programming, the pixel animation and rules.
I played it about every single day of my highschool life,. along with SF2 championship, Hyperfighting and Turbo. I'd stop at any arcade or gas station or convenience store or movie theater with a game every place i went, usually playing at 4 or 5 different locations per day.
never in all my billions of matches did anyone hit me in a stun state. i can ony remember about 2 times, and those people quickly learned not to. the difference with SF4 is everyone is hiding at home on windows live in their basement where they can pretend to be einstein and the incerdible hulk combined and make 10001 excuses for their "mommys basement" ethics.
and the point i am trying to make is that while its 'just a game', there are real actual people you are playing. but that doesnt even register in the minds of people hiding our it the basement, hence their cheeseball playstyles.
Vega was made weak, designed weak, and not given any cool combos, where as Ryu and severl others were seem to have been given the combo play style SF4 was designed for, where as players like Vega were made to be less than competitive.
i dont know anyone who has won a tournament with Vega, Elfuerte, Dhalsim and several others. they arent even playing the same game Ryu is. where are all the combos and super moves that link to other super moves with one EX after another.
stun states are fine in SF2, when all your opponent could do was get in a spinning pile driver or a 4-hit uppercut
Stun states do not belong in a game where one hit leads and combos to another and link to others and the player is unable to do anything until the next stun state.
stop trying to validate weak playning styles, you cannot excuse the unexcusable. it needs to be fixed. either stun states need to be removed or there needs to be friendly wake ups which of course would have the effect of making everyone who super combos stunned players simply appear weak. and it seems there is a significant portion of the SF4 player population who really has some kind of fear of appearing weak.
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 11:15 p.m. #346
the main problems with the character inconsistencies lie in combos. some players like Sagat, Ryu, and ChunLi are literaly able to combo practically until a stun state. I honestly feel Stunstates were only kept in SF4 so that some of those characters had an end to their combos, otherwise some of those combos simply wouldnt end.
I think every character in SF4 should be given the same amount of EX combos and normal hit combos. If Ryu can hit X amount of times, so should Dhalsim be able to, and if Ryu can link his Ultra and his Super, so should El Fuerte and every other player, and if Chun Li can link 3 EX moves together, so should every other character in the game be able to.
because honestly the whole "get better" approach to solving problems is actually just a funny joke used by people who use those characters with limitless combos
the truth of the matter is, and cannot be hidden anymore, at this late stage of the game, is that even if every character is played at their full max potential, flawlessly, the same unbalance still exists
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 11:24 p.m. #347
Vega should be able to link an EX scarlet terrot to an EX flying barcelona hit, wall cancel to EX bloddy claw, cancel to EX Crystal Rolling Flash, Canel to Ultra
and Super linked to Ultra
and short punch to medium punch to short kick to medium kick to piece of mercury to cosmic heel
if he can do all of that, go ahead and keep the stun states, and lets go to town
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 11:33 p.m. #348
or rather ultra linked to super
then he will be the exact same as those other characters.
the reason people like getting away with theat crap is that is becasuse many players CANT do it
lets make all Characters on par with Ryu for combos, shall we? will u be such a big proponent of limitless combos then?
i think not
Posted by Assassin on September 30, 2009 at 11:40 p.m. #349
how would you feel about this combo?
short punch x2 , short kick, medium punch, medium kick, forward HK, Piece of Mercury, to Cosmic Heel to EX scarlet terror to EX flying barcelona to Izuna Drop to EX blodody claw to EX crystal rolling flash to Ultra
that would simply make the combos even.
Posted by Jeremie on September 30, 2009 at 11:54 p.m. #350
but isnt that the reason SF4 has damage scaling? for combos that are lengthy? and that continue off of stuns?
i just want to know what exactly the problem is...is it stun hits...lengthy combos...lack of chained attacks?
the only thing i see that Vega needs an upgrade on are his super and ultra...and if Scarlett Terror had some invulnerability frames...
but thats just me and my opinions
Posted by Jeremie on September 30, 2009 at 11:56 p.m. #351
i guess thats a nice combo and it would be nice to see anything like that in game...but we have to use what we have for now...until we do get an upgrade
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 10:19 a.m. #352
@Assassin
LOL XD Dude, grow up. Don't take personally.
I also play all fighting games since I was a kid. My first fighting game was SF2, then MK. Both I played on their release days on Arcade.
I played competitively at many different Arcade rooms, Arcade tournaments, etc. I never expect mercy, and I never had it from anyone. Swallowing (mutual) pity, is not my thing, heheheh.
I always played against grown ups who used to not even let kids play. But with time, and dedication, I earned there recognition and respect. I rarely played someone at my own age. I was called: "The kid that never quits."
Since 1992, when I was 8 years old (factual), I grow up playing: SF2(A3,3,4), MK, MK2, MK(3,4), WorldHeros, SamuraiShowdonw(2,3,4), KillerInstinct(2), VirtuaFighter2(4,5), SoulEdge(SB), SC(2,3,4), DOA(1,2,3,2U), GG(X,XX,XXS,XXAC), SSB(M,B), FightersDestiny, Tekken4(5), EternalChampions(LOL), etc. and I didn't liked MvC, CvS, MB(garbage), and HnK.
I even stop playing other game genres, for playing fighting games. n_n
XD XD so there you have my "resume" LOL. All played on face2face, live-action gatherings, tournaments, and long trip challenges, but no money matches (dam, I wish that I was young again).
I have to thank you Assassin, you've made me remember a lot of good times, thanks. ;)
Assassin, buddy... its simple, you have your way, but everyone has there own ways too. You can't go around saying this-and-that just because it doesn't fits you. Don't promote people into being like a certain way, especially when facts are not involved. All I'm saying is, that everyone has the right to play to the fullest. Regardless of the hate they might get for being too good.
It happens... some will hate you and stay behind, but others will respect you and then, they'll get better than you (sh1t, heheheh).
Playing to the fullest is not wrong. Giving pity and mercy can be ok sometimes, but it is not smart to practice such thing that will not help you and your opponent to get better, period.
About the martial art example, it was just an example. Read about the history, so you'll see the first purpose of martial arts, then you'll understand my examples.
I have a bad tendency of talking advice, assuming people might know at least some reference... but I guess not everyone is as old as I am. :(
By the way, it sucks, getting older, just takes you away and away from the good things. Too much "responsibilities." :( (blah, My a$$)
Assassin, just be cool. ;) This is a game, no one gets hurt, its trial-and-error, its everlasting, its ever changing, IT IS... NON-STOP-CHALLENGING. The harder it gets, the better and more fun it is.
In the end, the smarter wins.
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 11:35 a.m. #353
@Assassin
I forgot to add in my "resume" (XD), my characters:
SF2) Ken, Guile. SFA3) Charlie. SF3 Alex. SF4) Vega.
MK) Kano, Scorpion, Sonya. MK2) KungLao, Scorpion, Raiden, LiuKang. MK3) Cyrax, KungLao, Sector. MK4) QuanChi, Scorpion, Jareck, Sonya, Raiden, LiuKang.
GG up to XXAC) Ky.
KI) Orchid, Saberwolf.
SSB up to brawl) Link.
SE up to SC4) Siegfried.
DOA) JannLee.
SS) Galford.
EC) Shadow.
Tekken) Lee.
FD) Ninja, Robo.
VF2) Lion. VF4) Lion, LeiFei, Akira, Sarah. VF5) Lion, Kage, Akira, Sarah, Vanessa, LeiFei. (I love Virtua Fighter, I think is the most competitive fighting game, too bad most people are scare of ti).
I don't like top tiers.
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 1:46 p.m. #354
When SF4 was announced and I saw the trailers, I decided that Vega was the main. Weeks later, he happens to be low tier.
This is my story in term of character selection, I chose my character for the looks, resemblance, etc. Then I adapt to the required play style. Its only my luck that most characters I chose end up being low to bottom tiers. But that doesn't stop me. I never quit.
I hate simple characters like Paul Phoenix, Mitsurugi, etc.
In reality, TopTier = Easy to win with, and LowTier = hard to win with.
But not always is like that, some characters can become pretty beasty with the proper skills.
Among my list, I consider Ky to be the highest tier that I've chosen to play with, and still he isn't a TopTier.
I don't like easy things, I play hardcore; Contra, Ikaruga, Gradius5, MarsMatrix, Raiden, Battletoads, Kid Icarus, Ninja Gaiden, AstroTripper, DMC, God Of war, etc.
I hate easy games like all RPGs, no sweat required.
Vega in SF4 = Hard mode. ;) LowTiers overall = Hard Mode.
And is true, about same skill not over compensating balance at the deepest level, but... calculated gambles and luck are one half of what goes on during battle. That's why knowing what one can do at fullest is important; "because knowing... is half the battle."
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 1, 2009 at 5:10 p.m. #355
@ Jink
"I hate simple characters like Paul Phoenix"
Haha I laugh at that silly comment you made.
Posted by Assassin on October 1, 2009 at 9:09 p.m. #356
alright you guys, that's pretty cool stuff, those were some good days. I was 15 when SF2 came out. there is no getting older. i'm breaking all the rules and I'm just going to stay a cool SF player all my life.
I always play low-tier players simply because I hate injustice and always go for the underdog. I began sf4 with Akuma but i simply felt too weak using such an awesome character to defeat people who braved the waters with Dhalsim, Blanka, El Fuerte, Abel, Honda etc. and there were alot of those players in the arcades where i played, and they chose those players simply because some of hte other players were too powerful. So I decided to switch to Elfuerte and Abel, who i really wasnt very good enough to win with.
I wasnt really good enough with Akuma either because I was waiting for teh PC version whereas everyone in the arcades had the console version at home to practice with. So I chose Vega and i started winning against some pretty good players without having to learn any combos, just by using old-school gameplay. and I got so good with him he became my main and my akuma doesnt even compare to him, but the more i learned about sf4 gameplay the less i wanted to use Akuma and stick to some underdogs.
Now I am probably going back to Akuma as a 2nd in order to have a combo-based character.
my main complaint is that all the characters aren't combo based. I have been through all of vegas trials several times and I am not impressed with any of them, in fact, i just find them so boring and weak I never bother to use them
I understand the damage scaling, but the fact is that some characters GET to hit you over and over and over to a stun then to finish whereas most other characters don't thats total crap. the draw about SF4 is the combos and links, but what does Blanka, Honda, Dhalsim, Vega Elfuerte, Ken, and Abel really have? nothing at all compared to Ryu, Balrog, Sagat, ChunLi, etc. most of those players can combo from one EX move to another and catch you with their supers and ultras at the very end of their combos.
its just not what i expect from such an advanced game as SF4
but Ken has always been powerful, now Ken is one of the weakest in the game. whats up with that? and Blanka and Honda were always able to compete with Ryu and usually win, but now they really cant at all.
there is just extreme bias in SF4, and i have been over to Capcom USA and i I'm pretty sure there was some sort of homosexual agenda behind it all .. hence Thailand's upgrade.
but thats all hearsay
Posted by Assassin on October 1, 2009 at 9:35 p.m. #357
but i cannot agree with it being useful or helpful
I sat there at the arcade yesterday and I saw a Sagat player sweating bullets as he pulverized a Honda 3 rounds in a row (5 round matches)
it just made me sick, literally, to seee an underdog player get no respect at all. the code is that you respect the underdogs for choosing them. but this Sagat player did several things which don't belong in the game:
1. he spammed fireballs as if he were playing against the Almighty himself, and against a player like Honda, thats unacceptable behavior, especially when you have already kicked the crap out of him for 2 rounds.
2. he relelntlessly did his combos one after the other and performed his ultra even when he was near getting a perfect for the 3rd time, which is unacceptable behavior. there is no skill required in doing Sagats 2x roundhouse to ultra at all, its a move that bo matter how many times you do it, you will not ooze skill, nor will u ever get better.
proper 'etiquette' for any warrior, would have been to use moves which didnt enter some automatic phase and hit the pother character 20 times, at which point neither player is learning anything and growing and development cease
I will tell u what it looks like, it looks like the player literally has some psychological/ social problems which cause him to be very stingy, petty, and small-minded, not to mention small-hearted.
thats all it looks like, even the guys girlfriend who was sitting right next to him felt disgusted and embarrassed with his behavior, perplexed at why he couldnt have made a more enjoyable game, and she was somehow dating the cheapest, most petty man in town.
by all accounts, it should be embarrassing for the player, but for some reason its not, perhaps he thinks he's in some sort of therapy session, and deserves it because of some injustice that's been done to him.
Posted by Assassin on October 1, 2009 at 9:36 p.m. #358
and learning only happens when someone is challenged and given opportunities to grow. I was a martial Arts instructor for many years, and I am now a university professor. the learning process needs to have egos set aside, and playersneed to be given lessons they can leanr from and oportunities to perform to the best of their ability. in SF4 gameplay that means NOT spamming no less than 1 millin fireballs at an upcoming Honda player. there is nothing to be learned there. it also means not holding your opponent in a motionless state while you go to town on him. noone will ever go from beginning to advanced simply by you beating the crap out of them. pulverizing themwhile they are turtled up on the ground.
nor are they going to leanr anything as your rush them and hit them 35 times out of the blue with your best effort..
its just never going to happen
the goal is not to destroy them, you will soon enough be faced with worthy opponents stronger and better than you who want you dead.
the goal is to create a warrior who has skill and experience and time perfecting his own skills.
as an instructor, you can only ever take battle to what the student is prepared for.
a 10th degree Grandmaster is not going to walk up to the guy who just came in off the street for a lesson and send him to the hospital not even knowing what just happened to him.
it doesnt work that way. the Master will take battle up enough only to challenge the student within the bounds of what the student can learn from and also be able to use the skills he has learned adequately, only what will bring out those skills in practical use in comboat..
and what happened to that Sagat player later? his eyes welled up with tears as Akuma arrived and kicked the crap out him 3 rounds in a row and he was barely able to move.
its a vicious cycle which breeds malice and contempt and hurt feelings and has no end. which is not what a video game is all about
Posted by Assassin on October 1, 2009 at 10:23 p.m. #359
playing with someone during battle or a fight is a sign of far greater skill than the bruteforce attacker, is far more respectful than the brute-force attakcer, and far more beneficial, and is no way insulting except to those with a poor sense of sportsmaship
one of the greatest, if not the greatest warriors in all of the Roman empire was a competitor in the Ancient Olympics fighting competition who was the undefeated champion of his time and never threw a punch.
He was qucik and skilled and expert enough of a fighter than he could duck or dodge every strike an opponent through at him and he always won from sheer exhaustion of the other man. He could do battle from sun up to sun down, all day long, without getting hit.
was that 'insulting' to the other man? his ego maybe, but who cares, that was a master of masters, the ultimate egoless warrior
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 10:56 p.m. #360
Then don't complain, just play. Have fun.
If you like combo based characters, use combo based characters. In SF4, Vega has his goods. Its just different to play with. Remember, this is not MvC2, this is SF4. As bad as things might go sometimes, I still enjoy playing as Vega, for me is not boring at all.
Whenever my opponent is in front of me, I keep them at Claw distance. 2MP, 3HK, FA, HK, or 2MK, works for that.
If my opponent jumps, I dash under them, and punish with 2HP or 2HK. And if is not a shoto, I do 3HK to try and catch them.
Whenever I hit with 3HK, I always combo with h-ST, 3-hits good damage, charges SC bar well, and gives me good wake up advantage.
During opponent's wake-ups, I use 3HK as placement cross-up, it doesn't hit-cross opponents, but it leaves you behind, and close to them. I follow with cl-HP, 2MP, EX-WD-Izuna, that's 5-hit solid combo, out of a made-up cross-up.
The situation was reset too. I can do the same thing, but my opponent can use FADC, SRK if it is a shoto, etc. to escape.
In cases like that, I wait at "safe-from-throw" distance, guard against their interruption attempts, and punish it depending what they did, how fast I spot it, and depending my SC and Ultra meter.
My toughest opponents are the ones that knows about Vega bad hit priority. They just sit back and interrupt everything I throw at them. When I'm aware of this, I sit back and safely charge SC meter, by doing consecutive l-ST, Kx3, l-ST, Kx3...
EX is very valuable for Vega. For me, having EX all the time is a must. The first chance I get build up, I do it.
I use taunt #2 to call up opponents into falling for EX-WD traps. Taunt #2 has the right timing for charging, imo.
If I have Ultra meter, and I hit my opponent with FADC on CHit or Lv2, I combo with the Ultra afterward. There's no reason to save up Ultra.
A basic set-up I use: 2MK (blocked at long range, +2) 3HK. If my opponent tried to attack, he gets hit by 3HK, if he stood still, the 3HK whiffs and I grab him.
Standing LK pokes, are very effective for cornering opponents, you can loop LK, or do 2MP.
If Sagat does p-TS, I do 2HK to slide under it. Slides are very good in SF. If Sagat does k-TS, I jump straight (safe from Sagat's HK), WD, or EX-Drill if I have EX.
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 10:56 p.m. #361
Vega has his ways to beat opponents, it might be hard and near impossible sometimes, but there are ways.
One time, against a Ryu, I used FA's parry to charge Ultra from HDKs, it was the second round, I took of my mask with 623PP, I hit him with FADC on CHit, then I combo with Ultra. I killed him, heheheh. It was a big "unnecessary" risk, but it worked.
I just don't quit, never. Its fun and challenging for me. That's why I still use Vega.
Another thing I don't like about SF4 overall is, that on cross up situations, if the play who was about to get crossed, does a SRK, forward, the gameplay automatically turns them to the opposite direction, where the cross up is suppose to land. In previous SF games, to do that, one must input the move toward the crossing direction, example: SRK backwards. But now, it is an automatic thing, it sucks.
I'm hoping that Capcom fixes this.
Posted by Jink on October 1, 2009 at 11:15 p.m. #362
Nice Vega videos here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/spartasan
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 2, 2009 at 9:44 a.m. #363
@assassin
you obviously are passionate about what you're talking about, and i think you shouldn't change how you play for anybody. but trying to indoctrinate a videogame is going to have stiff resistance [as people will argue "it's just a game"]. You bring up the point of console/pc vs. arcade, that people hide behind anonymity, and that bears for the other argument, as well. you can't tell if someone's trolling/hustling or if they're legitimately new/inexperienced [over the internet]. In arcades it's probably a lot easier to tell if someone's struggling, and I doubt anybody would have the guts to troll/hustle (although your sagat story proves this is no absolute). I kind of yearn for the type of matches you talk about, and in SSF4 it sounds like they'll have rooms for round robins, you could have those kind of matches with people you trust. btw, I lost faith in etiquette on sf4 when i'm constantly cross-picked by sagat (whom I normally beat) or tiger shot spammed in a player match.
@Jink
Thanks for posting those moves. I haven't given up on my vega either, because he's challenging, yes, but mostly because he is so unique. Also because I couldn't get the hang of gen :-(
Posted by Dave on October 2, 2009 at 1:36 p.m. #364
Each character has his own play-style.
Shotos rely on zoning and combo pressuring.
Rufus is all-out agressive
Viper is technical and mind games
Abel is a mixture of mind games and offensive pressure
Zangief is all about getting in close and not letting the opponent escape
Boxer is offensive pressuring and combo games
Seth is what i'd like to call a "careful offensive" character, due to his terrible stamina. He has the ability to do crazy combos up close, and to keep an opponent away effectively.
Claw is a defensive/counter character. He basically has only a few moves that could apply offensive pressure. Rolling crystal flash and cosmic heel. Pokes could be counted aswell, but i like to think of pokes as more defensive than offensive. He relies on the opponent making a mistake, countering, then getting to a safe distance.
Some playstyles are easier to master than others. I would put it in listform like so...
Shoto learning curve (ryu, ken, sagat, akuma) : Beginner
Offensive pressuring (rufus, boxer, zangief) : Intermediate
Turtle / Defensive counter (guile, E.honda) : Intermediate-Advanced
Mind Game Pressuring (Abel, Dictator, Seth, C.Viper, El Feurte, Gouken, Blanka, Cammy) : Advanced
Mind Games / Defensive counter / low teir (Claw, rose, gen, sakura, dhalsim, fei long) : Expert
Posted by yes4me on October 2, 2009 at 1:53 p.m. #365
How do you do the ULTRA from the other side of the screen?
Posted by Dave on October 2, 2009 at 2:17 p.m. #366
To do the ultra on your side of the screen the command is : charge d/b for 2 seconds, d/f, d/b, u/b+KKK
To do the ultra on the opponent's side...
Charge d/b 2 seconds, d/f, d/b, u/f+KKK
Posted by @367 on October 2, 2009 at 3:16 p.m. #367
Can't you do both with the db df db uf motion. Doesn't it go to your side if you tap uf and the opponent's side if you hold uf?
Posted by @Dave/365 on October 2, 2009 at 3:28 p.m. #368
Are your listings based on your gameplay only? Or are you just listing them in their tier order? Regardless neither list really matters imo cause you pretty much have to be an expert to truly master any character ( and even better to master their match-ups). Just cause a lot of beginners/scrubs use the shotos doesn't mean they can master them.
Side not I have yet to see a master/expert/even really good turtle guile/honda.
In my experience, if you get the advantage on these types of players and you back off and have them come after you, you'll see how crappy (lack of word choice) they are.
Posted by yes4me on October 2, 2009 at 3:29 p.m. #369
I don't know why but I have been trying for the past 2 hours to get that ULTRA on the other side and I just can't do it.
Here is what I done based on my input (training mode):
I am facing right.
TEST1: db,df,uf+KKK - LEFT SIDE
TEST2: db,df,db,df,uf+KKK - LEFT SIDE
TEST3: db,df,db,df,db,df,uf+KKK - LEFT SIDE
TEST4: db,df,db,ub.uf+KKK - FAILED
TEST5: db,df,u,f+KKK - LEFT SIDE
TEST6: db,df,u,f.KKK - FAILED
I am seriously out of idea.
Posted by yes4me on October 2, 2009 at 3:31 p.m. #370
I made a typo:
TEST1: db,df,db,uf+KKK - LEFT SIDE
Posted by Jink on October 2, 2009 at 3:43 p.m. #371
Vega's most useful tools (IMO):
1. Cosmic Heel for Cross-up hop: If Vega makes opponent to wake defending, mean they'll not try to attack with SRK, EX-invincibility, etc. because Vega punish them before for that, then hopping over them with CH is a must. Vega lands on their opposite direction and close to them, where point-blank combos are possible like; cl-HP,2MP,EX-WDID, or 2MK,h-ST, or 2MK,2LP,EX-WDID, etc. Remember, this is a gamble. Opponents can still interrupt this, but as meaty, Vega has better chance to not get interrupted. Pay attention to your opponent's EX-meter.
2. Light Scarlet Terror for building meter at mutual turtle-ling situations: If your opponents wait on you to come and kill yourself because they show they can interrupt most-to-all Vega's basic moves, back down a little and build your EX. Vega can do many l-ST quickly, just start charging again as soon as Vega did the first one. L-ST hops forward, Vega will get closer to opponent, Vega can do Kx3 or Px3 to back down into position, or, Vega can keep doing l-ST, get closer to opponent and hit, depending on what they might try.
The good thing about this technique is that Vega is always charging [1] (down-back). If a opponent tries...
...Fire ball, Vega can do WD, or flips to counter or avoid. Or EX-SHC for going through opponent's fire ball, since Vega was already building meter for that. Or EX-SHC for cross-up if opponents just sit there and watch.
..j.ump forward, Vega can do h-ST, depending on the height of the hit, an EX-ST might be possible, since Vega was already building meter for it.
3. Izuna Drop: Izuna Drop is a ground and air throw that has no escape command, and cannot be parried by FA, meaning is unavoidable if Mastered. Only things to consider are your opponent's early reactions, and moves SRKs. Apart from that, Izuna Drop is a good move for wake-ups, a Vega meaty-ing an opponent with ID, can be a pain.
more later, gtg...
Posted by @yes4me on October 2, 2009 at 4:57 p.m. #372
If you want to go off the opponents back just hold the uf.
Posted by yes4me on October 2, 2009 at 5:41 p.m. #373
I find out why... once you press KKK, you STILL have to hold the forward button. You can't go back too quickly to the db.
Posted by Dave on October 2, 2009 at 7:18 p.m. #374
@369
its based off learning curve and difficulty to use well
Example : I have used ryu less than half of how long i have used vega, yet i know that my ryu could destroy my vega because of hom ridiculously simmple-minded the gampley vs vega is.
all you have to do is keep doing jump-ins, cross ups, grabs on wake up. its a mindless strategy, any noob could it and beat a master Claw.
That why claw's learning curve is harder than ryu's, claw has to deal with no reversal, if he gets knocked down, he's screwed.
Posted by Jink on October 2, 2009 at 7:36 p.m. #375
Good Rose match, and videos at his channel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlJ0RX...
Vega at Korean tournament vs Zangief:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRkRxg...
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 2, 2009 at 11:34 p.m. #376
@Jink
Thanks for showing us these two great fights
especially the Vega fight.
Posted by @Dave/375 on October 2, 2009 at 11:47 p.m. #377
Me again. LOL. Its the exact opposite for me. I can't use ryu/ken/sagat to save my life. Akuma on a good day. And the ones listed as harder to learn come easier (some of them anyway) to me.
Oh my comment before was probably off topic on this thread. I wasn't really talking about claw. I just didn't agree with how you systematically grouped some characters to be played certain ways. Like a lot of characters in the defense counter part specifically sakura gen and dhal can be played pretty offensively and no need for good guiles and hondas to turtle. Don't know about claw. Don't use him much. I guess that list was intended to speak mostly about how claw has to be used.
Posted by Dave on October 3, 2009 at 12:35 a.m. #378
@ 378
Dhalsim is always defensive, his main purpose is to keep away the opponent at all costs. you rarely see dhalsims rushing down an opponent.
I guess he's more counter-defensive.
I don't claim to know everything about every character. The list was just a generalization of their playstyles. Any character can be used offensively, defensively, or mind-games-like.
What i listed was the playstyle most fitting in my view for each character.
And its funny what you said about not being able to use shotos.
Sagat is god tier and i cant use him for crap lol
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 7:40 p.m. #379
@yes4me: I'm pretty sure you can do the ultra from charging forward as well, anyway, all you do is hold in any direction you want for 2 seconds then shake the joystick back and forth a little then up to the direction you want to go.
@cowboy_soultaker: round robins sound cool, without rankings. so long as people are more concerned with just playing and having a good time and not about their ranking, which is bullcrap anyway, the arcade I play at here has 8 consoles set up on a stage that are all linked, and the winner just plays the next available player, its alot of fun.
@Jink: since i live in China i cant see anything on youtube because they are all blocked, and there are no claw videos on any of the chinese sites, because honestly nobody believes Vega. I have seen killer footage of El Fuerte, Honda and Dhalsim, but nobody believe in Vega. I'm not kidding, I usually play expert players and completely annhialate them the first time they play me, then they put in some more tokens and try and play me for real, they really think claw is the easiest guy to beat, weakest in the game. So I have never seen anyone else play vega in SF4 except for a mirror match up i played recently, so I pretty much created my own play style, completely unaware of what anyone else is doing or what can/ should be done with him. I think it would be helpful. If anyone puts vega video on a non-youtube site, let me know, thanks.
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 7:49 p.m. #380
@soul_cowboy: you know, the strange thing about all of that is that I think most of the SF4 play style was created or at least justified by people on forums claiming to be martial artists or claiming to know about fighting. thats the thing that really gets me.
@Jink: in my opinion, Vega should ALWAYS do the wall dive to builld ex meter rather than the Lscarlet terror, because the wall dive has the added and most importnat benefit in game play, building up a faking game by whiffing and faking, and also allows you to throw in a strike or a throw from time to time.
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 8:04 p.m. #381
some other good strategies include:
1. Wall diving almost non-stop to build ex meter and fake out opponents.
2. for pokes, forward Medium Kick is the longest strike vega has, so i use vega in the same way i use dhalsim at approaching opponents, at the furthest distance I use MK, if they are slightly closer I use crouching MP, if they are slightly close i use HP
3. for wall dives, I like to mix it up, flying up at varying distances from the opponent then over, stalling for variousl lengths of time, then coming down at different places. Flying up and out normally and arriving at various distances from opponent, and then my personal favorite flying down and over as quickly as possible by holding down on the joystick iniitally then guiding over quite horizontally to the opponents head, then with some quick joystick action you land a throw (the most difficult way to throw i feel)
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 8:14 p.m. #382
Also, moving forward and backwards alot to keep vegas prime distance is vitally important. it also makes vega alot taller and more intimidating.
and when people are throwing you when you do your full back flip, jumping backwards and striking is pretty useful, vegas vertical jump makes escaping by jumping very practical, and if that might not work, a LP first usually lets you jump back
for countering Focus Attacks, Forward and HK or HP are pretty useful for breaking FA's, only the first hit with your shoulders is armor-breaking with the LCRF, so it cant be used except pretty close, and Scarlet terror is armor breaking, if you arent charged and your are close, throw or kara throw, if you are a little further back, HP is the best option, if you are not close enough for HP then use HK or do your own FA or Back flip or dash forward and throw
one thing I really suck at is linking strikes in SF4. i cant seem to get the timing of alot of those strikes that have a window of only one frame for a link. anyone have any suggestions?
`
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 8:18 p.m. #383
and one thing that i came to really appreciate this last week is the backwards dash, i was quite surprised how many attacks i escaped getting hit from, the hits went right through me. Eventhough Vegas back dash isnt very far, it can be very useful for initially escaping when people are trying to tick throw, throw, or jab combo you.
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 8:22 p.m. #384
FA back dash absorbs a jab then lets you escape alot of times before the second ht comes
and something should be said for fighting without the claw, the game changes dramatically when you have no claw, suddenly all of your distances are screwed up. so if you have the opportunity, take off the claw at the beginning of the round and learn to play vega all over again as a clawless character. your entire strategy will have to change. I'm still leanring that myself, but I do use alot of jumping MK, MK, and HK, and i crouch alot less, and combos become alot more important
Posted by Assassin on October 3, 2009 at 8:50 p.m. #385
Wall Escapes: one of Vegas worst nightmares is getting backed in to a corner. So, when you are near a wall, instead of getting forced backwards with strikes, walk and dash backwards and half back flip to draw your opponent in at a semi-close distance, then jump off the back wall and go immediately to a full back flip. The back wall can be landed at different heights, as well, the lowest height is the fastest , they send off at different angles.
so whenever you feel a wall approaching, stop whatever you are doing and change your game to a distance & draw game to escape off the back wall to Full flip.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 3, 2009 at 11:10 p.m. #386
Before I leave my last bit of advice, that really does pale compared to what others have posted already, I wish some of the others that I am interested in (fei long, gen) had the same zeal, let alone information, on their pages.
When playing at length you realize how the above is proved true, mixing up your game and not falling into repetition traps is crucial. i have played 15 minute sets and i've stopped pressure chars (ryu/ken/sagat) from pressuring me and into turtling, which is much more rewarding for them due to lack of priority. thats where the body language and mix-up comes in. it's a lot harder then it sounds, you say you will do it then when they do jump in mk for the 11th time you catch yourself doing the same flight technique and they just keep on coming. playing long bouts can also get you frustrated and impatient, causing you to *gasp* jump in on ryu!
btw, someone said it earlier but srsly, everyone can play pressure vs. vega. I fought c.viper in one of said bouts and she got off her hiney and pressured the bejesus out of me. I thought it was pretty funny
Posted by Kage on October 4, 2009 at 1:02 a.m. #387
Good non you-tube claw vid.
http://www.justin.tv/clip/f194b294baa...
Great clutch combo vs Dhalism around 3:40...
Note the slide (db - HK) cross over "glitch" used to cross-up Honda somewhere around 8:20 ish.
Wish I could play like that!
Posted by yes4me on October 4, 2009 at 3:41 a.m. #388
How do you FOCUS>dash back and ULTRA? It sounds pretty impossible.
Posted by Assassin on October 4, 2009 at 8:36 a.m. #389
Thanks for the video Kage.
I liked his Cosmic Heel to crouching MP
I liked his Cosmic Heel Cross ups
I liked the pressure he as able to apply with LK
He's got some nice stab combos around 3:90 with a FA + Fdash
LCRF to HK was nice
and i like the halfbackflip wduring the opponents FA
nice MK pokes
I will incorporate some of that into my game
I feel I am quite a much better Vega player than he was though.
I wish I had some video of my matchups today, i kicked the crap out of some really good Sagats and Ryus, and many Ken players as well. I was very surprised to find and excellent Ken player, the best i've seen to date. Ken's kicks stuff the crap out of Vegas Cosmic heel and most of his flying attacks.
Another move in that video which I was also using earlier today, was the EX CRF through Fireballs, i did it actually by accident today and i used it quite abit since. I dont know why it never dawned on me to use it before as an anti fireball move.
I dont agree with that players turtling and waiting at all, I think Vega becomes very weak when turtling and waiting.
and I cant believe How I didnt even see any throws in that video, I usually get in at least 5 normal or air throws per round, sometimes alot more.
overall i think the guy played a bit too risky, he was standing right in harms way most of the time against Honda, and seemed to over-estimate Vegas close game a bit and he was heavily punished for it.
I think he was working too hard on confusing an opponent with speedy moves but most opponents really arent so easily confused.
anyway, that was interesting and useful, thanks alot
Posted by Assassin on October 4, 2009 at 9:48 a.m. #390
@ Jink:
The auto correct really is for the benefit of charge characters like Vega, Honda, Guile, ChunLi, etc
sure it sucks when a "1/4 turn" character benefits from it, but its way more useful for charge characters, so you can still execute a charge move as your opponent tries a cross up kick.
I think the Auto Correct accompanies the new Cross-up kicks for the benefit of charge characters only, its just that sometimes other player benefit from it as well, which they really shouldnt, as its as easy to do their moves forward and backwards, but I really hate it when you are flying ver the opponent to slash them in the back from a wall dive and they accidentally uppercut you because of the auto-correct. if anything, it should just be turned off for everyone but charge characters.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 4, 2009 at 10:08 a.m. #391
@yes4me
Tap the dash cancel and before the animation starts start buffering your charge. it takes 2 seconds to buffer, then execute. your opponent will almost be completely on the ground but as long as his head and a shoulder is up it usually hits.
Posted by Dave on October 4, 2009 at 10:10 a.m. #392
@ yes4me
Here is the trick for doing an ultra after a focus attack...
right before the focus attack lands, there are frames where you cannot cancel it. However, if you input the dash backwards command right before it hits, you will still dash backwards after it lands.
This gives you times to start charging the ultra early.
The command sequence should look like this...
1. Charge focus attack
2. claw begins the animation to strike (thrusting forward with claw)
3. immediately input the backwards dash command when you see claw's start animation for the attack.
4. After imputting dash back command, start charging for ultra
NOTE : Steps 3 and 4 should be completed before the focus attack even hits. This, accompanied by the freeze time when the focus attack hits, gives you added time to charge the ultra.
5. Wait for 1/4 of a second after having dashed backwards to finish the charge.
6. Finish ultra command.
It looks tough when you read it but it's quite simple when you get it down.
Posted by yes4me on October 4, 2009 at 12:14 p.m. #393
thank you both. That was very interesting.
Posted by Jink on October 4, 2009 at 2:14 p.m. #394
@Assassin
No youtube? That's bad :(
I remember other sites with videos, I'm going look for them, nothing guarantee, last time I check was a long time ago.
I see your point with the auto correct, charge characters only. Although they kind of always had them, at least in Down holding charges.
I also use fake-WD to build meter, and I provoke my opponents, to see their reactions at the same time. L-ST is faster to build meter. Both ways are good, and both ways work well depending on what the opponent does. If I'm l-ST building, if a fireball comes at me, I'm already charging for a WD, and probably soon enough to punish their attempt.
Both ways works good.
Vega vs Ryu match:
/watch?v=sxE1oBp84kM&feature=related
@Kage
Awesome video! That's how I play Vega lol, but that guy is better, more daring. Lol, DMC combos.
Sh1t, slide cross-up, that's new.
The only thing that "Tatsu" forgot to apply, was to punish Honda's Headbutt with HP. Vega's HP has the reach and speed to catch the recovery of Honda's HB.
Good matches, thanks Kage.
Posted by Jink on October 4, 2009 at 2:16 p.m. #395
Oops, dumb me. Here's the click-link to the Vega vs Ryu match:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxE1oB...
Posted by Assassin on October 4, 2009 at 6:57 p.m. #396
@Jink, ya, they're some clowns around here. Some very small-minded, petty, ignoramuses, who propagate ignorance, it's the friggin Dark Ages in China. the Dark Ages were dark only because of the Control of Information and banning of free informative reading materials and writings. I am exactly in the middle of the Dark Ages, darker than anything that happened in Europe. It sucks. I hope they die. Banning a vega match must be an unpardonable sin somewhere.
maybe you can write a bit about some strategy in those video, likes and dislikes, give you personal commentary on the match? thanks
Posted by Assassin on October 4, 2009 at 8:23 p.m. #397
well, i found some videos.
most of the videos of Vega are simply showing off some other characters moves,
these two are a little more how I play
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304...
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304...
Here's an example of why can't turtle with Vega:
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304... around 3:18
This has a nice 4th round.
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f354181... around 13:25
this one has some good aspects
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDAxMzM...
here are a couple others
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f376604...
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f354181... around 12:10
alot of the Vegas are pretty crappy, one of the biggest signs these are beginners is they are not able to land the Izuna drop consistently
Posted by Assassin on October 4, 2009 at 8:48 p.m. #398
oops, sorry, that sucks, the URL's dont change with the videos in the play list, so here are the actual links
these two are a little more how I play
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304...
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304...
Here's an example of why can't turtle with Vega:
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f279304... around 3:18
This has a nice 4th round.
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f354181... around 13:25
here are a couple others
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDAxMzM...
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f376604...
http://v.youku.com/v_playlist/f354181... around 12:10
Posted by Kage on October 4, 2009 at 10:07 p.m. #399
Came across this nice quality vid of Vega vs (Rufus and Ken).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwtaDt...
Aggressive style of play with good throw/counter-throw timing. Sorry assassin - only on youtube.
Posted by Assassin on October 5, 2009 at 9:54 p.m. #400
that's alright, I've heard Youku is blocked in America. Clowns everywhere.
Posted by Dave on October 6, 2009 at 12:48 a.m. #401
@Kage
That vega player resembles my style. Throwing in alot of rolling attacks. People under-estimate its chip damage.
He did make some silly mistakes though...most notibaly at 4:47 where he used the EX walldive when a simple medium kick would've won the round.
Funny how the announcers think it was the most amazing thing on earth lol.
Posted by Meteo on October 6, 2009 at 4:02 a.m. #402
Haha, Assassin if you wrote a book about all this I'd buy a copy.
Claw is definitely a character of mindgames. He forces people who are used to applying the same winning tactics every game to re-adapt each round against Claw in an arms race of psychological pressure. I couldn't agree more with the comments about having to remaster him for every matchup and playstyle, and that's what really keeps him interesting for me and unpredictable for everyone else. Claw IS classy, and rightfully so for his persona!
I don't mind the wall glitch, it's often humorous and sometimes can even benefit you when it messes up your opponent's counter attack. In older Street Fighters, you could mess up his walldive by quickly moving forward/backward anyway. Claw could use a small tweak of improvement, sure, but not much is necessary. Something like increasing stun from 900 to 1000. Invulnerably frames on ST maybe if you really wanted to move him up a little.
Everyone loves an underdog, especially one entertaining to watch with all the dodges, flying, weapon/mask attachments, and various playstyles.
As far as sportsmanship goes, I'd say as long as players don't take things too seriously outside of the game, the tactics and dizzy/taunt shenanigans inside the game shouldn't matter. If someone beats me with the same moves over and over, I think it falls on me to learn how to deal with it as a challenge and overcome it. With the example of that Honda player getting fireballed to death round after round by Sagat, well I guess some people are just like that. They HAVE to win no matter who they are playing and can't derive enjoyment from playing the game for fun. Still, you could look at it from the perspective that the Honda got many rounds of good serious practice against a fireball spam strategy.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 6, 2009 at 4:23 p.m. #403
youku isn't blocked for me.
Posted by yes4me on October 6, 2009 at 7:06 p.m. #404
Vega character 25th learned. Took 175 times to get 1000cp.
Ok he is not bad ONLY if I am on top of my game. His biggest problem is dealing with jumpers by far. I didn't have a problem doing damage.
Contrary to what some people may say, losing the claw or the mask give you about the same minus. In both case, you lose around 31% effectiveness (=SUM of percentage of damage received & given). If you lose both, Vega is 33% less effective. Therefore, I rather lose the mask than the claw.
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 7:07 a.m. #405
@Meteo:
Vega is such an underdog that you almost have to re-master him for every players play style.
For example, i can usually hold my own against really good Akumas. but there was a guy today who I just couldnt beat for the longest time, other Akumas would come in and kick the crap out of him, and I could beat those Akumas, but I couldnt beat this guy, simply because of his unique play style.
There are just too many way too powerful characters with awesome combos in SF4 for Vega to overcome by his own merit. meaning you really have to adapt to everybody's play styles and do things you wouldn't normally ever even think of doing. Whereas most other characters can simply do the same crap to everyone and win.
Tiers should definitely NOT be in SSF4, its total bullcrap in the arcade. that Akiuma playes like 50 wins a row today. and every top player at this arcade couldnt beat him, meaning many characters simply aren't in the right "tier" to even compete, which is utter bullcrap.
players can say "oh I deserve it, I should have done this or that" but whatever, that is a self-esteem problem in my book, feeling you deserve to get punished. its masochism. Playing vega half the time you feel like a Masochist. keep coming back for punishment, and seeming to play just for punishment.
But i stand by what I said earlier, if combos were equalled out throughout the game, it would be all good, but so many of those combos simply end game play for an undetermined amount of time and they simply don't end, and there is nothing you can do, you might as well not even be there.
maybe some people like playing that way, but the clinical term for that is Masochism.
in fact, there are a lot of people who have simply stopped playing in the arcade all together. i used to see so many people playing, now its just like Ryu, Akuma, Chunli who dominate the game by playing in a total "cheese 'em up" fashion with no breaks.
and that is probably what the Sadoists who created the game for their own personal favorites think of as a good time, but the game simply isnt equal in any way at all. there is no strategy, no skill, no outguess your opponent, beat him to a strike, choose a better strike, etc, there is only like 3 characters and their infinite combos and that is al they do, walk up, jab to combo or jab to throw, and really about nothing else. it takes about one brain cell to play like that after you have memorized the very finite number of pattern-combos
and SSF4 needs to fix that, nobody is playing anymore, because real players simply dont find playing with ryu all day long enjoyable, Ryu has always been the least popular character in the game, wtf is up with capcom?
people dont even find their game enjoyable anymore except for sado-masochists
its ridiculous
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 7:28 a.m. #406
@yes4me:
the straight up jump is a good move for jumpers, with HP if they are high or HK if not
and what i had to do on Akuma today was that and jumping forward with HP in the air.
and I had to do alot of leaping backwards and striking with HP just as I left the ground to beat out Akumas Double HK roundhouse which he spammed all day
the only time i caught him with Scarlet terror was immediately after Half-backflips, which really isnt so easy to throw you directly out of (not as easily as the full back flip anyway), though they try and usually end up at a very convenient distance for the ST
other than that, the only was I was able to beat his aproach by air was the jumpback HP
when someone is jumping in on you, you can begin your focus attack which will hit if they try to HK you, but if they pull their strike they will just land and throw you.
you CANNOT do an EX Flying Barcelona attack or an EX Bloody Claw when someone is jumping in on you. you must use the manual wall escape or jump straight up with HP or HK
his anti-airs suck, as he is an anti-air character, all you can do is beat them to the air with a perfectly timed airthrow (which works nicely right off the ground), or with strikes.
I would like to see vega have a "Devil May Cry" jump, where he can jump up, then dart forward with a strike out of thin air,
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 7:32 a.m. #407
and because his super is so extremely hard to land, i think the neutral joystick super whould have a bigger hit range and hit 6 or 7 times (his 3 teensy hits are by far the weakest super in the game), as a viable option to his "hey look at me, here I come" super
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 10:36 a.m. #408
I also think Vega should have a spinning claw uppercut, kind of like Seth's but a little more narrow
Posted by Kage on October 7, 2009 at 12:18 p.m. #409
i think when vega drops his claw opponents should take damage from stepping on it.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 7, 2009 at 3:50 p.m. #410
akuma cheese? that seems rare to me. Usually it's ryu priority spam or flow chart ken. I've always had a soft spot for akuma so gloves are off!! lol i'm just kidding, I type with gloves on like strong bad.
If you said rufus's impossibly easy links to ultra/special, ryu's high damage combos that can tie-in ultras/specials or balrogs near infinite and crazy links I'd be right with you, but akuma? I'm not saying you lack the talent, because you've contributed so much here, but akuma has a lot of things going against him. I played him in third strike and lack of ex and low health always proved my achiles heel. He's got hit confirmation like the other shotos do, cr. lp(x2) if hit, then cr. lk light tatsumaki h. shoryuken. if no hit, throw. there are variants of this for quite a few characters. and you are right, vega's lack of combos means less chances for pressure.
on a side note, i thought it was funny in the svenson interview he mains sagat, ken and viper. albeit ken and viper are red tier, but sagat? I have a hard time respecting sagat players. if they crossed me up or did a combo, you know, showed they took time to learn their char, I wouldn't have such a hard time.
Posted by Kage on October 7, 2009 at 7:54 p.m. #411
Hey any of you guys find a use of neutral jump MP? It looks like a teeny version of the neutral jump HP (that I'm also trying to figure out when to use) but not sure when to use it.
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 8:56 p.m. #412
@Cowboy: I am right with you there, the only erason i played 3rd strike was for Akuma, I started SF4 with him, and I feel almost like was created just for me (and sometimes I actually feel I am Akuma). the best part about playing him (Besides his slippers and beads and sign for "Heaven" on his back, and his hair) are his eyes, when yuou start playing Akuma you get lost in his eyes, and prety soon you fel your eyes are firey red and you start making that Akuma face while vanquishing your opponent.
i was referring to "Cheese" in the 1980's -90's sense. this guyed played simply too relentlessly, and cheese in my book includes doing the same move over and over, especially when you have sat at the arcade through 50 different players
I was actually kind of excited to see him beat everyone, but my excitement fade when I realized that I would never play like that. Akuma is such an awesome character that there's really no excuse to play in the 'cheapest' way possible, i hate guys who take every oppportunity afforded them, and then do that the entire round, and i mean really 'cheesy' moves like kicking as soon as you leave the ground and flying through the air with your leg out like some doofus, or throwing non-stop with only the goal in mind to throw non-stop, or some other 'cheesy' crap, or doing the HK roundhouse all day long (i couldnt believe how many times he landed that on me, thats one of the hardest moves to beat out that I've encountered)
but then i typically prefer countering to blockng because I HATE turtling.
and so cheese also has to include those players who not only take every advantage afforded them when the other player is in defense, and then do nothing but turtle and camp for indefinite amounts of time, because they can only do their moves when someone else is doing something first, so they sit and do nothing or turtle for 1/3 of the entire round, camping, or sit and wait for the clock to run out.
in my book, when someone is playing ultra defensive and turtled up and all you do is barrage them with endless strikes, knowing that most normal people simply get bored playing that way and will eventually give you an opening, or unti you get a throw, its time to take you out back. because its cheesy, and that is all this guy did.
A normal move would be to back away and begin fighting again.
there shouldnt even be corners in SF4, it should be anfinite looping back ground.
thats all cheese in my book, regardless of the character, its "player cheese" rather than character-based cheese.
playing 'cheesy' in my book is barraging a player who has been trapped in a crner with limitless strikes which once one hits leads to an indefinite combo and begins all over, AND THEN also being the king of turtles and campers yourself
the player strikes (if blocked) should push the opponent further away from you, like they used to.
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:12 p.m. #413
@Kage: that stright up jump HP is useful when u dont think you can get the straight up jump throw. it can be pretty easily beaten if someone expects it, but if they jump in expecting to beat your strike, you can usually land a throw.
and its pretty good when someone is right on top of you, trying to cross you up. try hitting the button the same moment you jump up, which would normally just be a knockdown on most other characters, but Vega can usually pull it off, they arent easy to land, like the stright up jump HK, but they do their job if you manage to time them right.
most of vegas game is off the ground strikes, throws, and air counters
I am thinking now that maybe the MP version might also be useful (possibly more useful) in those last-minute cross up situations when you strike as you leave the ground? i'd be interested to know how that does against corss up kicks
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:38 p.m. #414
@Kage:
I think the Claw should be a projectile, thrown more than a full screens distance which does more dameage than a regular HP strike, and good chip damage too. what a killer way to end a round.
not taken off and thrown, but maybe a sort of back turn like cosmic heel, then flung off of the arm while looking over the shoulder.
that 'detachability' would also give explanation to why it often gets knocked off during play
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:39 p.m. #415
and the claw can either be thrown up like Goukens fireball, or down from the air like Akumas or straight ahead.
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:40 p.m. #416
and is a knockdown hit
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:52 p.m. #417
StreetFighters problem is its "linear" play
no fighter in the world fights on a straight line, they move circular, hence they never get caught in a corner, and getting caught with your back up against a wall is a near imposssibility
thus, corners should be removed from SSF4, to give the feeling of circular motion by having a looping background.
Posted by Assassin on October 7, 2009 at 9:57 p.m. #418
even better would to have all games in large spaces and characters can side step and side stepping adjust camera angle
Posted by Kage on October 7, 2009 at 10:31 p.m. #419
@Assassin
Thanks for the insight! I'll try the punch on the way up.
For the rest of you - another great Vega vid!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VdURS...
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 8, 2009 at 12:22 a.m. #420
Also here's another great Vega vid.
I don't know he he did it but good editing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlP_UK...
Posted by Meteo on October 8, 2009 at 1:38 a.m. #421
Whatever SF's problems are, 2D play is *not* really one of them. Sidestepping would do nothing other than avoid an attack and shift the environment to a new linear camera angle. Its like just adding a mechanic to make you invulnerable from certain moves for a split second, nothing noteworthy. I would much rather have the focus system than that.
Some fighting games that have a much more free 3d environment to walk or fly around in tend to have characters that exactly face eachother the whole time anyway as well. If you try to change the arenas in Street Fighter gameplay-wise AND make it truly unique and interesting, it would extremely redefine the game, likely moving it away from the in-your-face technical fighting aspects it's known for. I imagine it would end up requiring you to aim attacks and stuff. Who knows, it could work, but you're talking about a different game.
Am I just sliding down a slippery slope away from the points you are trying to make, Assassin?
Anyway, Kage, that Vega video is hilarious!
Posted by Assassin on October 8, 2009 at 8 a.m. #422
@Meteo:
well, as I try and imagine the future of street fighter, and that I have also heard Capcom was thinking of pulling the plug altogether, maybe redefining it is what's needed.
i wasnt thinking anything quite so radical, it seems to me Street Figher EX was something like that, 3D syle, i cant really remember, but i suppose its only a matter of time and technological advancements until we are playng 3D Virtual Reality Street Fighter in our living rooms kicking over the furniture.
but i was just thinking of much MORE real it would be without the back wall. whats the worst that could happen? Forward dash is alot faster than backwards dash so you couldnt just dash forever, the guy will eventually catch you, but this way the game could continue to be interesting, as alot of those really cheap combos only work against the wall anyway, and it really benefits nobody to have a wall, some player and fighters in the real world are distance fighters who will go from here to hell and back trying to keep the right distance from an opponent, even if it means running away and turning back. its just cool. i think it would improve the game a great deal to have no walls, that alone would make the game alot more fair for all characters
Posted by @418-19 on October 8, 2009 at 9:13 a.m. #423
"even better would to have all games in large spaces and characters can side step and side stepping adjust camera angle"
Just pretend theyre in a long and narrow glass box
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 8, 2009 at 9:38 a.m. #424
I think they tried the infinite round-table thing in the ex series. that didn't do so hot on the ps/ps2. quite honestly, I wouldn't like to see SF go in that direction. If I wanted that, I'd play Tekken or Soul Calibur or something. I stopped playing them because SF4 (and to a lesser extent, blazblue) are the ideal fighting games for me.
every game is unique from the rules that define it. perhaps the current rules let us down (such as wall jump glitch). the SF4 engine is pretty solid imo, they just gotta iron it out a bit.
@Assassin
I try not to turtle as Akuma, i'm trying to learn his bread and butter but I get nervous and use the punch too fast, and the lp won't cancel if your lp's are too close together. Cheese tactics aren't fun, ever. I lose to flow-chart cammy's and guiles, it pains me to say, but even if I won i would still feel cheated. No victory, or loss, feels better then when 2 fighters do their best. you may be right, that BP's and GP's help draw that out.
Posted by Jink on October 8, 2009 at 11:44 p.m. #425
@Assassin
Buddy, get a grip. If you are truly into all you say, then play another fighting games to compensate your needs, or study and develop your own fighting game. I'm not mocking you, I'm serious. Put all your thoughts together, and come up with a fighting game. If you make it and turns out to be good, you'll be happy playing, and with $.
Vega (Claw) doesn't need anything that would make him like other characters, and stop being Vega, to be better. Playing Vega is challenging and fun. Just look at Tatsu, he got to TOP-4 on that tournament, with a "2nd worst character." Just imagine how good that feels.
Claw toss like Goken's fireball? No good. SRK drill like Seth's? Mmm nope. If you want that, learn and play with those characters. Not mocking you, just my opinion.
Btw, I haven't watched all the videos you posted, their streaming is slow. But at least I can watch them.
@Kage and Th3 JoK3J
Funny and awesome vids!
"Ya think it's narcissism? Hell, it's just truism."
DA TRUTH!! ;)
SSF4 news:
I heard that there's gonna be multiple Ultras for selection, just like SAs in 3rdStrike. That's good!
Posted by Meteo on October 9, 2009 at 2:23 a.m. #426
New upgraded ultra for Vega: Handgun
*BANG* Perfect.
I really don't understand what deal with calling it "masochism" is when someone gets defeated and can see that they made bad decisions, mistakes beyond simply messing up attacks or getting overpowered by the opponent. Also, I wouldn't say combos make it like you're not even there. So what, it takes a FEW SECONDS to watch your attacks or someone else's string together, I just don't understand what the problem is.
Posted by Assassin on October 9, 2009 at 6:53 a.m. #427
@Jink:
its "fun" to never get first place in a tournament
and its "fun" to lose, guaranteed to lose, and not be #1
thus, "Masochism"
thats the definition of masochism.
the world's top Vega player is not capable of beating an average good sagat player consistently.
and YES, Vega is hanging on the end of the broke stick.
when sagat, probably the strongest play in the game, can simply HK you directly into an unblockable Ultra, and vega, considered by scrubs and pros alike to be hte worst character in the game has to land a Focus Attack to get his really just a soso ultra to land unblockable, there is definitely something seriously wrong.
i can see Akumas Mega Ultra needing to be landed by only a Focus Attack, that thing takes off more than half your life.
and he is considered by many to be the top character in the game.
Vega gets 4th place. that is vegas most elite accomplishemnt, and will never get better.
to enjoy that is masochism.
the game play is simply broke.
when the biggest strongest crapheads in the game can ALSO combo the crap out of you with their eyes closed, simply on accident, and the weakest underdogs get their legs chopped off at the knees, something is seriously wrong
AND NO, i am not going to "accept" it. it is a failed and flawed system. SF4's best things are Combos, FADC's, Juggles, and limitless punishment by linking 4 EX moves together with an ultra
Why then, pray tell, did half of the characters not even get to play the game? Let me tell you why, because those characters can only enjoy themselves if nobody else can do those things.
there is no skill, i repeat None, Zip, Zero, Zilch, in pulling off a Ryu or Sagat Super or Ultra combo that is GUARANTEED to hit.
Vega is Broken. Eventhough I guarantee I can kick the crap out of you with Vega and most other players I meet. Top level competitors simply cannot take Vega as a Worthy Opponent in the title of Victory
Posted by @Jink on October 9, 2009 at 8:23 a.m. #428
and seth's uppercut he stole from Wolverine, it looks exactly like wolverines, and vegas claw uppercut would too.
he needs a strong wake up, he is the lowest character in the game, and needs something against sagats, balrogs, and Ryus, or make his Scaret Terror more like Guiles
and throwing the claw would be just as normal. he is the only character in the game with a normal weapon, and also the only character with something detachable, and the only character who has to go pick things up
so whats the difference if it was thrown and did damage as opponed to floating towards center stage? you would still lose the claw, become weaker, and have to worry about going to retrieve it, you only get one, not infinite amounts like fireball spammers, so it would make sense that because throwing weakens your game and you have one thing to throw, that you should be able to throw it down from the air or up from the ground or straight, 3 angles for you one and only projectile you will have to fightyour over to retrieve, bare-fisted.
thats WAY more than fair
Posted by Jink on October 9, 2009 at 2:03 p.m. #429
@Assassin
Don't misunderstand me. I play to win, and I do with my character of choice (Vega), no matter the disadvantages. I'll learn from Vega's weakness against certain characters by losing a lot, but then, I get on top of the game. Everything has a counter, some are safer than others, and some are too risky, but there are still choices. Knowledge, mix-ups, gambles, reactions, all goes in battle around luck.
Like I said earlier: Vega = playing SF4 on hard mode, for hardcores only.
This is what Vega needs to be better:
1. Unbeatable Punch priority with Claw on, against any trade attack situation, even against SC and some Ultras.
2. Unbeatable FBA with Claw on, against any trade for normal attacks.
3. Unbeatable SHC with Claw on, against all moves.
4. Claw Toss to hit opponent like Dudley's rose on 3rdStrike, but with the option of tossing the claw backward with LP, short-towards with MP, and a little farther-towards with HP.
5. Mask pick-up should have a Tap-Down command, for those who want to keep the damage boost without accidentally walking over the mask.
6. EX-ST should have invincible frames and faster start-up, like a SRK does.
6. EX-RCF must definitely start-up a lot faster, and recover faster.
7. FBA should jump from the wall a lot faster, like old Vega, without that brief pause when landing in the wall.
8. BloodyHighClaw, to have a direction launch option, where Vega launches towards neutrally, upward if tap UP, downward if tap DOWN.
9. PieceOfMercury must be an overhead, and should be able to jump over Sagat's K-TS. Like FeiLong's "6MK" overhead.
10. FBA towards jumping opponents, should go through them and wall-land, instead of getting stock on opponent.
11. SHC should have more damage.
GTG, More later...
Posted by meshach on October 9, 2009 at 2:47 p.m. #430
you suck pussey bitch
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 9, 2009 at 4:16 p.m. #431
I don't know if I would be playing Vega now if he was top tier. I'm sure there would be cheese enough to make me hate him. Now that I play him I wouldn't mind a few improvements, but I'd be risking losing the "unique" factor to vega. Can't really have your cake and eat it too, in this case.
being in the top 4 with vega means a lot more than being a top 4 ryu or top 4 sagat. I'd say it falls in the category of "bragging rights" or "morale victory". Would it be better to go all the way? definitely. How often though does a dan, or a gen, or a dhalsim (up till recently) or a honda etc. get a top 4 spot?
SSF4 seems to be a bit of an arms race. Each camp is wanting a little something (i've heard Ryu fans clamoring for his knife kick from SF3). But for the most part the prevailing theme seems to be "balance". Thats a bit abstract, and while it seems ideal it could entail things one wouldn't want. While this is a worst case scenario, from my understanding They completely changed Iori's fighting style in the most recent KoF. That broke my heart a bit.
If they make selectable "SA's" like in 3, we'd probably get the ST special. That would def be combo'd into (probably).
Posted by Kage on October 9, 2009 at 5:49 p.m. #432
While all this Vega bashing is well deserved, I for one want to focus on what makes Vega GREAT. Here's my top 5 list.
(1) Full screen ultra punish!
(2) UNBLOCKABLE super.
(3) PPP or KKK moves that make Vega completely invulnerable to attack.
(4) TWO EX moves that run right through fireball happy scrubs.
(5) Easy to combo into EX combo with normal hit confirms.
I know I know - there's downsides too - but for some reason I really enjoy playing Vega unlike any other character on the roster.
Peace!
Posted by Assassin on October 9, 2009 at 9:28 p.m. #433
Well, in the Vega camp, we do need something, and we're probably the Camp that complains the least and needs the most.
while we are throwing around Ideas, I had a dream last night where Vega did something like feilong's cross up where he rolls over your back, except this wasnt so much of a throw but more of a hop to a grab to a swing around to the other side of the opponene, to a release on the other side. And the move could be comboed on both sides, into the grab and after the release in a ST or something
it was something like that
and I joines this websites forum now, you guys should try it, we can open a Vega Thread. anyway, over there I suggested that Vegas Super land on the wall as normal, and then a second, semi-transparet Vega continues through the cloned image on the wall at regular FBA speed or slightly faster, then begins the slamming process, then the Wall image dives over at current Super speed and timing, and they join back to full Vega for the final slam.
that would also show us the "shadowy" side of Vega and his Dual Personality, what do u think about that?
Posted by Assassin on October 9, 2009 at 9:47 p.m. #434
@Kage:
I agree wholly, no character brings me half as much joy to play besides Vega, Elfuerte is the next in line
I found myself switching to several different chracters because my opponent wasnt so great, Honda, Blanka, Chun Li, Abel.. and then I went back to Vega and I was just excited and happy, eventhough I play him everyday
Vegas IS the Greatest. regardless of how he matches up with the meatheads.
And I stand by what I said about if SF4 was arcade only, arcade ettiquette and play style, Vega would be Consistently at #1
I really love his Ultra too, I have used it in situations even where I am stuck in the corner and being bombarded by a barrage of attakcs from a meathead, it lands on the wall right as the to some low MK or HK, flashes right in front of ther eyes there on the wall, then shreds the crap out of them
I also love the ultra through Fireballs, its got to be one of the most satisfying Ultras to land, right there with Akumas and Elfuerte's
but I wish it was more useful against jumping in opponents, who it generally misses, if it were only given a body-wide hit box it would be way more useful
Posted by Meteo on October 10, 2009 at 3:12 a.m. #435
Haha, yeah a Blanka was being over-aggressive towards me today. We both had very low life, and I was cornered. He came at me with a ball but then his ass got Bloody High Clawed with an inch to spare for the win! I love when you're right in their face at the wall like that. Point Blank, haha.
Here's a question: If Vega could combo a super/ultra from a FADC'd Scarlet Terror, how far up the tier would he move? :)
Posted by @438 on October 10, 2009 at 10:15 a.m. #436
That would be ultra only cause you cant do a super if you fadc. And not much cause there's a lot more holding him back. Any good pressure game and you're taking a whole lot of damage. No consistent way to wake up reversal out of many situations. Poor stam/dam. etc, etc, etc...
Posted by Jink on October 10, 2009 at 12:55 p.m. #437
@Kage #435
That's the right attitude! ;)
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 10, 2009 at 1:14 p.m. #438
I think he can already fadc into his super, but it's the claw version of the super so it doesn't crap for damage.
Balrog (boxer) can link into his ultra sure, but it juggles and due to damage scaling it does crap for damage. If the combo leading into super/ultra (super being the izuna version) wasn't too big, the damage should still be decent. But I think the scarlet terror special will solve all that. of course, if they make specials/ultras selectable you'd give up that sweet invulnerable wall jump.
I'll join the forum, sure.
Posted by @435 on October 10, 2009 at 3:24 p.m. #439
(1) Full screen ultra punish!
(2) UNBLOCKABLE super.
(3) PPP or KKK moves that make Vega completely invulnerable to attack.
(4) TWO EX moves that run right through fireball happy scrubs.
(5) Easy to combo into EX combo with normal hit confirms.
(1) Useless and unreliable unless opponents jump or spam fb or do not know how to block
(2)UNBLOCKABLE NOT = to unstoppable
(3)Can be hit out of it on the very vulnerable end parts
(4)One only is really usefull
(5)Check
Posted by @441 on October 10, 2009 at 3:27 p.m. #440
"if they make specials/ultras selectable you'd give up that sweet invulnerable wall jump"
Hoping to God that it won't be selectable ones.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 10, 2009 at 4:53 p.m. #441
@443
I am hoping not too. Is it really a big deal if you get the specials ultras like in alpha? Gen already does that.
@442
punish means vs. cheese and spam tactics. he isn't saying the full screen ultra has great utility otherwise. besides he's just trying to brighten up all the doom and gloom talk ;-)
Posted by Assassin on October 10, 2009 at 8:24 p.m. #442
"If Vega could combo a super/ultra from a FADC'd Scarlet Terror, how far up the tier would he move? :)"
in my opinion he'd be top tier, the only thing that makes Sagat, Ryu, etc, top tier is their ability to combo into their ultras and supers from single hits, as well as FADC's
if vega's Ultra hit off the ground like FBA knocking th opponent into the air then slicing them to pieces then it could be done straight off of MP or MK just like all the top tier characters, and then it could also be thrown into other combos. that would make him a "top tier" competitor
but Vega also needs to be able to FADC his Scarlet Terror, and even that alone would set him up on near top
Posted by Assassin on October 10, 2009 at 8:27 p.m. #443
@ cowboy soultaker:
what do you mean "selectable"? like a little icon appears for you to choose from? i think that would be lame
i imagined "selectable" simply meant adding another one, or some small movement like Vegas Super can "switch"
then how would that affect the wall dive?
Posted by Dave on October 10, 2009 at 10:24 p.m. #444
Claw's ultra is flawed for many reasons...
1. Minimal chip damage (normal sky high claw does more)
2. Does not track the enemy's position
3. For as hard as it is to successfully land in high-level play, it does less damages than easier to pull off ultras, such as ryu's or sagat's.
4. Easily punishable if blocked. Sure all ultra's are punishable on block, but think of the chip damage. Boxer's ultra's chip damage is insane.
5. No easy-link into ultra.
6. Even IF you could FADC out of a scarlett terror, there isnt enough time to charge the ultra. This could be fixed by giving Claw a new ultra that doesnt require charging or bouncing off the wall.
The comment made by Ono is reassuring of this fact -- that ultra commands will not overlap. Hopefully this means that Claw's new ultra might be a QCFx2+PPP command...some kind of claw combo even.
7. Ultra does not start until you've reached the wall. This means no possible wake-up possibilities since you can be hit on your way to the wall. The start-up need to happen on command (Screen goes dark as Claw begins jumping off the ground)
Ryu spends 3 seconds charging his metsu hadouken while all the action stops, why cant Claw spend 1 second getting to the wall?
Sure his Ultra has good properties...
1. Excellent starting frames, his ultra lands almost immediatly after it activates.
2. Good as anti-fireball spam
3. Good for wake-up finishing chip damage. It comes out so fast that poeple dont block or counter in time, and you cant just jump over it since its so fast.
But as you can see, the negatives heavily out-weigh the positives...
Posted by JDH on October 11, 2009 at 2:23 a.m. #445
Hell, I'm a vega main (but a noob) and I would be happy with just a reliable high priority wake-up. All those Ryu and Ken scrubs online that aren't very good can just spam SRKs and you're left having to respect them upon knocking them down.
Vega, on the other hand, when knocked downed, is not in the least bit respectable. Any smart player crowds him on wake up.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 11, 2009 at 4:52 a.m. #446
@Assassin
Selectable ala Street Fighter 3. It was "hinted at" in one of the articles posted on the event hubs articles. http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2009/oc...
what I meant was, lets say you select an ultra with more utility, like the ST ultra, if it's like SF3, that would mean you no longer have the wall jump ultra. That is all I meant. I am hoping that it isn't this way, I am hoping they are all available to you ala alpha 3. time will tell.
@JDH
you are right, if someone is playing a shoto as pressure and they've really hooked into you it's tough to break it. you can try KKK to flip their wake up move and try a kara throw, if they're crossing you up you can try a neutral jump HK or a light Scarlet Terror. Actually, as I've noticed, there are a lot of neutral versions of the hk/mk hp/mp. I may try going into training mode, recording jump ins and playing them back to find out what beats what. if I do I will be sure to post back here.
Posted by JDH on October 11, 2009 at 10:22 a.m. #447
Actually, I would like to add one two more buffs to Vega.
1. (As I posted above) A high priority wake-up.
2. EX-FBA should have armor.
3. Remove the stupid-*ss claw throw and mask throw. Why waste vega's specials on moves that just cause you to be weaker? Seriously.
With these simple buffs, Vega would move to a decent spot on the tier listings, and more importantly, zero skill high-tier-using scrubs would actually have to *think* and learn true *skills* in order to win. I don't think armor on FBA would be broken in the least bit. Just look at all of Balrog's armor and Zangief's. Also, I think Seth has armor on his EX's, but it may just be that they have broken priority.
@cowboy soultaker:
Thanks for that advice, KKKing the wakeup and kara throwing sounds promising, I'll have to practice it, because right now I cannot do Vega's Kara-throw consistently.
Also, I should incorporate more neutral jump wakeups. I haven't been trying this one much.
Posted by Meteo on October 11, 2009 at 11:09 a.m. #448
He's just not intentionally designed to be strong I guess. He feels like a character that is a more effective choice between equally-experienced players of lower skill.
In that case, his weaknesses kind of balance his tricky attacks, but the tricky attacks don't easily work anyway at higher levels of play.
Posted by Kage on October 11, 2009 at 8:39 p.m. #449
Just saw one of the better Vega players get demolished by a Gen player on Barfights II ! Can't wait to see the higher-quality uploads.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 11, 2009 at 9:01 p.m. #450
nice, I will have to keep an eye out for that one.
Posted by Assassin on October 11, 2009 at 9:54 p.m. #451
I'd be very interested in what you find out about Neutral strikes or any information on any strikes beating out any moves of any other characters at all
and I hope you post it in the Forum as well
I for one like the ultra. my only complaint is its hit box
and I might enjoy it more if the angle was controllable, even if its angling yourself up and down on the way to the wall instead of coming down
i kind of like that it looks like a normal FBA on the way to the wall, so if you get knocked out of it, it doesnt give up your strategy.
taking off the mask should close to double the power of your hits
the claw should be thrown at the expense of 1 or 2 EX blocks
EX scarlet terror should perform deep, low, powerful and invincible as most other wake ups, then you could leave the regular ST as is.
Posted by @452 on October 12, 2009 at 12:15 a.m. #452
Tatsu was playing Yeb and a Justin Wong. He's a pretty good vega. Actually one of the best SF4 Vegas I've ever seen. But when you see those match ups, you'll see exactly why hes ranked/rated where he is (LOW). Lol side note: Sanford plays a mean Dan which. Definitely Sanford's Dan > Tatsu's Vega. Maybe sometime soon we can get a tier list with Vega below Dan. LOL
Posted by Assassin on October 12, 2009 at 3:37 a.m. #453
@452:
I replied to your comments about tiers here: http://forums.eventhubs.com/viewtopic...
Posted by Dave on October 12, 2009 at 4:43 a.m. #454
Giving invincable start up frame to his ST alone would make him mid-tier
His ultra takes to long to start and the motion is awkward. I cant count the times that i did an ex-walldive by mistake.
Even worse, lose your claw and the ultra does pitiful damage, even with the mask off.
Lastly, i agree with JDH...
The mindset of a person fighting against Claw is simple and easy.
"ok, i just need to get him in a corner or knock him down first...then jump in on wake up since he has no reversal...maybe throw some punches in here....land a grab..spam more punches on wake up....just keep throwing random punches that have more priority than any of his EX-attacks....ok half his health is gone....oooo i knocked off his mask and claw...special attack....tripped him, time to cross him over and start again...spam punches, yay i win!"
requires no thinking and a simple mix-up game of tick throws and special attacks that are safe on block (rufus' moveset comes to mind)
This is the strategy that EVERYONE i play against uses on me....and its all they have.
If Claw's ST gets invincable frames in ssf4 (which he better damn get) then they wont have sh*t on me. Their only answer will be gone, and they will have to actually think, to win
Posted by Googie_1 on October 12, 2009 at 7:43 a.m. #455
PPP on the wake is very good for avoiding jump-ins and the KKK are help to mix it up.
One trick I do, is to use the Sliding kick to slide underneath people who either throw "Sagat's" fire ball, or hurican kicks or slimply when you know a person is going to jump in..
There ways of avoiding the Jump in's, very tuff though, its more about avoiding the jump in all together and attack when you have the space.
I really cant believe that the ST wasnt invinceble from the beginning.
Posted by Assassin on October 12, 2009 at 8:09 a.m. #456
Crouch + HP pwns hurricane kicks from any angle
Posted by @457 on October 12, 2009 at 8:31 a.m. #457
Invin frams on EXST may help a little but a well placed wakeup cross will probably still stuff it out clean if the move isnt auto corrected.
Posted by @456 on October 12, 2009 at 8:50 a.m. #458
I was @452 (post 455)
Look, I know youre a fan of Vega. Hell, I like him too. Vegarine is awesome. But for me what I see is what I get. And I've seen tournament players play dan much more effectively than I've seen them play Vega. Even though their usage is probably very limited.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 12, 2009 at 1:49 p.m. #459
sorry assassin, I totally forgot about the tests.
I did them quick, if someone wants to double check my answers they're free too.
(notations: I use correct format in test #1, and switch to N. MP, HK, etc for the rest. N. implies neutral jump)
vs. Ryu
Test#1 = Ryu's priority punch (jump in mp)
This is unlikely to be used on crossup, but it is used often when not doing aerial tatsumaki.
All neutral jumps trade when it's "well timed", meaning simultaneous. neutral jump MK or HK is best to combat it. N. MK only if you're jump is higher. N. HK is best for the rest of the time.
Test#2 = Jump in and cross up HK (not on wake-up)
N. HK and N. MK are not effective. N. MP when below ryu's jump, n HP is the best bet though. Simultaneous, as always, trades at best.
Test #3 = cross up mk on wake-up (for more j.mk ideas see ken's section)
This test was recorded with a sweep that I would not block, then a cross up mk. cross up mk's were not as consistant as I'd like, but i ran this for about 5-10 minutes.
All Neutrals will be punished. late or early mk's may be avoided all together, or even trade. cr. mp has a high chance of avoiding the cross-up on wakeup.
Ken
jump-in HK
When timed right, ken will at worst trade (for equal dmg with mask on). It takes great timing by ken to get the priority in the trade or hit. all neutrals (hk, mp, mk, hp) will out prioritize early hk. Late is harder to hit with.
Jump-in mk on wake-up
As with ryu, mk will out prioritize any neutral you do. This is because it will crossup even a jump, since the n. jump actually makes the cross-up more likely to happen. as with ryu, though, vega's mp (and hp) can avoid taking the hit. What you do after avoidance is up to you, you can try kara-throwing, since that is the most likely action ryu/ken will do after whiffing. I suggest mp, however, if an ill-timed xup mk is used, you might turn and hit with c. hp. it's a tough call.
Jump-in MK (not cross-up)
N. HK is king against a jump in mk. N. MP and MK are mainly for jumping early or lat compared to opponent. N. HP didn't seem to do so well.
Jump-in MK (pressuring fleeeing opponent)
If you are like me, at some point you've been caught in a j. flee trap. If this is the case, your best friend is fleeing j. hp. It's teh same as jump in, and the claw doesn't seem to have a hit box in this animation, so it is your safest way to punish a pursuant ken mk. this is possibly the same with ryu's mk.
Those were all the tests I did. I can try other opponents if you want. I'd welcome anyone to do this with the record function [in training mode] (like I did) or a friend to double check my work.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 12, 2009 at 1:55 p.m. #460
@457
you are right. "clutch" (as i don't believe there is such a thing with SRK shortcuts) SRK's will auto-correct, but it's amazing how many of vega's moves won't. ST won't, all neutral jumps won't, cr. mp doesn't. cr. hp was the only thing that changed direction part of the time. even that was iffy.
Posted by Kage on October 12, 2009 at 2:27 p.m. #461
@cowboy
Wow - thanks for putting all that down. Have to try the cr. mp vs Gen's/Vipers wake-up cross overs.
Also - been trying to refine Vega's cross-over attack (not the wall-dive). Unfortunately it's very positional. Haven't seen it on the forums so I thought I'd share it here.
The setup: Your back is against the corner. Opponent is far enough away that if you do a quick wall jump, your jumping in HP claw will just hit the back of your opponent. When you land, you're on the other side of your opponent!
So far i've managed this on Ryu and Sagat during online play making me hope this works on most sized characters. Again it's very positional but really nice when it works. Makes your opponent confused whether or not Vega has any normal cross over attacks and get them blocking the wrong way...
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 12, 2009 at 2:36 p.m. #462
@ kage
you're welcome. I should note that the reason the cr. mp avoids is cuz it goes the opposite way of the cross.
if that doesn't work against the viper/gen cross I can do them next. With gen though you may be better off just blocking. High, then low for the inevitable cr.lk
Posted by Kage on October 12, 2009 at 2:38 p.m. #463
To clarify,
I'm not even sure this is a true cross-over in the sense that your opponent has to reverse the direction of block to block the cross-over. But you DO land on the other side of your opponent which (at least so far) has led to my favorite combo (of the month): Cl. st. HP (hits twice) then st. HK (hits twice).
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 12, 2009 at 7:25 p.m. #464
was messing around in training. you can get 2 hits from cl HP and 2 hits from standing hk? i get pushed back too far and at best might get 1 kick to connect.
I found something out, gen's crossup doesn't always crossup, thats why it's hard to block. I was fighting someone from the forums and was holding the right block for a crossup, but it wasn't till i switched to a regular block that i finally blocked it.
Posted by Kage on October 12, 2009 at 8:45 p.m. #465
Well now - maybe that's why i have a hard time blocking cross-overs. I'll have to play with that a lil more.
For the double st. HP and st. HK to land you have to be close - i find it best to start with a jumping HP - for some reason it seems when you land coming out of jumping (towards) HP you're even more on top of them than you are with just walking up to them.
The timing for the st HP --> st HK is tricky - but just play with it. It's a meaty 5 hit fierce combo that does decent stun.
Posted by Assassin on October 12, 2009 at 9:35 p.m. #466
@Cowboy:
thanks alot for that info, every good stuff
i'd be interested in Blanka and Sagat and balrog someday too
@kage:
you are right on with that move, its better than the normal wall jump for escaping out the corner, and its them in he back, they must block the opposite direction and it can be dropped down and hit when you opponent is closer than half screen
HK is a very awesome move it hits often, it hits hard, and hit twice, and has pretty good priority, if you are too fro to hit twice with it, dont use it, stick with HP or MK
and the HP double strike should always be used with HP Crystal Rolling Flash. a good way for a set up is the jumping in HP
honestly speaking, the HP double hit to HP CRF should always be considered as an alternate to throwng after a missed special move like an uppercut or after you Fwd dash, or during a star state, it uses no EX and does crazy damage after a jump in HP
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 13, 2009 at 8:43 a.m. #467
@assassin
I agree. Tic throwing and Kara Throwing should be always at the ready, because chances are they're not gonna fear your jump in, they'll just go for a throw, and you'll be ready with to tech it. That kurochevsky guy (from that one youtube link) has the timing down perfectly to kara after his cosmic heel, when it's blocked.
So you can get two hits of cl. hp and get in a heavy RCF? I will have to practice that. Honestly I haven't come up with my own stuff yet, I've been working off of that tutorial vid.
Posted by Assassin on October 13, 2009 at 10:16 a.m. #468
@cowboy
man, i think 'm staying over here from now on..
no, its a Hp Cancel, but it does alot more damage than just the 2 HP strikes, it SHOULD be 2strike hit before the CRF but its not, though sometimes you might be able to catch someone with it, more likely a 2hit HP then a LP CRF
you know what else works nice? Fwd Dash + throw, u won't believe how often I throw or kara right after a dash, it has pretty strong properties, the trhow is more like a link, you cant just fire the buttons, have to wait for the right timing.
and i agree the Piece of Mercury should have the named changed to Piece of Crap, but it does hit nicely in some combos where you are running out of strikes and they are about throw in a low kick of some sort, i seldom use it, but every time I have used it it hits.. so, maybe we could look into it a little more
Posted by Kage on October 13, 2009 at 12:45 p.m. #469
Anyone have luck using the EX-RCF to counter a linked fireball? (where the opponent has you on a blockstring which ends in a fireball.) I managed to somewhat get it to counter Ryu's cr mk --> FB link during training - have to start the RCF motion at the end of RYU's mk animation or else it doesn't come out.
I haven't been really able to use the Piece of Mercury for anything. Maybe vs Honda's non-EX headbutts but that's about it.
Posted by Jink on October 13, 2009 at 2:18 p.m. #470
Truism!
Makoto (VE) / Dan (RY) vs. Ojisan Boy (SG) / Tokido (AK:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJsCFn...
Posted by chriss790 on October 13, 2009 at 3:29 p.m. #471
sorry to interrupt your conversation, can you give me any tip how to through lvl4 normal trial first combo, im useless at charging
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 13, 2009 at 8:49 p.m. #472
not a problem, you aren't interrupting.
Trial #4 01/03
The minute you jump for the jumping kick, hold back. you don't have to hold back down, just back. do your medium kick like normal, and at the end of your medium kick move your thumb forward and hit light punch. If you do it correctly, as soon as vega puts his foot down it should go into a roll. The timing of the standing mk to light rolling crystal flash is a bit touch, and will take some practice. But that is how you save your charge for it.
02/03
light Scarlet Terror, then immediatly move your thumb to the down-back position. Wait 2 seconds, then do your ex Scarlet Terror. if it's coming out, but late, then you have the right idea, you just need to get yoru thumb to the down-back position faster.
03/03 this is my favorite combo
Do a full level 3 focus attack, dash after its done and do the cosmic heel. Don't let go of downforward, because you are saving the charge. after you do the cosmic heel, and have held the df position for 2 seconds immediately press up-forward and 2 punch buttons. This will knock your opponent in the air, then you just gotta time the left or right + punch right (thats the easy part).
I know you just asked for trial 4 #1 but I figured I'd type out the whole trial. If you need any clarification just ask.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 13, 2009 at 8:51 p.m. #473
Sorry, it is NOT two punch buttons, it's 2 kick buttons. I am so sorry for any confusion. you probably knew what I meant but I feel terrible for missing that. I mean I play him every day >.>
Posted by Assassin on October 14, 2009 at 8:50 a.m. #474
i write all my combos down in wordpad as they come up then i annotate to help me remember
for example, Hard Trial 4 with vega is Jump HP, HP, LK, Crouch MP
then after i get it down i write like this Jump HP, HP, (d) LK, (d) Crouch MP
the (d) means Delay for me, so i know it is not going to work unless i delay to a specific time after the hit.
you may also want to write in (t) for 'tied together' or (f) for 'fire buttons' and (c) for 'cancel'
Posted by Meteo on October 14, 2009 at 10:26 a.m. #475
I know it affects both players' abilities, but latency online really hurts my ground-based izuna drops. I use it a lot in G1 matches in games where I can get 4 or 5 bars, but at 3 sometimes I just have to force myself to forget I have the move at all. Vega's speed makes it really hard to hit when you are practically inputting the grab in mid air before even reaching them. Still, I love floating around their counter attacks like I have a jetpack on and then slamming their ass.
In other news, Blanka still gives me by far the most trouble. I can deal with most other characters my level, but Blanka I can't do much other than poke and a few grabs/RCFs. What are some good ways to counter/punish his moves? I know ST and ultra can punish his super ultra, but not much else. Fierce jumping punch usually trades or gets beaten out by EX jumping ball when I try to stuff it.
Rufus is my favorite (most exciting) character to fight, I can usually avoid/bait his anti-airs and dive kicks. Rufus almost always follows up regular block strings with ex attacks, so be careful with grabs while blocking. If you can counter his arials with ST/airgrab and punish/surprise him with EX FBA/SHC, it's just a great match in my opinion. lol/haha
Posted by Assassin on October 14, 2009 at 11:26 a.m. #476
I played Blanka tonight, i was beaten the first 2 rounds then i won him every other round the rest of the night
I play in the arcade, so i feel lucky not having to deal with what you are dealing with.
I punished his roll with EXFBA's or HK slides
watch out for his slides, block them for sure, they reach super far, or go for a lvl 2 or 3 FA
stay on the ground with blanka, he has a lot of ways to punish air born people and his ex strikes beat out all of vegas ex strikes, even alot of his normal moves beat out vegas EX's
focus attack, and keeping optimal distance is important.
during his mix up games use jab strikes to LCRF or ST
exploit every opportunity when he is not charging, get as airborn as you can with HP, HK, and MK strikes if he isnt charging.
during his ultra, block the first one then jump over it as it comes back down
MP with the claw on during his electricity, or back dash/ half back flip then HK slide
you can pull him out of his electrcity in the beggining and end of it with FBA to Izuna Drop
otherwise over shoot it and go for HK slide
watch out for his LP roll, flip backwards when u see it coming
i hit with piece of mercury a few times during those odd hit exchanges you have with blanka and his funky little strikes
use ST to punish jump ins and his cr. HP long arm strike by prempting his strike
i have real good luck with HP CRF against blanka when he isnt expecting it, but not when he can spin , his spin will beat you everytime.
dont use your bloody claw, not even the EX version works on blankas spins. dont even use it from behind him, he can just spin upwards
save all of your ex for EX FBA punishing rolls to Izuna drop
other than that, just select your strikes very carefully
Posted by Kage on October 14, 2009 at 12:54 p.m. #477
Some other tips:
Punish a blocked Blanka roll with Vega's Ultra.
Learn how to block Blanka's ultra. If you're too close to dash back, Block UP, then block down.
If Blanka does an ultra and IF you're far enough away - you can air throw Blanka out of the first part when he's airborne. Takes some practice but it's easier than it looks.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 14, 2009 at 1:03 p.m. #478
once my TE stick gets here i shouldn't have a problem doing his ultra on command. more times then not if i'm attempting the ultra an ex wall jump comes out. it blows.
lol, sweep punishes ball....interesting.
Posted by noob on October 14, 2009 at 3:47 p.m. #479
does anyone else have a problem with the EX-izuna missing (part of a combo) because the izuna goes the wrong way? I swear I push up-right, and vega goes up-left.
Posted by @482 on October 14, 2009 at 5:03 p.m. #480
If you want to go towards the opponent, you have to HOLD up forward.
Posted by Assassin on October 14, 2009 at 6:56 p.m. #481
also the Ultra works good as he's rolling in, before he hits you, great against ex rolls, the closer your back is to the wall the easier it'll be to catch them
Posted by Meteo on October 15, 2009 at 5:21 a.m. #482
@482, I know what you mean, buts it's a matter of practicing the correct input. If you finish the input and are holding a little bit too much UP instead of UPRIGHT, vega will fly towards his back instead of his front. It's hard to notice in actual matches when it feels like you're doing it right, so repetition in practice mode will help.
The tips about punishing Blanka's blocked rolls with EX-FBA helped, that seems like the easiest punish in the match. I noticed that I wasn't able to punish blocked rolls consistently with slides or Ultra at mid-screen. However, When either player is in a corner, punishing rolls with slides/ultra/ST becomes easy. Also, if Blanka's slide is too close, it can be punished with ST or cr medium kick into ST/EX-FBA. Keeping blanka in a corner is a great thing to do I think. Random FBA's/SKH's are not.
I'm going to start typing up a few things I think about various matchups for the other arcade characters soon.
Posted by Meteo on October 15, 2009 at 5:26 a.m. #483
woops, "SKH"? I meant SHC (Sky High Claw)
"Bloody High Claw" is Vega's ultra, tricky terminology difference
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 7:31 a.m. #484
I hit with the ultra every single time these days, today I had Chunli's fist right in my face when it started, which looked cool
try this, instead of jumping at the same time they jump, jump up and back when they are on their way down, this will usually provoke them to jump forward again at which time you can ultra them. you can usually just throw it out as soon as you land. otherwise, i am really starting to enjoy getting backed into a corner, because its one of the most saisfying ways to land the Ultra
timing on it largely depends on your distance from the wall, though, but i hit with my utra every single round and sometimes twice per round.
just imagine you are a shoto, and as soon as you would throw a firebal, and know the other person is thinking the same thing, throw it out. I have his with my ultra when they are in the middle of throwing it out, not even pushing it out yet
i really love the ultra and i dont want it changed at all anymore, other than being able to combo into it.
and Scarelt Terror has been my best friend these past few days, i have hit with it so much I alsmost don't want it tochange, except that Vega needs to move up
i throw it in after all CRF's and it hits almost every time.
this is a very easy combo i'm almost embarrassed to write it so easy but it works all the time. when you get a shoto with a crouch MP, pause one moment to eilcit a reaction then throw it out instead of throwing out immediately, sit on it a moment, delay a second, then do it, you'll find it hits every time..
jump in and strike, crouch mp, delay, ST
and i am hitting with my HP CRF almost every time, at least getting the block damage, I dont even want it changed anymore. (except vega needs buffing) I'm not sure exactly what I'm doing , its all part of game timing, but mostly its just after a delay as well
as for buffing vega, I vote to keep all moves the same (Piece of Mercury needs to be overhead) and just increase the combos and links to include multiple EX moves with Ultras/Supers
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 7:43 a.m. #485
Piece of Mercury needs to be a double overhead strike, or better yet, one high strike and one low strike
Posted by Meteo on October 15, 2009 at 8:15 a.m. #486
"jump in and strike, crouch mp, delay, ST"
If you get that first jump-in strike, I'd much rather follow the full combo through to the crouch-mp/mk + ST or EX-FBA rather than wait for a delay. Hey, its guaranteed damage. If they block the first overhead jump-in, expect a possible DP to break your attack (in the case a shoto blocks your jump in, grab or delay or KKK after the block)
Be careful with RCF followed by ST. It works a lot for me too because Vega *looks* vulnerable after a blocked RCF, but an opponent who knows the trick will block it and deal you one hell of a punishment. A good test is to try a FBA first and see how they react to it: If they dont seem to counter your moves perfectly, RCF to ST is probably a good bet.
I like to start a match with a FBA, wiffing it safely if I need to. Just doing this can get you a bit of a read on who your opponent is. :D
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 9:15 a.m. #487
the crouch can be blocked as well, it really doesnt matter.
i get in alot of stand offs with Ryu and Ken in crouching positions, and a good Shoto always delays, because they rely very heavily on landing a combo, it seems thats all they can do, anyway, the Crouch MP delay can be done from anything, standing HK or HP, standing MP, FA, Dash, whatever, it doesnt rely on getting an initial hit as the EXFBA does, and the ST will usually just whiff. the reason for the delay is that your ST will hit them because they are trying to strike at the same time whcih will catch them up with a double hit ST
the EX ST i found trades hits or even beats out with a perfectly times FA that is going to hit you no matter what as you stand up. of course pressing down on the joystick when you fall can help to avoid those situations
and same thing with the CRF, you come of out of it, and pause a moment, long enough for them to decide to strike first, then you throw out your ST, it works because you delay before you do it, then just do it after a delay, you arent actually reacting to their first strike, it will hit them before they strike, you wont even see their strike, but it hits because they were going to strike
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 9:19 a.m. #488
otherwise it just whiffs, even with a landed crouching MP or crouck MK
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 10:25 a.m. #489
That gets me thinking.. what do you all do for starting off the match, first moves?
jump in with Air throw
fwd dash kara throw
Fwd a split second + MK
EXFBA
EX SHC from your back wall (prempting a fireball)
FA fwd dash
LP RCF
Fwd Jump HP
Wall Dive Izuna
flip backwards
what is your most common instinct
Posted by Meteo on October 15, 2009 at 11:16 a.m. #490
vs a typical shoto?
This covers the *typical* first 2 seconds of round 1 vs a new opponent. Just because multiple things could occur does not mean they are equally likely.
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv...
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 15, 2009 at 1:41 p.m. #491
nice flow-chart, meteo.
First thing I do is back-off and see what kind of game they're playing. If the first thing they do is a fireball, and I land my FBA then I know that I can win as long as I don't eff up too bad. if they don't throw a fireball, I know they've fought claws before, so I try not to jump in too much.
If they turtle I just build up my ex with l. ST's. They usually smell blood and come out of the turtle.
I think the only time I lead off with offense is in round two if I'm fighting a jumpy character, I go for the air throw.
Posted by Assassin on October 15, 2009 at 5:41 p.m. #492
ya, cool chart, thanks
I always do something right off the bat, just because i feel thats half the fun of the game is to out wit (out guess) your oponent right off the line.
I always feel disappointed when someone just backs off
its a little bit of a friendly wager, it feels like a little game inside of a game.
I usually jump in with an air throw
sometimes i like to hit them with the MK, that can hit them out of a fireball if you press forward on the joystick slightly first
its like a bit of a gamble, almost like a card game of some sort, you win or you lose, but i think its alot of fun when someone, either one, gets the first strike from an off the line action
but the flow chart is cool, just watch out for a HP shoryuken, that will usually hit your mid-air stall, requiring you to stall almost straight up from the wall instead while you check his game
of course sagats fireball will knock you right off the wall if uses it straight off the ground, in which case beginning with a HK sweep would have been a good bet. Will a ken or ryu HP fireball right off the line hit you before you can leap around it off the wall?
Posted by Meteo on October 15, 2009 at 9:59 p.m. #493
It's really a tricky game of reactions and timing. If the guy counters it well, usually that means he's anticipating some of my moves, which makes me try and bait him more often. A lot of times I can avoid and izuna drop their failed shoryuken counters. I dont throw out random non-ex FBA's if I'm crowded or am in range to get hit before I'm off the wall.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 16, 2009 at 8:41 a.m. #494
LOL@#376
all that Vega rocking was throwing my eyes off balance. I'ma try that next gief
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 16, 2009 at 9:26 a.m. #495
@#408
Vega's Flying Barcelona Special hits 4 times not 3. if you're hitting 3 times you're starting too late or have the wrong angle. Hit the back of the head.
Posted by Assassin on October 17, 2009 at 9:32 a.m. #496
well, you have to be close enough to do a regular throw anyway, the hit doesnt take much priority over anything than a throw will with the exception of Blankas electricity, and occasionally on a jumping sriking character.
the super throw has a MUCH wider hit box than the super slash. i can't even count how many supers I have whiffed altogether simply because of character evasion. if I cant grab with the giant super hitbox, there's simply no way I'm going to hit with the strikes. any Super strikes are accidental/ failed Actual supers. with the exception maybe chunli or blanka.
as long of a start up as the move has, to get in close enough for the srikes you'd have to be fighting a guy who was asleep at the controller to pull off a strike.
can anyone here show me the HIT/ power/ damage difference between a Super with all throws verses a "4" hit super, on an opponent with full health?
unless the strikes was actually bigger damage than the super, it seems completely useless, and I would like to know the damage comparison with the 3-strike hit as well
Posted by Assassin on October 17, 2009 at 9:38 a.m. #497
maybe good against Zangief too, his Lariet. you have to catch themm with their pants completely down while they are distracted by the colorful background to pull it off. though against characters like Chun's EX spinning bird kick, the Lariet and Electricity it prove usable, but exactly nothing else. it should have larger hitbox and at least be as powerful as the other super
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 17, 2009 at 11:56 a.m. #498
special with izuna does 330, special with 4 strikes does 280
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 17, 2009 at 7:44 p.m. #499
No it's pretty much just for show. there's never a circumstance where it is more beneficial to use the striking special instead of izuna. oh and the super does 308 for striking (4 hits no mask) 198 (3 hits no mask) and 363 for izuna (no mask). I also noticed that all attacks are affected in damage by the claw.... i thought only claw attacks were affected by claw.
Posted by Assassin on October 17, 2009 at 8:08 p.m. #500
wow, thats quite substantial, no wonder the mask costs 2 ex bars to lose, i'm never picking it up again
Posted by Meteo on October 18, 2009 at 2:35 a.m. #501
Well just be prepared to take 25% more damage! If you're using a lot of focus attacks it's probably better to minimize the absorbed damage with the mask on, but if you're going to land an ultra you might as well lose that sucker!
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 18, 2009 at 7:37 a.m. #502
it's only 10% more damage taken without mask... and damage scaling really works in our favor
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 18, 2009 at 7:49 a.m. #503
by the way, am i the only 1 that gets extremely aggressive with blanka.... i used to hate fighting him, but i've fought so many that i said "f- it. i'm going after this f-er." and HP RCF into 2 in 1 cMP, LP RCF into, 2 in 1 cMP, LP RCF into, 2 in 1 cMP, LP RCF into... etc until they ex roll out of it or jump, then go after them again until they get out fo it, then get close block, anticipate ultra, dash back and air throw him outta ultra, then resume RCF pressure.
Posted by Meteo on October 18, 2009 at 10:28 a.m. #504
So 10% more damage taken and 10% more damage given? I'm forgetting, not sure anymore how it exactly balances out in the end either way.
As far as Blanka goes, I'm starting to try some new stuff but am still not very aggressive. RCF loops I try tend to get busted, and most of my damage dealt comes from pokes and punishes in the corners.
Maybe I'll try recording a match or two for youtube and here.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 18, 2009 at 10:51 a.m. #505
well, hindsight is 20-20 as they say, reviewing a video could help you, and would also give an objective viewer (us) something to look at and offer advice on. With all my shortcomings lately I may be a bit more reserved in that department, wouldn't want to be the blind leading the blind (not that you're as bad as me)
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 18, 2009 at 11:05 a.m. #506
claw = +10% damage dealt
mask = -10% damage dealt -10% damage taken.
best offensive combo... claw + no mask
if you lose claw either pick it up or lose the mask.
and just curious what the hell does Vega say at the start of his ultra.
and for RCF loops you literally have to keep them constant and vary between LP MP and HP RCF. occasionally when you suspect a counterattack just block. but once you get blanka into the corner charging and blocking it's usually safe to jump and start a new combo with jHP, continue with whatever. onyl the best of the best blankas manage to get out of it and usually even they are down some health. RCF works wonders on blankas against wake up electricity. and if the slide is out and they roll you'll hit them. blanka is one of the few people we actually have some priority on.
the key to everything is being able to manufacture a charge out of nowhere and timing... it also helps to know what blanks's tend to do when you do certain moves so that you can anticipate what coming.
which brings me to my next point.... any speed increase in SSFIV would be sooooo nice. i'm already at executing ultra before fireball even leaves the character's hands or forward wall ultra on jumpy people (aka chun li, ryu, ken) then again i can't wait to see what awesome goodies Vega gets in the next game.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 18, 2009 at 2:08 p.m. #507
@509
I think "look out behind you" is what he says.
Posted by Jink on October 18, 2009 at 2:26 p.m. #508
"BLOODY HIGH CLAW! HAAAHAHAHAHAA!!" That's what he says.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 18, 2009 at 6:20 p.m. #509
@Jink Cowboy aslo VegaFabioLaCerda
Both of you are wrong and Jink he said at the "start of the Ultra" not when he's attacking.
When Vega connects to the wall he say
"Soke in your own blood" also some people think he say "Choke" instead of "Soak"
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 18, 2009 at 6:48 p.m. #510
lol I said "Soke" i mean Soak
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 18, 2009 at 9:24 p.m. #511
I think he says "yodel-layheehoo" XD
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 18, 2009 at 10:42 p.m. #512
thanks Jok3er... been wondering that for months.
Posted by Assassin on October 19, 2009 at 8:27 a.m. #513
@506:
i'm excited to hear you play aggressively with Vega against Blanka, you have to treat him like the animal he is. put him in his place like one would a rabid dog.
I really hope that the Vega camp gets good enough to demand some respect in SF4. your tips are spot on. Blanka is one that (just like a dog) you cannot flinch or show an ounce of fear, you have to own him, become his master, step up and meet his every action with dominance and aggression, show him who's boss, beat him down, battle him pound for pound with whatever he brings.
Posted by Dave on October 19, 2009 at 8:43 a.m. #514
@ VegaFabioLacerda
I've tested it in training mode several times and looked at the attack data.
1. Pick any character in training mode and have your opponent be vega
2. Smack him around until his mask comes off.
3. Go into training options and enable attack data on
4. Strike Vega using any attack and notice the 125% damage
So here it is in short.
Mask on Claw on - 100% damage
Mask on Claw off - 90% damage (Claw attacks only. Kicks do normal damage)
Mask off Claw on - 110% damage
Mask off Claw off - The damage is weird here. Far away standing punches seem to do more than kicks, if not just as much. Yet close up and crouching punches do less than kicks.
But in the long run the damage is less (for punches). The ultra normally does 450, yet without the mask and claw it only does 415.
I always switch to kick attacks when i lose my gear. If the claw's off, damage will still be the same. If the mask is off, i still get a damage bonus.
The only problem is that your poking game gets alot worse since the range is less
Posted by Dave on October 19, 2009 at 10:14 a.m. #515
Vega also has character-specific combos. Different characters have different-sized hitboxes. There are some combos that will work on some characters, yet not on others. I will list them here.
1. Jumping FP, cMK, cMP, EX-Walldive to izuna drop
Damage = 351
Works on - Sakura, Rose, Rufus, C.Viper, Abel, Boxer, Sagat, Dictator, Seth, Guile, Zangief, Chun-Li, Dhalsim, Gouken, Cammy
2. Jumping FP, cMK, light ST, EX-ST
Damage = 327
Works on - Gen, Rose, El Fuerte, Rufus, C.Viper, Abel, Boxer, Claw, Sagat, Seth, Guile, Chun-Li, Blanka, Gouken, Cammy, Fei Long
3. Jumping FP, standing FP, cMP, EX-walldive to izuna drop
Damage = 381
Works on - Sakura, Rose, Rufus, C.Viper, Abel, Boxer, Sagat, Seth, Guile, Zangief, Chun-Li, Dhalsim, Cammy
The only characters who cannot be hit with ANY of these combos are Ryu, Ken, Dan, and Honda
ALL of these combos work on Seth, Sagat, Boxer, Rose, Chun-Li, Abel, Rufus, Guile, Cammy, and C.Viper
As stated the hitboxes in this game are very weird. Prime examples are how the EX-ST combo will whiff a tall character like zangief, yet hit smaller characters such as rose and chun-li
Posted by Meteo on October 19, 2009 at 1:11 p.m. #516
Remember when Dave was talking about the difference between ending a combo with EX-FBA vs EX-ST? EX-FBA only does one more damage in the j.HP c.MK EX-FBA combo (315), and dave argued it was better to use the EX-ST ending because sometimes sh*t happens and you miss the Izuna Drop.
Well, I have a better reason to use it:
The EX-ST ending has 65 more stun (500 total vs 445)
I'm never ending with EX-FBA again, haha, unless they JUST got stunned and are getting low on health.
Here's another option that is of debatable use:
In Claw's character-specific combos, the jumping HP standing HP crouching MP parts should still connect on everyone I think. This part alone does 298 damage and 460 instead. You could do that, and then are safe from an immediate counter if you want to do a normal wall dive away from the opponent. This can keep your momentum rolling and if you connect with a Barcelona Attack its an extra 90 damage and 100 stun, and the regular Izuna Drop is 150/150.
j.HP c.MK to ST combo does 298 damage and 460 stun.
j.HP c.MK EX-ST does 314/500
j.HP HP c.MP alone does 298/460
if a follow up regular FBA attack hits, +90/100=388/560
if a follow up regular Izuna connects, +150/150=448/610
It's less guaranteed damage and most worthwhile against only some characters, but can be useful still if you want to get back at certain characters who spam moves like Dragon Punches to bust your combo links. You throw in that safe FBA after a hit string, and they wiff that DP counter at the same time. If they don't have a good DP-like counter, hell, throw in an EX-SHC from their back after the c.MP!
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 19, 2009 at 1:17 p.m. #517
@Dave
yeah I saw it. didnt know the damage was that high... kinda explains a couple things.
@Assassin
any non SRK except cammy and Zangief i'm pretty aggressive against. I'm also pretty aggressive aginst "timid" players that tend to be cautious and wait for a counterattack. counter focus attacking the counter attack really works wonders.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 19, 2009 at 1:21 p.m. #518
@Mateo
you're right but it's pretty difficult to pull off jHP unless you're really good at setting it up. anyone getting hit with it clearly wasnt expecting it. Occasional use might be ok but proceed with caution.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 19, 2009 at 1:22 p.m. #519
@Mateo
you're right but it's pretty difficult to pull off jHP unless you're really good at setting it up. anyone getting hit with it clearly wasnt expecting it. Occasional use might be ok but proceed with caution.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 20, 2009 at 7:38 a.m. #520
so yeah i always had problems with blocking throws and throwing on the ground. So i go "ok for 1 whole hour i'm only going to fight from the corner and back myself into a corner constantly... time and time again it's like people didnt know what to do lol. most threw fireballs which i punished severly, some actually did try to start some combos and stuff.... i don't know if they were really trying or not but when you go into a corner with the approach of learning or just blocking instead of trying to win you see s-tloads of openings in peoples combos. then again it could be they are thinking it's a trap but i dunno.
Posted by Meteo on October 20, 2009 at 4:16 p.m. #521
I had trouble filming new worthwhile matches of my own so far, but in the meantime, I found some replays on xbox live that may be worth taking a look at for effective strategies. Here they are, uploaded to youtube:
OMFG its Jr (VE 18k) vs El Sweepador (BL 41k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=susXAt...
Haze the Ripper (BL 24k) vs Agent Hoy (VE 27k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-svH9...
GoldBabylon (GU 68k) vs HotRod 8697 (VE 15k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdzjOf...
WHIP LATIGO (ZA 29k) vs DARK STAR NT (VE 29k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALMsVJ...
That last one vs. gief has some funny stuff in it :P
Posted by Dave on October 20, 2009 at 7:30 p.m. #522
I played with OMG its Jr. He's on my friends list.
We he's an up and comming vega and he asked for some tips when we did a Claw mirror match, but all-around he's good with execution.
BTW, my gamertag is FoutsKazuya if any of you want to play
Posted by @524 on October 21, 2009 at 5:20 p.m. #523
Nice vids. Can't see if the last one's Vega is really any good because that was a horrible gief. I mean how long did whip latigo have play to get 29k playing like that.
Posted by Dave on October 21, 2009 at 6:05 p.m. #524
I agree, that Zangief was pretty terrible, spamming green hands even after the 20th time getting punished for it.
The Grade Points dont really mean that much, they're more based on how often you play Championship mode, rather than actual skill.
It's always funny to me when i play someone with 12,000 GP who is terrible, then i'll start a new room and a guy with 2,000 GP comes in, and he's 10 times better than the other guy.
Ranked match was a better determiner of skill, in the fact that you didnt get rewarded points for losing. But at the same time, that mode was filled with baby ragequitters
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 21, 2009 at 11:19 p.m. #525
@Dave
half the time (myself included) that's because G1 players tend to start over and play in G2. i'm actually on round 5 in starting over. it's funny cause i pretty much dominate anyone in G2 including the G1 returners but the instant i go in G1 i struggle to get past the semi's. on top of that i use a ps3 controller... and man my left hand hurts from charging after damn near every match. i think the low grade like 40k and under G1 people are fun because the matches are really close (except for the people who can't play for s-t). I literally have to play at the top of my gamewith no mistakes. the 41k and up guys i almost don't even take seriously. i just work on blocking as much as i can and observing openings for future reference.
Man i need to invest in something that can record matches cause it looks good when it's whoever gets the next hit wins and whoever misses and i nail 'em with a crossup ultra. Anyone know of a good digital recorder i can connect to my ps3 to record my own matches? (preferably not a VCR)
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 22, 2009 at 10:01 a.m. #526
Anyone know how to do the dash forward ultra seen here from 0:21 to 0:28
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0A71F...
Posted by joe karma on October 23, 2009 at 10:27 p.m. #527
some changed id like to see with vega in the next game are
-slightly more aoe on ultra
-super acts like EX fba so it can be useful
-EX fba always hit on the way up. nothing like using ex meter to fly around with the opponent... also invincible on the way up
-EX sky claw invincible on the way up
-improved scarlet terror.. much like flash kick they both blow in this game.
and VegaFabioLaCerda #529 you charge db, dash foward ff, df, d, db, u
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 24, 2009 at 8:02 a.m. #528
that's going to take at least 2 weeks to even get close to working. I use D Pad and circles on d pad is hard
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on October 24, 2009 at 3:01 p.m. #529
O.o dashforward ultra? Intense....the possibilities
Posted by Kage on October 25, 2009 at 11:56 p.m. #530
Just found out Vega's RCF will beat out Abel's wake-up super/Ultra. It's important to be literally right on top as if you're late the super/Ultra will connect.
It's a nice bait if your opponent doesn't know the match-up.
Posted by Meteo on October 26, 2009 at 9:35 p.m. #531
Nice to know, Kage. Good Abels can be f*cking tricky.
Posted by Jink on October 27, 2009 at 12:37 a.m. #532
Thanks Kage.
Posted by Kage on October 27, 2009 at 9:25 a.m. #533
I'm _just_ about to hit G1 and thinking to myself - I'm not all too bad. THEN I see this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Boe8cT...
and I think, man - I'm still a noob.
(video courtesy of gootecks.com)
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on October 27, 2009 at 5:16 p.m. #534
@VegaFabioLaCerda
Yes it's kinda difficult to do but how he did it was
He kept his down back charge while focus dash canceling
when you dash your charge is still there after that quick dash all he did was just inputted the command (without having to charge again).
That's how he did it it's the same for all charge character Bison/ Chun-Li for them all u have to do is hold back Focus dash cancel and and follow it up with thier usual ultra command.
Posted by Jink on October 29, 2009 at 8:40 p.m. #535
I was half way on G2, winning a few more days for G3, but my PS3 got YLOD. Now I can't play, but I'll buy a new PS3 slim.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on October 30, 2009 at 10:23 a.m. #536
Jink... 2 questions
which model is it?
and
can you donate it to me?
:P
worth a try
Posted by Jink on October 30, 2009 at 9:29 p.m. #537
@VegaFabio
Lol, sorry. Me and my bro are finishing fixing it.
Posted by Meteo on October 31, 2009 at 11:38 p.m. #538
Woo Halloween
http://tinyurl.com/ghetto-vega
last minute improvisation...
Posted by Ioannis86 on November 1, 2009 at 9:11 a.m. #539
Any helpful tips with difficult mutchups like guile,e.honda and blanka's beast roll will be highly appreciated
Posted by Meteo on November 1, 2009 at 11:25 a.m. #540
Most importantly, practice and learn to exploit every opening with the most damage you can do. Try to get to the point where you can consistantly Izuna Drop people out of focus attacks, learn when KKK is best to use, and break any bad habits you see yourself forming. Sometimes you'll be having trouble for a long time and things start clicking and the problems clear up.
Situational tips:
Guiles like to sonic boom at point blank. EX-ST can go through them and will send him flying. Guile's flash kick is not a good anti-air vs vega if vega is doing a wall dive directly above him. Vega's cr.MP tends to interrupt and slash up guile when guile throws out random kicks and hits. Beware of guile's air grab, and also the fact that Guile has very fast recovery from sonic boom, so a full screen BHC ultra counter is risky. I have a bit of luck with RCF pressure in this match.
Honda's I have a bit of trouble with only if I play the same guy over and over and they get smart on the matchup. Honda does well when he's in close and you're on the ground, so avoid that situation and be ready to think fast to avoid his command throws and ground pounds. Walldives can catch him doing a lot, but not if he's waiting for it or has an ultra ready. His simple jumping anti air will REALLY hurt you quick. Jumping HK is useful in the air I think, grab his ass after missed ground pounds, or just EX-FBA through anything he wiffs.
We just had a lot of discussion on Blanka. Look above for some tips and videos. After a blocked blanka roll, EX-FBA through it as he bouces off. If he does one of those jump-back arc balls, I've seen people do a level 3 focus attack to absorb the first hit and blow him up when he lands. Beware of the slide and punish it if he tries it too close. Go in practice mode to get the technique down for blocking his ultra and punishing it. Sometimes a properly timed j.HP will stuff his normal balls, as does a LP on the ground. If you or he are in the corner, vega's slide starts punishing blocked special moves he does. Dont walldive almost at all, maybe only once in the match if you think it would throw him off guard with how he was playing you previously. Some carefully timed RCF pressure and cr.MP's can also help.
Posted by Ioannis86 on November 1, 2009 at 1:21 p.m. #541
Thanks for the helpful tips however in the guile section mind that not only his air throw but his jumping Hard K will knock you out of many wall dives.Also i think RCF gets beaten cleanly by right timed flask kicks(certainly bu ex-one's). About the BHC vs his sonic boom you are right he will almost always have time to block you and then you are in trouble
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 1, 2009 at 1:36 p.m. #542
For Guile just go ahead and start the match off with a FBA and aim for a cross up. So far 9/10 times Guile's first attack will be a sonic boom. if he doesnt then you know he's not a pushover. If he does just mix it up with SHC and FBA (both fakes and real ones). When you see guile walking back anticipate the sonic boom and nail him with a mixture of crossover and near side FBA. when you see him ducking he's charging for flash kick and fake FBA to try amd make him whiff (and punish if he does). aviod backflips if possible. FA the 2nd hit of his cHK and counter, dash toward, block whatever he is about to do and grab. when you see him at full screen for his sonic booms try to entice him into throwing them over and over (usually by FA all the non-ex ones)when you have ultra wait for guile to throw a sonic boom and PPP through it. just as you come out of the PPP moost guiles will throw a 2nd and be ready to run toward you. nail him with the ultra before that sonic boom even leaves his hands. if you get a jumpy guile time your FBA to start as he begins to fall from his jump or if you can do a crossover ultra by grabbing the forward wall going under guile's jump so that you nail him on the way down.
As for blanka.... most are pretty easy. almost every regular attack you have can stuff a regular roll (HP, HK, LP, cMP, cLP, cHK, jHP, **jHK** hint hint). so with that in mind go ahead and start the match off with a PPP. be ready to block down and be ready for a throw. you want to keep him on the ground as much as possible. the key here is not to counter with any special moves really. keep him on the ground at 2X cMP distance away and poke poke poke (cMP, cLP cMP, cLP cMPXX LP-RCF, HP-RCF *this is your best friend*, and cHK). the reason to keep him at 2x cMP distance is because eventually he will have ultra meter. when that happens kinda back off for a minute and sorta look defensive. wait for him to ultra. when he does and you see the animation for it hold up until it starts. at the peak of your jump air throw him out of his ultra. immidaitely hold a charge back and when you land do a HP-RCF him into the corner and poke poke poke him to death. the only real counter he has for this is a throw(or bite) and his ex roll. i never let either really stop me. if i get hit with it best he can do is 3 more of them. if you end up at a distance and he does the arc ball, either EX FBA, cHK, HK-ST, Air throw Ultra or HP-RCF him as he lands. try to entice him into whiffing a vertical ball and nail him as he lands. Whatever you do, do NOT input the ultra command while blanka is in the animation for his. It will nail you out of yours. wait till he leaves the ground then input it.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 1, 2009 at 1:38 p.m. #543
@544 also for jumping guiles (or anyone) ues more than HP SHC's LP SHC's do same damage and hit higher.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 1, 2009 at 1:46 p.m. #544
As for Honda,
SHC will beat sumo head butt unless you start late. FA will absorb his sumo ass drop. Pretty much do the opposite of blanka. Stay in the air a lot. Watch for his jumping HP. when you see it SHC. try to push him into the corner. if you can then pressure the hell outta him. this is when you use all those combos you learned in Hard trials. jump, slash and roll him to death. pretty much anticipate his butt grab as his wake up and you should be set
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 1, 2009 at 1:48 p.m. #545
http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthrea...
Here's some really good tips for match-ups.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on November 2, 2009 at 3:08 a.m. #546
Sup,yall should witness the best Vega player Makoto own both
Tokido akuma and Ojisan Boy Sagat it's great!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=codILI...
Don't mind the french lol
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on November 2, 2009 at 3:18 a.m. #547
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tmx25X...
without the french
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 2, 2009 at 9:13 a.m. #548
going by the video I wouldnt say he's the best... he's good but personally I think myself and a few other Vegas I know are better than him. He made a LOT of mistakes in there.
@2:24 Either made an untintional LP SHC which means he doesnt 100% have the controls down or he intentionally did it and made a poor choice of moves to get away (or guessed Sagat would jump). That's a move you should NEVER do unless you are 100% sure it will hit.
@2:44 I could see what he was trying to do but if you fight enough sagats you'll know that when you see fireballs like that it's a trap. He jumped waaay too late and he got nailed for it. Makoto should have either waited for the 3rd fireball and jumped, Focus'd dashforward and block, or EX-SHC through them. There were too many better options out there than jumping late.
@2:58 He was lucky there. he SHC to get out of the corner. Again there were better options. I don't know anything about this Sagat but I can promise you I would never be able to escape a corner that way against a skilled Sagat. However because Sagat made the bigger mistake of letting him get away with it Vega ends up winning.
@3:18 Ok so you're caught in the start of a Sagat pressure loop. It's ok to test the waters once to see if you can counter but if your cLP gets stuffed... don't keep trying to counter with it. That ended up pushing you all the way into the corner..... where you don't want to be. Throwing or Tech Throwing could be used to interrupt. standing HK would have been a more viable option. and as you can see 8 seconds later look how much health he had lost. But he was stubborn and managed to pull it off at 3:25 and escape the corner.
@3:38 Again if something doesn't work... don't do it again. he tried FA sagat's jHK 8 seconds ago and it didnt work then. Backdash, Air Throw, LP ST, cHP, jHK. Patterns kill you fast. ESPECIALLY patterns that don't work. Kiss another 30% health goodbye.
@3:45 You put Sagat into the corner and then give it to him with 10~15% health left.... poor decision making there. Lots of more choices he could have done.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 2, 2009 at 9:14 a.m. #549
@3:50 Most of the mistakes now are simply due to either poor decision making or inexperience. This one is mostly for advanced and expert players. he had a good run making a comback fighting an uphill battle from the corner most of the fight. 1 thing you can control is which side you're on after landing an izuna drop. Apparently he was more focused on the combo that setting himself up well. If he had crossed over sagat in the air he would have wound up out of the corner instead of in the corner. It takes a little bit of practice to master but it always helps to put the other guy into the corner instead of yourself.
@3:54 If you look 2 seconds prior you'll see sagat jHP. He's expecting you from the air. So what does Vega do? He jumps in. When you see someone expecting aerial attacks that's just asking for a whiff. Fake him out, make him whiff and nail him.
@4:08 Ok... so Vega finally get's smart and realized that jumping in without a set up is bad. This is what seperates good players from great players. Sagat has used the same start up for a combo at least 3 times (jHK, cLK into something). Standing HK to knock him out of the air or even a HK ST would have worked. A cHK was way too much of a gamble. Vega was hoping Sagat would land on it but it wasnt timed right and the damage and position wasnt worth it. a HK ST might have gotten stuffed but again it's all about reaction time. Whatever he was thinking ended up with himself in the corner fighting uphill again.
If you notice, when he stops trying to counter blocked combos and gets better at his reaction time he starts winning again. He almost let it get away. This guy suffers from what I call "autopilot syndrome." Basically he has preset moves he tends to do to respond to an opponent. The problem with this is that you tend to not be very fluid in your choosing of moves. You end up being stubborn, determined to get a specific move to work and keep getting punished for it. When it doesnt work then you tend to try to haphazardly counter and usually end up in the corner. It took him 2 and a half rounds to stop automatically doing moves and actually respond to his opponent. I think this is a pretty good Vega but I wouldnt say the best or even great. There's just too many major mistakes that he made. (unless he intentionally just wanted it to be close)
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on November 7, 2009 at 12:22 p.m. #550
Well he defeated the 2nd best Sagat and one of the top 3 Akuma's in a row >_>
Posted by Gerbhofz on November 7, 2009 at 12:54 p.m. #551
Hello everyone.
I just figured out the other day that you can ultra punish Blanka's straight ball attack if you block it and do the ultra right away. I've had my difficulties with blanka players and started trying out some tactics and this works for all ball attacks if you block them.
You have all probably figured this out already but anyway.. :P
Posted by Nub on November 7, 2009 at 8:20 p.m. #552
Also, against Honda's normal head butt - after blocking the headbutt - walk up and standing medium kick to counter before Honda can get into block.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 8, 2009 at 10:05 a.m. #553
@554 and @555
you can air throw blanka and honda out of every aerial attack they have (double checking on honda's ultra). or if you're fast enough.... you can ultra and nail blanka out of his roll before it hits you.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 8, 2009 at 10:11 a.m. #554
yep... you can air throw outta honda's ultra too
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 8, 2009 at 10:37 a.m. #555
If any of you want to watch I'll be in an online tournament streaming my matches. www.justin.tv/mrwootwoot
starts today at 6PM EST or 3PM PST
Posted by theonly_J on November 10, 2009 at 3:32 a.m. #556
Hey i just wanted to put up a video of me playing my friend... I wasn't playing my A game but its still a good video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3xTx...
If you want to play me on PSN hit me up: theonly_J
(even though i hate vega mirror matches)
Posted by Jaf on November 10, 2009 at 9:09 p.m. #557
There's another very Claw player by the name of 'Nao'
Posted by Jaf on November 10, 2009 at 9:10 p.m. #558
very *good I mean to say
Posted by Kage on November 10, 2009 at 11:52 p.m. #559
omg - just discovered the fine art of plinking. can't believe i didn't know about this before. Now my J HP --> st. cl HP --> HP-RCF comes out literally 90% of the time. Before the plink it was 50% at best.
http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthrea...
now if I could only get the jab RCF -> st. HK combo...
Posted by Meteo on November 11, 2009 at 10:32 a.m. #560
So explain to me this "plinking" in a Vega context.
I j.HP, but then when I st.HP to RCF what is different about the input? Usually I just hold back st.HP and quickly push forward and tap HP again, but yeah 50% at best.
Posted by Kage on November 11, 2009 at 1:29 p.m. #561
Hey Meteo,
So instead of just hitting st. HP and towards for the RCF, hit st. HP~LK instead.
"HP~LK" means you hit HP a fraction of a second before you hit LK - almost like Kara throw timing. The LK never comes out - but now a single tap of the HP~LK registers HP across 2 frames and makes the combo easier to land.
Technically, any button with "lower" priority than HP will work. (By button priority if you hit both buttons at the same time - the higher priority button will register with the attack you see on the screen.) So HP~LK works, but so does HP~MK.
For Vega specifically, you can't use HP~MP since this triggers the EX-RCF which isn't necessarily what you're trying to do.
Just thought of something - my EX-Scarlet Terror always seems to come out easier than my non-EX ST's (after a df HK). Going to try a combination of HK~MP or MK~JP to see if this makes it easier for me to time.
The exact button priority list is detailed in that link posted above.
Posted by Meteo on November 12, 2009 at 4:54 a.m. #562
the st.Hp to fierce RCF isn't all that useful to me anyway unless you can pull off crazy FADC stuff afterwards (I can almost never)
Still, I could see the p-linking effect in training mode when linking a cr.MK to cr.MP~LK. It feels awkward though so I won't be trying to really use it at this point.
Posted by Kage on November 12, 2009 at 11:34 a.m. #563
I agree. My initial enthusiasm as somewhat worn off.
I was hoping the p-link would me somewhat of a link master. Unfortunately while it does make links easier, it doesn't make them easy.
Posted by Meteo on November 13, 2009 at 3:09 a.m. #564
I want to see this combo:
j.HP st.HP cancel to HP-RCF FADC to cr.LP cr.LP cr.MP cancel to EX-Walldive with follow up Izuna Drop, knocking the opponent dizzy, then lvl-3 FA to Ultra.
This would be possible against certain characters with the right about of pre-existing stun, no? Man, I'd love to see that all together.
Posted by theonly_J on November 14, 2009 at 3:20 a.m. #565
@Meteo the above combo you just said isn't that hard to pull off, the only problem is it would only work on larger characters such as sagat, seth, zangief ect (any other character the izuna drop would just go over there head). the only character that i think can get stunned by that combo would be a seth user seeing as he has such low stun numbers, sagat and gief on the other hand have insane stun numbers. I can pull off the combo, but what i was trying to work on today was a j.HP st.HP cancel to HP-RCF FADC to cr.LP cr.MP LP-RCF FADC cr.LP cr.LP HK-ST and a taunt after for good measure lol.
the only problem is that idk if i have enough time after the first FADC to get out a LP-RCF.
Posted by Meteo on November 15, 2009 at 11:50 p.m. #566
Well I at least know you can get out a cr.LP, and if thats out you can LP-RCF I guess.
Anyway, I found another tiny use for p-link.
st.LK to st.RH~LK
3 hits, 150 damage, 250 stun (claw+mask vs healthy Ryu)
st.LK can be linked after cr.MK too, but you normally have better options. On the rare chance I happened to be landing a st.LK online, I used to follow up with cr.MP, but against short characters st.RH~LK seems to be the better option.
Posted by Kage on November 17, 2009 at 8:55 a.m. #567
Hey guys,
Any strategic point to interrupting a standing cl. HP with KKK or PPP?
It looks sorta cool - but seems very punishable. Haven't had a chance to try it much in actual gameplay but maybe it'll help keep the opponent guessing.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on November 21, 2009 at 5:25 p.m. #568
@Kage
I could see it if you know your opponent would be mashing out the SRK hoping there is a hole in your link, which if you use KKK you'll get a free combo. Otherwise I'd see it as points for your opponent from an inevitable leg sweep or projectile.
Posted by Kage on November 21, 2009 at 7:03 p.m. #569
@cowboy_soultaker
Yeah I agree the interrupt is vulnerable - plan to test it out a lil more.
Just came back from the 1st day of the norcal regionals. Awesome players. Got my butt handed to me by a very good Guile. Definite tournament jitters (my first tournament) leading to some scrub play (by me) but this rush-down Guile was something to behold.
My buddy has some video from this - will put it up on youtube when I have a chance.
Posted by Sanwa man on November 22, 2009 at 4:54 p.m. #570
How can people complain about vega being weak?
He fu*cking beats me all the time!
Everytime im in a g1 final, im faced against vega, and he friggin beats me!
So, now I decided to play with vega and find his weakness.
I was a ryu player all my life, but it wasnt hard to play with vega.
Vega is actually fun to play with.
I trained about 10mins with him, before killing 2 ryu in a row in g1!
Vega isnt sh*it, the people using him are.
Take gen for example, people thought hes sh*it, but now everyones playing him...
Posted by PSN @ theonly_J on November 23, 2009 at 12:31 a.m. #571
Just wanted to share a couple of videos with u guys of my vega
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3xTx...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkvR84...
Posted by Kage on November 23, 2009 at 1:10 a.m. #572
K guys, the vids for my very brief experience at the norcal regionals 2009 is up!
First vid vs Rufus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7liDt...
Missed some throws that didn't register, but played as well as I could with tournament jitters (both my hands felt numb for most of the match).
2nd vid vs Guile (who I later found out was Dagger G placing 5th in the tourney): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPEJrU...
Fortunately, only the last part of our match-up was recorded where he does some insane combo on me towards the end (you can hear the crowd go "ooooo"). The first part of the match (not-recorded) is pretty much more of the same with me getting whaled on.
Again, definite nerves in this match - but even playing at my best there's no way I could have taken this guy. For the record, all the competitors I saw/met were friendly. Dagger G in particular - when we sat down to play he must have noticed my hands were shaking - offered to plug in my controller. Cool guy.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on November 24, 2009 at 4:56 p.m. #573
yeah you did better than me Kage..... I got creamed by alex valle's gouken lol
Posted by Meteo on November 30, 2009 at 4:08 a.m. #574
These are now the hardest matchups for me, when the other player knows the matchup very well. Really good players can make it like a chess match almost, and perfect play can lock me out of a win:
Abel - amazing at punishing vega and using rolls to counter
Balrog - turtles out in the open and owns vega in corners
Zangief - I have to rely too heavily on bait/punish tactics
Occasionally a great Crimson Viper will do a number on me, but I've barely been able to get enough practice against her.
Posted by @Sanwa Man on December 1, 2009 at 10:24 a.m. #575
You are assuming that everyone that complains about vega are losing their matches. Do a clutch Scarlet Terror against a shoryuken that SHOULD hit and you'll realize, though Ryu is in the air and his move is pretty much done, you still get hit.
I wouldn't have gotten to G2 as fast as I did if I wasn't playing Vega. But just because you spend 10 mins with the character you presume to know all about him. Here's Vega's Weakness: Any time he wall jumps, do an air Tatsu. Any time he RCF do a shoryuken. Any time you jump in, do an aerial Tatsumaki. Or just pick blanka and ball all day.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on December 1, 2009 at 10:33 a.m. #576
@meteo
Weird thing about Abel for me was I was actually getting auto-corrects on some moves like cr. mp or scarlet terror during his rolls. I never got frame advantage like that before. Usually on Rog I can wait and stuff. A 'rog turtle would be fairly hard to break I guess....you could try throwing a random bloody high claw off of his wall as a mix up lol. Does he stuff your wall jumps? He can pretty much buffalo head or Jump mp all wall jumps. I guess grab often, I've seen people cosmic heel and grab (like a kara throw) upon block.
As for the gief matchup, I think it depends on the player using gief. if he lariats a lot learning when he's vulnerable during the lariat is key. Getting in using some good block strings (like J. HP, cl. HP, cr. MP) is a good way to attempt some damage when he's not spamming lariat. If he's doinga lot of high priority moves to put pressure on you then that is tricky. A person who truly knows gief would use a variety of tactics and would be very hard to stop.
Posted by Meteo on December 2, 2009 at 8:08 a.m. #577
I find that a very late headbutt by Balrog will beat any walldive, or at the very least, safely wiff. I'll try and actually find some good matches to film soon if I can get free time and point out specific things.
However, Blanka has become nothing more to me than other good characters. Through practice and listening to you guys I've really picked up on punishing his mistakes, avoiding or stuffing rolls (vega's slide kills them so long as vega is not just starting up) and getting them to trigger their ultra when I am ready to block and punish it. The really good blankas can still beat me a bit more often than not, but they really have to fight well and get a life lead.
Posted by Meteo on December 2, 2009 at 8:36 p.m. #578
Well, I didn't have much luck online today with finding opponents who could really lock me down. There's not much to see, but here's some videos anyway, just for fun:
vs Oni Fuz (Gen 57k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8o4Ggu...
vs NEXZON (Zangief 58k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQWHTc...
vs GHOSTEFC (Ryu 67k) - this match was laggy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyIz_o...
vs Chunkzer (C.Viper 41k)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfFaL7...
vs Mr Clips12 (Seth 27k) - bit of fun editing :P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHUsAH...
Feel free to point out bad habits I tend to use.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on December 3, 2009 at 10:41 a.m. #579
wow, is this G1? Ryu and 'Gief looked like they didn't understand the match-up at all. It's a strange fight for a shoto or grappler but I am fighting people in G2 that have the match-up down pat. It just seems strange to me. Good posts though. I think the Ryu and Viper players should re-watch them, lol. The seth too, even though he won.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on December 3, 2009 at 10:45 a.m. #580
oh yeah, at your #580 comment, Head-butts can shut the game down, and the auto-correct works in his favor on this (and even if it didn't it'd be a whiff at worst) That is why turtle is so frustrating from a Boxer. Headbutt beats a lot of moves up close, lp and lk are faster then anything vega can throw. Boxers learn quick they can just throw random across teh screen dash punches cuz they get a big ol HK. up close you can even grapple em out of it. not having a ground overhead (I think ken has 2? huh) hurts big time.
Posted by Ali on December 3, 2009 at 7:19 p.m. #581
Hi everyone,
I have two questions I hope someone can help me with them:
1) In the normal trial mode, second one, I was able to remove the claw easily but not the mask. I used the same buttons for removing the claw plus mp instead of hp, as instructed in the left of the screen. I also tried f,d,fd +mp as instructed in the top of this page but didn't work. What is the correct way to remove the mask?
2)I played the arcade mode, level:hardest, and I beat a lot of characters until I met Seth. I tried so many times but he's very strong. Is he defeatable by Vega? Any advice would be much appreciated and thx in advance.
Btw, great site.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on December 3, 2009 at 8:17 p.m. #582
@ALi
I believe i can help you out on this one
ok firs one, To remove your mask You need to press LP+MP together or simply the 3x punch button. good luck on the further trials
the 2nd,To me it's really easy defeating the CUP Seth by using your evading back flips againt his sonic booms Use lots of HK it got the range and does good damage and will disrupt his focus attack. Don't jump in alot
also Flying barcelona attacks are good against by crossing him up be aware of his shorukens tho also when he have his ULTRA be cautious take your time cuz Seth is very good at his timing of unleashing it catching you.
Posted by theonly_J (PS3) on December 3, 2009 at 8:22 p.m. #583
@ Ali
#1- Its the same movement with HP, and it takes away 2 ex bars
about the seth thing...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zri119...
should be even easier since vega has the slide
Posted by Ali on December 5, 2009 at 12:46 a.m. #584
@ th3 Joker
Thanks for your reply and it worked.
@ theonly_J
Thanks for your reply but it didnt work, maybe im not doing it right but pressing LP+MP after pressing f,db,f removes the mask successfully. And thanks for the vid, very helpful.
I need some help with third trial: crouch medium kick then Heavy ST. Can anyone help me on how to do this because after I c.MK, my Heavy ST gets blocked by Dan, so what do I need to do? I understand it involves canceling, but how do I do that? Any help would be very much appreciated. Btw, I using PS3.
Posted by The JoK3R J on December 5, 2009 at 7 p.m. #585
@ Ali
Your Welcome
also i would like to help out on the third trial
It's about being quick when your stringing your combo's
Ok Have your analog or D-Pad facing Back downwards so you can charge your ST
while charging as soon after you press that C.MK button immediately put in the Heavy ST command. Don't hesitate
Posted by Vega Gets Raped in the Corner on December 6, 2009 at 8:13 p.m. #586
I mained Vega for 3 months but I decided to quit because Vega gets raped in the corner. It's not even funny. Every character in the game just lays Vega down on his back and has their way with him. Over and over and over again, until he's dizzy, then they stop using condoms.
Why the F*** is every offensive option he has so damn telegraphed? If you still get hit by FBA's, you suck... badly. SHC? Good players will just jab you of it calmly. If you do manage to hit with a SHC that is not EX, take your piddly damage and then eat punishment, because ITS UNSAFE ON F***ING HIT. Every one of your normals has lower priority than every other normal on the game. Everyone of your specials has sh*t for priority, almost always loses, and EVERY F***ING THING YOU DO HAS ASS recovery.
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 12:52 a.m. #587
The easiest way to do any charge attack in street fighter mostly on the 360's sucky dpad is to use both the dpad and analog stick together. For example a back forward charge woule be done by holding the analog stick back and then while its held back tapping forward on the d pad once. If its and Ultra like Blanka's for example you can just hold the analog till you are ready then tap forward on the dpad quickly twice then press LB. Really easy, makes harder specials like Vega's and Guile's easier. Felt like sharing, i checked everywhere to see if anyone else is doing this but i guess its only me.
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on December 8, 2009 at 3:47 a.m. #588
@BlackVision
(0_o)how long have you've been playing Street Fighter?
i ask cuz you really don't know what you're talking about
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 7:57 a.m. #589
lol....well its just a solution to using the Xbox 360 controller to play, makes it easier to Ultra Combos with charge characters. I have played street fighter for a couple of years but on the 360 only about 5 months.
Posted by Meteo on December 8, 2009 at 8:10 a.m. #590
Lol, that sounds like such an awkward and unnecessary way to execute charge moves, but I want to try it just out of curiosity..
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 8:12 a.m. #591
Yea try it first.....
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 8:24 a.m. #592
Sry about my first comment though, i was half asleep and skipped some words while typing. I mean't for Blanka'a Beast roll attack, you could charge by holding the analog stick back for 2 seconds then tapping forward on the dpad once then LB or RB. Note though that doing weaker attacks this way is indeed very akward...it is best if its only done when trying to do a Super Combo, Ultra or strong charge attacks with the bumper and trigger buttons. The roll can easily be done consistently too...keep holding back on the analog stick till the first attack hits an opponent or is blocked then press forward on the dpad again and then LB.
Posted by Guess? on December 8, 2009 at 8:25 a.m. #593
Hmm... Analog and Dpad? Sounds interesting. I'm not familiar with the 360 controller. Just curious, but what finger(s) do you use to hold the analog while (I assume) you are using your thumb on the Dpad? The index? If so, I assume you use your middle finger to press the left triggers?
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 8:29 a.m. #594
Left thumb analog, right thumb dpad
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 8:31 a.m. #595
and second and middle fingers for the bumpers and triggers....using the X,Y,A and B buttons is useless this way though
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 9 a.m. #596
I am not sure about the ps3 but since the dpad is above the analog stick, you'll probably have to do it backwards, For example Blanka's beast roll can be done by holding back on the dpad then forward on the analog stick then L1 or R1
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 11:47 a.m. #597
To make it clear on the fingers Guess?.
On Ps3
left thumb on dpad, right thumb on analog
On Xbox 360
left thumb on analog, right thumb on dpad
and like i said before this is best when doing the heavy attacks, ultras and super combos of charge attack characters not doing weaker attacks with the X,Y,A,B or Triangle, Square, X, or Circle buttons.
It is easier because, for example Blanka: you don't have to hold back for 2 secs, then forward, back, L1, or LB. Instead you can just hold the analog button back for 2 then tap forward on the dpad twice(since the analog button is already back, it counts as going back twice) then L1 or LB.
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 11:51 a.m. #598
edit
***It is easier because, for example Blanka: you don't have to hold back for 2 secs, then forward, back,forward L1, or LB. Instead you can just hold the analog button back for 2 then tap forward on the dpad twice(while still holding the analog button back - since the analog button is already back, it counts as going back twice) then L1 or LB***
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on December 8, 2009 at 2:19 p.m. #599
@BlackVision
I think it's just very silly and unnecessary that you have to take the time while fighting having your
(left thumb on analog, right thumb on dpad)
Come on... holding downback for 2 secs then going back and forth is not even difficult to do
but while fighting you want to use your whole other hand to press foward twice when all u really have to do is to go back and forth with "one hand" >_>
Posted by BlackVision on December 8, 2009 at 3:55 p.m. #600
Yea it isn't difficult to just hold down and back, but i find it a lot easier my way when trying to do ultras and super combos on the XBOS 360 CONTROLLER. I play normally until i need to do a super combo or ultra. It doesn't really feel awkward for me in fact i rarely notice my right hand moving to the dpad. I guess my fingers are pretty long.
Well wasn't expecting this method to work for everyone, just wanted to help people having difficulty doing the UlTRAS and SUPERCOMBOS of characters with charge attacks. An expert gamer won't need to use this method and should already be equipped with the arcade stick.
-there is no bold so i had to use caps-
Posted by Meteo on December 10, 2009 at 10:49 p.m. #601
Ugh, so all of my Zangief matches have been going pretty well, except for that f***ing ultra of his. This just happened to me thrice in a row. Every Zangief match I get into, I dominate most of the round. However, at some point, when hes at 5% and I'm at 70%, I end up in a blocking position within his massive ultra throw range for a fraction of a second.
ULTRA IS TRIGGERED
What can I do? Might I just as well put the controls down and not even attempt some kind of counter? Every other character the seems to be a way out of their ultra (unless you're recovering from something of course).
And boom boom twirly-BOOM, I'm dead, and the big dopey brute stares through the screen as Vega eats Gief's junk.
Posted by BlackVision on December 11, 2009 at 1:01 a.m. #602
Ha thats happened to me way to many times, but the only way (i think) to avoid it is to jump away or move away, or do some super combo or ultra.
Usually when i fight him, i get close to him, but not too close enough for him to be able to grab me, and wait for his attack, usually the banishing flat(green hat) then attack him right before the move hits me then i jump away. I rinse and repeat till his dead...but usually i use zangief whenever i know i am going to fight him. Spinning Lariats never fail to impress, well against the A.I that is.
Zangief isn't really that bad, cammy on other hand is. Mostly when using characters without hadoukens, or charge attacks. Worst though is if you use Zangief against cammy.
Posted by Meteo on December 11, 2009 at 11:20 a.m. #603
Well I just went ahead and checked it out in training mode.
ULTRA TRIGGERED:
jump away = failure
EX anything = failure
dash = failure
PPP/KKK = failure
It's completely unavoidable. However, it's like this with any character. Ryu can't EX-DP and no one can counter with their own ultra. The trick is that you have to bait it and do your jump-away or reversal at the last possible second BEFORE the ultra is triggered. Bait-and-avoid is recommended, hitting him out of the air lets Gief keep the ultra. You MUST avoid ANY situation where both players land at the same spot at the same time. Not even PPP/KKK will save you. Very difficult within a whole minute's worth of hit and run tactics...
Command throws suuuuuck.
Posted by tadaa on December 14, 2009 at 9:37 a.m. #604
i main vega and i love vega. i deeply object the "vega is weak" sayings which are really non-sense.
BUT there are things i really hate about him. someone please help me with these:
1-ryu: the ryu players (which are the half of all the players) always do the same thing.jump towards you with m.k. or h.k. if i scarlet, i get hit he wont even take a damage and lands safely. if i kkk or ppp, he cr.k when i land or focusus during my kkk-ppp and releases at my moves end. i cant straight jump kick or air grab, i get hit. so i am there at the corner taking kicks until his timing get wrong and i run away. what is the way to avoid this?
2-blanka: after blocking his straight roll, i can find no way to punish him as soon as he lands. none of vega moves reach him as he lands really far away. what do i miss?
3- i hope they will give him more priorities on Super SF4 :(
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on December 14, 2009 at 2:43 p.m. #605
@tadaa
Trust me you are not alone every single person in this world who mains Vega even the pro's felt or feel how you feel
Posted by Noob on December 14, 2009 at 5:31 p.m. #606
A lot of good tips on shoryuken.com
Some highlights:
(1) Jozhear really knows his sh*t. I always get a lot out of reading his posts.
(2) cr. mk to st. HK link for punishing a missed SRK
(3) if you block Ryu's sweep, counter with your own sweep. frame data says you should get him clean.
(4) Against shotos who like to do cross over attacks, do a cr. HP.
(5) Kara focus attack, forward dash, followed by Kara throw lets you cover a deceptively large amount of ground.
@tadaa above,
(1) try to position yourself so you can counter a jump in with an air throw. Try an early neutral jump HK or HP (or MP) if they're almost on top of you by the time you take to the air. If they jump in on you from an untechable knowdown, I'd block and get ready to backdash or counterthrow.
(2) Against blanka - best strategy is to get EX meters. Then, if he does a straight blanka roll, your counter EX izuna will hit clean every time. Once you get ultra, you can ultra a blocked blanka roll.
If Blanka does that cross-over roll thing that hits from above, focus attack to absorb the first hit, dash out afterwards and df HK into your favorite combo.
Posted by Ali on December 15, 2009 at 1:55 p.m. #607
Hi,
I need some help on the normail trial level 4. Can anyone tell what exactly I need to press or the combinations of buttons to pull it off: jump hk, mk, L RCF. I am able to do the first two but dan blocks the 3rd one. As soon as I jump I keep pressing back, then hk, then mk while pressing back then f and lk at same time but Dan blocks it. Any help from anyone would be much appreciated. Thanks
Posted by noob on December 15, 2009 at 2:44 p.m. #608
@ Ali,
Well, the first thing that comes to mind, is try pressing the punch button instead of kick to get the RCF.
Try the 2nd and 3rd parts of that combo (cr. mk to f-lp) to make sure you have the timing down for that. Once you do, incorprate the j. HK.
Posted by Ali on December 15, 2009 at 9:15 p.m. #609
I tried cr.mk to f-lp and I am able to do it, although with great difficulty, but I am still unable to do it the trial: j. hk, mk, l RCF. I would appreciate additional help from anyone. Is ther a vid that domenstrates how to do the trial using a ps3 controller? Thanks
Posted by Th3 JoK3R J on December 16, 2009 at 12:58 a.m. #610
@ Ali]
As soon as you jump in the air you should be already back charging rite after the mk just press forward and square fast causing them to link
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on December 18, 2009 at 1:06 a.m. #611
@Tadaa
1-ryu: you have to move around constantly. you have to be faster than your opponent. Best way to avoid this is to own the air. Start off by learning quickly when he likes to jump 95% of ryu players will go in patterns of some sort. anticipate the jump+hk and air throw fast. don't get predictable with it. Occasionally dash under him and have a present waiting for him when he lands. Also try FADC backdash j+HP or j+MK (neutral or back) or as SOON as you see him jump (practice the timing in training first) SHC HP or MP. If you have ultra input command for ultra at the peak of his jump. you'l nail him every time. Note that every counter has to be done soon or you'll get hit. If you get knocked down you're pretty much fuzzed. best bet is block high then low and be ready to tech a throw. Hope for the best. and if you get out make him pay
2-blanka: for blanka's straight roll you have a stupid number of ways to beat it before having to block. standing you have HK, HP,LP, MP, Cosmic Heel, even Piece of mercury. crouching you have HP, MP, HK, LP. Jumping you have HP, HK, Air throw, Charging you have Scarlet Terror, Ultra. if in the event you cant time it good (cause it does require timing) for any of the above moves or blanka has combo'd it after block you got a couple choices. EX Full Barcelona Atack torward forward wall or ultra or.... if you notice what a lot of ryu's do when they block your SHC and you're too far away... Dash forward and punish. you'll be close enough then for certain to sweep.
3- as far as priorities concerned only 1 i think think of actually is pretty stupid. Sagat's jMP. everything else just needs the active frames adjusted slightly.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on December 18, 2009 at 1:08 a.m. #612
oops and do what #611 said.... lol
Posted by tadaa on December 20, 2009 at 3:41 p.m. #613
i think i cant time it right. it is so frustrating. ryu comes toward me endlessly and any neutral jump attack of mine will get beaten by his fj kick. i block or ppp and he cr.lk or throw.
to avoid blankas roll with what you said above the timing is very difficult. i mean am i the only one who get nervous online. i cannot do what i can against computer when online. you have to nearly predict he will roll and do you attacks or else, a little late you get the hideous creature's roll.
Posted by Keith on December 20, 2009 at 10:07 p.m. #614
The least they can do to improve Vega in SSFIV is to make it easier for him to keep his claw during battle. Remove the stupid Remove Claw input and make it so that opponents would have to get Vega to low health in order to try to get the claw out of his hand.
Posted by /b/ on December 21, 2009 at 10:46 p.m. #615
Down-Forward Launcher can also combo into HK Scarlet Terror or EX Scarlet Terror.
Posted by Meteo on December 22, 2009 at 12:55 p.m. #616
Yo, I love the remove claw command, don't remove it!
Posted by Peterrr on December 25, 2009 at 3:41 a.m. #617
@ anyone - is the leaping forward kick (down and foward hard kick) totally safe on block?
Posted by @ Peterrr on December 25, 2009 at 4:43 a.m. #618
After a blocked Cosmic Heel, your opponent will recover a single frame faster than Vega. To my knowledge, this is not fast or close enough to give anyone a guaranteed hit vs Vega after they block, so yes, it's safe on block.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on December 25, 2009 at 12:59 p.m. #619
yes in a way you have to look for blanka's roll... but if you foght blanka enough you should know exactly when the roll is coming. If online is giving you problems try some player matches wiht someone using blanka against you and work on the timing there. Like I said above on ryu's jumps you have to instantly react to them or you'll get hit. I'd say at most you got about 4~6 frames to react(recommend jump and air throw). and that's only if they dont insta j+hk or whatever. of course if you see them doing that then it should be a free juggle of your choice for you. The key to this tho is being able to change it up every time. and never repeat the same move more than twice in a row. so the first time he jumps at you air throw him. 2nd time dash under. 3rd time backdash + PPP, 4th time jump back + hp/hk, etc.... and then just randomize it. eventually he'll resort to air tatsu (usually followed by insta dp be ready to block high crossover on both the tatsu and dp and punish the whiff. after that does work he'll resort to either the walk up sweep/throw or fireballs... and we should all know what to do when someone throws fireballs.
Posted by VegaFabioLaCerda on December 25, 2009 at 1:03 p.m. #620
Peterrr,
CH is semi safe on block. It's -1 on block and there are no 1 frame moves... only way it can be punished is by throw or any move that starts i frames on frame 1 (i dunno if there are any tho)
Posted by tadaa on December 26, 2009 at 4:54 a.m. #621
@VegaFabioLaCerda
when i fall to the ground he jumps to match the time i will stand so there remains no choice for me to jump and air grap or anything, i can only block. and so do i. but after the block he either cr.lk or grab, and does that of course simultanously, so when i try to grab his cr.lk hits me or when i also block his cr.lk he grabs me with the (i think) most disturbing voice in a character in sf4, ryu's grab shout. i want to smash the computer when i hear that bark.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on December 31, 2009 at 6:56 p.m. #622
Alright, I have been away a while but I'm here for some advice. Recently I've gotten one of the pieces I've been missing, and that is a mixup game. I've fallen in love with Piece of Mercury and how often it actually connects in-game. if they make this an overhead in super, it would really make the mix-up game even better. However, there is still something missing from my game preventing me from beating higher rank people, even in G2.
Has anyone else hit a plateau like this? and if so what did you do to help add to your current game?
I'm getting a lot better and keep a good distance (though in a gief match-up i underestimate the square piledriver range at times), i feel my mixup is pretty good, I stopped relying on a feint to sweep. The pieces I KNOW are missing from my game are the on-demand izuna's (struggling with the timing) and working in more RCF's into my hp assaults.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 1, 2010 at 5:34 p.m. #623
did anyone else notice you can do an izuna with down+punch?i'm having a tough time landing it consistantly with left or right. and since I've been using down I'm starting to get it more consistant. I got the idea from some gamefaqs post talking about a dreamcast SF game.
Posted by @cowboy on January 1, 2010 at 8:18 p.m. #624
About plateaus: Try new things, play outside of your comfort zone sometimes I guess. If you fight someone who kicks your ass, play them in player match. Then, go to sleep. Take a break for a day. Sometimes your brain digests stuff over time and later on you'll start getting better and stuff will start "clicking" again. Once you're done with G2, you'll realize it was a joke, and then you'll realize that G1 is kind of a joke too.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 2, 2010 at 9:47 a.m. #625
@629
Thanks for the advice. I will definitely put that into practice.
The most consoling thing about G2 to me is that a good 80 percent of the people I fight are legitimately trying to learn their character. I fought a tough blanka that did his B&B and crossups, didn't just ball all day.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 2, 2010 at 10:07 a.m. #626
[url]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2643/4237128399_467458337d_b.jpg[/url]
I think this is the method that was said to be favored in doing izunas. if I am wrong let me know. After working the down + punch method for a while, I started doing this naturally with better results (i hope the embed works.)
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 2, 2010 at 10:09 a.m. #627
er, my last post didn't make it, guess it doesn't like BBcode
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2643/4...
I posted this link. It's how I have ended up doing izunas. I did a control+F search of this thread and couldn't find the favored way to perform it on command, but I think I remember it being this. let me know for sure. If it is, maybe catalyst will post it in the guide section to help new vega players land the izuna.
Posted by tadaa on January 3, 2010 at 8:28 a.m. #628
i hate that guile or chun-li players always air grab my izuana. my izuana must grab them instead but no, i go down.
and i have realized that a normal izuana catches el fuerte's ultra when we are both on air. it was good to see :)
Posted by Noob on January 4, 2010 at 1:41 p.m. #629
@cowboy
Try making a vid of you playing and post it up. We can help better critique your play if we see it. It might help to have a thick skin since there's always going to be trolls but there's a lot of good people on this forum.
@tadaa
Try hitting your izuna early if you anticipate an air grab in the corner. By early, hit punch as soon as you leave the wall. You should beat out most attempts at a counter. If however your opponent does nothing you'll totally whiff and be open to any combo.
I don't think this works as well if your opponent is across the screen though.
Posted by Error 2PT0 on January 5, 2010 at 9:58 a.m. #630
At tadaa, if you see them going for the air throws just hit em with vegas claw attack instead of going for the izuna or mix it up with a l. SHC...
Posted by Error 2PT0 on January 5, 2010 at 10:05 a.m. #631
I dont know about u guys but for me S. HK helps ALOT to rule most geif and rufus players...
Posted by tadaa on January 5, 2010 at 1:20 p.m. #632
i have worked hard to be a good player but i think it is in vain. i am on the verge of giving up the game. i am sick of losing over and over. i can make combos in training but i cannot do a single combo online. because of my excitement and frustration. i have come to G2-A in 4 months but even G2-E Ryus beat me.
Posted by WDDV on January 5, 2010 at 1:53 p.m. #633
Hey guys, lots of helpful stuff im reading and im wondering if you can help me with something. Zangief is really giving me problems with his lariat, what happens is I play people, beat the $hit outa them with whatever character they use, and then they go to gief and spam the lariat.
So far i've noticed that the only things that work against the lariat are an izuna drop (If Im REEEAAALLLYYY lucky and accurate), and a sweep IF I'm not too close. Sometimes I can use light rolling crystal flash to catch him between lariats. But I need a consistent way to get around the Lariat.....any ideas?
Also what do I do when i get cornered?
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 5, 2010 at 4:45 p.m. #634
@noob
I will possibly post a video sometime.
in general: Izuna's are best carried out using the crossup strat I posted above. However if your opponent is in the corner, using down + punch is more effective to land the izuna.
@WDDV
It is important to understand the properties of zangief's lariat. it seems to be hit or miss, sometimes you get a move off but later you do the same thing and it doesn't come out. There is a reason for this. Zangief can hit at any time during his lariat, but 2 point of the lariat are quite dangerous, startup and wind-down. I am not sure if this is because of invulnerability (as sometimes there will be a trade) but it is easy to see this property when you block.
Try blocking a lariat and you will see it hit your guard once, then twice. between these two strikes of your guard is when you would punish a lariat. You can delay your wall jumps so that your barcelona attack will hit during this window, you can do an ex sky high claw and never worry as you are invulnerable to the lariat in ex. you could probably even do a cosmic heel during this "magic time" between the 2 hits. I suggest using the Training mode recorder and just make gief lariat all day, and test out different ways to punish it. The Tutorial video does a good job showing what moves work best (ex sky high and ultra).
I think once you understand the properties of it, you'll be set. Tighten up your block strings too, because if you whiff a block string you are punished with a grapple. If I get time I might just try out a few things and post them here.
As for getting cornered, I struggle with that too. Gen can ex wall jump in times of trouble but we don't get that luxury. work on timing a throw out of your Kx3 flip. Not sure what the frame advantage is but it might help. you can also try doing an ex sky high off the opposite wall. someone else might have more advice that is helpful.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 5, 2010 at 9:19 p.m. #635
It's a little crude but I made a lariat tutorial video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkET_s...
I can't figure out how to conver 3gp so I "edited" it with anotations. Wouldn't have been a problem but my camera was low on batteries, so I had to use my blackberry. I'd say it turned out alright.
Posted by Average Joe Vega on January 6, 2010 at 8:55 a.m. #636
my strategy when fighting gief is to just be as far away as possible. So the gief will get pissy and start coming at me, if
1. they lariat their way to vega....you sweep them out of it, btw block lariat high and dont sweep when vega is directly under it
2. they banishing flat...since vega has distance you will be able to react quickly enough to hit them with leaping kick to ex fba
3. some gief's like to jump hk/hp when they close in....here if you are good enough to predict their jump then air grab them or scarlet terror them out of the air
4. when they get too close use a mix use back dash and back flips or wall dive away.
So there it is, key is always keeping yer distance with gief
Posted by Error 2PT0 on January 6, 2010 at 11:52 a.m. #637
Im tellin u guys s.HK helps ALOT against geif get the spacing down and you can kick him out of every lariat...
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 6, 2010 at 6:07 p.m. #638
it wasn't meant for a match-up guide.
some of the best lariat counters are in the tutorial vid from this guide anyway.
Posted by Dave on January 6, 2010 at 9:50 p.m. #639
Great to hear that Vega is getting beefed in SSF4!
As for Gief...
-HK. works wonders
-Don't spam cr. MP too much or Zangief will SPD you from the hitbox
-Use Walldive to bait lariats. Punish with sweep or even ultra
-Jump-in MP and HP both stuff lariat from the right angle
-watch out for jump-in to green hand and punish with scarlett terror
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 7, 2010 at 10:57 a.m. #640
@dave
well, over at shoryuken i read that when someone asked seth, he responded "we're giving him a little something". Then he added "don't expect to see him jump up in the tier list".
I guess take that with a grain of salt. the SF4 vega community is pretty much in the majority on what they want, and it is pretty clear they don't want him too high in the tier list either. I'd like a nice meaty bison-ish rank.
Posted by Meteo on January 8, 2010 at 3:04 a.m. #641
I don't think they're going to change the gameplay much at all in ssf4 for existing characters except to give additional ultras. I think that is appropriate.
Strong characters like Ryu look like their new ultra doesn't make them much stronger, but characters like Vega seem to be getting new ultras that add a little versatility.
Vega's new ultra starts with a slide, kind of like Cammy's old one. Easier to do after a focus attack, and it might even be combo-able after a Cosmic Heel...
first video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSnx6r...
Posted by Error 2PT0 on January 8, 2010 at 11:19 a.m. #642
I do like vegas new ultra. Unfortunately, one new Ultra wont change vegas rank... His moves need more priority everything he does trades... and sadly vega loses 90% of em...
Posted by Kawalor on January 8, 2010 at 1:42 p.m. #643
As much as I liked Vegas Ultra it was preety useless. :/ Unless you're enemy was a fireball spammer or failed his Ultra you had to count on luck to hit him with "Bloody High Claw".
Posted by Error 2PT0 on January 8, 2010 at 1:55 p.m. #644
I dunno i think im likking his new ultra now... it goes under fireballs and across the screen... plus he now has an overhead attack...
Posted by Kawalorn on January 8, 2010 at 3:17 p.m. #645
I meant the first Ultra the new one seems actualy usefull.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 8, 2010 at 5:58 p.m. #646
what is his confirmed overhead? PoM? I am looking for information but i guess my ear isn't to the ground.
Posted by Kage on January 8, 2010 at 9:53 p.m. #647
Df mk is a real overhead! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bosf8b... skip to 1:40 into the vid.
Posted by Jink on January 9, 2010 at 2:51 a.m. #648
@Dave
Straight Jump MK also stuffs Lariat. Very good, requires little timing and distance precision.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 9, 2010 at 5:56 p.m. #649
thanks kage, that is really good to see.
A lot of things stuff lariat, which is what I was hoping to show. Range and angle ARE factors, but it's useless if you do it on the lariat's startup, or during it's second invisibility frames. You can st. HK on startup if you want but i am positive it will at best trade.
get the timing down and you can cosmic heel a lariat, which i think combos into a few things ;-)
Posted by WDDV on January 14, 2010 at 9:04 p.m. #650
@ Kawalorn
K you've gotta be joking, his ultra is in my oppinion very good. If your opponent jumps, throws a fireball, or fails an ultra it's pretty easy to land. I land about %70 of the time, mind you i don't throw it out willy-nilly.
@ cowboy_soultaker
Ya i noticed that it hit twice but didn't know i had that window in the middle, thanks. I think they should be adding A LOT to Vega considering he's considered the weakest character in the game, I mean at least give his moves some more priority and give him a new attack to replace "Throw away claw" and "Throw away mask".
Posted by Noob on January 15, 2010 at 1:53 p.m. #651
I think I'd be happy with just some invincibility on Scarlet Terror start up - and the ability to FADC - ultra out of a Scarlet Terror attack.
Posted by Vega Forever on January 15, 2010 at 2:30 p.m. #652
It is really easy to make Vega a top tier without changind the life his moves drain.
The problem with him and the thing that makes Sagat, Ryu, et. powerful is that Ryu, they can hit a falling in air opponent again and again with so many option which include even ultras. But that cannot be said for Vega.
1- Let him EX Barcelona any falling in air opponent also after any Scarlet terror.
2- Air grabbing an izuana drop is totally non-sense! but that is what happens with Guiles and Chun-Lis no matter when you press punch they grab you.
3- The wide open frames after KKK and PPP are insane!
4- He has no invincible anti air. Let one of his crouching punches be an anti air like akuma's or rose's or ryu's. they crouching high punch but they STAND and lift their punches above their heads for gods sake. vega doesnt even lift his arm above his head any time.
5- Yes i can do the ultra. But why giving an already weak character the most hard-to-pull ultra. b(x2), f, b, f then punch or kick would do it.
If that come true, Ryu and Sagat will be crying together to Vega not to kill them!
Posted by bsnack on January 16, 2010 at 1:34 a.m. #653
Vega looks like he's coming out of a vagina in that picture. Ouch.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 16, 2010 at 3:56 p.m. #654
@bsnack
lol, now that you mention it, it does.
Someone on SRK put that his slide should be safe on block, with frame advantage. I thought that it was crazy at first, till I fought a sagat and chun that could poke, with little punishment, with their cr. HK. I think it'd open up a lot, especially since he's getting an overhead and reduced startup on RCF.
Posted by DOOM on January 16, 2010 at 6:03 p.m. #655
damn im going to a tournament tomorrow cant learn all of thease in one nigh
Posted by i wont say name on January 18, 2010 at 9:07 a.m. #656
Cool
Posted by Vega Forever on January 21, 2010 at 12:28 p.m. #657
Today, while playing online i have done something i have never witnessed. After an attack of mine i have sweeped and it hit the falling opponent it was a combo. i do it after jumping any punch or kick and while he or she falls sweep and it hits but it never says it is a combo. but today it became a combo and i dont know how i did it neither remember what was my first attack to cause him fall from air. does anyone know that kind of a combo which seems to be a secret?
Posted by snakeeater91 on January 21, 2010 at 1:58 p.m. #658
@Vega Forever - Sweeps can be comboed into but it is very tough, especially with Vega since most of his combos are links. Shotos seem to be the most popular for sweep finishers.
Posted by Jim on January 21, 2010 at 4:43 p.m. #659
Hi,
I saw Vega's new ultra and my question is do I need to download an update to be able to do the new ultra, or is it a new game altogether? I play SF 4 on a ps 3. Thanks.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 21, 2010 at 8:21 p.m. #660
snake is right, there is a small window for certain juggling situations. for example, you can combo Cosmic Heel and then sweep (if you have no meter and can't do the scarlet terror link consistantly).
@Jim
This footage is of the new game coming out, called Super Street Fighter 4. All characters will have 2 ultras, with the exception of gen, who will have 4 (2 mantis and 2 crane). If you sift through the news page a bit you'll find a lot of information on this new game.
Posted by Meteo2 on January 26, 2010 at 1:11 a.m. #661
just in:
SSF4 to be released April 27, 2010
Posted by Vega Forever on January 26, 2010 at 3:12 p.m. #662
@cowboy_soultaker
Gen won't have 4 ultras it seems. as he already had 2 and no video of new ultras on youtube or anywhere shows he gets new ultras
Posted by trialsarehard on January 26, 2010 at 3:18 p.m. #663
somebody please help me. i have searched the page and saw that someone already asked the thing i will ask but the answers given didn't solve my problem. i cannot stop blanka's rolls! when i play online and i see my component is blanka i say "ok i lose again" and i lose again! is there anyway to beat blanka with vega? how will i stop his straight roll? how will i punish a stragiht roll because when i block it he lands too far for any of my moves to reach him. so he goes unpunished and can do straght rolls endlessly to kill me. the sweep attack wont reach him when i block only ex barcelona but i dont have infinite super meter you know :(
Posted by 1886 on January 27, 2010 at 1:40 a.m. #664
Blanks Rolls can be countered with an EX wall dive on the rebound most of the time, and they can always be ultra'd
flip kicks work well to avoid the chip damage
EX wall dives can bat out his roll if you catch it early enough
you need the claw for blanka
whenever he begins electricity you halfbackslash and slide
if he starts hoping left or right just throw him
his Ultras can be avoided with flips or countrered with an ultra
in general, things that work best are using your wall jumps, air throws, Focus attacks and wall claws
i beat some of the best Blankas int he game quite regularly
the thing to remember with vega is to go back to your SF2 gameplay, its all strategy, and all on the fly counters
its not like sagat and other characters who dont even care what the other player is or isnt going to do..
just out wit your oponent
Posted by 1886 on January 27, 2010 at 2:25 a.m. #665
"throw away claw" is a pretty lame move to give the weakest character in the game
it can only really be used as a taunt, and then you have to hope to high heaven that you can pick it up again before you finish your taunting.
but it is nice to have something to play with if you find yourself playing a turtle who wont come out of the corner
but throw away mask should be free, he would probably be top tier if you could begin the round without the mask, and not have to use up 2 bars of EX do it
Posted by 1886 on January 27, 2010 at 6:09 a.m. #666
with the izuna drop, FA's and Accuracy, each tiny bit of lag throws it off, until eventually you just land flat on the ground, whiffing completely, and then you are eaten alive
Vegas online game completely depends on the connection speed
if its even the slightest off you have a about a 3% chance of winning against a decent opponent.
I dont think the people at capcom ever really thought about how the slightest would complete make Vega unusable.
i play in the arcade alot, and I can tell you that there is no move in all of streetfighter 4 which requires as much skill, timing and perfect accuracy and placement as Vegas izuna drop
in the arcade, you have a pretty good chance of yanking anyone out of anything, including shoto uppercuts, FA's and everyone else's crazy moves, including shotos jumping in with HK or HP to counter, and you can even beat out Guile and Chunlis throw, to reverse their throw and land your drop
that makes vega very formidable
since playing online, I find the moves i pull off with extreme precision on the arcade very difficult or impossible to do most of the time online, i use a hori on a non-slip mat, on a lap table, its pretty solid, but still not enough accuracy to pull off the precision moves needed for vegas drop to beat out other counter moves
even in SF2 Vegas drop took the most guidance and precision to land of all the moves in the game.
I can my my game is considerably "safer" / worse online.
and vega has such low priority, that even on the arcade, the ST is extremely difficult to pull off because it must be timed in the window of about one frame with an aggressive Shoto or General Bison attacking you in the corner.
its doable, just very difficult, and online that one frame disappears, and you dont have any chance at all of getting out a Scarlet terror in those situations, so for online play, vega really more priority and a bigger window. the normal ST should be about where the EXST is, only with added frames.
Posted by 1886 on January 27, 2010 at 6:10 a.m. #667
and the Izuna Drop window for a grab should be as big as the normal air throws and have the same priority. I honestly feel those were dwarfs.
and his M and H CRF need to begin as fast as his LCRF
otherwise vega isnt really viable for online game play.
he is still my main, and thats mostly because I am not nearly as good with anyone else.
the way people play online, even in the "play for fun" section is just too cheap for vega to stand a chance. he does well against people who dont act like they have to do the 100% cheapest thing imaginable with 10000 strikes per second and tick-throw as much as humanly possible
against those "so-called" hi-level players vega doesnt have any of the tools necessary to even protect himself. or do anything at all to keep people off of him outside of the occasional crLK, and even that crLK often immediately opens vega up to an unfair advantage
and his back flip recovers too slow to even be used at all when you are playing against psycho-aggressive opponents.
and the player section online is filled with people who all they want to do is tick throw you to death, or lay in a barrage of nonstop attacks hoping to chip damage you to death
and they are perfectly happy and seemingly excited about doing that.
Posted by 1886 on January 27, 2010 at 10:12 a.m. #668
I often play excellent Vegas, people who can do every move in the entire game, including elfuertes infinite loop, all of goukens super long combos etc, but the problem they all have with vega is they rely on the claw for everything, and they play vega as if they are using sagat or another character, just relying on his own merits, expecting to kick some butt. they do ok when its vega on vega, but against other characters that style really doesnt work at all. even though they can do all of vegas longer combos with ease, they havent grasped the essence of the character.
then after they mirror me, and usually beat me, they go on to using other characters against my vega, one by one, until i have kicked the crap out of most or all of their other characters, whereas their vega would have no chance at beating those high-tier characters at their full combo power.
in fact, i dont use any combos.
i use lp to mp some times, i rarely or never even jab 3 times with lp. I never do the Cosmic heel to ST, i always just slide, I never jump in with HP to stand HP or any of the combos thereafter, all i do is cr MP to EX FBA,
I do often use FA to Ultra and FA to Cosmic heel to FBA iz
other than that i use Vegas basic moves such as ST & EXST on the proper places, wall dives with claws, air throws, throws, some stand HK, and FA's, i rarely even jab out with cr MP
I've really quite perfected my game to suit each character and various playing styles.
the best Elfuerte I have ever seen can only do elfuertes infinite combo 2 times, and doesnt do any other combos except one to utilize his super gauge. but he has mastered th game play against all the different opponents.
elfuetrte is alot like vega, in that he's on the bottom of the tier list, and has to be customized, though he doesnt need nearly as much customizing as vega does
Posted by Spanish ninja on January 28, 2010 at 5:46 p.m. #669
Ok I dont know about anyone else but half the time I pull off Izuna drop it seems be be on accident, does anyone else have that?
My main point for posting is to have some questions answerd. Why cant people get over being perfect'd by vega? It pisses me off that people bash me online for doing well with him. Not to mention I get all sorts of bull@#$% comments about using Vega. People saying that it takes no skill to use him and that using "Flying Barcelona" is absolute cheese. Its obvious he has his flaws like any other character, why cant people just deal with the fact I am good with this character? I just want to know if anyone else gets crap for playing vega gets crap. Btw I agree with the Past 2 Comments above me entirely.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on January 28, 2010 at 7:57 p.m. #670
@1886
I've weened off of trying to dazzle with combos. Since Cosmic Heel is fairly safe on block (I think only boxer's lp punishes it) it doesn't hurt to throw it out. I do find myself poking a lot though. It annoys the piss out of opponents.
@Spanish Ninja
I have trouble grabbing with izuna in corners, so i usually use down + punch. Otherwise I try to cross up, and hit towards + punch. it's a bit tricky and take's practice. 1886 had a post a few posts up touching on that.
I have only had 1 person every flame me for my vega, saying I just "hopelessly poke and cheap throw". There is a way to punish virtually everything vega does, it's hard enough to play him and win, just for that reason. the people that complain about stuff like that usually aren't the type that should play online, in my opinion.
As for what someone said earlier about gen not having 4 ultras, I could indeed be wrong. However I think one of the past news articles mentioned it, but even still those details can change daily.
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 2:10 a.m. #671
at the end of this video for Super Street Fighter 2:
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/27751
it goes through every character, and Vegas is smaller, shorter, darker, than everyone else's..
its worrying
anyone have any word on Super SF4 Vega?
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 2:30 a.m. #672
If Vega isnt improved, Juri look s like the best Vega Compliment / Replacement for SSF4
Posted by Aldushi on January 31, 2010 at 4:17 p.m. #673
Hi! I'm Vega fan too and it's my favorite character I play with. I know how to perform all of his moves but I must confess that Capcom didn't balance quite well SF4 because of the lack of Vega Combos. I think Vega can perform a 6 hit combo so far i think, so that sucks. Plus I think it's not fair for Vega players. Let me explain why : we all know hadouken characters such as Ryu, Ken et Akuma can perform a lot of combos and especially they always rich the jiggle zone where they can keep on hitting. I found a special move with Vega, too bad the game doesn't count it. When you hit your opponent with Heavy or Ex Scarlet Terror you perform immediately the ultra and it goes through your opponent but it doesn't hit him. I hope Cacpom will do something about it in SSFIV. I mean it's not fair Ryu can perform his Ultra right after his light Shoryuken and Vega can't.
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 5:46 p.m. #674
i really think the "option select" goes without saying
its obvious that anyone who does one move which cancels out 35 of someone else's 1. not only does them no good on 'skill development', 2. takes no skill, and is not a tactic that is even remotely considered "skill"
Take Sagats Tiger Knee, or his jumping Elbow
those two moves can just be done any time to counter anything, and there is nothing that beats them
you won
but the common "SRK view" is that that was simply "not good" for the guy doing it, but that it still is legitimate skill which is as praiseworthy as any other move in the game
which simply isnt true
a guy who wins around with tiger knees and jumping elbows has cheesed the entire round
and his win is about as amazing as someone who 360 pile drives you or lariats you to death with Gief
and in no way compares to anyone playing with any real skill
i really dont care what the SRK glee club thinks is a good win, or that they think all wins are equal
its laughable
Posted by Spanish Ninja on January 31, 2010 at 9:15 p.m. #675
Hey guys me again TY for the tips and advice earlier but I have a few more questions. I have recently started attempting Vegas hard trials and Im able to pull the moves of fine but I really cant seem to incorperate any of these combos into my strategy for basic skill level players, obviously I adapt to all plays with a few tweeks here and there but I really cant see how I would incorperate these moves in at any time. Can some on link me a video on how to or at least tell me when a good time to use is good
Please and ty
-Spanish Ninja
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 9:43 p.m. #676
Hard: Trial 1 •
Jumping Hard Punch, Crouching Light Punch, Link into Crouching Medium Punch, Cancel into Light Punch Rolling Crystal Flash, Cancel into EX-Focus Attack.
Hard:
i never FA cancel the CRF because its only level 1 and does a little sliver of damage, and costs you 2 ex bars
the combo before that is ok, but i usually dont do the jump in. The problem I have is that the overhead jump in HK or HP requires you to be so close to the opponent because of the vertical jump of Vega, that you are dangerously close to getting in the position you need to avoid at all costs with vega,
another problem you have is that people often get angry and quit if you are slashing them 10 times with your claw, i think its pretty cheap, but after you do Hard Trial 1 without the FA, you need to back off. dont get into a slashing game. its weak.
a better move is to NOT jump in, and do the rest of the combo from a LP
I often do cr.LK during an attempted throw then cr.LP, then the rest of the combo, without the FA
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 9:47 p.m. #677
Hard Trial 2 •
Jumping Hard Punch, Crouching Light Punch, Link into Crouching Light Kick, Light Kick Scarlet Terror, juggle with EX-Scarlet Terror.
this one depends on the first strike, a good set up for jump ins may be off the back wall
without it, you have to be too close to the opponent and its really not feasible , you practically have to be pushing up against the opponent , and the first strike its self has to be landed right on top of the guy. i never do it.
i really think vega should be able to go from FBA to cancel mid air to do a regular overhead HP or HK to a combo.
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 9:51 p.m. #678
Hard: Trial 3 •
Jumping Hard Kick, Crouching Medium Kick, Link into Crouching Light Punch, Cancel into EX-Flying Barcelona Attack & Izuna Drop.
i dont like this one for similar reasons, and i prefer to use the cr.MP after a jump in strike, to FBA or just the MP to FBA
i can often land a jump in HP to MP, using LP needs to be too close and weak for me
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 9:55 p.m. #679
Hard: Trial 4 •
Jumping Hard Punch, Standing Hard Punch, Link into Standing Light Kick, Link into Crouching Medium Punch.
this is really hard, and really useless
i do think standing LK is one of Vegas best moves, but in this case i would skip it and go from standing HP directly to Cr. MP to FBA
and i would use it more often without the jump in
its difficult to get that jump in and / or the standing HP in high level play.. they are way to punishable
i never do them
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 9:57 p.m. #680
Hard: Trial 5 •
Jumping Hard Punch, Crouching Medium Kick, Link into Standing Light Kick 2x, Link into Crouching Medium Punch.
another useless combo
Posted by 1886 on January 31, 2010 at 10:01 p.m. #681
i guess the thing to take away from Hard rial 5 would be that you can do 2 LK's to crouching M, because there is a lot of opportunities in the game to use the first standing LK
Posted by 1886 on February 1, 2010 at 9:09 p.m. #682
4 out of the 5 hard-trial combos require a Jumping Hard Punch to land, and 1 requires a Jumping hard kick to land
The only time those combos can be attempted is in the following situations:
1. on an overly aggressive, cocky, arrogant, player who underestimates Vega to the point of not even bothering to block or worry about anything you do, who is not even playing seriously
2. on a player of low skill, but then it would just be wrong to do one of those combos on a poor naive newcomer
3. From a jump off the back wall, as this jump has far more horizontal range and angle and allows you to land at a safe angle to continue your game if you miss or he blocks or counters
4. from a wall jump off you opponents back wall, as he is crouching or downed, jumping over him to the wall, then directing back out to in front of him, striking from a cross-up angle, hitting before you land further out
5. during a Dizzy state
6. after a missed Ultra
and that's about the only time i would ever attempt it
as you cannot do it from an air counter HP, which is the most useful time to use the HP strike
Posted by 1886 on February 1, 2010 at 9:19 p.m. #683
jumping off your opponents back wall doest cross-up, actually, but it does work on occasions when your opponent moves away from the wall as you jump towards it
another buff for vega should be an off the wall cross-up, even if he has no other cross-up, the off the back wall, over the opponents head should cross up
another one should be a Focus Attack with a Backward dash cancel should be comboable, currently, you can back dash after a FA then jump forward and hit with HP, but the opponent recovers back and you cant do any follow-up strikes
Posted by 1886 on February 1, 2010 at 11:01 p.m. #684
it's pathetically sickening that Vega is the only player in the game who cannot do any of his combos after a level 2 or 3 Focus Attack
Posted by 1886 on February 2, 2010 at 2:52 a.m. #685
a straight up jump HP has a much better chance of landing than a forward jumping HP
its almost a defensive move, instead of retreating on an opponent, just jump straight up and hit HP to counter his attack then go right into the rest of your combo
I tend just to do the standing HP cancel to HP CRF if i land a straight up HP jump, but thats probably just habit
sometimes I just crouch after the Up jump HP and hit with cr Mp then FBA
I found myself not knowing what to do today when I had my opponent stunned
i had no EX and couldnt think of anything to do. usually i throw, I kept thinking of jumping in with HP bu then i didnt know what else to do after that. i never do those combos, but it would have been nice have them just for fun.
I 2nd Elfuerte, and when I say 2nd, i just mean i'm much better with Vega, though i play Elfuerte almost everytime these days, and if I come across a cheap plaer or someone I can't beat, i switch to vega
i automatically switch to Vega if I face Boxer, Dictator, or Sagat though
so I'm should practice one of those combos for those stuns without EX, Vegas hard trial #4 looks the best of all of those, i should have remembered the solid damage dome just by jump in HP stand HP cr. MP.. I would skip the LK just for safety issues
and #1 looks ok, without the FA, though its much easier for me to do #4, as sometime my LCRF doesnt come out at all in that combo and a strong character can beat you badly if you miss the timing of it.
Posted by who are your 2nd / 3rds on February 2, 2010 at 3:08 a.m. #686
all of you main Vega, who are your 2nd / 3rd characters?
do you use other charge characters?
if you main Vega, many people 2nd or 3rd other charge characters because the movements are similar,
Vega skills transfer to ChunLi, Blanka, Guile, Honda, and Dictator, and maybe a couple of others
or do u main a shoryuken movement character, by far the majority of SF4 characters
i main Vega and 2nd ElFuerte, his movements are shoryuken type, but his play style is very unique in the game
shoryuken characters are way easier to use than Charge characters
but i think one may be affecting the other slightly, such as i am becoming lazier to charge my vega, and my 1/4 turns don't always come out with ElFuerts
anyone else have this kind of experience?
Posted by 1886 on February 2, 2010 at 4:09 a.m. #687
most satisfying Vega moves in the game
what is the most satisfying moves in the game?
here is my list:
1. Ultra Guiles Sonic boom.
I love this perhaps more than any move in the game.it makes me so happy, and i hit it about 3 out 5 times or more
2. Ultra Dhalsims sire
This is very rewarding as well, and even harder to do than Guiles
3. Air throwing Hondas Splash.
I love to jump backwards and air throw Hondas Sumo Splash, its truly satisfying
4. Air throwing Rufus dive string combo
he only leaves the ground for a split second, and is just right over the ground, and this throw is very cleansing to the soul
5. Air throwing Dictator after his head stomp hits your block and he comes flying back for more
Jumping forward to meet this one with a throw is very fun
6. Ultra Blanka's blocked spin
I love this ultra, he really always feels safe as it hits him when he's just on the ground
7. Breaking Boxers EX charge with Scarlet Terror, he comes in like a buffalo, and it shatters his whole thing to pieces, it very satisfying to watch him break apart and fall
8. Rolling Boxers 3 button turn punch with HP CRF, that strike goes through most other moves, except for CRF
9. HP CRF Blanka as he tries frantically to do his electricity, if you give blanka a long time to see this one coming, he usually tries to shock, but it wont begin with the CRF on its way
10. Air throwing Dhalsim as he teleports by jumping up and pressing throw before he appears
11. Focus Attacking ChunLis overhead razor Heel that drops down, its a guaranteed level 2 knock down
12. Air throwing C. Viper in her flaming pants move.
13. jumping up and air throwing a missed C.Viper Ultra brings alot of joy to my game
14. air throwing any shotos missed uppercut, i love slamming them down after this one..
15. taunting and then jumping forward and air throwing them when they try to cheap hit me during my taunt.
Posted by 1886 on February 2, 2010 at 4:10 a.m. #688
16. Ultraing Boxer from behind him when he charges in with a charging punch, it goes to his back wall, and rips him apart when he gets to about where you were
17. Air throwing El Fuerte's mix up game, especially when he is right in the middle of a splash animation
18. EX FBA-ing after Honda's Dive, when he seems to have already recovered but is unable to block
19. Ultra-ing Boxer during his charge attack from your own back wall, when is almost reached you
20. Ultra-ing Chunl-is Fireball
21. grabbing Cammy out of her ball with an air throw
22. Landing a Super on a shoto by hitting the back wall when you are close to it, just as the fireball begins to come out, and grabbing them before they can recover
23. pulling shotos out of their uppercuts with an Izuna drop
24. Ultraing Geif when he does the green hand thing
25. using an EX walldive on a turtling opponent from their back wall, making them very angry and forcing them to jump around and come out to fight
26. ultraing anyone when their strike is as close as it can get to your head when you land on the back wall
27. airthrowing Ryu and Ken's air spin kick
28. Focus attacking Rufus's double airborn spin kick thing, and striking before the second hit lands
29. Ultraing Dictator in the back during a slide
30. over-shooting gief and sliding when he does the lariat
Posted by 1886 on February 2, 2010 at 4:22 a.m. #689
31. standing LK boxer as he charges in with all his might, to stuff him flat out and then kara throw off the rebound
that is truly one of the most rewarding moves in the game
Posted by Spanish Ninja on February 2, 2010 at 8:40 p.m. #690
Hey Ninja here and man do I need some help.
The help you gave earlier was great to help me better understand vegas moves, ive perfected them in each way possible. Now to come to the consern I have that I need some advice on. Ok well I have two older brothers that are heavily into ss4 like myself One plays blanka:Home Made arcade stick and the other plays dalshim:Sega saturn style controller. Ive figured out there combos to the letter and yet I still wind up loosing more than I want to or ever do for that matter. I could use some tips on some key moves that help counter boths characters. Me im some what of a perfectionist and really just want to sweep them but taking buy suprise, might yall give me some advice in my quarel?
Posted by 1886 on February 3, 2010 at 9:50 a.m. #691
if you are having problems with those two characters, I'm guessing you need to work on your Focus Attacks
FA's are the most important against those two characters, more than any other
against Dhalsim, a LP Wall Claw from your back wall is useful, for dhalsim you have to time your rhythm to be in the middle of his.
anytime he starts doing those fire combos do your back slashes, and time he disappears you need to jump and be prepared to strike or throw
keep your distance, and use FADC's to advance or retreat
use your FA's on most of his attacks
Blanka is the similar, dont FA when he's jumping in, because his combos are mean and he can add unblockable ultras to them, but FA everything else
if he rolls into the air, jump back and go for a throw unless its EX
uses your dashes alot after all of his rolls, to close distance and draw strikes
if his back is near a wall you can punish his roll with HK
halfbackslash and slide his shock, or poke with the claw
counter his Ultra with an Ultra, or do a full back slash, or jump off the wall and flip over him.. if you arent sure if you can get the ultra, or if he is too close, don't do anything at all risky, just block, whatever you do, you cannot get caught by his ultra
Vegas Slide works good on the recovery of alot of Blankas moves
you can cancel a roll with a jumping down strike
try and draw his ultra & super out by faking openings
dont try and beat him anti-air, dont go for any air throws when he is jumping in
its hard for me to say what your problem is unless I know specifics
maybe you could tell us what moves are you having trouble with, and what is he doing that does the most damage or is hardest to block
tell us what it is that makes you think your brothers blanka is so hard
it may just be a psychological barrier
Posted by 1886 on February 3, 2010 at 12:35 p.m. #692
Focus Attack for Vega is great at the start up, level 1, great at level 2, and but quite bulky and heavy at level 3
I never throw out level 3 FA's and i also never do level 1 against an opponent unless I am just absorbing and advancing at a distance
vega has one of the games best level 1 advancing FADC's
level 2 for vega is the sweet spot, right at the beginning of level 2's flash, in the first frame or two
thats the spot you should ALWAYS go for, unless your opponent is going to strike or not arrived in the hit zone yet, then hold it longer or sorter as needed
in general, always release at the moment needed to strike your opponent
in reality, you need to learn to make that timing the first frame of the Level 2 FA
and you can Focus Attack absorb Blankas electricity too, by the way, that comes in handy
Posted by Spanish Ninja on February 3, 2010 at 2:37 p.m. #693
Ty so much for the advice i intend to put it to good use, ut one thing is rather irksome about dalshim that i would like to know. He has some sort of spinning air like kick that goes in specific directions, I have EX'd wall claw before after his move is done and his attack will overide mine and knock me down leaving me toally exposed. But I intend to put my Fa to use more ill post again to give an upkeep ty again SO much.
Posted by Spanish Ninja on February 3, 2010 at 7:43 p.m. #694
You are king of vega i here by declare it bro. I perfeted my bothers tice in 4 round bouts. TY again
Posted by 1886 on February 4, 2010 at 8:40 a.m. #695
heh, thx, im glad it worked for you, the EX bloody claw from your back wall usually also goes through Blankas regular spin
as for dhalsims dive, he walks on fire, so his feet are really tough, that move is really strong.
thats what i meant when i said your rhythm has to be between his rhythm. so just delay your jumps to wall about 1/2 a move longer than you normally would
and remember LP claw dive goes higher than HP, so choose the right one, i almost always use LP
the catch with Dhalsim is that if his timing is in line with yours, his moves eat yours up
so getting "between" his timing is essential
it really depends on who leaves the ground first, and when etc, his LK dives straight down, and his HK dives out far, its a very strong move for him, so you have to time your dives carefully
in general, FA until you get the timing.
if you have other character-specific questions or something you learned that's useful, let me know
if you dont get it, you can FA the dive and release exactly on the first frame of level 2 FA
Posted by 1886 on February 4, 2010 at 9:27 p.m. #696
releasing any later than the first frame or two of Vegas Focus Attack makes the FA too slow and bulky to be useful
level 2 and level three are both kind of crappy focus attacks for vega
but the first frames of level 2 are much faster than the other Level 2 frames and all level 3 frames
level 1 is if you dont have enough time for level 2, or for advancing on dhalsims or fireballers, hit FA at the moment the strike was going to hit you and forward dash, and vega just appears to walk through the fireball without doing any of the FA animation
Posted by Meteo2 on February 5, 2010 at 4:05 a.m. #697
Perhaps, winning by getting very lucky at numerous 50-50’s isn’t really “earning” the win, but is that the winner’s fault? Is he or she not allowed to call it “legitimate”? Well, the winner didn’t necessarily do anything wrong, so I’d say it’s still legitimate. However, did the loser “lose” legitimately? Think about that. What about if the winner gets lucky by throwing out a “dumb” ultra? Is it legitimate but not praise-worthy? When talking about these terms, the clarity really depends on how well each person defines them.
Obviously, all this talk doesn’t trivialize the matter of players winning one way or another. Without analyzing so much we can apply heuristics or rules of thumb and see that a Dan player who beats a Sagat player has more to (rightfully) brag about than a Sagat player has who beats a Dan. It really is laughable to say that “all wins are equal”, because to do so is to either not understand anything, or it’s saying what you really mean in a way that is grossly vague.
Ok, here’s a scenario: Stabby, Kenny, and Scrubby are all participating in a small SF4 tournament today at a local arcade. It’s just an informal event but it has a 2.00 buy-in and a few prizes. Stabby and Kenny are both excellent players. Stabby mains Claw, but Kenny mains Gen and is not able to use him here. Instead, Kenny will use Ken. Scrubby isn’t a good player, but has figured out how to abuse Claw’s Izuna Drop and has always done so in any SF4 match ever. The tournament starts and these two matches take place at some point:
FIGHT 1: Stabby fights Kenny: Early into the match, Stabby realizes that Kenny’s Ken has a tough time avoiding Claw’s aerial attacks. Stabby catches Kenny with many Izuna Drops during the match and wins easily.
FIGHT 2: Scrubby fights Kenny: Scrubby spams Izuna Drop, occasionally with a few pokes and FBA’s, and Scrubby wins easily. (Kenny prays for a SSF4 arcade release)
After the tournament, Kenny fights Stabby and Scrubby again for practice.
FIGHT 3: Stabby fights hard and skillfully against Kenny, and gets a close win without using many aerial attacks.
FIGHT 4: Scrubby, once again, spams Izuna Drop, and manages to win but by only by a close margin this time, since Kenny began to catch on.
So, how should we judge the various wins of Stabby and Scrubby?
Posted by Meteo2 on February 5, 2010 at 4:09 a.m. #698
In Fight1, was it perfectly fine for Stabby to exploit Kenny’s weakness? What if a lot more money was on the line? What if Claw was considered top-tier because the Izuna Drop did a ton more damage? What if Claw was considered top-tier because of a tactic that Stabby didn’t use?
In Fight2, was it fair that Kenny was able to use a tactic without knowing (or caring) how to do anything else? Would Scrubby be more justified if Kenny was using Sagat instead? Even though Fight2 was almost identical to Fight1, did Stabby earn a more “legitimate” win by simply knowing more tactics that weren’t even used?
In Fights 3 and 4, was Stabby necessarily playing more honorably than Scrubby? How does the cost of a credit on the arcade machine factor into the “right” people have to play the game a certain way? What about the number of people waiting to play, as well as the atmosphere of the arcade (in regards to how friendly or serious everyone is)?
These questions are not rhetorical, they can definitely be looked at a few different ways. Maybe if Ken was top tier people would root more for Scrubby, or maybe they wouldn’t if they knew Kenny’s main was Gen and Kenny only picked Ken because of the similar name!
So, is the Izuna vortex cheap against Sagat? Is it cheap if Sagat lays off the Tiger Shots and Tiger Knees? Is the Izuna vortex cheap to use against Dan? Hmm…
Food for thought.
Personally, my opinions on those last three questions are as follows: Not really, maybe, and possibly. This is kind of how it is for me with everything here. There are many factors and many times it’s ambiguous. Of course I think someone who picks Sagat because of his power and picks on low-tier newbies online is a f***ing ***hole. However, I remain uncertain when it comes to Sagat players who throw down money at tournaments. In some way it seems possible for Scrubby to be a prick but still provide a learning experience to Kenny. Option selects are as cheesy as it gets, but they have a big influence on the game. Some people have fun pushing and exploring the game to the maximum, and they find that aspect of it important. Others find that Street Fighter becomes a lot more dynamic, interesting, challenging, and everything else when both players push themselves more than the game.
Posted by Meteo2 on February 5, 2010 at 1:37 p.m. #699
correction:
"In Fight2, was it fair that Kenny was able to..."
should be
"In Fight2, was it fair that SCRUBBY was able to..."
Sorry about the walls of text, haha! Continue talking about whatever :D
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 1:41 a.m. #700
@phoq:
the block strings used by me most is
LK, LP, MP, FBA
LK, LK, MP, FBA
LK, LP, LP, LP
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 1:44 a.m. #701
and sometimes just
LP FBA
or
LK HST if its only against an oppnent approaching for a throw
you have to throw in an FBA or your block string will fail miserably
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 1:47 a.m. #702
i suppose LCRF could be used in place of the FBA's in the "block string", but i never do it
Posted by Vega Forever on February 6, 2010 at 4:37 a.m. #703
@who are your 2nd / 3rds
M.Bison and E.Honda. I love to cancel scissors kicks and headbutts to supers. so satisfying.
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 7:52 a.m. #704
can anyone name a character who can't cancel into a super other than Vega?
i doubt it
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 7:55 a.m. #705
his super should begin at an Izuna, then go to three suplexes
or a Super Scarlet Terror like Guiles,
or even a CRF
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 7:57 a.m. #706
i mean begin at FBA Super to 3 suplexes, or FBA cancel to super on the wall
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 8:03 a.m. #707
super scarlet terror that ends in a claw strike knocking the opponent up against the back wall, then he could either cancel to ultra, or continue to leap forward and stab them with his claw up on the wall hen full back slash out and they slide down the wall to the ground before they can stand back up
Posted by 1886 on February 6, 2010 at 8:49 p.m. #708
the above I meant Super CRF to pin them to a wall
or a super ST knocking them up in the air that can be canceled to Ultra at that point
or a ground super of standing HP claw strikes and 3 Ground Suplexes
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on February 8, 2010 at 1:59 p.m. #709
@1886
you stopped poking because "it's cheap" and you don't throw "because it's cheap".
This thread used to be about information useful to people wanting to get better at vega, now it's just evangelizing rather then sharing an opinion. I suggest reading this: http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playin...
lastly, i think you are confusing what a blockstring is. Tigerknee's in succession are not block strings. Your block stun wears off before the next knee. you have a chance for a reversal. HOWEVER if you don't know how to reversal or escape, it can be difficult to do so. This is pressure, not a block string. An example of a blockstring is vega's j. HP, cl HP, cr. MP. It's a combo, and when blocked it generates appropriate amount of block stun to avoid reversal, so when you are finished you are a "safe" distance away.
overall I don't suggest you play this competitively or online. I suggest you find a game that you enjoy. When you have a laundry list of complaints that outweigh the benefits that usually means you don't like a game.
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 9:13 p.m. #710
that should be SF2 Turbo, above, not 3
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 9:14 p.m. #711
i believe it was capcom vs SNK 2 that i really enjoyed
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 10:08 p.m. #712
i dont mean to get hard on the developers, I know they were working in time constraints, and I know they tried their best to regulate player sportsmanship online
and i applaud the SF4 developers for the "Super" features of SSF4 which seem to solve the the entire problem
the only things i specifically hope are included, on top of what I've seen already, is the ability to invite specific players, kick players, ban players I.P. addresses, and the ability to create servers
and server options could vary the number of players, the rounds, reserve slots, etc..
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 10:12 p.m. #713
and searching servers by # of players, Connection speed, and I.P address of Server / creator ID, would also be very useful
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 10:17 p.m. #714
players who fully register with legitimate information, including photo, should receive a special avatar / star rating, and then in server options, when creating a match, you should be able to limit people who can join by whether or not they are "fully registered", "Partially Registered", or "unregistered"
Posted by 1886 on February 8, 2010 at 10:19 p.m. #715
Fully registered via credit card billing Name and Address.
Posted by Meteo2 on February 9, 2010 at 12:06 a.m. #716
I play over xboxlive, but my friend has the PC version so if you get an invite from "Revaize", that's me and him. Probably it'll be hard to catch up with you 1886, but keep an eye out.
I don't think the concept of "cheesy" players being dishonorable is silly, but I agree more with the side saying if something's in the game that all players can use, then there is not much wrong with it so long as it doesn't drastically break the game. However, people that mix those powerful and easy tactics with skillful play and versatility are more impressive and respectable, I agree.
In the end, I'm just taking SF4 for what it is and having a good time with the way it was made and the way people play it.
Oh! By the way, there is supposed to be a crazy new Vega combo video in the works to be posted soon (hopefully today). I can't wait, I'll link it when I see it.
Posted by Meteo2 on February 9, 2010 at 6:09 a.m. #717
Here's that vid. Manually executed, some of it is neat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n67gsh...
Posted by 1886 on February 9, 2010 at 10:33 p.m. #718
can you break down the combos into text here?
i dont get youtube
Posted by 1886 on February 9, 2010 at 11:18 p.m. #719
nevermind, i did it
these combos were nice,
the best thing is that you can EXFBA to Claw strike to EXST, Im not sure if that was an actual combo or a training mode combo without block set, but it really looks like he was hit before he hit the ground. perhaps it only works in the corner
another thing was the HST to Super, i dont know why he couldnt grab them, perhaps its not possible, only can strike, and i think it must be in a corner
here they are, maybe some mistakes, let me know
HP FADC Fwd dash jump HP strike
jump HP + LK + 2xCr. LP + Fwd Dash cancel + Ultra
Jump HK + LK + cr. LP x2 + EX FBA - IZ
Jump HP + LK x 3 + Cr. HP
Jump HP + Cosmic Heel x 2 + ST
LCRF cancel Focus Attack + Cr. MK + LK x 2 + Cr HP
Up Jump HK + HP + LK + cr. HP
Jump HP + cr MK + LK + cr LP x 2 + EX FBA - Claw + EX ST
Jump HK + HP cancel HCRF, EX cancel, cr LP + cr LK + LST + EX ST
Jump HK + HP + cr LP x 2 + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
Jump HP + cr LP x2 + LCRF + FADC + cr LP x2 + LST + EXST
LCRF + cr LP x 2 + eX FBA - Claw + EXST
Jump MK + HP cancel HCRF + FADC + cr LP x3 + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
LCRF Cancel FA + HP + cr. MP + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
Dhalsim) Jump up HK + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
Jump HP + cr MK + Cr LP + LP + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
HP FADC cr. LP x 2 + cr. LK + LCRF FADC + HK
LCRF cancel FA + LCRF + EXST
Jump HP + cr LP x3 + cr MP + EXFBA - double Claw
HP FADC cr LP x3 + cr MP + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
LCRF Cancel FA + cr MK + LK + cr LP + cr MP + EXFBA - Claw + EXST
Jump LP + cr LP + LP + LCRF FADC cr LP + LP + LST + EXST
Jump HP + cr LP + cr LK + LCRF FADC + cr LP + EXST
Jump HP + Cosmic Heel + HST + Super - claw
LCRF cancel FA + HP cancel HCRF + cr LP x 2 + HK
Jump HK + MK + LCRF FADC cr LP x2 + LP + LCRF FADC cr LP x2 + cr LK + HST
Posted by 1886 on February 9, 2010 at 11:26 p.m. #720
a lot of those ate up 4 ex bars
and they were all jump ins, but i liked one of his last ones where he did his kick at teh last second.
i suppose it may be worth canceling and CRF with 2 ex bars for a couple other of those combos, but i doubt if canceling 2 ex bars and finishing with one of those combos does as much damage as the EXFBA
and I know the EXFBA to claw to EXST doesn't do as much damage as 2 EX FBA's to izuna for the same EX
but I liked those combos, and really enjoyed the vid, thanks alot
Posted by Noob on February 10, 2010 at 12:04 a.m. #721
Nice vid. Thanks for the link.
Anyone know if the EXFBA to claw to EXST does more damage than EXFBA to throw?
Posted by Meteo2 on February 10, 2010 at 1:58 a.m. #722
Depending on the length of the combo, it may or may not do a bit more damage. However, the cost of the meter in relation to a small bit more damage, and the difficulty of pulling it off, kind of make it impractical. It's cool but it took Joz many attempts.
Focus Canceling out of a RCF into a plinked standing roundhouse might be worth trying though. I want to see how much damage that does in short combos.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on February 10, 2010 at 7:47 p.m. #723
@1886
The link is not dead. It could be the region you are in is blocking the site. You also mentioned you don't get youtube. there was someone else who used to post on here who didn't, and that was Assassin. Just wondering if you're him posting under a different name.
Posted by 1886 on February 10, 2010 at 8:08 p.m. #724
this is what i got from my readings
50 EXFBA + 90 Air Claw + 48 EXST = 188 combo, Cost: 2 EX bars
50 EXFBA + 150 Izuna Drop = 200 combo, Cost: 1 EX bar
so that's a potential 400 for two Izuna's for the same EX expenditure
80 Cosmic Heel + 50 EXBA + 120 Izuna = 250 combo, Cost: 1 EX bar
80 Cosmic Heel + 100 & 60 HST = 240, Cost: 0 EX bars
i think the claw to EXST is meant to be used in corners for those people who have trouble with the "wall glitch"
in fact, if your opponent is against the wall and you EX FBA him, you can direct yourself to the right, against the wall, and around to grab him for the Izuna at a much lower height than the normal grab away from the wall
all in all, I think I will use the Cosmic heel to ST alot more, for just 10 less damage, you save an entire EX bar
the main problem is that the Cosmic Heel to ST takes charge time, where as the Cosmic Heel to EXFBA can be charged down and forwards. I dont know why all charge moves can't be held in either direction, its brilliant
so the EXFBA is still more useful in high level play when the odds that you land your Cosmic Heel or FA decrease significantly, thus making charging fully more difficult
the cosmic heel to EXFBA is so easy and can be done instantly in unexpected situations
but I should really begin training my charges a little better, like the blanka users do.
but most of the time i throw out a Cosmic Heel I am looking to apply pressure, or maybe throw, and to charge every time "just in case" seems like a lot of wasted effort
but if i was disciplined enough to use the ST every time, i suppose i would have my EX bars to use elsewhere, such as burning 2 bars for a CRF cancel, or to throw the mask off
but if i didnt have EX to use on FBA's, I would more than likely burn it all on EXST's for priority moves, Range, and countering Fireballs, and other mid-to close range attacks
Posted by 1886 on February 10, 2010 at 8:13 p.m. #725
EX ST and EX CRF are 2 things I can never get enough of, so if I can convert even 2 or three Cosmic heels per game into a HST, i would be able to use my EX CRF's for those cr MK + Fireball Shoto combos, and use my EX ST for close in fireballs and getting myself out of tight situations
Posted by 1886 on February 10, 2010 at 8:18 p.m. #726
so even if I could convert ALL my Cosmic Heels to ST's, i still would find it nearly impossible to justify the use of any EX for a cancel, or at the end of a long combo for greatly reduced damage
those combos are flashy, but a little too sexy for me
probably just people who want to do long combos would do that
in reality, at higher levels of game play, if you did those combos you would be almost guaranteed to lose the round for not having any EXST, EX CRF, or EXFBA to counter with
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on February 10, 2010 at 9:48 p.m. #727
yeah i thought we were too. what's with the cowgirl stuff?
all I know is without me really fleshing out any details it seems i get lumped into a category that I don't think fits me, by a stranger. I got a little defensive. if it had your SN above it I probably would've reacted differently.
Posted by 1886Assassin on February 10, 2010 at 10:26 p.m. #728
I suppose those long combos do ok for stun damage,
but vegas highest stun damage comes from individual strikes
I get stuns quite a bit, they come mostly from high claw wall dives, standing HK, HK sweep, crouching HP, and jumping back HP, and EXFBA to Izuna
This Combo leads directly to a Stun state from the beginning of the round for Ryu:
HK Sweep + Wall high claw from your back wall + standing HK + Standing Far HP + Crouching HP
here is one for the 2nd round:
EXFBA + Standing HK + Standing Far HP + Cr. HP + high claw wall strike
here is another for any round:
High Claw wall strike + standing HK + Sweeping HK + Standing HP + EXFBA to Izuna
or
standing far HP + Crouching HP + jump straight up HK + Standing HK + Sweeping HK
or
anti-air jump HK + jump back with HP together + High Claw wall dive + EXFBA to Izuna + Standing HK or HK Sweep
or any combination of those above
you should be able to do those strikes one after the other without being hit yourself, putting almost all opponents in a stun state, gief required one more of those strikes
these are vegas highest stun damage moves, they all do 200 stun damage:
landing any of the sky high claw wall dives does 200 stun
Far standing HP = 200
standing HK (2 strike)= 200
cr HP = 200
cr HK slide = 200
any Jumping HK or HP = 200
level 3 focus attack = 200
EXFBA to Izuna = 200
the close HP only does 100, and the close HP cancel to HCRF only does 230
adding a jumping HP to that bumps it up to 394
but there isnt many opportunities for that jump in in high level play, but its a good air to air counter, and jumping back with HP is a good off the ground strike
if you want a good way to do the close HP cancel to HCRF, you can crouch first, charging down and back, then move the controller to back and strike then straight to forward HP, you can do it without walking backwards this way, or needing to jump in, and is often a good surprise attack
level 3 FA is useless, and probably one of the hardest Level 3 FA's to land in the entire game
Posted by yot on February 15, 2010 at 12:12 p.m. #729
removing the claw makes vega weaker but does it have any effect on his stamina/defense like the mask throw does? This information hasn't been put here 4 some reason.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on February 17, 2010 at 11:21 a.m. #730
I believe the consensus is the mask only decreases damage dealt, not damage recieved. Well, that and a decrease in range on punches, too.
Posted by ayo on February 18, 2010 at 2:10 p.m. #731
tvc up in here innit
Posted by Meteo2 on February 18, 2010 at 2:20 p.m. #732
Sorry that SF4 wasn't the second coming of Christ returning to enforce your personal, minority interpretation of the street fighter bible. What do you want? Everyone to obey a list of what attacks are too cheap to do after other attacks? Do you want Capcom to fire and scold everyone for using the limited time and resources they had to make SF4 as they thought was best?
I guarantee you that if the SF2 designers were used as consultants, things still wouldn't have turned out to your taste. Go play HDRemix or something, SF4 is simply a different game and there is other sh!t out there. Go think and write out every mechanic for your "perfect game" if you are just going to complain about things. Who knows, maybe it'll change the fighting world but most likely its just going to be
A: exactly SF2
B: unknowingly full of loopholes and more cheap tactics
C: a game where all the characters play exactly the same
Maybe get out of the house/apparent and play in person instead of getting frustrated by online latency that makes throws harder to tech. Make a website dedicated to increasing support for your wish for a perfect SF5 2012 release. It's not helping anything to post "fagoot fukking cheap ass sh!tty fukking capcom everyone who beats me is a cheap fag" on this Vega discussion page.
Posted by Guess? on February 18, 2010 at 10:39 p.m. #733
Hahah. Looks like the Vega thread has surpassed the Guile one.
Posted by Vega on February 19, 2010 at 4:20 p.m. #734
I think you may be mistaking sentences for paragraphs there.
Posted by Vega Forever on February 20, 2010 at 5:34 a.m. #735
@metheolap
you watch your mouths at least do not shower your homophobic sickness here in a site about a video game!
Posted by zombiebrian on February 20, 2010 at 2:30 p.m. #736
Ok had alot of complaints about these comments, we relies these threads are a bit wild west. unfortunately thats due to fact we can only delete em one at a time which is rather a painstaking process. This will cease to be a problem soon if what catalyst is trying works we will be able to ip ban these trolls.
mean time can i ask you not to feed the trolls as this is why we have so many its like the south park episode with the homeless and spare change.
im gonna try and delete some on this page so please dont add to it
Posted by Meteo2 on February 22, 2010 at 12:48 a.m. #737
Soo... how about that Ex-RCF? Invincible to more things than I thought.
Nicovid rip :P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oa7yBK...
Posted by jdnice11 on February 22, 2010 at 1:06 a.m. #738
Is it just me or does Guy's Ultra 1 look like it could be Vega's new Ultra 2. I mena just modify it a tad and i think that move would be perfect for Vega. Have Vega Start of with his sliding kick, into the Scarlet Terror, then perform a Bloody High move (slashing from side to side) and then finishing with that spinning suplex! i think that would a Perfect Ultra for Vega. I mean his new Ultra the Splendid Claw is awesome, but its too short!
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on February 22, 2010 at 9:51 a.m. #739
nice post meteo, I know about it's fireball avoidance but not some of those others. Also I didn't know it was invincible on activation, it's interesting how he was able to avoid dhalsim's super and ultra...and how the heck is it that he avoids the super with his ultra? crazy.
@JDnice
I wouldn't be opposed to a visually pleasing ultra, but I'm kind of happy it's short, as there are now several ultras longer then seth's original. Plus, his and guile's were added for the sole purpose of being able to be combo'd into. Other characters are just lucky that they have 2 comboable ultras >.>
Posted by Meteo2 on February 23, 2010 at 8:49 a.m. #740
Well it looks like ultra startup has total invuln to fireballs perhaps, I wonder if it has wakeup invuln to the other stuff like Rufus's spin, Viper's firekick, and FeiLong's expunch? I gotta try ultra the next time a shoto tries to end a block string with a fireball!
Posted by zombiebrian on February 23, 2010 at 5:06 p.m. #741
really just came around to check but i have to say im not impressed by the time some of these new ultras are gonna take. Sure they make nice eye candy but a year from release i reckon a few of us will be more than a bit tiered of seeing geifs cyberian blizzard
Posted by ragh9364 on February 24, 2010 at 1:34 a.m. #742
i hope they clean up the barcelona move in ssf4, i hate when i do the ex version of the move and the first hit pops the other guy up but the screen stretches and sometimes vega bounces off or just doesn't even hit the wall and lands on his feet looking away from the opponent and has that little bounce when he lands, it's kinda unfair with the disadvantages of being vega already...ex snake strike vs a masked vega = anyones super move, ex snake strike vs an unmasked vega = ultra, capcom needs to get to work
Posted by Meteo2 on February 26, 2010 at 1:03 p.m. #743
A friend told me to start recording my G1 finals
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gq8mtI...
I think it helps to review your own stuff, really
Posted by Kage on March 2, 2010 at 7:53 p.m. #744
Meteo! Nice vid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HO6fq7...
I think this is you as well. Hard to see the name in the background.
Action starts around 6:03
Posted by Meteo2 on March 3, 2010 at 2:18 a.m. #745
Yeah unfortunately that was indeed me, haha. Lost my composure at the end, and dizzy didn't help.
I'm trying to record my G1 finals when I can, because I think analyzing your own stuff definitely helps a bit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIHtqq... (Rose 56k)
ate me up when I tried to do things at bad times
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxIF9T... (Claw 39k)
mirror match!
Posted by Kage on March 3, 2010 at 12:29 p.m. #746
Haha yeah I was rooting for you until the end there hoping for a major comeback. I should put some more vids up myself - have improved somewhat since getting my butt kicked at norcal regionals. keep the vids coming meteo! good stuff.
Posted by Meteo2 on March 3, 2010 at 12:29 p.m. #747
Woops, kind of said that twice already. Oh Well.
Jumping MP is now being recognized as a great safe jump of Vega, please read: http://www.shoryuken.com/showthread.p...
Posted by Meteo2 on March 3, 2010 at 12:31 p.m. #748
Haha, thanks Kage, will do. Hope to see your own videos at some point!
Posted by .... on March 5, 2010 at 12:45 p.m. #749
Anyone know if they actuall did speed vega up or at least cut down on some of his frame rates? its freaking ridiculous...
Posted by Vega Forever on March 7, 2010 at 5:01 a.m. #750
i want to see some SSF4 gameplay videos of Vega. is there any on YouTube? because i couldn't find any...
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on March 7, 2010 at 1:53 p.m. #751
There isn't much of any characters right now, except the 3S characters. It's sad but it seems we may have to wait till april.
Posted by THAT guy on March 8, 2010 at 8:14 p.m. #752
Vega is beast! and totally my main, but i always have troubles busting off the BHC but never his super, but i dont know why, also, i figured that some guys online are defenceless if you fake em out with a no slash flying attack then hit them with the Down Forward hard kick, or a grapple, if you wind up close enough to them (but this only works on guys who really like to block. plus the ex sky high claw is great and takes out a good chunk of health.
Posted by Dark_Fantom on March 13, 2010 at 9:40 a.m. #753
To make Vega balanced, they have to:
1)Give him more combos in addition to a combo-able ultra.
2)Take away his "throw claw/mask" move and give him something else.
3)Make his super less predictable. (I think make it hit on the way up would be great)
4)Give him chip damage on his normal moves when he has his claw on.
5)As someone said before, get rid of his wall dive glitch.
Posted by nocturnal on March 22, 2010 at 5:32 a.m. #754
as Vega players what is your Top 3 of enemies? I mean when you're doing a match and when you see which character your opponent's chosen, which ones make you say "damn, this will be hard"?
Posted by Dark_Fantom on March 22, 2010 at 11:03 a.m. #755
@ nocturnal
Gief, blanka and Sagat. Gief spams his lariat, blanka spams electricity and sagat is just hard to beat lol.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 26, 2010 at 11:30 a.m. #756
Gief and blanka are typically easy. Sagat can be beaten if you're patient and can block well.
For me
Dhalsim (really sux trying to chase him around the screen)
Honda (ochio throw pisses me off there)
Gen (I still havnt figured out a reliable strategy vs him)
a close 4th is chun li. (most chuns can footsie very well.... which is my weakness)
Posted by nocturnal on March 26, 2010 at 4:15 p.m. #757
yeah chun li is really painful! i hate her neutral jump high kick especially. it covers such large area. and the down+forward+high kick move being spammed drives me crazy.
but mine are: number 1 Blanka of course. When i see my opponent is Blanka i say "Ok i have lost" and i do... I don't know. I play fairly well guess. But i am totally helpless against blanka. I mean he can make his rolls constantly and you cannot counter without you also getting hurt which is more painful than what he gets. If i block the straight roll and i dont have ex meter there is nothing to punish him also.
number 2 is Balrog. I sometimes cant get him off me and that buffalo head move drives me crazy with tons of priority.
and 3 is Guile. sonic boom sonic boom sonic boom. if you barcelona, air grabs you before you izuana. if you jump over the sonic boom toward him, he flash kick. and that crouching high kick!
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 27, 2010 at 8:03 p.m. #758
For Blanka see my above post like 50 or so up. (stay offensive)
Rog.... standing hk is your best friend. it stuffs everything except the headbutt which you should be blocking. Don't poke and you should do well.
as for jump happy people like guile. you have to be able to correctly predict his next move. take at least half a round to study him and his habits. if he likes to air throw bait it and nail with a LP version Sky High Claw. eventually he will stop. after that wall dive till he starts air throwing again and repeat. Go into training mode and practice the timing for izuna on flash kick. the key is to fly over and come back. if he izuna he's nailed. if he likes to cHP you (uppercut) only try the ex FBA (if you miss dont try to land izuna. just try to land the 2 hit claw attack). look for patterns in fireballs. guiles sonic boom has stupid fast recovery.ultra him if you are 100% sure he's throwing one you hear the "S" sound in sonic just go.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 28, 2010 at 1:18 a.m. #759
i meant if he flash kick he's nailed. sorry tired again.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 28, 2010 at 1:38 a.m. #760
oh and for cHK, you got a lot of options. block hit 1 focus hit 2 dash and nail (probably throw). or you can (timing is moderately strict) cMP xx EXFBA (if close enough). or if you wanna be tricky you can Piece of mercury or cosmic heel over it and nail. (one of the few times PoM is sorta useful except it's unsafe on hit. It's just a mix up option.
oh and also.... if he starts round 1 with a sonic boom. start rounds 2 and 3 with an ex RCF.
if he blocks ex fba (or if anyone other than sagat for that matter) never ever come back if they nail you once for it. they'll be lookin for it and sittin all over it. use the opportunity to get distance (and bait the hell outta that jump).
since i'm here anyway....
for blanka (as stated above) you have more priority than him. IMO it's one of the few 6-4 matchups. blanka balls get stuffed by almsot every normal (including jumping normals) they get stuffed by air throws, ST, slide (cHK), the only things that dont stop it is SHC and FBA. then on the other side it's punishable as hell on block. EX FBA at minimum, ultra is standard. his ultra can be air thrown, his slide can be Focused, his electricity can be jabbed (cLP) through. RCF stuffs almost every wake up option he has cept ultra and ex up ball (which doesnt stop me from doing it again since he just wasted meter). about the only thing blanka can do vs you is jump at you. in that case just be ready for air throw or block. he really doesnt have many if any options.
rog... bait that headbutt. sit all over it and nail with a minimum of ST. i'm tellin ya standing HK is your best friend. when he gets into headbutt range just stick out jabs in random amounts. try to stay outta the corner. if it costs you half your health to get out it's worth it.
above all else you MUST know how, what and when to block.
Posted by nocturnal on March 29, 2010 at 11:56 a.m. #761
thanks. these will be helpful but demands real practice :) i want a friend to fight again and again but people just do one match on player match. computer is stupid. real practice should be with a tough blanka player but cant find any to play constantly.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 29, 2010 at 1:39 p.m. #762
send a request to poonray. good blanka
Posted by nocturnal on March 31, 2010 at 12:31 p.m. #763
you cannot search a username in games FWL. or can you and i dont know how? :S
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on March 31, 2010 at 6:36 p.m. #764
you press the PS button, go over to create message and type in poonray as the recipient and ask him when you can do a player match. You tell him VegaMan sent ya and he should respond pretty soon. Or... you can go to www.up-your-game.com and click on chat(IRC) and do player matches in there. there's a couple good blanka's in there
Posted by chesszealot on April 6, 2010 at 2:59 p.m. #765
Hi everyone,
I need help on how to play against Rufus. I never can get away from him and he just keeps jumping and then quickly attacks me and he does this repeatedly saying "hey". What can I do to counter attack him or get away from him?
Thanks in advance
Posted by Th3_JoK3R_J on April 6, 2010 at 11:51 p.m. #766
@chesszealot
Go here for your help on all your bad match-ups =)
http://www.shoryuken.com/showthread.p...
Posted by killermanX42 on April 13, 2010 at 5:52 p.m. #767
i need a way to stop Ken and his annoying jumping combos as vega while i'm charging. does anyone know how to help me?
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on April 14, 2010 at 7:05 p.m. #768
1. dont charge while your opponent jumps.
2. use air throw on ken when he jumps.
3. when he stats air tatsuing to counter your air throw, nail with ultra or SHC
4. Neutral jump + HK or LP
5. Focus backdash
6. dash under him.
7. slide upder him.
8. wall dive in reaction to him.
9. if all those options fail.... block.
Posted by x_Who_Is_Alpha on April 20, 2010 at 3:18 p.m. #769
Thank god vega can chain to his ultra, even if its situational its still better than nothing like before.
Posted by killermanX42 on April 20, 2010 at 4:18 p.m. #770
thanks dude
Posted by killermanX42 on April 20, 2010 at 4:28 p.m. #771
i have another question about how to beat a spam
how do you beat Zangief's arm spinning spam? i try to dodge out of the way but he moves forward also, even if not very far, just enough to hit me. i also want to know how to get past it because every time i try to i just get knocked away
thanks in advance X3
Posted by akillyz on April 21, 2010 at 4:51 p.m. #772
can someone help me out here? i cant seem to escape corners with this guy, any Vega players have good strategies? my best is either block, then counter with a scarlet terror or wall kick, but niether work that well.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on April 23, 2010 at 9:32 a.m. #773
for Lariat, just hit him on recovery.
for vega in the corner it depends on who you're fighting but chances are you're screwed. Block and wait for a mistake. then cLP into far wall ex Fba. if you don't have meter you're really screwed unless the other guy really f@cks up. stay outta the corner.
Posted by darkness_prisoner on April 25, 2010 at 7:16 p.m. #774
he can now link crMP then EX charge down then up+kk perfectly and easily and anywhere!!! yesterday i managed to link his combo outside the corner easily:
dnMK, dnLP, dnMP, EX charge down up+kk
his f+mk overhead is better now, the game is now faster which helped him now, his ultra 2 can punish ryu after blocking ryu's dnHK, can reach honda and blanka after their charge back forward+p recovery, to bad his scarlet terror still the same weak priority and should be used carefully, focus into ultra 2 links without the need of the dash after hitting with the focus :)
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on April 26, 2010 at 12:30 a.m. #775
i think what you mean is cMP into EX FBA works at any distance the cMP can connect at.
his Piece of Mercury is now an overhead
the game isnt faster Vega just has faster startup on a lot of his moves.
blanka balls could always be punished on block by ultra, but i did notice punishing honda on headbutts i didnt do in sf4.
and you can focus ultra in sf4 without dashing. no change there.
Blanka vs Vega is now easily 4-6 and probably 3-7
Posted by darkness_prisoner on April 26, 2010 at 6:30 a.m. #776
overall he is the same but only since he can now combo cMP into FBA ex in any distance, then it will be more fun to play with him and win more games.
Posted by mojoworldandcompany on April 26, 2010 at 3:46 p.m. #777
Did no one fckin realize how much the damage output on vega has changed?!
he's not only faster (i've beaten balrog to a punch!}, his combos not only connect easier and perfectly consistently, but he can do real good damage, three hits from his bnb combo and you pretty much lost.
this list on event hubs needs to be changed, some off the stuff on here is just wrong. and there needs to be a new video tutorial. vega changed alot.
find me on psn. mojoworld
I only play vega
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on April 26, 2010 at 5:04 p.m. #778
mask remove only takes 1 bar now. needs to be fixed on guide
Posted by Dark_Fantom on April 26, 2010 at 6:05 p.m. #779
Speaking of mask removal, by How much does it increase his attack power? and if you pick your mask back up does he still keep the extra attack power?
Also doesn't getting rid of your claw make your EX moves take up only half a bar?
Posted by hornjo93 on April 26, 2010 at 9:19 p.m. #780
if you remove the mask u take 25% extra dmg but u do 10% more dmg and if u remove ur claw all ur atks decrease by 10
Posted by mojoworldandcompany on April 29, 2010 at 10:30 a.m. #781
where am I supposed to complain to get this vega entry fixed? event hubs, you need to fix this thing, alot of the information on this page is wrong, or half correct now that super street fighter 4 has come out. I'd like to see this information fixed and vega re-evaluated.
Posted by BananaShikiTheLegend on April 29, 2010 at 6:12 p.m. #782
Anyone found any combos into Bloody High Claw/Splendid Claw that don't involve Focus Attack/AA Cosmic Heel?
Posted by nocturnal on May 1, 2010 at 5:06 a.m. #783
i dont have a xbox or playstation, so cant play SSF4. so please keep it up here for good SSF4 Vega matches video links. Everyone is playing Dudley, i cannot find any good Vega.
Posted by Meteo2 on May 2, 2010 at 1:20 p.m. #784
Woo had some login issues here but the admins rock ;)
Heres some of my Claw replays to kickoff SSF4 on my channel
vs SDS CHRONIC (C Viper) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4k5dFI...
vs XOXCSTONEX (Blanka) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwYVWL...
another vs XOXCSTONEX http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyFSF_...
vs TooSicc510 (Boxer) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyFSF_...
Posted by Meteo2 on May 5, 2010 at 3:40 a.m. #785
a bunch more here for those who want to see vids
http://shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t...
Or just visit to my YouTube channel (see above), I don't want to spam more links anymore.
In any case, Vega is noticeably more competitive and that makes me happy :). Not well-rounded by far but that is what makes him so interesting!
Posted by Zetsurin on May 6, 2010 at 9:23 a.m. #786
When you're fighting against Ibuki, beware. Kunai stuffs EX Sky High Claw and Bloody High Claw (if you're going for the Ultra as an anti-air). I don't particularly understand the EX SHC, as it can go through plasma, fire, and ultras. Watch out for those lil' pieces of metal.
Posted by Meteo2 on May 6, 2010 at 11:41 a.m. #787
Splendid Claw doesn't get stuffed by kunais if you activate it when you're about to be hit with one.
I was waking up with two ex kunais about to hit me. A reversal splendid claw avoided them and caught Ibuki on her way down from the air.
Posted by Dark_Fantom on May 6, 2010 at 10:50 p.m. #788
Splendid claw is a Wicked ultra. While it doesn't do as much damage as BHC, it can go through fireballs on startup and can catch jump-ins pretty well. It seems to come out pretty quick too.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 7, 2010 at 9:52 a.m. #789
@779 and 780
i think you only take 10% more damage now without mask.
@782
SHC is an AA. you only have 3 ways to combo into it. via Focus, lk version AA ST, or trade with your back in the corner. and yes it's still unsafe on block and hit.
@786
some wierd things stuff kunais, i think my ST or a normal stuffed it once.i'll hit the training room to figure out what it was.
@788
i find equal uses for either ultra. U1 is invincable to fireballs all the way until recovery. U2 is only invincable on startup. if U1 gets stuffed before flash you lose ultra meter. U2 doesnt reach full screen. basically i have it divided like this. on tall people (gief, sagat, vega, thawk) and on people who like to jump a lot (mainly ibuki, guy, ken, bison, rufus, akuma, viper, dhalsim, and seth) i'll use U1, on people who tend to stick to the ground (mainly ibuki, guy, ryu, gief, dudley, makoto, abel, balrog) i'll use U2. yes i know i mentioned some people twice and some not at all. for the people i listed twice, i used whichever ultra i see as default (U2 for guy, U2 for ibuki, U1 for gief etc) until after i see how the other guy plays. I'll adjust next time i see him if needed. for the poeple not listed i take the most common move they use and see which ultra would be more effective as a counter.
i strongly PREFER U1 over U2 for the simple fact that it does more damage. i'm sure you've noticed major damage scaling when your opponent is almost dead (yes damage scaling not only applies to number of hits but also, the amount of life guage left. at 1/4 life you can really see the difference between U1 and U2 in damage. U1 rarely doesnt kill and U2 rarely kills.
Posted by Doppler on May 8, 2010 at 7:39 p.m. #790
any tips to beat the pussys of ryus?? is the only tha I have some problems, but even I can slash a lot, but is the only that have problems.... and some chun lis
Posted by Meteo2 on May 9, 2010 at 1:18 a.m. #791
Hey guys, anyone have tips for common Cosmic Heel (df.HK) setups they use? Cosmic Heel is one element missing from my fighting style and I'm experimenting with how to apply it effectively.
A few setups/situations I'm starting to use CH in:
-starting bigger punishes for things like wiffed DP's
-neutral jumping barely at the edge of opponent's poke range and then throwing out CH upon landing to try and catch their poke
-throwing out CH after they block or get hit by a far poke of mine (like cr.MP, st.MK)
So far it's been tough to randomly react to an opponent's wiffed pokes with CH. Does anybody have success doing that?
@Doppler
What in particular with those matches vs Ryu and Chun gives you the most trouble? What is the most frustrating? It's hard to answer without knowing what the problem is.
Posted by Doppler on May 9, 2010 at 8:24 p.m. #792
@Meteo2
Well my vega partner,I dont know if you have bad times with those that I mention before, but in particular is to safe when the ryus is only cr.LP and then jump to the other side and do a MK to cross up me.
I try to safe from it using my Scarlet terros but is useless because it dont have good priority, so thats my problem.
For chun lis is almost the same thing, but with ryu is most the problem cause his graet priority in almos all of the atacks, I need a good tactic with those
Posted by Meteo2 on May 10, 2010 at 1:45 p.m. #793
When you think a Ryu is going to jump up near you, you should maybe try to jump as well and airgrab him. Depends on the situation. Learn to block well and tech throws. Watch good Vega vs Ryu videos (I have my channel linked above) and try to play a bit like those Vegas. Some good Vega players are Ujiki, Makoto, Cat-k, Kubiwa, Ranbo, Yamasan, Hakaba Poemer, Wasa Beef
also a few more good Vegas know of: Da Assassin jaY, Jozhear as vega, KentaroFA, X Knucklez X
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 11, 2010 at 11:49 a.m. #794
Meteo
i pretty much use cosmic heel to cover distance or to hop over low pokes (usually cMK). if you zone it right you can use it as AA on neutral jumpers then combo into Scarlet Terror or U2
Posted by Meteo2 on May 11, 2010 at 7:33 p.m. #795
@laCerda
Cool, I know CH has varied uses but its helps to focus on a few practical applications like you suggested, so thanks!
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 12, 2010 at 10:57 a.m. #796
yeah for some reason people either completely freeze up after CH and you can throw/combo them(they usually know throw is coming so they are succeptable to n jump), or they come ready with a reversal and 9 times outta 10 they whiff
Posted by HouseWD on May 13, 2010 at 1:07 p.m. #797
ModInside's(Guile Player) XBL Online Stats 7:18 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS0xFY... 118 Streak ended by a Vega Player xD
The Vega match http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZZbfV... 5:10
Posted by theonly_J on May 13, 2010 at 6:45 p.m. #798
I'm glad a claw player could stop his streak but honestly that Vega was pretty horrible. Anyways not gonna hate congrats to him on his win, heres a good video of me, also if you check the rest of the channel you can see more vids of me with more like every 3 days
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D--kgp...
Posted by Stop on May 16, 2010 at 6:40 p.m. #799
I love my Vega but holy damn his priority is terrible. Only us Claws can know what it's like to repeatedly outplay an opponent and still lose strictly because of character bias. Grrrrrrr.
Posted by Sakanade on May 16, 2010 at 7:36 p.m. #800
i need help on sim and super im-on-crack hyper agressive cammies. my usual flurry isnt working on those specific char's
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 16, 2010 at 8:37 p.m. #801
@#799
You cant look at it as priority. it's all about active frames and i frames. And no... his "Priority" isnt terrible. it's pretty good actually. Standing HP beats wakeup DP free. SHC beats honda's headbutt. almsot every normal vega has beats blanka at everything. you have to learn you cant always press buttons. you gotta block sometimes too.
@800
sim.... i can't help you there. my 2 worst matchups are sim and gen. let me know when you find something that works there.
for cammy. downback man.... downback. it beats everything cammy has.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on May 17, 2010 at 10:55 a.m. #802
Anyone know how to approach a chun-li matchup?
god that bish is vega's worst matchup, i swear
Posted by Sakanade on May 17, 2010 at 10:13 p.m. #803
i didnt want to make a topic on the forums.. but can someoen give me a general idea of what has higher priority or beats out his wall dive and super..
Posted by Stop on May 18, 2010 at 5:59 a.m. #804
#801, I don't get into the game as deeply as plotting out "a" frames and "i" frames, all I know is I just lost because my EX SHC got beat by a Gen normal. IMO, anybody's EX should always beat anybody's normal.
And thanks for the tip on blocking, I hadn't thought of that. /rolleyes
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 18, 2010 at 11:32 p.m. #805
@#804
well..... as you can see sometimes it doesnt always work out that ex beats normal. Honda's U1 loses to a normal. By your opinion it's shouldnt happen, but it does.
If a gen normal is beating your ex shc you might not wanna use shc in that situitation. Gen is my worst matchup so I cant offer you much specific advice. The only way I can beat Gen is by blocking really well and countering the things he's - on block with. It took frame data to get decent at that matchup for me. you don't have to learn frame data, but it helps.
and sure anything for the blocking tip.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on May 18, 2010 at 11:39 p.m. #806
All vega players should also master how to Izuna drop focusing opponents. Although it could be hard to grab smaller characters like chun, sakura, gen, etc...you should be able to izuna drop standing opponents like 4/5 times (maybe) to prevent them from focusing your wall dives and make them do something stupid like jump(lol)
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 19, 2010 at 12:38 a.m. #807
Trying to Izuna drop sakura is a bad bad bad idea....... cHP stuffs everything
Posted by Sakanade on May 19, 2010 at 4:25 a.m. #808
ok its been about a few weeks.. anybody wanna share some new things about their ssf4 vega.. thanx to his buffs and fixes and the damage nerf that was done to the whole cast my win percentage has gone up drastically vega is waaaaaaaaaaayyyyy more deadly now..
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on May 19, 2010 at 10:26 p.m. #809
@808
just fact that c.MP to ex-FBA hits crouching opponents better and at longer distances(i don't think it misses now)
the best tip for vega players is to learn the CORPSE HOP (ie using cosmic heel or pierce of mercury to cross up an opponent while they are waking up.
1. after a scarlet terror- quickly dash forward, cosmic heel, c.LK to ex fba
2. after an izuna drop - quickly dash forward, cosmic heel, c.LK to ex fba
3. after a sweep - cosmic heel, c.lk to ex fba
4. after a sweep - POM (cosmic heel goes too far) to instant over head (j.HP)
the good thing about this is you can mixup what u do after you cross up. Like grabbing after c.LK, etc
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 20, 2010 at 12:22 p.m. #810
to sorta repeat and add to #809 (good info btw)
cLK scales damage. Use cMK. also.... if you do nothing but low hit exfba they gonna catch on. especially if vega mirror. like #809 said, you have to mix it up. throw a throw in. or n jump. also.... don't always use cosmic heel or PoM. use lk version Scarlet Terror. that builds meter and crosses over. jHP is good but be cautious. you can be punished on landing or before. the recovery on instant jHP is fast so.... use it sparingly.
another tactic i use is cross over to safe jump set up. and i'll loop it for as long as i can between mix ups. when they finally figure it out i usually turtle and wait for the ultra to whiff and finish them off.
Posted by Dark_Fantom on May 23, 2010 at 9:16 p.m. #811
Has anyone noticed that you can't combo your U2 from a Scarlet Terror? It's weird because it would work out so well if you could.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 24, 2010 at 10:58 a.m. #812
U2 only combo's from FA on Counter Hit or after aerial hit of Cosmic Heel. I've heard rumors from jump in HK/HP but i cant pull it off.
U1 only combo's from FA on counterhit. Same rumor above applies here.
comboing into your ultra with vega is useless. damage is already scaled anough from health alone. add hits before it and it U2 does the same damage as a standing HK.... which can be comboed into easily.
I speculate that you can combo into ultra 1 from cMP but.... I havnt been able to pull it off.
Posted by Sakanade on May 24, 2010 at 4:57 p.m. #813
anybody got tips on a cody matchup?? he ruffian kicks stuff my air assaults and my backslashes...
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 24, 2010 at 9:57 p.m. #814
Block > Cody
Posted by IzunaGhost on May 26, 2010 at 6:04 p.m. #815
@VegaBisonAbel, I agree with you bro, I play Vega as my main and am lucky to have a friend on the same playing level as me to train with (dont get me wrong Im not amazing but competent) however he uses Chun Li as his main and knowing the tricks we're both gonna pull and all varied mix ups makes it a tense fight, I work so bastard hard at beating her! but have only ever won one match against her so far out of loads -_- so frustrating, dunno what im doing wrong, any other character i go against gets mangled up hard lol so yeh any tips on beating Chunny would be ace! HELP! all you Vega Pros! I know in reality his beauty wouldnt fail him :P
Posted by Dark_Fantom on May 26, 2010 at 8:45 p.m. #816
Whoa, U2 combos after aerial cosmic heel???
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on May 27, 2010 at 7:34 p.m. #817
@IzunaGhost
Don't be scared to do jumpins especially when she doesn't have an ex bar for and ex hurricane kick.
also chun's tend to end their block strings with a hazansho or sweep, it's up to you to read if they are doing either one and focus attack to counter.
also try to focus attack at max distance to bait a sweep or a walk-in throw
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on May 28, 2010 at 1:14 a.m. #818
also... be careful of standing MP into hazanshu. dont do like me and focus the MP. 90% of all chun's have lots of footsie experience.... about the only reliable way to beat her is to have better footsies.
Posted by IzunaGhost on May 28, 2010 at 9:19 a.m. #819
thanks for that bro, gotta admit using the focus attack effectively is something im still getting used to with most characters not just Vega, seeing how players better than myself play, all use the focus... atm for me learning it well will be the key in upping my game, but yeh ill be sure to try out your advice ;)
Posted by Sakanade on May 29, 2010 at 12:08 a.m. #820
Blanka is no longer a bad matchup against vega..
and neither is cammy and other characters who like to or mostly have to jump at you to start a crossup combo or to get a combo period... i've been doin some testing for the past few weeks on his U2 to see the PRACTICAL uses of it.. and i gotta say.. its his answer to alot of situations that in vanilla made it tough for him.. Blanka Horizontal ball is punishable by the ultra. Cammy is VERY punishable by it..
Me personally still prefer his U1 cuz i took the time to get close to mastering it.. but BECAUSE its vega dont try to combo into either of them, we need that brutal damage. if you can learn to predict and get timings down then ur winnings will increase solely on ur ultras.. also U2 combo's from a counter hit FA for the same damage without having to back dash and stuff..
some may already kno this just sharing with those who are interested..
Posted by akillyz on May 30, 2010 at 12:07 a.m. #821
my biggest problem with vega is overhead attacks. because most of his moves rely on crouching charge i am always crouching, balrog and ryu in particular have some decnt over heads and always give me problems, plus abel gives me problems because as far as i know vega doesnt have the tools to take out the guy.
can someone gave me some pointers for those 3 matchups?
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on May 31, 2010 at 1:09 p.m. #822
@821
well the obvious solution to your problem is to not crouch all the time. to be a good vega you need to be moving all the time and not staying in one place where opponents can just jump in all day.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on June 3, 2010 at 5 p.m. #823
just saw tatsu with ssf4..best vega in america
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/7407375
@ 24:00
Posted by Meteo2 on June 9, 2010 at 3:44 p.m. #824
Vega Hitbox Data
http://shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t...
And for a little fun... Claw Mindgames :P
http://shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t...
A BUG/GLITCH of Ultra II failing versus Zangief's lariat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKM_cg...
Another crap-tastic miss with Ultra 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3l5_wG...
Posted by CONSTvariable23 on June 18, 2010 at 12:50 p.m. #825
@#821/akillyz:
Vega, like Blanka, has moves that can propel him forward or backward while still holding down. Use his back flips, unique attacks, and slide (carefully, of course) to stay mobile while charging. This is especially useful if you're looking for a chance to land your Ultra. But keep in mind that frequently you'll just have to stop charging and try other things, otherwise you'll get too predictable, and a predictable Vega is easy as pie to take down.
Posted by ARK on June 20, 2010 at 4:46 p.m. #826
I'm not a pro at Street Fighter like u guys but I wanna be able to own my friends with Vega. I do, jump in Hp,standing HP (2 hit), crouch Mp and Ex Flying Barcelona Attack and Izuna drop. Basically I wanna know if anyone has a combo with Vega that does more damage than this. My dog who always plays with Ryu totally hates Vega now, lol. Any combos will be greatly appreciated.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on June 21, 2010 at 5:44 p.m. #827
nope, that's basically vega's most practical damaging combo, but as you may know now, vega's main strength isn't in learning damaging combos, but in poking, landing izuna, and kara-throws
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on June 21, 2010 at 6:14 p.m. #828
backflips are typically a bad idea. pretty much for every instance you can think of where backflip is useful, i can think of 9 more that it's not useful in... and probably discredit the instance you're talking about.
as far as combos.... vega isnt about combos. he's about zoning, footsies, poking and mobility (pretty much what 827 said). most combos suck with vega. 3-5 hit combos are average and more than adequate. just try to save meter for fireballs, block well and know when to press a button.
Posted by shadow050 on June 23, 2010 at 11:05 a.m. #829
@ 806
sakura's crouching HP can be gotten around by crossing to the opposite side she's facing, right before hitting the attack button... it'll usually result in a slash on he back - similar to what it does with guile and his flash kicks.
but yeah, landing the izuna drop is tough to accomplish on players who anti air like that with her.
Posted by theonly_J on June 28, 2010 at 4:17 p.m. #830
You check this channel got some videos of myself on here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbGQ37...
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on June 30, 2010 at 11:43 p.m. #831
@830 ey man yer prolly the best vega here, just wanna ask what 's your mindset going into a match? like for me, my whole mindset is to find ways to land the cosmic heel to I can start my mindgames/mixups.
Posted by Sakanade on July 2, 2010 at 10:51 p.m. #832
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2OWG5...
a post of me and my vega.. nothing super fancy just some solid play let me kno what you guys think.. some feedback is always aprecciated
Posted by Doppler on July 3, 2010 at 8:36 a.m. #833
I really need some help with blankas, those greens things are a nightmare with hes safe rolling atack and how you guys atack a blanka
Posted by Sakanade on July 3, 2010 at 9:17 p.m. #834
i let him come to me.. you gotta out turtle blanka. when he does blanka ball horizontal try a medium or light RCF depending on spacing. dont ever go airborne unless its in a combo
Posted by Doppler on July 5, 2010 at 8:54 a.m. #835
hey thanks thats help, I hate blnakas and hes safe moves and they improved hes speed? wtf??!!! I punish hes rolling with ex Barcelona, but now I see other way thanks
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 5, 2010 at 2:26 p.m. #836
turtle blanka? well I rush him down and try and keep him in the corner as much as I can. In the corner, vega can shut down all the blanka balls. U don't want to turtle with vega against anyone, but that's just me.
Posted by Sakanade on July 6, 2010 at 12:09 p.m. #837
Since vega doesnt have a GTFO me move its generally said that you dont wanna turtle... but if you kno how to do it. then hey.. all the power to ya
Posted by Sakanade on July 7, 2010 at 3:09 p.m. #838
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-xCTD...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqdD_w...
videos vs a pretty good fei long.. this was a really good match..
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on July 11, 2010 at 12:12 a.m. #839
Blanka is always gonna be the one that stumps vega players cuz it seems like Blanka can do what vega does except better. Blanka's moves aren't safe on block. his df hp is very punishable as well.
Options for punch slide (df HP): on block you can ultra II. You can also cr. mp ex wall dive. Very unsafe but still trips people up.
Vertical Ball: You can ultra II this. You can stuff it if you see it coming with st. HK.
One of the things I heard in the forums is blanka is a very reactionary character. IF you don't give him something to react to you can focus on punishing his unsafe tactics. Good Blankas are gonnna be like Good Chun-lis, Ryu's, etc. They're hard to beat cuz they got their character down. So either way you look at it you will have to adjust because a good opponent will adjust as well.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on July 11, 2010 at 12:13 a.m. #840
I mean you can ultra II horizontal ball on block :-/ I haven't tried the other balls yet.
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on July 11, 2010 at 12:19 a.m. #841
sorry me again.
you can Ultra II the rainbow ball on block, and you can even Ultra II a whiffed vertical ball (as long as it doesn't make you switch sides). A lot of things can punish the rainbow ball on block, such as cosmic heel (vega's launcher).
A good blanka will be crossing you up with KKK leaps as well as j. MK, lp into electricity and use good normals to stuff you. A lot of grab and tic throw shenanigans as well. It is so hard to have a blanket strat for when they are at high level play. A good blanka will never random ball, but for the ones that do you'll have a few tips to punish it.
Posted by Sakanade on July 12, 2010 at 5:19 p.m. #842
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2UJPJ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozqDXC...
first one is guile.. he was pretty solid with his block strings and other ways to play agaisnt a vega.. but yeah.. still came out on top
the second one is a VERY solid hakan.. from this video there may be hopes for the turkish wrestler..
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 13, 2010 at 9:50 a.m. #843
@sakanade
you have a very very low level vega to be honest with you, you mostly just spam wall dives. no poking game whatsoever and you spend 90% of the fight across the screen. didn't see 1 kara throw set up or even just a tick throw. You will be so free against people who know how to get around wall dives.
Posted by Sakanade on July 13, 2010 at 2:02 p.m. #844
I dont see how its spam... Its no different than a ryu or a sagat playing keep away with their fireballs.. its a part of my strategy.. i dont have to play the way EVERY vega plays to win. if they kno how to shut it down then i move to something else.. i play the way i want to and its working.
Posted by Sakanade on July 13, 2010 at 2:13 p.m. #845
there is no set handbook how to play ur character. just becuase people say you shouldnt use sumtin cuz of how unsafe it is doesnt mean youshouldnt use it. the absolute only way to get around that would have been to focus it. but if they started doin that then its just easy izuna's for me. i have my gameplan and i'm sticking with it.. so ur saying im a low level claw cuz i dont poke or kara enough? claw's pokes in themselves are a keep away game so whats the difference between that and chun's legs or blanka elec? none.. the only characters that doesnt work on are sim bison seth and other vega's cuz of backflip.. i kon the weakness and strength's of my style. If you cant see that then ur the low level one here.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 13, 2010 at 3:11 p.m. #846
umm i watched yer guile vid...and all you did was WALL DIVE! back flip the crap away then WALL DIVE! then back flip the crap away then WALL DIVE! you spend like 3/4 of the fight all the way the other screen, waiting to make another wall dive...yeah I used to play like you that's why I know it's very very low level.
Also your definitions of "good players" is low level at best. I'm not trying to hate, just pointing out that your game could use some variety because your attack is very very one dimensional
Posted by Sakanade on July 13, 2010 at 7:07 p.m. #847
i didnt backflip then fba ALL the time.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 13, 2010 at 10:12 p.m. #848
@847 yeah but you know what I mean
Posted by cowboy_soultaker on July 21, 2010 at 10:19 a.m. #849
I agree with sakanade that it is a strat and it is up to the opponent to learn how to counter it. If the opponent does the same thing it elicits the same response from you (so long as it is the winning strategy).
That said, exploiting a player's weakness for a strategy pays off in the short term but VBA has a point that it can make bad habits should you fight someone who can counter it. Good players will adjust but it will be harder to adjust to a strategy you are less familiar with. Or perhaps those are more my words than his.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 21, 2010 at 7:25 p.m. #850
plaease cowboy, let's not say that spamming wall dives is a "strategy", just like chucking fireballs for the sake of chucking fireballs is not a strategy.
Posted by Doppler on July 22, 2010 at 8:15 p.m. #851
well shotos in personal is not a big problem
Now I hate those bison, chunlis, cammys and rufus, and well still some ryus
did you guys know some move to safe when they do only croosups or those dive kick kind atacks?
I know vega dont have a Get the hell out of me, but thats my weakness
Posted by Johnry on July 23, 2010 at 2:11 a.m. #852
Rufus's dive kick can be countered by s.LK, I think.
KKK to get away from Chun-Li's cross up.
Posted by lynx_vega on July 27, 2010 at 7:23 p.m. #853
any hint for bison matches?
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on July 28, 2010 at 8:16 a.m. #854
Sakanade:
I have to agree with VegaBisonAbel here. You have a very one dimentional game, which there's nothing wrong with except that it obviously is not working. Both wins you got off a super vs guile.... and you probably dont know why he got hit by either of them. I will say that you're about the best you can possibly be with your strategies but there's nothing wrong with having more tools in the toolbox.
I counted 33 wall dives vs guile. 12 got punished, 7 hit. the rest were either blocked or whiffed. nothing wrong with doing wall dives but you've turned something unsafe on block or whiff into the core of your game. I wall dive myself too but not to the extent that you do and no one is saying you shouldnt wall dive. but when you took 12 unnessessary hits for it, it refects there's something wrong. I mean if someone isnt going to adjust to your playstyle and just keeps falling for the same thing over and over go for it. but technically he had the advantage on your wall dives 12-7. it wasnt working. I'll give your strategy props if you can figure out why it "worked."
That's what VegaBisonAbel means by one dimentional. it means you have one way to win. so what happens when you fight someone that knows how to beat wall dives? do you lose or do you change it up? If you wanna really improve as a player then try going a whole round without wall dives. then a whole match. then 5 matches. then 5 wins in a row. then 10 wins in a row. then when you've learned to rely on something else... try doing the same without that for a whole match, then 5 matches, etc. that's how you improve. that way when you fight someone who knows how to beat those options you still have other options.
watching a couple other vids... it's probably a good idea to start blocking more. You're also missing chance after chance to punish whiffed/blocked moves. vs guy you landed lv2 focus and at point blank range you just let him fall. at least sweep. it's better than nothing. the backflips are bad but these other things are more serious problems than that. most backflips are done at full screen, so against most characters it's safe.
lastly, it's probably a better idea to post videos of you losing if you really want feedback. you'll be more likely to both see the reasons behind the advice and actually take the advice given. posting matches of you winning is just showing off. again nothing wrong with showing off if you play as good as theonly_J does, but those videos don't really make you look like a solid vega.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 28, 2010 at 7:24 p.m. #855
@lynx vega
well, like how I play all charge characters is to keep them st.MK distance. Dance in and out of range while poking with st.LK, st.MK, cr.mp, st.HK, overhead, or cosmic heel(yeah vega has so many great pokes, use them).
Bison can't punish RCF, so use it when the enemy's not expecting it for free chip.
With proper spacing, you can jump on Bison pretty safely as he can't shoryu yer jump.
when he has ultra 2 do NOT do an empty wall jump because ultra 2 can punish wall jumps from full screen.
other than that...learn to block his moves, predict his jumps to air grab and DON'T SPAM crouch techs or you'll eat scissor kicks to the face.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on July 29, 2010 at 1:43 p.m. #856
i never noticed that. I'll look for a different OST vs bison now instead of crouch tech. Also, bison's devil reverse hitbox changed for the better (for us). It no longer hits behind him. so if you expect devils reverse, wall dive behind him and slam his ass to the ground. nothing he can do about it. 90% of all bison's start out with that crap too. so that's one of the rare times i'll start a match off jumping in. i'll keep my finger on MK just in case there's a N Jump but almost every time is a free air throw. any bison that picks U2 vs vega is a moron. there are very very few situations where you should ever get hit by it. if you see U2 just sit on it. as long as you play safe he wont use it (and if he does free air throw at a minuimum). jumping on bison is pretty safe. some will do the insta-jumping double punch. just n jump or jump back to bait it and punish. personally I always pick U1 for this matchup. Go for the damage IMO. Especially since devil's reverse/U2/non-ex headstomp/sweep/teleport/psycho crusher are so easy to spot... and punish with it. Just be careful of ex headstomp. so many of my ultras just whiffed right thru him cause of those stupid i frames. you'll still be safe distance but you waste ultra.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on July 29, 2010 at 4:39 p.m. #857
I don't ever use Ultra 1 anymore. I like to have a really good escape/reversal/jump in punisher when i'm being rushed down.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on July 30, 2010 at 12:16 a.m. #858
yeah..... i've gotten so good at blocking from vanilla that i just stick with U1 for more damage potential. i'm not too worried about being in the corner anymore....
about the only characters i use U2 vs is:
Abel
Cammy
Chun-Li
Cody
Hakan
Balrog
Really good Zangiefs
Basically anyone i suspect of having a predictable jump is a good candadite for U1 nailing. Anyone with a good ground game gets the U2 since it's more reliable and versatile.
Posted by theonly_J on August 2, 2010 at 8:26 a.m. #859
Hey just showing a vid of me, theres some other ones on the channel too so feel free to browse them, this one hasn't been renamed yet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUhDWD...
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on August 2, 2010 at 1:19 p.m. #860
@the only J
imma take that walk back to cr.mk-cr.mp-ex-Fba after a corpse hop. That trick is so simple yet so good.
you and tatsu hold it down for the Vega army here in USA
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on August 2, 2010 at 1:19 p.m. #861
@the only J
imma take that walk back to cr.mk-cr.mp-ex-Fba after a corpse hop. That trick is so simple yet so good.
you and tatsu hold it down for the Vega army here in USA
Posted by darkness_prisoner on August 5, 2010 at 7:15 p.m. #862
defensive and rush down vega in a tourney:
( watch vega taking 3 at once after ken match)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mycCAI...
Posted by Doppler on August 5, 2010 at 9:08 p.m. #863
anyone here have problems with akumas??
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on August 6, 2010 at 12:43 a.m. #864
@doppler
like what exactly?
Posted by lynx_vega on August 6, 2010 at 9:22 a.m. #865
@doppler
I have problems too, in get in to akuma cuz he only scape with trickys air fire balls, and hes C. HP
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on August 6, 2010 at 12:06 p.m. #866
against akuma.
don't use FBA cuz c.HP destroy it.
you can slide under/dash under air fireballs, so you can punish the akuma on the way down.
Posted by lynx_vega on August 6, 2010 at 4:32 p.m. #867
thanx that help, but how do you get that fat monster with that safe dive kick of rufus?
Posted by lynx_vega on August 6, 2010 at 5:43 p.m. #868
and how is the EX barcelona crooss up??
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on August 6, 2010 at 6:16 p.m. #869
lol the ex barcelona cross up is extremely hard to do...there really is no science behind it other than practicing how to do it. You need to create your own ex-fba cross up setups cuz there is really no science behind it yet.
rufus is a terrible matchup, all I can say is just don't let him start his dive kick pressure.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on August 6, 2010 at 11:54 p.m. #870
OST with cMP or insta n jump HK, or air throw
Posted by x_Who_Is_Alpha on August 22, 2010 at 9:37 p.m. #871
Almost done writing the Vega Discussion, its a bit more in depth than what is on this page right here. Im going to be done with the character matchups next week on Sunday.
Posted by Shadaloo on September 9, 2010 at 7:06 p.m. #872
I like vega. But i think he is TOO buffed up in SSF4 that he is overpowered. I use vega and can almost destroy ne1 with him. His EX moves now have invincibility frames. and his zoning is unbelieble. His claw is now regarded as the best pokes in the game. better than bison and chunli.
When i play now online. I honestly barely stand a chance vs good claw players. You cant jump in the air because he throws u. U cant win in the air bcoz of his high prioty jump inns. u cant stay on the ground because his long pokes. easiest damage to do on claw.. tech throw him repeatedly. I hope he gets nerfed via an update.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 11, 2010 at 8:14 a.m. #873
@871 -
i'm doing the same for the srk forums writing the new vega matchups i should be done this weekend with a rough draft. if you want we could swap versions and pick out stuff missing from eatch others. if so just PM VegaMan on srk, psn or www.up-your-game.com
@872
try not playing people that suck. if you want a real challenge then play people in my chat room on www.up-your-game.com and stop playing scrubs. vs a decent honda, akuma, sim or guile vega doesnt stand much of a chance.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on September 12, 2010 at 1:53 p.m. #874
@vegafbiolacerda
yer vegaman?
@shadaloo
1. priority is an illusion
2. vega's main weakness is shown after any untechable knockdown. That's why vega mainer's are kings of blocking and teching...atleast better than most imo.
3. his leg is his best poke ..lol
4. please don't say vega is overpowered. in theory he can do all that...but in theory ryu can psychic shoryu any attack, but that is not the case is it?
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 13, 2010 at 1:21 p.m. #875
yes lol
Posted by SF4junkie on September 15, 2010 at 2:05 a.m. #876
My fav vega combo
j.hp, s.hp, c.mp, ex fbc to izuno drop nice damage
Any strong foes?
Random vs Random?
PSN: OoDemonSeedoO
XBL: GotDemonSeed
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 15, 2010 at 11:54 p.m. #877
meh i like jHP, HP, HK
no meter use.
Posted by Rimpala on September 16, 2010 at 4:39 p.m. #878
Vega's been my favorite character ever sence I was able to play him in the arcade version of Street Fighter 2.
In this game he can literally run circles around grapplers like Zangief. Sometimes it's best to just his regular moves as he has some hard hitting combos and his "cosmic heal" can actualy be used to position Vega behind an opponent after they've been knocked down. If the opponent is getting too close you can totaly punish them with the EX-Flying Barcelona Attack & Izuna Drop. And his EX-sky high claw is extremely usefull against opponents that like to use specials alot.
His specials are to be used sparingly though, that's the trick. They're great as suprise attacks.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on September 16, 2010 at 5:18 p.m. #879
so with ibuki...we block to where ibuki is but not to where the kunai is right? or is there more to it?
really good ibukis can just perfect me once i get caught in their vortex.
so for the usual cross up vortex that most ibukis do is there a way to block the kunai?
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 16, 2010 at 7:35 p.m. #880
block whichever hits you first. same as you would for dhalsim and his ultra teleport behind crap. as long as you're in blockstun you'll auto block anything after it. MOST ibukis will crossover kunai low attack to start it out. but the key is to pay attention and try to see what height, position, and angle they are throwing the kunai. after a bit you'll start seeing the pattern. the sooner they throw it the more likely it is to cross over.
Posted by VegaBisonAbel on September 16, 2010 at 8:38 p.m. #881
ahh so the kunai doesn't overhead?
i didn't know about that auto correct block during block stun(good stuff there).
so the kunai will always land first before their attack(whatever target combo they do once they land) right?
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 17, 2010 at 10:30 a.m. #882
i think the kunai always hits first. if it doesnt cross over have to block high. if it crosses over you have to block it low
Posted by Blackdealh36k on September 23, 2010 at 4:30 p.m. #883
A whole year LAter And Im Still one of the BEst Vegas Around...Gamer Tag Blackdealh36k..i think i met one vega who i honestly thought was better than me....has anyone done that combo where u connect light punch after focus attack roll just cant get it.
Posted by VegaFabiolaCerda on September 26, 2010 at 10:47 p.m. #884
@883
I don't know what you're basing your skill off of, but i can probably think of quite a few better than you.
as for doing roll FADC cLP, cMPxx EX FBA or roll FADC cLP, cLKxx LK ST, EX ST yep I can pull it off. pretty useless tho
Posted by IzunaGhost on October 13, 2010 at 9:51 a.m. #885
Quick question... when you EX FBA with Vega how does one pull off the double slash in air or on the way down? You know... where Vega stabs down then slashes out. I seem to only ever Izuna or slash once. Is it a case of no input when drawing close to your opponent (other than punch) or is there an actual way to do it?
Posted by Th3_JoK3R_J on October 13, 2010 at 7:06 p.m. #886
@885
When u execute EX FBA and when your over your opponent keep your analog/stick in neutral position and just press any punch button.
Posted by Johnry on October 14, 2010 at 5:46 a.m. #887
@885
As I understand it, the EX FBA consists of two hits.
If you dont hit or get blocked by the opponent when jumping, you will get a double slash on the way down.
If the opponent blocks you on the way to the wall, you will only get a single slash when coming back at him.
Posted by Johnry on October 14, 2010 at 6:10 a.m. #888
@885
Ignore my last comment - I was wrong. Whether you make contact with the opponent on the way up is irrelevant.
Posted by IzunaGhost on October 26, 2010 at 4:03 p.m. #889
I found the double slash goes in everytime if, as you EX FBA to the wall or through your opponent, as Vega leaps off the wall press forward or forward/up which ever once, so as to further the trajectory of it, but release after pressing forward, and then PPP when near to them. Its better if they're standing on block as the last slash pushes them slightly away from you. Same principle for his super, but Izuna does more damage so....yeh, there ya go, hope that helps someone out :)
Posted by Th3_JoK3R_J on October 27, 2010 at 5:08 p.m. #890
your a little late lol.
Posted by nocturnal on October 27, 2010 at 8:48 p.m. #891
I want to ask something. I dont have a PS3 or XBOX so i cant play SSF4. But in Vanilla, Vega can do some specific combos only to some characters and cannot do the same to others.
For instance: "Cosmic heel+ neutral jump hk". Or "jumping HP+ cr. MK+ cr. MP+ Ex flying barcelona". You can do these combos for example to Dhalsim but cannot do to for example Ryu.
Did that change in Super?
Posted by IzunaGhost on October 28, 2010 at 5:10 a.m. #892
LOL yeh I know I'm behind, but I aint got a PS3 or Xbox either :( ...so I only get to play on a friday at my mates. My Vega is pretty beast though considering :P
Pretty sure Vega's combos work on all opponents dude, just gotta be precise with timings.
Posted by nocturnal on October 28, 2010 at 10:14 a.m. #893
absolutely sure what i said is true. you can go training and try and see. try the combos i have said above. also u can try "jumping hp+ close hp+ cr. mk+ ex flying barcelona. this also dont work on ryu and such but works on dhalsim and such.
Posted by nocturnal on October 28, 2010 at 10:33 a.m. #894
anyway, you'll see they dont work on some opponents when u go to training
what im asking is do these combos now can be done to everyone? i had the list of the characters these combos dont work on but lost it. but sure ryu is one of them. so can u do these combos to Ryu in Super?
Posted by IzunaGhost on October 28, 2010 at 4:17 p.m. #895
yeh, I've not had any trouble pulling them off in Super on anyone, not to say some match ups arent hard work.
Posted by nocturnal on October 28, 2010 at 8:27 p.m. #896
ok thanks, good to know that. Hope i will have a PS3
Posted by Arcturus on November 5, 2010 at 4:52 a.m. #897
I read in the comments above and do agree that Rufus is a bad match up for Vega, however if they start dive kick pressure, you should use his standing LK. I use that and my percentage of beating Rufus' has increased. In some instances, it does trade, but most of the time it knocks him right out. Other than that, it is a matter of hit and run, and unexpected rush downs that they are never prepared for.
IMO his toughest match up is Akuma...one mistake a demon will hit, or a vortex chain. While I have grown to find him easier as time goes on, he is still a dangerous customer for vega...more than Rufus and Abel...with Abel you just gotta avoid frame traps..lol
Posted by NMS84 on November 6, 2010 at 1:48 p.m. #898
I hope someone here can help me out...I'm a decent Vega on PSN (about 7000BP) and I have figured out almost all matchups...but not the Guile matchup. I have big problems going up against a turtle Guile and get punished and beaten like 8 times out of 10. Does anyone have any good tips or hints?
Posted by Ryu_Apprentice on November 12, 2010 at 1:07 p.m. #899
you shouldnt have much issues with guile when you are using vega, you have many tools to deal with him no matter what he does (unless you fight a highly talented player), anyway here are some tips.
1. Dont panic: if he throws sonic booms just back flip with KKK, if he slides then focus the second hit and punish with your most damaging combo (cMK sHK, cMK cMP ex Barcelona drop)
2. watch him: If he is walking back or throwing out random pokes he is probably hiding a sonic boom in which case you can do the same, perform a back flip and hide your wall jump in it then perform it.
3. Outpoke him: you have alot of poking tools, cMK,cMP,sHK. use them
4. Be patient: most of the time if he has meter he will go for ex flash kick on wake up, block and punish.
5. remember that you spin kick is safe on block so use it.
Posted by NMS84 on November 12, 2010 at 3:20 p.m. #900
Thanks, I really appreciate it. Yeah, the poking I have figured out, but I guess I'm just to impatient and panics against Guile. I will take your advice to heart.
Posted by BackFlipToEvade on November 18, 2010 at 11:04 a.m. #901
As a Vega player I have many questions. I ONLY use vega, since SFIV and now on SSFIV. I'm weak I know, but I don't have the patience to learn another character.
My questions are:
1. What is the range on Vegas jump to do his HP cross over?
(example: I am playing and I go to jump, as I'm coming down I SOMETIMES cross the player for a cross over. Many times I'm surprised by this so I don't continue the combos.)
2. Do they have to be crouched for the cross over to work?
Posted by Ryu_Apprentice on November 29, 2010 at 3:30 a.m. #902
@BackFlipToEvade
HP cross up is very unreliable in my opinion, the timing is so strict that you miss more than you hit but if you wish I will tell you a few ways
1. in the corner
2. Hitting the HP as low to the ground as possible
3. when the opponent is crouching
in SF4 and SUPER if the opponent is crouching they become slightly bigger due to the hitbox.
but in my opinion forget the crossup, besides jumping is quite a risky business if not used well.
Posted by Ryu_Apprentice on November 29, 2010 at 4:18 a.m. #903
all things being equal the crossup HP is useless, besides you have a ton of other cross up options.
Posted by nocturnal on November 29, 2010 at 4:46 a.m. #904
Won't Eventhubs change the character overview at the top of the page which is about Vega in Vanilla not in Super?
Posted by BackFlipToEvade on December 6, 2010 at 9:18 a.m. #905
I think that vegas light punch is very useful. It's gotten me out of rush downs sometimes. Both standing and crouching light punch. Sometimes I'm lucky to knock the player out of the air with a standing medium punch when he/she attempts to jump.
Neutral jumping and light punch attack also works well with right timing and it's a fast strike.
Can't quite make it to the top before your opponent is going to attack you?
Neutral jump medium punch works well too. Because the strike in the attack sweeps to a diagonal up-ish direcion.
Correct me if I'm wrong, I've just used these and they have gotten me out of some situations.
Posted by NMS84 on December 9, 2010 at 7:08 p.m. #906
Hey all Vega mainers!
Just wanted to say that I started a YouTube channel dedicated to the Spanish Ninja. I'm trying to gather as many videos, replays, tutorials and links as possible there to help out anyone who wants to get better with Vega. If you have the time, go there and comment and come with suggestions and tips. All help is greatly appreciated and more videos/links would help out immensly!
http://www.youtube.com/user/ShawAndMo...
Posted by nocturnal on December 13, 2010 at 4:52 a.m. #907
Give Vega his fake wall jump back!
Posted by PwnDizzle0 on December 17, 2010 at 10:36 a.m. #908
Vega is SUPREME!!!!
Posted by Rekkaken2468 on December 26, 2010 at 5:23 p.m. #909
characters like vega dat require skill to be used own basic BS characters like ryu.
Posted by CammyBoy on January 14, 2011 at 3:19 p.m. #910
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DbX5a... vs Vega, a mirror match.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DO7I8... vs Balrog. I know I probably shouldn't use the wall dive so much but he didn't seem to want to stop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZEyVI... vs Ryu. Ignore the first round entirely, that was garbage. Also you can hear me talk about the origin of my gamertag!
Just a few games, I have more on my youtube. I'm just looking for tips from other good Vega players on where I could improve.
Posted by cearbeartron on January 15, 2011 at 6:03 a.m. #911
@903
The j.HP crossup is not useless at all. It may be random but id say that's to you're advantage at times. Lets say I try to cross up my opponent on knock down and fail, 95% of the time I will still have a successful jumpin(assuming he doesn't srk me etc). And if I succeed I'll have a confused opponent and a free combo.
Not saying that you should do it all the time though as jumpins can be very risky, but doing it ones in a while wont hurt.
Posted by Johnry on January 29, 2011 at 9:44 a.m. #912
I wish Vega had an anti-air :(
(and before you say it, no, ST is not a real AA)
Posted by GodPride on January 30, 2011 at 4:43 p.m. #913
Contrary to what's stated, because of the added knee, Ultra 1 should not be used as anti air. It's initial hit sends the opponent too high up to the point Vega ends up wiffing the Ultra. This tends to happen at the peak of your opponent's jump. I wish Capcom would remove this feature because it isn't a blessing as intented, it's more of a curse in disguised. Other than that, it's still the go-to-ultra for me.
I think that knee move would best suit Vega's Super instead where you have more control of Vega's trajectory and it could also serve as a combo ender like the EX Barcelona if allowed. (Seriously, if Capcom wanted to give us an incentive to use Vega's Super, that'd be the way to do it.)
Posted by cearbeartron on February 2, 2011 at 12:34 p.m. #914
@911
Forgot to mention that it is only practical on some characters, mainly big ones(Balrog, Zangief, T.Hawk etc).
Posted by sleepythadon on March 21, 2011 at 1:23 p.m. #915
This is some scrub Akuma I encountered on Xbox Live..... makes Vega seem Over powered but... Vega is still nerfed like crazy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsFORV...
Posted by sleepythadon on March 21, 2011 at 1:25 p.m. #916
oh.... that vid I posted is me playing Vega and winning a double perfect victory against an Akuma player
Posted by VegaSota on April 14, 2011 at 7:27 a.m. #917
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2IyoG...
Bleeding Edge - SSF4 Claw Combos
Posted by shadow050 on April 17, 2011 at 4:25 p.m. #918
idk if this has been answered but... how will comboing into the ex RCF make anything diferent, aside from the additional damage (that will be scaled down due to it being in a combo) of the "hard or EX version" as opposed to the "light verson" of RCF... which will be adding LESS THAN and additional 60 points of damage?
if my understanding is correct... there's not real difference other than the one i stated... which will... suck.
Posted by yuenyun on May 1, 2011 at 10:20 p.m. #919
@shadow050 I'm having trouble understanding your question haha. What is the point of comboing into EX roll? EX RCF is fireball invincible on startup, so sometimes I'll throw it out in front of fireball characters. The startup is slow, but is good for chip or just catching them off guard. Otherwise, I don't really use it in combos. I mean, I could be missing something though.
What I DO know is that in Arcade Edition, EX RCF has more positive frames at the end, so you can combo into c.MP after (into izuna drop). I could be wrong there too lol.
But I mean, RCF in many situations, if timed correctly is basically free chip.
Posted by nocturnal on May 5, 2011 at 7:49 a.m. #920
I am a PC player and so still playing Vanilla. Can someone say is Vega's priorties hiher in Arcade edition? Because in Vanilla, Ryu's little finger can break my Ex-Scarlet, you know
Posted by nocturnal on May 8, 2011 at 9:15 a.m. #921
For f**k's sake, someone change this character overwiev! It is still about Vanilla Vega!
Posted by shadow050 on May 10, 2011 at 6:39 p.m. #922
@ yuenyun (919)... what i meant was.. apparently now you can actully combo INTO exRCF (from mp or mk i believe)... and i'm saying that it seems like we'll be able to combo into that as opposed to only being able to combo into the light version of RCF from MP.
because the EX RCF = H. RCF in terms of damage output (which is stupid btw)
the additional hits will cause the damage to scale down and the difference in total damage of MP->exRCF will not be that much greater than MP->L.RCF
which will suck.
now, maybe we can continue the combo from exRCF and add on (link) MP->exFBC... which will be nice but obviously require a lot of meter.
so that's basically what i was getting at.
so far,from what i can see, Vega is still the most crapped on fighter in the game in regards to how much things "make sense" about him, his moves, and their properties.
in short, he's still the most "WTF!? OMFG!!" character in the game, and i mean that in a bad way. like,when you're using him those are the words you'll be saying as you notice how "****** on" he seems.
@920 nope. his priorities still suck as of SSF4. they got a lil better but many of the same moves still beat it and you will still be "SMFH" at them.
@921... 100% agree!!
Posted by shadow050 on June 8, 2011 at 5:22 p.m. #923
please update this info!!
Posted by dodsonbe on June 19, 2011 at 6:18 a.m. #924
wow vega gets no love anywhere. he gets mad nerfs and it apears that this page is for vanilla!
Posted by MaysTheCraze on June 21, 2011 at 2:11 p.m. #925
Yeah, just took heed that this was Vanilla Vega, ha. I'm not sure the info here applies to AE. Same with Rose's page...
Posted by nocturnal on June 26, 2011 at 12:06 p.m. #926
They will never update Vega's page
Posted by nocturnal on July 6, 2011 at 3:56 p.m. #927
Although it writes nowhere, now that I'm playing AE, I feel that Vega's Scarlet Terror has been nerfed as if it was not a bad move already. It is completely useless now. The start-up frame seems to be much longer.
Posted by Neelram on July 18, 2011 at 6:03 a.m. #928
Vega getting nerfs? That's like Yun getting buffs... O.o
Posted by bleble630 on July 26, 2011 at 12:59 a.m. #929
Vega's Scarlet Terror is useless now, this was a good move, now it is sucks... Vega in AE is soo weak. In SFIV Vega was best... Vega in SFIV was the weakest character in the games, but I played him, now is unplayable... ;/
Posted by shadow050 on July 31, 2011 at 11:58 p.m. #930
ya'll are exaggerating.
Scarlett Terror isn't useless now, and i don't think it got nerfed. it simply didn't get the buff it should have.
maybe you meant Splendid Claw? his second ultra? that received a (very stupid) nerf, which was an increase in start up time.
Vega in Vanilla DEFINITELY was NOT the best incarnation of him in the SF4 series. he also wasn't the "worst character in the game" in my opinion.
he was just MUCH WEKER than he SHOULD have been, and the things they didn't give him are very annoying because so many of his short comings just don't make any got-darned sense!
he's definitely still playable... but you MUST have match up knowledge, and make a good read of you opponent and adjust in like every match. it's hard to beat other people who are good, if you aren't actually just the better player. this isn't really the case with some other characters, because they don't have sucky health and stun, lack of a good reversal move that has invincible frames, and don't require very strict inputs for links like vega.
Posted by Spanishninja on August 2, 2011 at 6:25 p.m. #931
Im a Vega user also, and its sad that his page hasnt been updated, but o well, as for his nerfs i agree on the Cosmic Heel nerf, it was a bit too strong, i can live with that, his slower start up for his U2 was just plain stupid, i dont find any reason for it, his U1 is CRAP i mean yeah some one jumps towards you and you U1 2 things happen.
1) You hit the jump in and the whole ultra misses effectively wasting it.
2) Your hit out of your Ultra by the jump in and you wasted your ultra completely and worst case scenario your still trapped in the corner with no way out because lets face it EX Scarlet terror gets stuffed like 60% of the times and 100% when the enemy is on top of you.
He needs a DECENT buff because like Shadow050 said. WHATS THE POINT IN COMBOING HIS EX RCF IF ITS GONNA GET SCALED TO HELL. Vega needs a decent anti air, some degree of invincibility on start up for his scarlet terror would make him a viable character not just for the Loyal players.
I main Vega since SSF2
Posted by nocturnal on August 15, 2011 at 5:03 a.m. #932
Scarlet Terror should hit his exact overhead area, or they have to give him an anti-air claw normal, like Akuma's b+d+hp. But right now the area directly over his head is simply defenseless, if you dash the jump in you'll get slided, if you focus you will get grabbed, if you ST it will whiff and u'll be punished, if you U2 opponent will block and u are dead. U2 was the best counter to the jump ins but now they have slowed its start up -WHAT THE HELL WAS THE POINT OF THAT?- and so there is nothing he can do for, say, an Abel mix-up jump in.
Posted by nocturnal on August 16, 2011 at 5:27 a.m. #933
When will this guide will be updated? Why doesn't Vega get the update? :(
Posted by Who Is Alpha on September 3, 2011 at 4:50 a.m. #934
You guys want me to update the page for you? I started maining Vega again and id do the Vega nation a clear solid.
Posted by General_Awesomo on September 3, 2011 at 9:41 p.m. #935
@ #934
Yes Alpha, I think we would all appreciate that.
Posted by Zeidust on September 21, 2011 at 10:54 a.m. #936
Huge news.. the 2012 update includes the ability for VEGA to connect Bloody High Claw off of Cosmic Heal.
Posted by Spanishninja on September 26, 2011 at 6:47 p.m. #937
@936 Good luck pulling that off the U1 takes a bit longer to charge than the Scarlet Terror so im guessing the timing is going to be Strict as hell.
Posted by shadow050 on September 27, 2011 at 5:11 p.m. #938
@ 934
PLEASE DO
@ 937
they claimed that they're "fixing" some of the hitbox issues with vega's U1 so even if it takes just as long, or slightly longer to charge, it MIGHT be feasibly done. although, i'm not 100% sure it's true that it takes longer to charge. i mean, i KNOW it takes longer to EXECUTE but that's a totally different issue. in any case, it should be a viable combo for him. with the ease we can connect EX FBA to CH, it would be STUPID if it was uber hard to connect U1 to CH.... then again... it wouldn't be the first time they did something (really) STUPID regarding Vega... -_-
Posted by nocturnal on September 27, 2011 at 7:38 p.m. #939
I can also help or do the update alone if the work is given to me. But something is sure, this guide must be updated!
Posted by Spanishninja on October 3, 2011 at 2:06 p.m. #940
@939 So lets do this bro, i got a decent Claw, and no one gives my main main some love so lets make it happen just give me the heads up and we can do this, write down combos and strategy all of that stuff.
Posted by nocturnal on October 5, 2011 at 6:53 p.m. #941
Great! What's your msn? Let me add you and we can communicate better. And also after we write all, are we sure Eventhubs will accept putting it here? Wouldn't be nice if all our effort went to waste :)
Posted by shadow050 on December 2, 2011 at 12:04 p.m. #942
@ 934
Alpha... you let us down man... you said you were gonna update this thing 3 months ago...
Posted by nocturnal on December 2, 2011 at 2:18 p.m. #943
@942
I think this guide won't be updated until SF7 is out. Vega is the only char to still have the Vanilla guide and they are updating the Ryu guide for the 4th time now as ver.2012 patch notes is out (not the patch is even released, mind you) :(
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